I just had a look at this. I mean: is there anyone out there who would buy it? Sure might be interesting reading, but for 20$??? Come on, for the price of a paperback 13$, fine, for 96 pages! But 20$, I guess reused artwork and again a lot of vague hot air about how cool 4th ed will be, but nothing substantial. Just my 2 cents.
Let the bashing begin ;-)
$20 for 96 color pages is fine (see Pathfinder).
However, $20 for a preview (advertisement) is not fine.
although I am in favor of 4th edition, sometimes I cannot understand how they think.
Instead of making it downloadable and promote the new edition, they think we are stupid enough to go and buy it.
Their marketing department truly sucks!
Yeah, I plan on risking the ire of broom-wielding shopkeepers shouting,"This ain't no libary!" and chasing me out as I try and read the thing in the store rather than shelling out cash for it.
I suspect what's really upsetting you about this is the knowledge that people will buy this product. I don't doubt it's your disappointment in gamers that's fueling your outrage.
although I am in favor of 4th edition, sometimes I cannot understand how they think.
Instead of making it downloadable and promote the new edition, they think we are stupid enough to go and buy it.
Their marketing department truly sucks!
This is all starting to remind me of TSR's final days(years) when they were headed by someone who disrespected their fans enough to say something to the effect of "they'll buy anything we put out."
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I have a certain morbid curiousity and I would like to read it, so I have more info on 4E and how it works, to develope a more educated stance on my feelings toward the new edition. BUT!!!
F*$k you, WOTC, if you think I will pay you $20 for a friggin' advertisement that is worthless in gameplay and will probably have a ton of rule changes once the core books hit shelves. A useless product that will sell, but is only out there to start the I.V. drip of money from WOTC's "valued customers".
Sure, the sheep will graze, but WotC expects that which is why they are targeting less-discerning clientele.
Everyone buying this book should recieve a free shirt with "BAA" printed on it, but I have no doubt that it will sell well.
FH
I suspect what's really upsetting you about this is the knowledge that people will buy this product. I don't doubt it's your disappointment in gamers that's fueling your outrage.
Heh. You're ascribing motivation to the posts of others. I hear one gets kicked off of the EN World boards for that.
Good thing this is a different neighborhood, eh?
I'm not vested in this debate, but what *I* think might be upsetting to the previous posters and the OP is that this doesn't bode well for how how WOTC is going to market the 4th Edition. That is, "this is a sign of things to come."
What do I mean specifically? That the game might be parcelled out in such a way that to get "whole content" one is going to have to buy a lot more books.
I don't think any sensible person begrudges WOTC the right to set a fair price for their product, and make some money. I personally don't think it's unreasonable for them to update their product with a new edition. But I think you're being unfair if you begrudge these folks some concern over this. It looks odd, to sell a 'preview' like this. It suggests that they really will break this down any way they can to make a few more bucks.
This sounds very much like the Dungeon Survival Guide that just came out. I have been disappointed by some products I have purchased before but not really angry. The DSG made me angry. 64 pages of pure advertisement with no legitimate new info thrown in. As seems to be more and more the case when I purchase WOTC products, I felt...dirty and disgusted when I realized what I had actually paid good money for.
Based on that I will wait to look at this in a store before I blindly buy. If it is as I suspect, my money will stay safely (and very briefly I'm sure) in my pocket.
Everyone buying this book should recieve a free shirt with "BAA" printed on it, but I have no doubt that it will sell well.
FH
Fakey, is it okay if I use your quote to sum up my opinion on a lot of 4E stuff?
Fakey, is it okay if I use your quote to sum up my opinion on a lot of 4E stuff?Everyone buying this book should recieve a free shirt with "BAA" printed on it, but I have no doubt that it will sell well.
FH
Wait! Lemme sell off my junkmail that I scribbled the letters w o t c on the back of, first.
I just had a look at this. I mean: is there anyone out there who would buy it? Sure might be interesting reading, but for 20$??? Come on, for the price of a paperback 13$, fine, for 96 pages! But 20$, I guess reused artwork and again a lot of vague hot air about how cool 4th ed will be, but nothing substantial. Just my 2 cents.
Let the bashing begin ;-)
Yet one of many reasons why I hope that WotC fails miserably with 4th edition. That way Hasbro will hopefully sell off the D&D license to some other company that actually gives two turds about the game's long-time fan-base and history.
I have a certain morbid curiousity and I would like to read it, so I have more info on 4E and how it works, to develope a more educated stance on my feelings toward the new edition. BUT!!!
F*$k you, WOTC, if you think I will pay you $20 for a friggin' advertisement that is worthless in gameplay and will probably have a ton of rule changes once the core books hit shelves. A useless product that will sell, but is only out there to start the I.V. drip of money from WOTC's "valued customers".
Sure, the sheep will graze, but WotC expects that which is why they are targeting less-discerning clientele.
Everyone buying this book should recieve a free shirt with "BAA" printed on it, but I have no doubt that it will sell well.FH
umm... apparently, one of us has missed a memo. I thought the thing coming out soon just had design notes, discussions on how they were going to be changing the game system, not actual rules? Oh, and artwork. Lots of artwork.
I just had a look at this. I mean: is there anyone out there who would buy it? Sure might be interesting reading, but for 20$??? Come on, for the price of a paperback 13$, fine, for 96 pages! But 20$, I guess reused artwork and again a lot of vague hot air about how cool 4th ed will be, but nothing substantial. Just my 2 cents.
Let the bashing begin ;-)
You beat me to the post. I was gonna put something here about just this. I couldn't agree more. To pay for this preview is insulting enough, but to pay $20 for what will amount to be no more than 2-3 chapters from the real PH which will retail for $30-$40 (we assume?) is even more insane that the last bit of insanity they spewed out.
It seems like WotC is testing us. Kind of a "Let's see how much we can get away with without actually doing it." sort of thing. Then they can dial it back for sanity's sake. We hope...
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I suspect what's really upsetting you about this is the knowledge that people will buy this product. I don't doubt it's your disappointment in gamers that's fueling your outrage.Heh. You're ascribing motivation to the posts of others. I hear one gets kicked off of the EN World boards for that.
Good thing this is a different neighborhood, eh?
I'm not vested in this debate, but what *I* think might be upsetting to the previous posters and the OP is that this doesn't bode well for how how WOTC is going to market the 4th Edition. That is, "this is a sign of things to come."
What do I mean specifically? That the game might be parcelled out in such a way that to get "whole content" one is going to have to buy a lot more books.
I don't think any sensible person begrudges WOTC the right to set a fair price for their product, and make some money. I personally don't think it's unreasonable for them to update their product with a new edition. But I think you're being unfair if you begrudge these folks some concern over this. It looks odd, to sell a 'preview' like this. It suggests that they really will break this down any way they can to make a few more bucks.
They've already admitted that this is what they are going to do. They are leaving a lot of core classes and monsters out of the first round of books, so you have to buy one or two rounds to get the whole "core" game.
They've already admitted that this is what they are going to do. They are leaving a lot of core classes and monsters out of the first round of books, so you have to buy one or two rounds to get the whole "core" game.
Heh. Since they have admitted this, let us only beat them with sticks and not light them on fire.
Just kidding, say "no" to real world violence.
Well heck Cory, thanks for the news. I find it weird that they fessed up to it openly though.
This isnotgood...
Next Month:
Wizards Presents: Races and Classes
This lavishly illustrated 96-page book gives roleplaying game fans...
Following Month:
Wizards Presents: Used Toilet Paper
This lavishly soiled 2-ply toilet paper gives roleplaying game fans yet another unique, behind-something glimpse into the busy lives of WotC marketing executives. Suckers -- err, customers will get something worth almost as much as essays and asides from the game's premier designers, developers, and editors. Explore one of the D&D game's most iconic activities (bathroom breaks between combat encounters), sharing insights never before revealed in any previous game product (what a surprise!).
PS I really am trying soooooo hard to be nice about where D&D is going. I just need a little help from WotC -- just a little :/
Now for the most popular fantasy rpg, in the most popular series of Collectible Monsters, collectible spells and collectible combat rule pieces:
Collectible Classes:
Peasant: Common
Adept: Uncommon
Warrior: Rare
Fighter: very rare
Monk: very rare
Bard: very rare rare
Sorceror: very rare
Wizards: Ultra rare chase
Cleric: very rare
And: Rogue: Ultra rare (only in deluxe double price boosters)
*Cards give you an access code which allows you to download one use Character sheets from DI for a nominal fee.
Argh!
I plan on reading this at the Barnes and Noble cafe. No one ever stops you from reading at Barnes and Noble.
...essays and asides from the game's premier designers, developers, and editors.
For the record, I've always found the shameless self-promotion in which businesses must engage to be very funny. Isn't pride one of the Seven Deadly Sins (the worst, in fact)?
:P
...essays and asides from the game's premier designers, developers, and editors.For the record, I've always found the shameless self-promotion in which businesses must engage to be very funny. Isn't pride one of the Seven Deadly Sins (the worst, in fact)?
:P
Yes, but, luckily, sin isn't going to be covered until the 4.2 rules come out in 2010, so they have some time to put the proper spin on it.
Nothing to see here. Move along.
I'll wait to see the actual car crash before I comment. Could be worth it as an art book, who knows?
And we have an excerpt - complete with typo!
LOL!
http://www.gleemax.com/Comms/Pages/Communities/BlogPost.aspx?blogpostid=224 26&pagemode=2&blogid=7012
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They've already admitted that this is what they are going to do. They are leaving a lot of core classes and monsters out of the first round of books, so you have to buy one or two rounds to get the whole "core" game.
Heh. Since they have admitted this, let us only beat them with sticks and not light them on fire.
Just kidding, say "no" to real world violence.
Well heck Cory, thanks for the news. I find it weird that they fessed up to it openly though.
They didn't exactly put it that way, but we know some things that most people consider core will not be in the first PHB or MM. We also know that most of these things are supposed to see print at some point in time either through other PHB's and MM's or D&D Insider. Since they are putting out a PHB, DMG, and MM a year, you can easily see where it is headed. They are basically making you buy at least 6 books and probably more to get the whole "core" game.
And we have an excerpt - complete with typo!
LOL!
http://www.gleemax.com/Comms/Pages/Communities/BlogPost.aspx?blogpostid=224 26&pagemode=2&blogid=7012
All I get is:
Unexpected ErrorDO NOT BE PERSuADED BY MY ENEMIES INTO THINKINg THAT MY DEMISE IS QUICKly aPPRAOCHING.
I recommend that you close your browser and log back in.
They are beginning to remind me of Fox TV. People who care about their work toiling away making as best a product they can (The Designers or Show Developers) are constantly trumped by poor decisions from clueless executives, whose very actions are so ignorant they appear to be malicious, but are merely very incompetent.
All I get is:
Unexpected ErrorDO NOT BE PERSuADED BY MY ENEMIES INTO THINKINg THAT MY DEMISE IS QUICKly aPPRAOCHING.
I recommend that you close your browser and log back in.
Yep, I'm getting that now too.
Weird.