I hesitate to offer this up, but I certainly hope we can discuss this without it turning into a flame war.
Yep, the holidays approach. In the spirit of the same can't we find common ground - atheist and believer? Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays? Secular and religious?
Some may find this intrusive, but does it really have that much impact on how you choose to celebrate or not?
To the mods - If this has blown up in the past pls feel free to delete and accept my apologies.
Secular, religious...it's all still "Bah, humbug" to me. My fondness for Christmas waned with every year past childhood.
That quote from the article where the AFA president asks "How do we define 'good' if we don't believe in God?" just rolled me. So according to this guy's definition, anyone who isn't Christian can't possibly know right from wrong because they don't read the Bible. That man needs to take a philosophy class...
That quote from the article where the AFA president asks "How do we define 'good' if we don't believe in God?" just rolled me. So according to this guy's definition, anyone who isn't Christian can't possibly know right from wrong because they don't read the Bible. That man needs to take a philosophy class...
It is a silly comment because society teaches you good vs. bad just by the framework of laws. Nobody really 'owns' them. They arise out of the need to survive as a group. Do they mirror the Bible? Yes. But are they mutually exclusive? No.
I think it boils down to - Should they/can they evolve as society does?
Also, should we strive to be so PC that we sacrifice those elements that make us what we are? Applicable to all sides.
Holidays always evolve . you think Christmas started out as a celebration of Jesus or with Santa close? what about the xmas tree or gifts? All of that was added a bit at a time and it all does change over time.
I celebrate xmas, but not any of the current christian parts. I put my tree up I light up my house I like Santa and gifts and xmas elves.
I also celebrate yule , but just because I am not christian does not mean I dont enjoy are little Americana traditions of xmas
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The funny thing about Christmas, it's not just a Christian holiday... it came about on the day it did as a compromise between pagan ( winter solstice ) and Christian beliefs (birth of Christ sometime in January) it allowed the communities of that time to celebrate in harmony and gave them common ground, wich helped in the political field as well,granting the powers that be more control over people.So yeah compromise and peaceful co-exsitence can happen....
It was it a roman emperor... I forget who but one resin it is always the 25th was because that was the day solace was on that year.
I'd like to see people stop splitting hairs about what religion it does or doesn't have ties to, or whether it has ties at all. If people would focus more on the social aspects it would be better for everyone. Who can't agree that themes of giving, celebration, sharing time with family and friends, and thinking about others before yourself are worth taking at least one day a year to focus on?
Post which has becom misplaced from the generic post thread.
Post asserting that Luke Skywalker is the supreme being.
Post asserting that Gargamel is the supreme being.
Post asserting that the smurfs are in favour of Luke Skywalker.
Post asserting that Darth Vader is supporting Gargamel.
Post by Jedi claiming that Darth Vader and Luke Skywalker are actually on the same side, and that it is Emperor Palpatine everyone needs to worry about.
Post by Emperor Palpatine observing that he has only ever acted for the general good.
Posts involving much paranoid finger-pointing and accusations of 'insulting intent'.
Post by confused smurf asserting that good does not involve any kind of religions at all but involves drinking alcoholic beverages and lying under mushrooms.
Posts by people from all sides dogpiling the smurf.
Flamewar.
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
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Is the question whether to say "Merry Christmas" or "Happy Holidays"?
C'mon. Say whichever is in your heart and receive others' wishes as they were given.
It only really becomes a question when it is taxpayers' money being spent on the message. In which case, ask yourself how much of your tax dollars you want spent on Eid ul-Fitr.
That quote from the article where the AFA president asks "How do we define 'good' if we don't believe in God?" just rolled me. So according to this guy's definition, anyone who isn't Christian can't possibly know right from wrong because they don't read the Bible. That man needs to take a philosophy class...
Maybe true; however, the very ad pictured in the OP's article implies that the religious can't possibly understand doing good because when the religous do good, it is not in response to the concept, but an action precipitated by an outside force (God). Stereotyping is not confined to only one side of the aisle...
I think if everyone calmed down and didn't go all alpha-male on the other side whenever this sort of thing comes up, believing their beliefs are threatened, we may be able find some common ground somewhere.
"Good" as a concept does not have to be confined to a single belief system. One does not have to acknowledge a God to recognize good and evil. One does not have to be an atheist to perform good for its own sake. We all want the human race to advance and evolve; it would seem the difference comes in the methodology...
Yes. Good points all.
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I don't fully understand their point. Are they trying to squash freedom of religion?
It feels too much (often on both sides) that they are trying to "promote" goodness by promoting hate.
EDIT: And the whole "Christmas is a Christian holiday" really annoys me. I really don't care -- I'll enjoy it regardless. But the truth is that Christmas is not a Biblical holiday at all. No one knows what day Jesus was born. And most (all?) of the traditions typically associated with Christmas have rather Pagan origins.
That's the quandary. Too often by promoting something you're not promoting something else. Sometime opposites, but not always.
A coworker used to wish me Happy Hanukkah. I'd wish him a Merry Christmas. Neither offended the other, as we were genuinely offering each other good wishes.
I think as a society we need to focus more on the intent than the words used, but I realize that sometimes it's hard to gauge intent. Some read offense into everything. That doesn't help.
Look for the positive this season!
Maybe true; however, the very ad pictured in the OP's article implies that the religious can't possibly understand doing good because when the religous do good, it is not in response to the concept, but an action precipitated by an outside force (God). Stereotyping is not confined to only one side of the aisle...
Very true. Assuming that persons of religious bent cannot reason the good is to invalidate great thinkers like Thomas Aquinas, St. Augustine, DeCartes, and Kant, to name a few.
I think if everyone calmed down and didn't go all alpha-male on the other side whenever this sort of thing comes up, believing their beliefs are threatened, we may be able find some common ground somewhere.
I've always wondered when we got so thin-skinned. Everyone gets offended by everything. Then the inevitable lawsuit and large monetary payments for mental anguish ensue and...ah, there we go. Now I understand.
I think as a society we need to focus more on the than the words used, but I realize that sometimes it's hard to gauge intent. Some read offense into everything. That doesn't help.
Yes! Intent! This is a subject I've been trying to get my students to understand for days now. You've possibly hit upon a fundamental flaw in our society. Everyone is so wrapped up in their own subjective view of things (i.e how that makes me feel) they ignore the original, objective intent of the words or actions they are so offended by in the first place.
Jeremy is correct.