Contributor
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I am looking for a specific reference in the core rules that provides guidance on how long a character who requires sleep can go without sleep before experiencing negative consequences.
I have a party who has been travelling all day and fought through the night without resting. I don't see any reason to impose penalties on them for missing one night of sleep (beyond the lack of ability to regain spells, etc.), but I'm wondering how long a character can actually go without resting.
There are plenty of special attacks, spells, and abilities, that cause a character to become fatigued/exhausted, but they don't really apply to the natural fatigue due to lack of sleep.
Is there such a rule? If so, where is it? If people are house ruling this one, I'd be interested in hearing what you are doing. My players haven't asked about this, but I'd like to have an answer ready when/if they do.
Thanks!
I would say one night without sleep per Constitution modifier.
You can ask for a Constitution check for each night : DC10 +5 per night.
Each failed check brings a fatigue factor : fatigued, exhausted.
On a failed check on a exhausted condition, the character collapses.
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I do remember seeing a rule for this, though I cannot remember where. It was something along the lines of after the first 24 hours, you need to make a DC 10 con check, adding +1 to the DC every hour, or become fatigued after the first fail, exhausted after the second, and then unconscious after the third fail. But that sounds a bit harsh, as it would be impossible to stay a few nights up. Maybe make the check every night until they become exhausted, then make the check every hour?
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Contributor
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Wow! Thanks for the rapid reply!
I can tell this is going to be one of those mental exercises I go through where I create a rule that isn't likely to be used very often. But sometimes that can be fun. Here's my basic premise, based on a very small amount of research on actual sleep deprivation.
Any character or monster that is not immune to sleep must sleep for a period of time each night in order to regain hit points and to support study of magic spells. Prolonged lack of sleep can have serious consequences for any creature whose physiology requires rest.
- Any character of average health can go one night without sleep and suffer no ill effects. Characters with lower constitution must sleep every night.
- The effects are both mental and physical and get progressively worse as time without sleep goes on. (Lack of sleep doesn't just make you weak and clumsy. It affects your thinking, perception, and social interaction, as well.)
- An average person will begin to suffer at least minor physical and mental effects after about 2 days.
- Death can occur after a person has not slept for two weeks or more. However, a person's body will likely collapse into unconsciousness before that happens.
- Damage incurred from lack of sleep cannot be regained in a single night of sleep.
The question is how to translate this into game mechanics, keeping in mind that this is a fantasy setting and not real life. I'm leaning toward something like the following rule. This is a very rough draft, though:
House Rule: Sleep Deprivation
A character can go a number of nights without sleep equal to 1 + Con modifier before suffering any ill effects. Characters whose Con modifiers reduce the number to 0 or lower must sleep every night.
After that time, the character suffers a cumulative -1 penalty to all rolls for each night without sleep. When the total penalty reaches -3, the character must begin making daily Fortitude saves (DC 12+number of days without sleep). Characters who fail the save are fatigued, in addition to previous penalties. The penalty to all rolls applies to these Fortitude saves, as well.
When the penalty reaches -6, the character must begin making hourly Fortitude saves (DC 12+number of days without sleep). Characters who are already fatigued become exhausted. Otherwise, they become fatigued.
Once the penalty equals the character's Constitution score, the character is automatically fatigued (or exhausted, if previously fatigued) and must make two Fortitude saves each hour:
- The first save is made against a DC equal to 20+number of days awake. Failure indicates that the character immediately falls asleep, no matter what activity they are currently engaged in.
- The second save is made against a DC 12+number of days awake. Failure indicates that the character suffers 1 point of damage to each ability score. Characters who manage to stay awake long enough can literally kill themselves.
A sleep deprived character cannot heal damage normally. Although magical healing can keep such a character alive, the penalties will eventually leave the character unable to accomplish most tasks.
When a sleep deprived character finally gets to rest, the penalty to all rolls decreases by a number equal to his or her Con modifier for each 8-hour night of rest (minimum of 1 per night). Ability damage is healed normally. A lesser restoration spell cuts the penalty in half and reduces fatigue and exhaustion per the spell description, while a restoration or greater restoration spell eliminate the penalties altogether.
If a sleep deprived character rests, but then goes without sleep for more than one night before all previous penalties have been removed, the deprivation cycle resumes at the current level of penalties.
I'm standing by for holes to be punched in this. I think the first criticism could easily be that it's too complicated, but I'm sure there're more problems than that.
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well, have you ever taken a look at the Exhausted condition? -6 to strength and dexterity and not being able to run or charge seems like enough of a penalty. Try to avoid giving ability damage for things like this, save that for monster abilities, poisons, diseases, and magic. I'd say you did a pretty decent job of making a rule on the fly for this.
This opens it up for a spell to make a person able to go without sleep for 1 day (I do believe I saw a spell for this in another game, which is probably where I saw the sleep deprivation rules). Useful for those times when you need to stay up all night to stand guard, study a monolith, or what have you.
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Contributor
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Thanks for the feedback and for the compliment. New rules usually aren't my forte.
I actually looked at the fatigued and exhausted conditions, first. The only problem I see with them is that they only cover the outward physical symptoms of sleep deprivation. There is a huge cognitive and physiological impact, as well.
Maybe it would be easier to simply work it in stages:
Stage 1 (1 + Con mod) nights without sleep: No penalty
Stage 2 (2 + Con mod) and beyond: Fort save (DC 12 + nights without sleep) or fatigued plus -2 penalty to Intelligence and Wisdom
Stage 3 After fatigued: Staying up requires daily Fort save (same DC) or become exhausted plus -6 penalty to Intelligence and Wisdom, plus save hourly to avoid falling asleep (even if in the middle of an action)
This removes the deadliness of extreme sleep deprivation, but since the rule won't be used that often, perhaps that part's not necessary (or can be played "by ear" for those scenes where the messenger has forced himself to travel overland for several days, then falls dead from exhaustion as he delivers the missive...or whatever).
I think the penalties proposed are too light; a person could go a full week with only a -6 to rolls? I know D&D should be heroic, but that's pushing it for me... especially when studies indicate that driving home after an 18-hour shift is equivalent to driving drunk, except due to mental fatigue.
I wrote rules for this at some point, right after I read a big sleep deprivation study. Have to see if I can dredge them up.
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Contributor
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Cool. I'd like to see them.
As for the penalties in the above concept being too light, you may be right. The -1 penalty per day has a bigger impact, but gets mathematically complicated as the days go by.
For the time being, at least, I think I'll be sticking with my first cut on the rule. Assuming the issue even comes up, it's not likely to get to a point where ability damage would become a problem.
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The closest that I can find in the Rules As Written concerning what happens is:
Forced March: In a day of normal walking, a character walks for 8 hours. The rest of the daylight time is spent making and breaking camp, resting, and eating.
A character can walk for more than 8 hours in a day by making a forced march. For each hour of marching beyond 8 hours, a Constitution check (DC 10, +2 per extra hour) is required. If the check fails, the character takes 1d6 points of nonlethal damage. A character who takes any nonlethal damage from a forced march becomes fatigued. Eliminating the nonlethal damage also eliminates the fatigue. It’s possible for a character to march into unconsciousness by pushing himself too hard.
Fatigued: A fatigued character can neither run nor charge and takes a –2 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. Doing anything that would normally cause fatigue causes the fatigued character to become exhausted. After 8 hours of complete rest, fatigued characters are no longer fatigued.
Exhausted: An exhausted character moves at half speed and takes a –6 penalty to Strength and Dexterity. After 1 hour of complete rest, an exhausted character becomes fatigued. A fatigued character becomes exhausted by doing something else that would normally cause fatigue.
I would rule that combat would cause a fatigued character to become exhausted...
-That One Digitalelf Fellow-
Can't seem to find my original rules -- probably on the back of a cocktail napkin somewhere. I did find a variant I'd proposed that reduces the amount of time, but eliminates tracking penalties:
Remain Awake: A character can stay awake a number of hours equal to 24 + his her Constitution modifier. Each additional hour requires an Fortitude save, starting at DC 10 (the DC increases by 1 per subsequent check). If in the midst of combat or a similar situation, the character need not make checks until the situation is over, but the starting DC increases by 1.
There are indeed good amount of reports about this from the army, from people who are typically in good physical shape and so on...reports of hallucinations are quite common, and in couple of days such delightful things like paranoia creeps in. And having paranoid people with weapons and training to kill near you of course does not help to YOUR paranoia...
WIS penalty is in order, though of course good roleplayers can play at least some of this out.