Just posting this thread for use in early 2009, now it seems that the final editing phases of S1 are under way, and artwork has featured on the Paizo blog.
James Jacobs wrote:
The Clash Begins
Friday, November 14, 2008
It's been many, many months since Leandra Christine Schneider won the first RPG Superstar contest, but we're finally almost there—her module, Clash of the Kingslayers, is going through its last bits of editing as I type this. To celebrate, check out some of the art from the adventure!
Request:
I think I have worked out how Glimmerhold is laid out from the descriptions and artwork of the module, but if someone at Paizo (or if the author) could post a link to a sketched cross-section through Glimmerhold, the surrounding lake, and the dam, that would be useful please; I appreciate that the monastery in the map sections on the covers seems to have left no room for such a depiction.
Questions:
Does 'The King's Curse' affect any alcohol/gold which comes into the possession of those affected after the moment that it has struck, and does it abate (and the effects reverse) with the demise of either the king or Helrún?
Is gear in the possession of the PCs affected by the curse if they have sworn fealty? What about if they have not dones so?
Some of these questions might have been answered on the original thread, but it's a bit late here for me at the time of posting to go and look them up, and the intentions might have changed over the past 12 months.
Congratulations, once again, to Leandra Christine Schenider, and here are your first questions to you (on this forum, as far as I know, anyway) as a published author! ;)
{ I think I have worked out how Glimmerhold is laid out from the descriptions and artwork of the module, but if someone at Paizo (or if the author) could post a link to a sketched cross-section through Glimmerhold, the surrounding lake, and the dam, that would be useful please; I appreciate that the monastery in the map sections on the covers seems to have left no room for such a depiction.}
I'm talking to James about this; we had Rob do a map for it but for some reason it didn't end up in the adventure! I blame gnomes!
{Does 'The King's Curse' affect any alcohol/gold which comes into the possession of those affected after the moment that it has struck,}
Christine's opinion may differ, but I'd run it as a one-time event.
{and does it abate (and the effects reverse) with the demise of either the king or Helrún?}
I would not have it reverse, otherwise the decadent greedy nobles would resume their unfair control over the city's money.
{Is gear in the possession of the PCs affected by the curse if they have sworn fealty?}
Thank you for your thoughts, Sean; looking forward to seeing that map if a link becomes available.
Amongst other things, I have been looking at the possibility of running a Beta version of Clash of the Kingslayers, but have been having problems with Helrún's stat block since she has domain spells and Mystic Theurge levels in 3.5, but domain spells have disappeared in Beta, and as far as I know Domain powers are not advanced by Mystic Theurge in Beta.
To preserve Helrun's CR of 12 for a Beta conversion, I'm thinking of advancing her by a couple of levels somewhere, and adding either extra cleric or Mystic Theurge levels would help make up for the missing Domain bonus spells by providing extra slots.
A 3.5 Helrún by the way seems to only have a clerical caster level of 9th, as far as I can make out, whereas the blade barrier scroll will have a minimim caster level of 11th; I seem to be overlooking a reminder as to the caster level check which she will need to make to use the scroll somewhere, unless this was left out.
I love the combination of putting a blade barrier in front of Helrún and the use of command 'approach' on a type who looks a melee sort (i.e. has a weak Will save) by the way... I get the impression it must be a very deadly table which Christine plays at or runs with those sort of ideas floating around... :D
Further Question:
Help! What sort of noise do Ebon steeds make? (See Doomguide, Page 26.) Lionlike roars? Deep-toned bleats? Something else altogether?
And what happens to a mount when its rider is slain? Does it *poof* back to infernal realms or is it a native outsider? The Doomguide Blessing subtext of the Doomguide entry says that Doomguides '...can call an ebon steed to serve as a mount...' which gives me the impression that their interaction with ebon steeds might be a bit like a 3.5 paladin's call mount ability. (In that case, do Doomguides with extra class levels have more advanced mounts?)
Go ahead using domains, they're going to end up pretty similar.
To use the scroll she just needs to make a DC 12 (scroll's caster level +1) check, which is almost a guaranteed success for her.
I think it would be freaky if ebon steeds made a guttural noise crossed with a hiss. ;) I'd treat it like a paladin's or blackguard's mount... it leaves at the end of a battle. If they have enough levels, I could see them having better mounts, just like a pal/blk.
The Stonescribe Library (Monastery, area 9):
Looking through this entry, if I understand correctly, it seems to me that the columns trundle around and light in the room forms the magical equivalent of a holographic projection depending on what configuration the pillars are arranged in and what speed they're spinning at. What sort of rolls will it take for PCs to work out how the system functions, and to attempt to find information that they want, on the subjects of the Monastery, Glimmerhold, or of anything else? Is there any danger of being crushed by tops to a careful/experienced user during normal function of the library, when vengeful spirits are not causing the pillars to career around the room?
If the monastery has been around for thousands of years, I'm seeing opportunities here for ancient information stored in the library to serve as hooks if woven into a homebrew campaign.
(Assuming for post adventure use that the library survives relatively intact and can be restored to original shape and function.)
P.18
Spinning Columns (trap) wrote:
...At the beginning of the next combat round after its activation, eah stne column moves to a random emoty alcove (roll d8 to determine which) using the shortest available path...
There are four columns according to the information, but I see only 10 alcoves on the 'Monastery' map, and 12 (or maybe 13, depending on where the location starts) on The Agronach map. Should there be two extra alcoves on the monastery map, or does the transformation to Agronach cause extra alcoves to appear and the gearing necessary to move the columns into the new alcoves? (If the correct number of alcoves for the 'Monastery' version of the room is show, is only d6 rolled for the trap during 'monastery' activation of it?)
Combat Gearbrooch of shielding (25 charges), gloves of dexterity+2, monk's belt; all three of these items are ghostly representations of real items and vanish if the Manyfaced One is slain. Their real counterparts are located in areas 9, 4, and 7 respectively.
I cannot find any mention of the monk's belt in the entry for area 7. Where is it in area 7, and how does the radical transformation of that area in particular affect its location?
On the subject of area 7, what effect does the post-transformation 'alchemical saliva' and 'moving teeth' have on those present in the area (including the resident guiltgorger giants, assuming that they remain in the area after the transformation)?
P. 26
I am unclear what the combat gear for a doomguide is, since it is not listed. I assume from the offence line that it includes a masterwork lance, but I have no idea what the armour is. From the number given in the AC line, of '+8', it appears to be full plate, but is it masterwork like the lance or is it something more outlandish? The listed Dex of the doomguide is 14, but only '+1' is counted in the AC line from Dex, and the Initiative listed is +0. If the armour is regular full plate armour, I could see the Dex bonus to AC being restricted to +1 (and also the bonus to any Dex related skills too) but I do not see why the Initiative listed is +0, and if the armour is masterwork full plate, then it will surely allow a +2 Dex bonus?
My current interest in the doomguide stat block relates to an experiment I am carrying out attempting to upgrade it to a Beta version with two additional levels of fighter; I am thinking of adding the Dazzling Display and Stunning Defence feats, and ramping up the Intimidate score as much as possible, since it seems to me that doomguides are supposed to be out to scare people witless before closing in for the slaughter...
Glimmerhold map situation update:
The Paizo Blog of Wednesday, 4th March, 2009 featured mention of the Clash of the Kingslayers module, and a map/cross-section; whilst I am unsure how to link to specific Paizo blog entries, I can duplicate the link given to Paizo's official Glimmerhold map/cross-section: *jpg image link*
Doomguide conversion progressing slowly; the loss of synergy bonuses and the armour check penalties applying to Ride in Beta is hurting the Ride skill, and I'm probably looking at burning one of the additional feats gained in the conversion to increase the Ride skill.
Doomguide conversion progressing slowly; the loss of synergy bonuses and the armour check penalties applying to Ride in Beta is hurting the Ride skill, and I'm probably looking at burning one of the additional feats gained in the conversion to increase the Ride skill.
Actually, the armor check penalty to Ride only applies to fast mount/dismount in Beta. Even though the main skill table shows Ride has an armor check penalty, the main skill description on p.70 clarifies this to just fast mount/dismount.
I'm surprised the loss of synergy bonuses has that much affect - the additional +3 for all class skills usually makes up for the loss of synergy bonuses, at least in the conversions I've done.
And regarding the full plate, the max Dex bonus to AC should be +1. As for initiative, go ahead and bump it up to +2. Small errors always make it into stat blocks, particularly if minor stats are changed during editing. Or make it +1 to represent the ebon ram's initiative.
Doomguide conversion progressing slowly; the loss of synergy bonuses and the armour check penalties applying to Ride in Beta is hurting the Ride skill, and I'm probably looking at burning one of the additional feats gained in the conversion to increase the Ride skill.
Actually, the armor check penalty to Ride only applies to fast mount/dismount in Beta. Even though the main skill table shows Ride has an armor check penalty, the main skill description on p.70 clarifies this to just fast mount/dismount.
I'm surprised the loss of synergy bonuses has that much affect - the additional +3 for all class skills usually makes up for the loss of synergy bonuses, at least in the conversions I've done.
And regarding the full plate, the max Dex bonus to AC should be +1. As for initiative, go ahead and bump it up to +2. Small errors always make it into stat blocks, particularly if minor stats are changed during editing. Or make it +1 to represent the ebon ram's initiative.
As far as I know, the Beta starts off with only 1 skill rank max investable in any skill at 1st level, unlike the 4 allowable in 3.5. Starting out able to put three ranks less in a skill cancels out gaining a +3 bonus if it is a class skill and you have ranks in it, if the DC of a check otherwise remains the same.
Being down a +2 synergy bonus is equivelent to a shift of approximately 10% in terms of a d20 roll if I recall my maths correctly.
Am I correct in thinking that raising an ability score by means such as level increase does NOT retroactively imbue a character with additional skill ranks in the Beta for earlier levels taken?
I'm working on the basis that the doomguides start out as 1st level dwarf commoners, but then get recruited, gain the half-fiend template (and an Intelligence boost) and start taking Fighter levels.
The location of Glimmerhold seems vague (the rim of the Mindspin Mountains, though that's a very large area!). It may be intentionally so but I'm just curious. We're running Clash of the Kingslayers as a side-quest to CotCT and are thinking of putting it near Crystalrock in Varisia since that seems reasonable trading distance to Janderhoff.
The location of Glimmerhold seems vague (the rim of the Mindspin Mountains, though that's a very large area!). It may be intentionally so but I'm just curious. We're running Clash of the Kingslayers as a side-quest to CotCT and are thinking of putting it near Crystalrock in Varisia since that seems reasonable trading distance to Janderhoff.
Glimmerhold can't be in Varisia, because the city is famous for adamantine (p. 4) and Riddleport is the only place in Varisia with forges hot enough to smelt adamantine (Second Darkness Player's Guide, p. 20).
I think that it's on the Eastern slopes of the Mindspins, but I'd love to know its official location.
Sean/Christine:
I see a Headband of Intelligence +2 listed in Helrún's possession, and a Fox's Cunning listed in her combat preparations suite.
Now the stats listed seem to suggest to me that a 8/10/12/13/14/15 array has been used to generate Helrún, and that the Headband of Intelligence has been factored into the listed 'base stats', but in that case why does the Fox's Cunning raise her Intelligence by 4 points, to 22, given that the Headband is an enhancement bonus, the Fox's Cunning is an enchancement bonus, and as far as I know enhancement bonuses to the same ability score do not stack with one another usually - only the current highest modifier applies?
It's not really errata, but I would point out that there's a pretty sweet challenge involving using ranks in perform, and none of the pregens have them. It might have been better to chuck in a pregen with that, given how seldom it does feature in modules; additionally, the lack of it means that the pregens are at a significant disadvantage in one of the coolest parts.
I don't use the pregens -- in fact, I resent the space they take up in every module and AP -- but it seems to me that if that space is to be committed, that the pregens should be selected to cope with the less usual parts of the adventure.
It's not really errata, but I would point out that there's a pretty sweet challenge involving using ranks in perform, and none of the pregens have them. It might have been better to chuck in a pregen with that, given how seldom it does feature in modules; additionally, the lack of it means that the pregens are at a significant disadvantage in one of the coolest parts.
I don't use the pregens -- in fact, I resent the space they take up in every module and AP -- but it seems to me that if that space is to be committed, that the pregens should be selected to cope with the less usual parts of the adventure.
They all use the iconics as pregens. Much as I dislike them even more than I hate the idea of different pregens, one wonders why they didn't include the one with ranks in perform.
We try to rotate which iconics we use, while still keeping in mind what each is good and and how that relates to the challenges in the adventure. That's why undead-heavy Hungry are the Dead has both Kyra and Seelah (good for killing undead).
The Perform challenge in Clash was only a small part of the adventure, and even if none of the PCs are good at Perform it's not like failing that challenge will cause them to die (unlike a challenge that requires disabling a deadly trap with no rogue iconic).
I know that it's a balance, but it seems to me that the effects of losing the (as I recall) three perform checks aren't insignificant, either. Not to mention that having basically having no one set up for them is pretty incongruous, given how unusual (in a cool way) that challenge was; it's a nice non-combat element of the module and the pregen party is going to blow at it.
Sean/Christine:
Urgent question. Does an official coat of arms exist (or a description of one) for Glimmerhold, or may I employ my native wit (such as it is) and consult with specialists in heraldry to devise one?
There is not an official version. Christine may have ideas about what it should look like, but you should do whatever you feel is right for your campaign. :)
The idea I am likely to be working from will be a group of three hammers & anvils in the bottom of the shield (for the aristocracy, merchants, and workers of Glimmerhold), a dwarven waraxe in the middle, and a black dragon (or maybe just the head) for the top. (The latter standing for the current king's dragon slaying deeds.)
Given the difficulties of converting Helrún who loses domain spells in Beta conversion with ramifications for her spell-casting strategies and tactics, I have given up on attempting a full Beta conversion of S1.
The work I have done and practically completed is on the Doomguide Valkyrie which I post here, spoiler-tagged:
Spoiler:
Doomguide CR6
Female half-fiend dwarf commoner 1/fighter 6
LE Medium outsider (augmented humanoid, native)
Init +2; Senses darkvision 60ft.; Perception +12 (+14 on taste and touch based, or to notice unusual stonework)
Defence
AC 24, touch 12, flat-footed 22
(+9 armour, +2 Dex, +1 natural, +2 shield)
hp 64 (6d10+1d6+28)
Fort +9, Ref +4, Will +6; +2 racial bonus against spells and spell-like effects; +2 Bravery bonus to Will saves against fear
Defensive Abilities Defensive training +4 dodge bonus to AC against monsters with the giant type, harvest the doomed (60 ft.), stability; Resist acid 10, cold 10, electricity 10, fire 10; Immune poison; Armour training (1); Bravery
Offence
Spd 20ft. (mount fly 50ft., good)
Melee mwk lance +14 (1d8+6/x3); +1 against orcs and goblinoids
Space 5ft.; Reach 5ft. (10ft. with lance)
Special Attacks terrifying charge, smite good
Tactics
Before Combat The doomguide moves into a position from where a charge is possible, utilizing her mount’s fly speed. If there is a large crowd of civilians available, the doomguide will ‘grandstand’, using Dazzling Display to make an intimidation check to demoralise, before charging in.
Against a small group of obvious seasoned guards or adventurers, the doomguide will simply close for combat straight away.
During Combat A doomguide’s most powerful ability is a spirited charge combined with the terrifying charge special ability. She tries to employ it as often as possible (dealing 2d8+12 damage) adding her smite attack if able (for a total of 2d8+26 damage). Also, her mount is capable of making attacks and even shoving opponents around the battlefield via its Improved Bull Rush feat (Bull Rush +12 or +14 on a charge).
Morale If reduced to below 15 hit points, the doomguide tries to use the Ride-By Attack feat until she is able to kill an opponent and gain hit points via her harvest the doomed ability.
Statistics
Str 20, Dex, 14, Con 18, Int 16, Wis 15, Cha 8
Base Atk +6; CMB +11
Feats Animal Affinity, Dazzling Display, Intimidating Prowess, Iron Will, Mounted Combat, Ride-By Attack, Spirited Charge, Weapon Focus lance)
Skills Appraise +3 (+6 if related to nonmagical precious metals or gemstones), Handle Animal +11, Intimidate +14, Perception +12, Profession (various) +6 (+8 if related to stone), Ride +14 (+10 if armour check penalty applies), Swim +8
Languages Common, Dwarven, Giant, Orc, Terran
SQ stonecunning, weapon familiarity, weapon training (lance) +1
Combat Gear masterwork full plate armour, masterwork lance
Special Abilities
Harvest the Doomed (Su) A doomguide is constantly surrounded by an invisible vortex that draws fragments of souls into Hell. Anytime a living creature within 60 feet of a doomguide dies, this vortex severs a piece of the creature’s soul and sends it to the doomguide’s patron. If the dead creature was intelligent and had at least 1 HD, the nearest injured doomguide heals 5 hit points per HD of the dead creature.
Smite Good (Su) Once per day, a doomguide can make a normal melee attack to deal 5 extra points of damage against a good foe.
Terrifying Charge (Su) When charging into the fray, a doomguide is fuelled by divine wrath that strikes terror into the hearts of her enemies. The target of her first attack during a charge must make a Will save (DC equal to her attack roll) or be panicked for 1 round. This is a mind-affecting fear effect.
Doomguide Blessing In exchange for their immortal souls, the doomguides gain a modified fiendish template. Instead of wings, natural attacks, and sell-like abilities they gain the harvest the doomed and terrifying charge abilities and can call an ebon steed to serve as a mount.
Ebon Steed the flying rams have the statistics of heavy warhorses, fly speeds of 50 feet (good), the extraplanar subtype, and the Power Attack and Improved Bull Rush feats instead of Endurance and Run. Estimated bonus to Fly skill Checks for and Ebon Steed is +12. (4 ranks for HD, class skill for +3, dex bonus +1, and a racial bonus +4 for being a (good) flier.)
Apologies for any (UK) English spellings, employed to pacify my spell-checker.
Basically I increased the Fighter levels by two to maintain CR parity under the Beta system, spending extra feats on Animal Affinity, and intimidate related things - the latter on the basis that part of the doomguide's reason to exist is to terrify the living daylights out of those 'sinners' who merit such punishment as flights of doomguides.
The loss of the synergy bonus to Ride from the ranks in Handle Animal worried me sufficiently that I went with the Animal Affinity choice, rather than Stunning Defence, the natural progression from Dazzling Display. If I had had the time I might have statted up a 'doomguide lieutenant' perhaps a couple of Fighter levels higher and with the Stunning Defence feat. In those fights with a lieutenant present, the tactics before the fight would change slightly, the normal doomguides making 'aid another' efforts to improve their lieutenant's Intimidate for a use of Stunning Defence before the group charges in for combat. (Imagined as something like the normal doomguides rattling their lances on their shields whilst their leader brandishes her lance and lets forth a terrifying yell/warcry.)
Anyway, I hope that this may be of some interest/use to someone out there.
