RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32
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Hello!
I'm currently planning for a one shot, to be run October 25th and I need some advice/info:
How long does a typical encounter take in 4e? We're running 6th level PCs with around 4-6 players and I need to be able to make sure that I have enough encounters prepped for the time I have without having to scramble to make new ones on the spot. Any assistance would be welcomed!
Thanks!
Hello!
I'm currently planning for a one shot, to be run October 25th and I need some advice/info:
How long does a typical encounter take in 4e? We're running 6th level PCs with around 4-6 players and I need to be able to make sure that I have enough encounters prepped for the time I have without having to scramble to make new ones on the spot. Any assistance would be welcomed!
Thanks!
I ran the Kobold Hall adventure on the weekend with 3 PC's( Cleric, Fighter, Rogue) and an NPC cleric( didn't do a great deal to be honest I kept forgetting him).
The first encounter( I created myself)was in the ruins above the hall where there were 2 Kobold Minions and a Kobolt Skirmisher. The Rogue tangled with them and managed to kill them with a bit of trouble and the rest of the group who were waiting at the hills bottom hearing a skirmish headed up so I set in 2 more minions and 3 skirmishers. Two of the skirmishers died along with the minions. 1 escaped to alert the rest. After this the adventure ran as per the book.
The group went through the enrance room (with a green pool)which was entertaining encounter.
The next encounter in the tomb/come Tiamat alter room,
Then the skull trap room encounter. The party finished the Kobolds and their Drake pets before we had to finish.
All in all it ran pretty well in 2 hours for the 4 encounters.
The players seemed to enjoy it, some more than others. The fighter had used a number of his healing surges but looks to have enough to finish the adventure. The priest was getting stuck in especially on the last encounter.
The rogue(halfling) was all over the place but aiding the group with flanks whilst enjoying himself tumbling past enemies.
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32
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The big thing to keep in mind is that if this is the first time people are playing 4E - or even if they have played before, but aren't familiar with their characters - combats will often be slower than expected.
I've generally found that combats go between 30-45 minutes, but it could be an hour or more if people are unfamiliar with their characters. (Of course, you can make various preparations to help with this, via well-detailed character sheets and power listings and the like.)
What I'd recomend doing is including some 'optional' fights in your adventure - that way, if things are going quickly, you bring in the extra fights. If not, if fights are taking longer than expected, than just keep things moving along towards the end.
Thanks for this. I'm planning on creating several encounters and only using the ones we have time for, since that's the limiting factor here. We're also planning a "Dry Run" adventure that will be played as a boot camp scenario with no chance of death or dismemberment in the very beginning of the game to get people acquainted with the rules without actually killing them... 30-45 mins is very helpful!
Hello!
I'm currently planning for a one shot, to be run October 25th and I need some advice/info:
How long does a typical encounter take in 4e? We're running 6th level PCs with around 4-6 players and I need to be able to make sure that I have enough encounters prepped for the time I have without having to scramble to make new ones on the spot. Any assistance would be welcomed!
Thanks!
The big thing to keep in mind is that if this is the first time people are playing 4E - or even if they have played before, but aren't familiar with their characters - combats will often be slower than expected.
I've generally found that combats go between 30-45 minutes, but it could be an hour or more if people are unfamiliar with their characters. (Of course, you can make various preparations to help with this, via well-detailed character sheets and power listings and the like.)
What I'd recomend doing is including some 'optional' fights in your adventure - that way, if things are going quickly, you bring in the extra fights. If not, if fights are taking longer than expected, than just keep things moving along towards the end.
Totally agree with this statement, PC's need to have their powers written in front of them so they get to grips with the format. The other thing I'd also say, a lot of the critters do seem to have too many HP's. The Kobolds Skirmishers I mentioned above had 27 HP which sometimes threatened to drag some of the minor encounters out so they dropped when they hit 20 points of damage on the odd times to keep things flowing. It also means the players don't know how many HP's the enemy will have.
After all minions have 1 HP, why not give them 10 on occasion, not too often though.Just run the game to keep a flow, if the encounter is starting to drag a bit drop the HP's. After all kobolds have always been pretty weak in encounters.
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Most encounters I've run so far have been in the 1 hour to 1.5 hour range. That being said, I am terrible about skewing towards harder encounters. I find that the biggest slow down comes from the player's side of the table - they really need to know their abilities cold. NPCing a PC can also result in a greater slow down more than you might expect due to the learning curve.
Also, if you plan to stick with 4e, I strongly recommend investing in the Alea magnetic disks to track the various conditions. In the short term, you should grab some red poker chips or checkers to use for tracking the bloodied condition. A large number of abilities trigger off of or improve depending on the target's condition, and having a visual representation is important for that. If you've got a pallie or fighter, you should probably use some type of token to indicate which creature is marked. Otherwise, it's very easy to forget who is marked.
The Alea disks are great for tracking status. We currently use them to track bloodied, harmful effects that end when you save, beneficial effects that last until end of the next turn, and marks/curses. You could slice and dice it further if you buy a larger collection (e.g., have a specific color designated for slow, one for incapacitated, etc), but we have found just tracking that handful of effects speeds up play. We bought a 10 pack of reds and one of their variety packs and it has been well worth the investment.
Edit: One minor disclaimer - the Alea magnets are powerful and have a tendancy to push each other away. This is annoying, but not enough to make them non-functional.
Good ideas from the pony lord, Sebastian. I think I'll bring some red poker chips to my next game to track bloodied.
We already use pennies or beads to show which enemies are "marked", but having a visual representation on the board to show who is bloodied would save a lot of time asking "which one of these guys is damaged again?"
If you take a look around the Internet, you will find that lots of people have made 4e power "cards" which can be printed out. They can be formatted to print on index cards, or just printed 6 or 8 on a normal sheet of paper. I don't have a link handy at the moment. I remember some discussions on these boards about 4e power cards so with a little searching you should find it. For my group, each player has a sheet or two with the cards printed on (colour coded, which is nice), so that they have a quick and easy way to look at their powers. In my opinion, these are great and save a ton of time.
We've had good luck with Pipe Cleaners. Cut one in thirds, make a loop, and drape it over the mini to show conditions.
Bloodied is Red.
Dying is Black.
The Paladin's Marking is Yellow.
The Cleric/Fighter's Marking is Brown.
My Ranger's Hunter's Quarry is Green.
The Warlock's Curse is Purple.
Sure, if the Paladin's marked one of my quarries, who's been cursed by the Warlock and is now bloodied, the mini looks like it's just stepped off the plane in Hawai'i.
Let'see, last "game day" adventure we created was for 5th level characters.
1) Cross the rope bridge, with 2 Chokers, 3 Hobgoblin Archers and 1 Hobgoblin Warcaster. Took a little while (~1hr), the Chokers pull the bridge down, dropping some PCs into the bottom of the cavern, while others tried to jump across (or Feystep), separating the party into 3 groups, which didn't allow concentration of firepower.
2) Hear the oncoming Hobgoblin reinforcements as you're going down the corridor, so the PCs can set up an ambush in a room, turning the tables on the Reinforcements (1 Dire Wolf, 1 leader type Hobgobo, 3 bugbears). Fight went fast, ~30 minutes. I was surprised about how fast it went, honestly.
3) Boss fight, Deathlock Wight with 2 shadowhunter bats and 3 dark creepers. Fight was unimpressive on both sides, no undead meant the Deathlock couldn't use all his powers, and the dark creepers work best with combat advantage. Fight took ~1hour, due to hit and run tactics of all parties.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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2) Hear the oncoming Hobgoblin reinforcements as you're going down the corridor, so the PCs can set up an ambush in a room, turning the tables on the Reinforcements (1 Dire Wolf, 1 leader type Hobgobo, 3 bugbears). Fight went fast, ~30 minutes. I was surprised about how fast it went, honestly.
Interesting set-up. Were there specific actions the PCs could take to set up the ambush, or was it more just giving them sufficient time to hide?
I use red pipe cleaners for tracking Bloodied condition - Cut a single pipe cleaner into three equal pieces and twist each into a loop.
For all other conditions, I make notations next to the PC's or creature's name on the initiative tracker. Too many different markers on the board gets too confusing.
For a four- to five-hour session, I find that three encounters, plus either a decent intro (more than just a one-minute "You've been asked to ...") or else a short role-playing/investigative scene, is about right.
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Contributor
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I second Sebastian's comments about the alea tools. As an alternative, it is possible to get 1 inch poker chips in a variety of colours (I bought a bunch from Paizo, but I don't think they carry them any more). If you need, you can stick them on the bottom of a mini with blue-tack or something similar. But Alea tools are better.
Interesting set-up. Were there specific actions the PCs could take to set up the ambush, or was it more just giving them sufficient time to hide?
2) Hear the oncoming Hobgoblin reinforcements as you're going down the corridor, so the PCs can set up an ambush in a room, turning the tables on the Reinforcements (1 Dire Wolf, 1 leader type Hobgobo, 3 bugbears). Fight went fast, ~30 minutes. I was surprised about how fast it went, honestly.
Both. We put a wide portion of a corridor, with some ledges and stuff a bit before the actual encounter. Drawing it on the map triggered a "Oh crap, it's an ambush," reaction. When there was no ambush, they relaxed and headed on, then found out about the oncoming forces.
They took the hint (good players), fell back to the prepared terrain and then set up an ambush. Had them make some stealth rolls, the people who could roll helped the people that couldn't, waited till they got ready (they remembered at the last minute to douse the lights) and toddled the bad guys into the middle of the trap.
The PCs got a big charge out of being the proactive ones for a change, they were excited and that made things go fast. I think it really made the session.
I thought the bridge was going to be the encounter they were talking about afterwards, but nope, it was the ambush.
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I second Sebastian's comments about the alea tools. As an alternative, it is possible to get 1 inch poker chips in a variety of colours (I bought a bunch from Paizo, but I don't think they carry them any more). If you need, you can stick them on the bottom of a mini with blue-tack or something similar. But Alea tools are better.
I have used thin foam sheets cut into 1-inch squares to indicated conditions. They come in a variety of colors and you can get them in a craft store in fairly large sheets for like 2 bucks apiece. I used them in a convention game playtest this last weekend and they worked great.
During my game, by far the biggest time-sink was the players figuring out what their powers did and what options to do. Half the group had never played 4e, and one had never played an RPG before. There were seven players and the first combat took nearly two hours, as people suddenly realized it was their turns and scrambled to figure out which power was best to use.
The next two encounters went faster, and I was able to get three encounters (including the 2 hour one) in roughly four hours. A smaller group more used to 4e can definately do it faster. If the players are new to 4e, expect them to freeze up at first, deciding on what powers to use. Once they get confortable, it will go quicker.