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Now that you mention it, this situation probably does require a Bluff check for the guidance spell, since it seems to almost be like passing a secret message.
For an orison, I imagined both of the verbal and somantic components would be short, since it is an at-will spell-like ability. For guidance in particular I was thinking the touch itself was the somantic component.
That makes sense to me, for Orisons anyway. GM TN?
Devargo creeps me out.
I really need an exclamation other than "Gods and spirits" already.
I think Ayedah is going to wait until after our deal for whatever Devargo knows goes through and then she'll ask about the price for the dragon.
Ayedah, since you look more closely at the room - give me a perception check?
Or do you want it in the IC thread?
Ah, I wasn't sure if it was ok us talking about it while in a IC convo at present, but since it's already come up...
Don't worry Ayedah, Zalen doesn't plan to abandon the poor helpless dragon if he can help it. But I think it has to be done very correctly or Devargo will end up asking way more then we have for it if he thinks we care about it. You can do as you like of course, but if you trust Z to handle it, he will. By the way, Smooth Move on the trap door passing info! And they say Barbarians aren't subtle! ;-)
And everyone else still there?? I fell kinda bad that this is a mostly Zalen show at the moment. I'm trying to get through this tickley situation as quickly and as safely as I can so we can move onto other stuff that involves everyone. Hopefully no one is getting too bored or feeling left out? Alandra, Jillian, Krek? You all still there?
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32
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I see the problem - it is the other major issue i have with the PbP format.
Combat has worked well with my modifications, but all "group vs 1" discussions tend to drag. The best i can do is try to get to the "damn point" quickly, and cut away as much dross as possible.
Any ideas to improve this would be welcome.
I'm totally cool with they way its going now. In situations like this, just because I'm not posting because my character has nothing to do at the moment, doesn't mean I'm not following the thread and enjoying the game.
Glad to hear that Rimrock, it would be the same for me (and has been) in similar situations where someone else is doing most of the talking for a bit. Just hope everyone else feels the same :P
Anyway, I guess if they had any major problems they would (hopefully!) speak up :)
Yeah, it's fine! And for the best too, considering what could happen in there if negotiations go badly.
I'm holding off on posting for a moment. Ayedah's very much in "shut up and listen" mode right now and focusing on keeping an eye out for trouble.
Can you explain the actual Play of the game Terra?
Zalen is pretty sure he doesn't like where this is going though...:P
Ah, thanks Krek! You probably just upped the price of the lil critter for us, :)
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Ooops, got this wrong the last time around. For future reference, here is the complete rules text.
Knivesies is simple to play. Two contestants stand on opposite
ends of a long wooden table. Their right hands are strapped
together with a boiled leather strap, belt pouches are fitted to their
waists, and a dagger is stuck in the tabletop between them. The
game begins after a count of ten, during which time observers
can place bets by tossing gold onto the table and standing at the
end of the table where their chosen fighter stands. As the game
begins, each contestant makes an initiative check.
There are two ways to win Knivesies. You can either force the
other contestant to fall off the table, or you can grab for the gold
and drop it into your pouch. Snatching a fistful of 1d10 coins off the
table is a standard action that provokes an attack of opportunity.
Since each opponent has only one free hand, the first round is
typically a mad lunge for the dagger, forcing the slower opponent
to make grabs for gold. There aren’t any more rules beyond this;
most Knivesies games devolve into tabletop brawls, with the first
person to drop or touch the ground losing.
The game ends once a contestant is unconscious, dead,
or knocked off the table; as soon as no coins remain on the
table; or as soon as any coin is knocked off the table. When the
game ends, an unconscious, dead, or de-tabled contestant is
automatically the loser. Otherwise, the winner is determined by
which person has the most coins in his pouch. At the end of the
game, all money is emptied from the pouches back onto the
table. Half the total is paid to the winner, while the remainder
is split evenly among all of those who stood at the winner’s end
of the table.
I'm sorry if it seems like I'm trying to steal Zalen and Alandra's thunder, it's just that Alandra's suggestion really did catch her off guard!
That's how she thinks of the others too. She saw Zalen, Krek, and Gren as fellow warriors to fight beside with no worries, while Alandra, Katryala, and Nayr seemed more like the type that needed protection, even though she had no real idea of what any of them were capable of. And she really does have that tendency to think of Jillian like a child. She doesn't even realize she's doing it in Jillian's case. Not many small folk on the Plateau. :)
She'll shake that way of thinking eventually, and quicker if they call her out on it. Alandra could put her foot down now and that would be enough. You have to respect her clan after all.
For some reason though I get the feeling Devargo's already made his choice. (good luck Zalen)
rules
Uh oh.
Perfect Terra, exactly what I was looking for. Thanks.
And NO WorriesValkyrie my dear, it's ALL good. I Love the way our Shoanti warrior reacts from her gut and her heart. Sure, it may get us into trouble every now and then but that only adds to the fun, no? ;-) Besides, she is of pure and good heart and only has the best intentions and that's hard not to like.
I'm also quite fond of our viscious and fearless little prietess of Pharasma =)
Zalen is still trying to get a bead on Jillian and Krek as they seem to be of a more complicated personality. His natural way (and talents) lead him to try and divine a person's motives and intent. That way he can more easily either work with them or manipulate them. At the moment, he still hasn't quite figured out exactly where the Big and the Little ones of our party are coming from.
As for right now, Zalen also, fortunately for us, happens to be quick of mind as well as quick of hand and foot (and also a Nat 20 on the Bluff doesn't hurt! ;-) so Hopefully he's managed to turn you ladies' outbursts to our advantage :)
Shit... not to get ahead of myself, but who's going next? :P
LOL oh S#it! I guess Z's quick mouth got him into this one, I hope his quick feet and hands can get him out of it!
But still "King of Crawlies?" Ya Gotta love it! =D
I have to admit, I'm a little sure as to what to do here now. Zalen certainly has no intention of losing, but he also has no desire whatsoever to kill the hapless fellow.
Hmmm, Terra, could you tell me what kind of skills, rolls,checks etc. would be involved for Z to say, try and pull the man forward, fall to his back and flip his opponent up over him and hopefully onto the floor? (where hopefully the worst he might end up with is a broken arm or something?...well, at least from Zalen...)
OR, how about this gang? It's obvious Devargo is pretty teed off at Zalen now...might it be better to lose on purpose?? Might that mollify the humourles S.O.B. and help us to get what we're after? Or would that be showing weakness and get us in more trouble? Zalen wouldn't like it, but he'd be willing to take the hit to his pride if it accomplished the mission....
What do you all think?
Also for Terra: Just out of curiosity, according to the module, which was obviously set up for this fight, was there any real way to get the info we needed and still avoid it? Feel free not to answer in the name of game secrecy or whatever...I'm just, as I said, Curious ;-)
Jillian will kill Alandra if she tries to kill Zalen for losing on purpose, but only if the 'King of Crawlies' tries to attack the group after Zalen does win, thus causing Krek to try and kill the cronies, because he doesn't like angry people, and prefers them rid of...
Never mind, scratch what I just said..
Damn it Z, just win.
Jillian will kill Alandra if she tries to kill Zalen for losing on purpose, but only if the 'King of Crawlies' tries to attack the group after Zalen does win, thus causing Krek to try and kill the cronies, because he doesn't like angry people, and prefers them rid of...
Ayedah will kill the boat.
Seriously though, I don't know what would be the best approach. Devargo does seem really angry with Zalen, and I'm not sure whether him winning or losing will help matters much. It might be more important how he wins or loses. I think he wants a show put on for him.
Wow, if Zalen wins and he wants one of us to go up on the table with him for another round... 0_0
If we can avoid a fight we probably should. There are still all the guards outside to worry about, not to mention whoever else might be in this boat.
I think providing him entertainment and throwing money at the problem are probably our best options.
Hmmm, ok well it seems like the majority feel it best to win the fight, but perhaps Not to do it so quickly?
Well, I'll give some more time for Terra to answer my mechanical question and also for Krek to weigh in should he choose then I'll post
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Pushing the thug off the table sounds like bull rush to me, maybe with some grappling added in.
In general, I'd say most is acrobatics, trip, bull rush, or similar combat maneuvers.
As for how to read the King - i rolled a sense motive check for you, and you're really not so sure. He probably wouldn't appreciate a bad show, and wants to see Zalen sweat and fight. If he threw the game, he'd probably lose more points. As to "losing after a good show" vs "winning the thing" - you really can't tell.
Ok, well maybe Z will save that maneuver until a bit later...;-)
If I miss any rolls I need in describing what I'm doing during the fight, feel free to roll 'em yourself DM T
and Wow, Big Spender Devargo! Better SILVER even! lmao heh heh
I don't really care about the money, Ayedah's just trying to play to what she thinks are Zalen's strengths.
Just a question-I thought only monks could cause lethal damage unarmed?
Oh and how much loot did Zalen grab last turn?
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6 Coins, the bad thing being that it's a mix of gold and silver - Delvargo really messed up things by putting in some silver here.
As for the lethal: Anyone can do that with improved unarmed strike, or if you simply take a -4 penalty to attack in 3.5. Here, the thug has IUS - thought it was fitting for a smalltime brawler and thug.
Ok next questions, does the -4 still apply in pathfinder?
And can you make a sneak attack with an unarmed and/or non lethal attack?
(Makes sense that you should, I punch to the kidneys for example, even without a knife, still Hurts!)
Ok, well until you tell me different then, I'm going for it :)
Pushing the thug off the table sounds like bull rush to me, maybe with some grappling added in.
In general, I'd say most is acrobatics, trip, bull rush, or similar combat maneuvers.
Oh and I forgot at add in response to this, Zalen would be opting for using acrobatics in the maneuver to make up for his average strength. (Play to your Strengths man! Which in Zalen's case, is Dexterity, Not strength ;-)
Whew! Good job! We might make it out of here with all of our skin after all. :)
I'm not kidding about Zalen's lie being better than what Ayedah was going to put forward either.
It probably would have been over the top though.
Hey GM Terra, there's something I'd like to clear up with you, if possible.
Are you basing Devargo's (or anyone else's for that matter) reactions more on what I Make Zalen say? Or by the Scores his abilities dictate by the Rolls?
Because, while I may have some small talent with words I certainly wouldn't consider myself having the Charisma (and perhaps not even the intelligence?) that Zalen does. While I do try to speak in character as much as I am able, much of what I write is for the amusement of you, the other players and myself.
What I'm trying to say is, like, if Zalen had a good idea that Devargo may be pissed off by something, like, for instance "My Sultan of Silk Weavers" than HE probably wouldn't say that if he was trying to get something out the King of Spiders. But what do I know? I don't have a charisma of 15 or such high bluff and diplomacy scores. That's what the stats and rolling part of the game are for after all, so that these extensions of ourselves, who are usually much more capable than we are, can do the amazing things they do.
So, if you Are considering both, all well and good. But if something important could be blown, even though he might have got good rolls, just because of some silly word or phrase I may make Zalen say... well, that kinda doesn't really seem fair. That, you know, such success or failure could depend on MY words when Zalen is probably a much better speaker than I am...
For example, Zalen got a 26 on his Bluff and an 18 on his Diplomacy. Now I can see several points being shaved off the Diplomacy cuz Devargo doesn't like him. but unless the King's Sense Motive beat 26, then he should have believed Zalen's lie that he didn't really want the beast and was disgusted by it, shouldn't he? No matter what specific words I may have used?
Anyway, hope at least Some of that made some kinda sense :P
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I am trying to base it of both, truth be told. The numbers dictate how positive i try to view your actions, how well you hit the target's nerve, and just how easy it is to convince me. That being said, a certain amount of player action is necessary. "DAlly, wanna f..." won't win you Dallisarea, the Nymph queens favor, even if your diplomacy modufier is +587
OK, that's good to hear. Thanks. : )
But can I ask? Does that mean Devargo beat Zalen's Bluff check to know he was lying about actually wanting or caring about the dragon as opposed to Seeming like he was trying to get back in Devargo's good books by doing him a favour by taking the 'disgusting creature' off of his hands and even Paying him for it? (which is what I was trying to go for with the Bluff and his speech)
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This is strictly off the books and OOC: The King of Spiders is a sadistic a**!+%#, and tortures the pseudodragon for fun. He's quite happy to making the life of a benign, innocent creature hell, and not about to let up. He bought your lie about wanting to sell it further down the road, but he's not going to sell for anything less than an increadibly offer. The adventure gives something in the region of 5000 GP as a guideline for buying him. Now, i assume that is for people who are "merciful"... but I still use it as a baseline.
Well then, so what do you think people? Obvisously we don't have anywhere near that kind of coin...what do you think? Should we Go for it and try and rid Varasia of of this disgusting Leech on her underbelly once and for all? We ARE supposed to be Heroes after all ;-)
Zalen is personally sick of this bully and would have no problems sinking his rapier into him...
Anyone think it's possible? Or we looking at a TPK here?
MAYBE we could come up with some other kind of plan? Like, say...Ayedah Does go to dinner with him and we Assaniate the Mo-Fo somehow?? I dunno..
Anyway, if you guys were up for settling this thing here and now in a Brawl, Z would be up for it.