|
Check your perspective here. You're seriously trying to draw a comparison between Razz's postings and FabesMinis? Did you note that FabesMinis was posting on this thread before Razz came along? Given that Razz only posts in the 4e forum despite his well known feelings for it? If people were following him to other threads outside 4e I could understand your point, but of course he doesn't post anywhere else, does he? He's a one trick pony, and sniping at FabesMinis, who actually contributes positively to the community, is unfair.
Ok, I've noticed that you follow Razz around and seem to answer every, single, regenerating (TROLL!), post Razz makes on 4e.I have to ask, how are you behaving any different than he does? I mean, I know that his posts are inflammatory, especially to someone who likes 4e, but I fail to see how your post-stalking is much better. To a large degree, I think its behavior like this (both you & Razz) that contribute to the ill will between the fans of 3.5 and 4e.
The 'Ling
Daeglin,
I can understand your point, and i am not equating FabesMini to Razz. I concede to all of your points, but the fact remains that if Razz posts anything, Fabes is there in minutes with a snarky response that accomplishes absolutely nothing.
This has no bearing on Fabes other posts, which I'm sure are appropriate . Good posting on one topic/area does not excuse poor behavior elsewhere. Neither does Razz's excessive trolling excuse Fabes, more subtle variant of the same regenerative posting. I pointed this out hoping that by identifying the behavior as similar in kind to what Razz does, Fabes might reconsider his tactics.
|
|
Ah, but here's the thing. Trolls regenerate when fed. It's best to just ignore their fued. If it's THAT distracting to you (since you can't ignore here that I've noticed), then send a letter up the chain.
You are of course correct regarding the feeding of trolls. Sometimes when a bad habit is identified, it will cease (at least that was my hope). As for sending it 'up the line', I'd prefer not to.
On topic, I too am very curious about the silence from GG regarding these releases. Was anything learned at Origins?
Seems to me that the 3X sale is more an acknowledgement that the shelf needs clearin' more than a true 'we're on THIS side of the edition war', really. Why waste valuable time and effort supporting things which are no longer selling (because, really, everyone who would want them likely HAS them) when you have a new product line to launch?
Good point except that its PDF's not physical books. So no actual shelf.
What concerns me is that if Goodman took the poison pill as it were, then the brand name of DCC is in effect under Wizards control.
I don't think Wizards would waste time with a seperate licence.
If they are doing 4E on there own I can see that as possibly being a good move (no money from me but hey there will be a market for it), I can even see them not making any more 3.5 DCC but why kill the lines older material? The Brand name DCC could support both come to think of it. Guess I'm just a little disapointed, yeah the adv. can easily be converted back, but I really don't like supporting anyone who supports Wizards bussiness reason not rules.
Something stinks. What is worse is Wizards stance on 4E, I always thought hey, if I miss a book maybe I can find it as a PDF. Guess not. Then people wonder why the growing dislike of 4e, never mind the rules, but the poduct and company are so tied together that hate for the one becomes hate for anyother.
RPGNow always deletes files/products that don't sell within a certain time frame. Also, from a producer's point of view, at some point maintaining 'dead electrons' is more of a hassle than it's worth.
Really I thought once you had them up they were just a saved file? Sure they use up space but other then that. Intersting.
Really I thought once you had them up they were just a saved file? Sure they use up space but other then that. Intersting.
Don't discount the spaced used so quickly. Eventually you have pages and pages of stuff that clog up servers and slow down searches. It seems strange, but all those electrons get pretty heavy after a while.
Don't discount the spaced used so quickly. Eventually you have pages and pages of stuff that clog up servers and slow down searches. It seems strange, but all those electrons get pretty heavy after a while.
Really I thought once you had them up they were just a saved file? Sure they use up space but other then that. Intersting.
You might be right, but I guess there was enough of a market out there to keep it going. I suppose I always figured the thinking behind PDF format was that it would always be there when and if you wanted a product that simply no longer existed in a dead tree format. This is an outsiders perspective however, not form a bussiness point of view. Though things like older 1st ed. D'n'D stuff is still at drivethu, so I guess I figured there would also be a market for items less then 15+ years old. Not questioning your logic, just figred the would be a market for it.
You might be right, but I guess there was enough of a market out there to keep it going. I suppose I always figured the thinking behind PDF format was that it would always be there when and if you wanted a product that simply no longer existed in a dead tree format. This is an outsiders perspective however, not form a bussiness point of view. Though things like older 1st ed. D'n'D stuff is still at drivethu, so I guess I figured there would also be a market for items less then 15+ years old. Not questioning your logic, just figred the would be a market for it.Don't discount the spaced used so quickly. Eventually you have pages and pages of stuff that clog up servers and slow down searches. It seems strange, but all those electrons get pretty heavy after a while.
Really I thought once you had them up they were just a saved file? Sure they use up space but other then that. Intersting.
Well, take this with a grain of salt, since I'm approaching this from my area of specialty (computers) and not from a particular business background, but I'd guess that 1E stuff has some demand because of A) rarity, B) nostalgia, C) limited supply. There's a ton of 3E stuff, and no doubt another ton of 4E stuff is on its way. I've seen devs say the vast majority of a pdf's profits are realized within the first few months of its release.
If new customers have trouble finding your new hot items because your pages are clogged with old items that aren't selling, it's probably for the best to delist them. You really don't want your database full of stuff that never gets accessed. It's just wasteful.
I think the big advantage to pdfs is the publisher doesn't have to worry about things like printing costs, distribution runs, or any real production issues they are outside their control (frex, you don't have to worry about your printer leaking a copy of your print copies onto the web ...)
It's nice to think you'll always be able to get a pdf of older stuff, and for some really old stuff, that may be true. But there's simply too much material released for the newer editions for ALL of it to be stored ... perhaps someday a few true classics will emerge and stick around when we're all playing 6E. ;)
I've yet to hear anything from either Goodman or WotC - its strange, to say the least. If they were in bed together, you'd think at least one of them would be "shouting it from the rooftops".
Contributor
|
I've yet to hear anything from either Goodman or WotC - its strange, to say the least. If they were in bed together, you'd think at least one of them would be "shouting it from the rooftops".
[speculation]Perhaps they cut a deal early, and now WotC regrets it and doesn't want to make any more side deals. Thus, they have asked Goodman to keep a lid on it for now.[/speculation]
I personally think this is unlikely, but it is a possibility.
If they were in bed together, you'd think at least one of them would be "shouting it from the rooftops".
Maybe they're both embarrassed... :D
|
|
Well, if you say it... it must be gospel.Ok, I've noticed that you follow Razz around and seem to answer every, single, regenerating (TROLL!), post Razz makes on 4e.
I have to ask, how are you behaving any different than he does? I mean, I know that his posts are inflammatory, especially to someone who likes 4e, but I fail to see how your post-stalking is much better. To a large degree, I think its behavior like this (both you & Razz) that contribute to the ill will between the fans of 3.5 and 4e.
The 'Ling
What underling said. I LIKE both games. Yes, it is possible.
I got some 3.5 games going. A Pathfinder playtest and I have plans for more. I am playing in a 4e game, and have a great idea for Punjar or maybe an Eberron one come the fall. I also play HERO and WH40K RPG, CoC...I have no conflict.
Frankly, I just don't understand the snide remarks and sniping. It would be nice if our boards community just stopped this.
I'm going to side with Mactaka on this one. I like all the games as well and am tired of all the sniping. It really should be stopped for nothing good ever comes of it.
Thoth-Amon
Daeglin,
I can understand your point, and i am not equating FabesMini to Razz. I concede to all of your points, but the fact remains that if Razz posts anything, Fabes is there in minutes with a snarky response that accomplishes absolutely nothing.
This has no bearing on Fabes other posts, which I'm sure are appropriate . Good posting on one topic/area does not excuse poor behavior elsewhere. Neither does Razz's excessive trolling excuse Fabes, more subtle variant of the same regenerative posting. I pointed this out hoping that by identifying the behavior as similar in kind to what Razz does, Fabes might reconsider his tactics.
I agree with your overall goal of reducing trolling and the predictable counter-responses. I guess that I tend to lump FabesMini into the "Comic Threadjacking"-type group recently discussed elsewhere rather than trolling. Reviewing my post, I find I don't like the tone I used, and blame it on frustration towards the whole issue. My apologies.
|
|
I agree with your overall goal of reducing trolling and the predictable counter-responses. I guess that I tend to lump FabesMini into the "Comic Threadjacking"-type group recently discussed elsewhere rather than trolling. Reviewing my post, I find I don't like the tone I used, and blame it on frustration towards the whole issue. My apologies.
No apologies necessary. :)
Since this is sort of a bump, has anyone heard anything new about Goodman & the GSL?
So far we know:
1. they have 4th edition products in the pipeline.
2. They are canceling their 3.5 DCCs "soon". (Note: this could just be due to poor sales of the PDFs and the ending of the d20 license.)
3. Their early 4ed releases are definitely NOT free, so do not fall under the 'promotional" clause of the GSL.
4. We've seen posts by some folks associated with GG, but nothing yet official. Even in these posts, little of substance pertaining to the license and long term plans were discussed.
Am I incorrect on any of these points? Has any new information emerged?
I asked him for a future interview regarding the business of Goodman and making those decisions which he agreed to conduct at some point in the near future. So I'll be curious to hear what is going on myself.
I do notice from the Free RPG Day product that there is no mention of the words "Dungeons and Dragons", no logo, no d20, nothing of the sort. Clearly it's a system-less book and the other adventures won't be. But I wonder (having not combed through the GSL very completely) if there's perhaps a loophole here that's being exploited.
|
|
Nothing yet. Joseph and crew are very tight lipped regarding this matter.
It's unconfirmed, but I heard that GG would be able to sell at GenCon but then have to respect the moritorium on 4e 3PP until October after that. {Fellow player looking on one of the 4e boards, maybe WotCs)
However, the promo's in the Free RPG day and the GG website contradict that. Any ideas?
|
|
Well, I guess this is an update of sorts. I gleaned this from the GG site in a discussion about future Castle & Crusades conversions of DCC 3.5 modules. Joseph posted this about the existing 3.5 line and 4e.
Yes, we're looking at options to make the 3.5 DCC's still available under 4E rules. We originally planned to convert the 3E modules via downloadable conversion documents, so you could buy DCC #1 at your local store then download the file to get the 4E stats. That unfortunately won't be feasible under the new guidelines for 4E products. But there are some other possibilities, like releasing new print versions that are overhauled to 4E. Nothing's final yet, but that's where we're leaning now.
So, what does this reveal? Perhaps not much, other than an implied attempt to meet the rules of the GSL. Does this mean they signed? idk.
Well, I guess this is an update of sorts. I gleaned this from the GG site in a discussion about future Castle & Crusades conversions of DCC 3.5 modules. Joseph posted this about the existing 3.5 line and 4e.
Yes, we're looking at options to make the 3.5 DCC's still available under 4E rules. We originally planned to convert the 3E modules via downloadable conversion documents, so you could buy DCC #1 at your local store then download the file to get the 4E stats. That unfortunately won't be feasible under the new guidelines for 4E products. But there are some other possibilities, like releasing new print versions that are overhauled to 4E. Nothing's final yet, but that's where we're leaning now.So, what does this reveal? Perhaps not much, other than an implied attempt to meet the rules of the GSL. Does this mean they signed? idk.
Interesting. If their reasonably fast about it I suppose they'd have some chance of making sales, particularly among gamers that never bought their products before. In fact I'd at least consider the idea of picking up some of their best titles (as rated by the other posters over here) if they did some kind of a mass conversion of their stock. We don't have many 4E adventures yet after all.