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As I read the Numeria entry in the Gazetteer yesterday, there were some questions coming up in my mind that I'd like to ask (or discuss).
It seems clear that Numeria is a homage to EttBP, but is this really all there is about this country?
A giant spaceship crashed aeons ago and a whole culture evolved around it?
When did the ship crash there? Was it before humans came to Numeria?
And it is said that the wreckage is the scource of adamantine and other Sky Metals. But is Numeria the only scource of adamantine in Golarion and, if so, how does it affect the market price and availability of adamantine? Or was the ship that big that adamantine is still as available as the core rules suggest?
There's mention of the Technic League and "metal men" as well. How can I envision this? There are no examples of the mentioned super-science. What kind of technology is available in Numeria? Laserguns? I don't hope so... Wand-rifles? And the "metal men" seem to be robots from the ship; but how do these look like exactly? Are they more similar to classic robots from 50s/60s SciFi-movies or more like helmed horrors, iron golems and such?
I'm sure that most of my questions might be answered in the upcoming CS, but I'd like to know now! :)
Creative Director
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Numeria is absolutely inspired by/a homage to Expedition to the Barrier Peaks, and also to the Temple of the Frog. We haven't done much with Numeria beyond what's in the Gazetteer yet, and probably won't do TOO much with the place any time soon. Mixing sci-fi with fantasy is one of those things that polarizes fans, ya see, and until we're more settled in "standard Golarion" we aren't gonna get TOO crazy with things.
Andre Norton's "Witch World" series of books, could prove to be another source of insperation too. A telepathic race (a-la psionics) survived the crash, and live on through the indiginous races of Numeria.
Superscience!
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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There are most assuredly lasers and similar weapons scattered around Numeria, but few have actually been discovered, fewer still function properly, and fewer still are in the hands of people who understand what they are.
Think of the intact portions of the ship as vast dungeon complexes. Almost anyone who enters never comes out. Sometimes weird sounds and even alien monsters emerge from the wreckage.
The adepts of the Technic League scour the plains for valuable wreckage and guard the secrets of that wreckage closely. They serve the Black Sovereign, essentially a barbaric despot in the Conan mold, but they do not share everything they know with him.
The aristocrats, such as they are, drink strange fluids harvested from the ruins, occasionally developing strange afflictions or powers. Weird patches of radiation (and the weirder creatures and sub-humans who dwell nearby) stretch across miles and miles of the barren, occasionally hilly landscape.
The Metal Men are the servitor androids housed in one portion of the ship, animated and controlled by a wizard in service to the Black Sovereign. They act as his shock troops, and look a bit like the robots from AI, in my view. But with swords and cloaks and stuff.
Think of them as warforged mixed with the fencing and boxing robots from Expedition to the Barrier Peaks, but with the weight and somewhat unfinished nature of C3P0 from The Phantom Menace. But, again, with cloaks and swords and stuff.
You know, real cool-like.
I think I love Numeria.
Oh totally, man.
Barrier Peaks was my all time favorite.
For the look of the high tech gear I would go with the old pictures from the modules themselves. They have a strange retro vibe to them and not everything is easily identified as a weapon or what the purpose is.
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I am reading through the gazetteer and got to "Numeria: SAVAGE LAND OF SUPER-SCIENCE" just last night. Honestly, I let out a little groan.
Now, don't get me wrong, I'm a big Barrier Peaks fan. I love that stuff. My groan was for the campaign world in general.
Having this "weird science" land smack dab in the middle of Worldwound/Mendev/Ustalav/River Kingdoms seems really problematic if someone doesn't want to include that. You can't get from there to here without having to go through "the lands of mutants and 'lasers'". (Dr. Evil Laugh)
I would have preferred it off to the side someplace - a good example is the reference to the Land of the Lost in the Realm of the Mammoth Lords. It's there, you can use it, but it's not on the road from here to there.
I worry it could lead to Deus ex machina laziness by players and DM's who want to go off the precipice a bit. "Oh, that! It came from Numeria!" It's an interesting worry in a land where most anything could be written off as "magic" but at least in this world the magic has specific rules built up to contain it - the tech doesn't.
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The adepts of the Technic League scour the plains for valuable wreckage and guard the secrets of that wreckage closely. They serve the Black Sovereign, essentially a barbaric despot in the Conan mold, but they do not share everything they know with him.
I am imagining a cult off-shoot the Technic League, who worship a piece of wreckage as god. They are housed in a cave complex that extends deep into the earth where at the heart is an entrance to a buried peice of the wreckage. This is their shrine. This is where all honor and glory is bestowed upon their most sacred relic: The Flat Screen television with endless re-runs from the digital library of Monty Python skits and movies...
I used to hate sci-fi in my fantasy, until I read R. Scott Bakkers "Prince of Nothing" series. There is an extra terrestial race of pretty nasty beings that crashed on the settings planet some thousands of years ago, but he colors everything a little differently. It was a "mountain" that crashed; there was your typical evil god called the "No-God" that was encased in a giant "coffin" (small space ship? Something akin to power armor?). Anybody around this No-God suffered a sickness (radiation?). In order to defeat it, the ancient heroes needed a magical weapon named the Heron Spear. It was also called a "spear of light" (a laser?). The author never states that's what these things are, and they're mostly relegated to the stories past, but still, if I ever used sci-fi in my fantasy, I think I'd do something like this.
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So, for all the Pathfinder gurus out there, which products contain information about Numeria beyond the Campaign Setting? Specifically, which book has the seven sky metals in it? I know I own it, but don't know which of the six adventure paths it's in.
With that in mind, is there a collected appendix for all of the Pathfinder published material in existence? Some place I could go to and search for a topic (like Numeria) to see the products that contain it? Doesn't really work well with Paizo's search engine on the website.
Thanks, gurus. You're the best!
I know one of the second darkness books has something in it about sky metals but I don't know which one specifically.
So much cool stuff!
So... awesome. So much awesome... I can't cope.
Man, I really, Really can't wait until there's an adventure path that goes to Numeria.
We haven't done much with Numeria beyond what's in the Gazetteer yet, and probably won't do TOO much with the place any time soon. Mixing sci-fi with fantasy is one of those things that polarizes fans, ya see, and until we're more settled in "standard Golarion" we aren't gonna get TOO crazy with things.
Curses!
*Shakes Fist*
Is it my fate to forever be foiled by fickle fantasy fandom?!
We haven't done much with Numeria beyond what's in the Gazetteer yet, and probably won't do TOO much with the place any time soon. Mixing sci-fi with fantasy is one of those things that polarizes fans, ya see, and until we're more settled in "standard Golarion" we aren't gonna get TOO crazy with things.
Curses!
*Shakes Fist*
Is it my fate to forever be foiled by fickle fantasy fandom?!
Look at the bright side, that was like three years ago. Maybe we're a little closer.
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So, for all the Pathfinder gurus out there, which products contain information about Numeria beyond the Campaign Setting? Specifically, which book has the seven sky metals in it? I know I own it, but don't know which of the six adventure paths it's in.
With that in mind, is there a collected appendix for all of the Pathfinder published material in existence? Some place I could go to and search for a topic (like Numeria) to see the products that contain it? Doesn't really work well with Paizo's search engine on the website.
Thanks, gurus. You're the best!
Well, there is the Pathfinder Wiki.
My players like to believe the crashed ship is a spelljammer itself.
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Creative Director
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There are two reasons why the crashed spaceship isn't a spelljammer.
1) I'm not a fan of Spelljammer—it's too silly and filled with weird and unappealing elements of self-mockery for my tastes.
2) It's not open content anyway.
The crashed starship in Numeria is a technological object. The old adventure "Expedition to the Barrier Peaks" is one of its inspirations.
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There are two reasons why the crashed spaceship isn't a spelljammer.
1) I'm not a fan of Spelljammer—it's too silly and filled with weird and unappealing elements of self-mockery for my tastes.
2) It's not open content anyway.
The crashed starship in Numeria is a technological object. The old adventure "Expedition to the Barrier Peaks" is one of its inspirations.
+1. Space hippos flying viking longships and caravels through the vacuum from planet to planet is just... nrgh. Makes my head hurt so much. I understand the urge to integrate other planets into the D&D cosmology without disrupting sword & sorcery too much, but there are so many better examples of how to do this out there (John Carter of Mars, application of the teleport series of spells, aforementioned adventure, etc).
+1. Space hippos flying viking longships and caravels through the vacuum from planet to planet is just... nrgh. Makes my head hurt so much. I understand the urge to integrate other planets into the D&D cosmology without disrupting sword & sorcery too much, but there are so many better examples of how to do this out there (John Carter of Mars, application of the teleport series of spells, aforementioned adventure, etc).
I liked the space hippos! A hippo-man with a blunderbuss is just great!
And... I know this probably comes as little surprise, considering my avatar is a caterpillar with a goblin face, but I think later editions of D&D tended to take themselves quite a bit too seriously. It's part of why I loved Spelljammer. It put a bit of welcome "Baron Munchausen" back into D&D.
That said, I definitely understand Pathfinder needing to bring its own identity to spacefaring and sci-fi on Golarion, and I wouldn't want them to try and copy Spelljammer. For what it's worth, I've enjoyed what they've done so far.
There were some pretty awesome elements to spelljammer, amongst the more silly stuff. I always loved the Illithid and Beholder ships, any of the ships, actually, that didn't look like terrestrial seafaring ships. Those astral ships from Dragon Magazine #309 are what I hope Pathfinder spaceships tend towards. Space IMHO should be weeeeeeeeeeeird.
There are two reasons why the crashed spaceship isn't a spelljammer.
1) I'm not a fan of Spelljammer—it's too silly and filled with weird and unappealing elements of self-mockery for my tastes.
2) It's not open content anyway.
The crashed starship in Numeria is a technological object. The old adventure "Expedition to the Barrier Peaks" is one of its inspirations.
I never said that it should be a spelljammer ship, only that my players like to believe it is.
Sorry about the thread necro, but I just discovered Numeria and I love it! Being a big time fan of Dave Arneson's Blackmoor, this corner of Golarion is just perfect for me.
Besides the Pathfinder Campaign Setting and the Inner Sea World Guide, are there any books I should pick up for more quirky Numeria goodness?
-Havard
Sorry about the thread necro, but I just discovered Numeria and I love it! Being a big time fan of Dave Arneson's Blackmoor, this corner of Golarion is just perfect for me.
Besides the Pathfinder Campaign Setting and the Inner Sea World Guide, are there any books I should pick up for more quirky Numeria goodness?
-Havard
Dungeons of Golarion has a numerian fortress: the red redoubt. Lots of interesting stuff in there, including battery operated darkvision goggles and the Robot subtype.
I fear that's the only other piece of info I know of.
Thanks for the quick response! :) I have been looking at Dungeons of Golarion for some time. I will put that on my wish list then!
Oh and has the Black Sovereign really been corrupted by the Technic League? I think he is only faking it to make them trust him. That's going to be the basis of my campaign anyway B-)
-Havard
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There were some pretty awesome elements to spelljammer, amongst the more silly stuff. I always loved the Illithid and Beholder ships, any of the ships, actually, that didn't look like terrestrial seafaring ships. Those astral ships from Dragon Magazine #309 are what I hope Pathfinder spaceships tend towards. Space IMHO should be weeeeeeeeeeeird.
Only the humans had those terrestrial seafaring ships.
Elves had plants that grew in the shape of butterflies. Dwarves would send rock fortresses. Even gnomes in those benighted days had something more akin to a factory than a vehicle. Neogi had giant spiders.
Honestly, there was plenty of interesting stuff worth mining in Spelljammer.
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*sigh*
I thought there was finally some movement to see some official release to expand Numeria. But nooooooo, Håvard - you necro'ed it. Damn you. DAAAAMNN YOU!
:)
Sorry Urzien! :D
Just trying to get that movemet started! :)
In the meantime I will simply use my old Blackmoor D20 stuff to expand the realm :)
-Havard
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Sorry Urzien! :D
Just trying to get that movemet started! :)
In the meantime I will simply use my old Blackmoor D20 stuff to expand the realm :)
-Havard
Nay! I say we lay siege! To arms! :D
For people interested in more Numeria, there's also a nice write-up in the Absolom book about the folks from Numeria and their dealings in the city. Certainly helped me get a better bead on them...and as I recall there's some good reference art too.
For people interested in more Numeria, there's also a nice write-up in the Absolom book about the folks from Numeria and their dealings in the city. Certainly helped me get a better bead on them...and as I recall there's some good reference art too.
What book and the pages, please? I was curious if they ever placed anything in any of the books dealing with Absolom due to Red Redoubt being outside of Absolom.
For people interested in more Numeria, there's also a nice write-up in the Absolom book about the folks from Numeria and their dealings in the city. Certainly helped me get a better bead on them...and as I recall there's some good reference art too.What book and the pages, please? I was curious if they ever placed anything in any of the books dealing with Absolom due to Red Redoubt being outside of Absolom.
I can't seem to find anything on Numeria in Guide to Absalom. Is this the book you're talking about Freedom?
I ran a mini-campaign that combined my own notes, Numeria, Oerth's Blackmoor, and B4 The Lost City ( glacier instead of desert). \
It was a lot of fun.
Ewan! :)
Love the idea of using the Lost City in a Glacier environment! :)-Havard
I can't seem to find anything on Numeria in Guide to Absalom. Is this the book you're talking about Freedom?For people interested in more Numeria, there's also a nice write-up in the Absolom book about the folks from Numeria and their dealings in the city. Certainly helped me get a better bead on them...and as I recall there's some good reference art too.What book and the pages, please? I was curious if they ever placed anything in any of the books dealing with Absolom due to Red Redoubt being outside of Absolom.
I skimmed through Guide to Absolom and only found a brief mention of Karamoss and Red Redoubt.I was trying to ask Grimcleaver for his source of information since I never heard or saw it in any of the books.
Oh right, I meant to ask Grim too. Oops.
Ha! Why am I not surprised that Havard was the one who necro'd this thread?
(And why am I surprised that he should be looking into Numeria right around the same time I was getting interested in the region? Sometimes, I think you read my mind, Havard!)
In any event, I think this area is ripe for adventures in the Burroughs manner- Conan meets John Carter of Mars. Throw in a little of Moorcock's Eternal Warrior/John Daker, and there you have it.
As for the Black Sovereign- Havard, there is a throwaway line in the Numeria entry in the Inner Sea Guide that mentions the Star Mount as being the source of the addictive substances many of the Technic League are hooked on; could they have gotten the Sovereign addicted to something, as well? Thus, it would only take some doughty adventurers to kidnap him, dry him out, and you've got one angry Kellid barbarian conqueror ready to dish out some vengeance on the Technic League.
One other thing that really intrigues me- the bit that talks about how the Gearsmen sometimes willfully seem to ignore their orders. Are the Technic League really pulling the strings as they think, or is something or someone else still in command of the robots? Shades of Gamma World, there. (Now we just need to grab some of the mutants from the Mana Wastes, and we've got a party.)
they could make Warforged race race for gearmen.
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I plan to use Numeria in my upcoming campaign (which is self-created). I like the hook of that giant mechanical spider rampaging across the countryside. It reminds me of that one scene from final fantasy viii... where a giant mechanical spider was rampaging through town and you couldn't really kill it easily. I think I may have something like that happen as my poor PCs are chasing Lovecraftian horror (or being chased by) all across Avistan.
The module Seven Swords of Sin has some Numerian goodness in it. I would recommend that.
I'm apparently one of the few that not only is okay with sci-fi in my fantasy, but I actively promote it.
It seems silly to me that Wizards learn to shoot lasers from their hands, and no one can figure out how to make the laser from from a metal tube. We have wands for crying out loud that allow us to shoot lasers from sticks!
Put a button on it, or create a casing that allows the user to bypass UMD for wands put in it.. whatever. And we can arm a bunch of storm troopers with laser rifles.
This has always been one of my big arguments about firearms. 2/3 ingredients for black powder are used for fireball. Yes, we are using 20th century knowledge, but jeeze, All it takes is some guy with tindertwig (match) and some wizard spell components.. with a little knowledge of alchemy.
Dudes. Buy it.
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In ages past. From out of the dark tapestry comes a runaway planet, hurtling between Golarian and it's Moon, unleashing cosmic destruction! the World's civilizations are cast in ruin!
Thousands of years later, the world is reborn...
A strange new land has risen from the old: a world of savagery, super science, and sorcery. But one man bursts his bonds to fight for justice! With your companions the warriors, rouges and heroes, you shall pit your strength, your courage, and your fabulous magics against the forces of evil.
Enter Numeria!!!