Jake,
Do not take offense to the lack of wanting to create a character. What it seems to me is that you are over-focused on story. What they may be most interested in is "what cool stuff can x guy with x stat possibly do." If they don't want to create story-based characters, then creatively create characters that they know. Say "party Rogue" has an old drinking buddy that just got "party rogue" in trouble. This drinking buddy, as it turns out, is possessed by a fiend that "party cleric's" clergy has been hunting for a few years/centuries. After figuring this out, and much ROLE-playing and investigation later, boom the players become more enthralled with your game world.
Now, as to setting:
Are you using the core rules (generic rpg)or
Greyhawk (slightly expanded on the core rules)
Forgotten Realms
Dragonlance
Iron Kingdoms
Kalamar
Ravenloft
or a Homebrew world
(I could list more worlds, but this starts me out).
When using settings, invest the characters in the world, either through contacts & stuff they could "lose" or people they care about. This may help, it may not, but I find it encourages RP-type behaviors. Remember, reward those players who RP better with slightly better XP awards, mainly to show that this is what you want.
I could go on, but I'd like to be more useful rather than giving generic details. Personally, I didn't want to invest into a character for the first 4 or so years, until I started to get the rules down better (mind you, I started in second edition, which was far from a "rules lite" system). I started expanding on my characters about year 3, when I realized it would make the game more fun for me and the other players. Now, I tend to play "rules lite" games, with RP taking over Rolling, but there are players and DM's out there who really just want to roll, and that's okay. Balance the actors with the grunts & go from there.
/d
Director of Narrative
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thanks for the advise i have a few questions about it though. since i usualy use Eberron and Forgotten Realms...
To start with you are lucky that you use those two worlds, as they nearly the only ones getting any 'official' support these days. As far as your question about how to get them intrigued with the setting you need only think about what got you hooked. Was it the pictures of Sharn that you fell in love with? The intermingling of expanded races? Did you like FR because of the characters involved in the world? Maybe the vast amounts of fiction that has been written about the setting?
If they are your friends and they are people you can tolerate for a few hours each week, then you probably have some idea of what makes them tick. Use their particular interests to you advantage in this. Think of characters in movies that they like and figure out what it is they like about them. Get inside their heads and then throw those little details that you know they will bite upon instead of generic problem/reaction/solution situations.
I hope that some of this helps and I hope (know) your games will improve.
I'm concerned that maybe your trying to hard. Sure there are games out there that rival Tolkien in terms of epic tale and the players performances would compare well to a rehearsal of hamlet. But really this is by far the minority.
Most games take place in an environment were everyone shows up to have a good time, to laugh and have fun. Half the entertainment is provided by ribbing each other and dealing with humour in and out of the game. Once you have the players roped in on the entertainment factor you can then start to juxtapose this with more mature themes and dire situations - but in short spurts. Players that have been showing up and playing a character that's fun are a lot more likely to have some kind of an emotional attachment to what's going on. Gaming is entertainment and constantly dealing with real world issues like racism (except in a humorous way) is probably a mistake. True evil seems a lot more sinister when its in contrast to something, while constant attempts to inject seriousness into a game are more likely to come off as simply corny and melodramatic.
Keep in mind that gamers that have been playing for decades don't usually graduate to some kind of hard core playing that's always serous all the time while we immerse ourselves totally into the world. Not usually anyway. Furthermore the memories, the really good ones anyway, that your players will take away from your game will usually be the funny ones. If they are the dark and grim ones its probably because such scenes stuck out from a more light hearted background then because every scene of every session was an endless montage of evil and battling hopelessness.
yep, sometimes it isn't all about the world-shaking storylines. Sometimes it is about the little stuff, like you said, crossing a river on slippery rocks, while being shot at by gnolls. You don't have to change them overnight. Add small bits of background to the story. If they don't give you character backgrounds, you can do pretty much anything you like. Sometimes, less is more in character backgrounds.
I had a character once who didn't remember anything before a month before he met the other characters. It was open license for the DM to do whatever he wanted. I loved it!
And let's not forget the simple fact that your players are teens. With all due respect, they might not be as mature as you and therefore aren't looking for the same kind of experience.
For example, I have a 42-year-old player who still thinks it's really funny when he smacks an NPC in the balls with his mace. Some people just don't grow up.
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man i love waking up to great tips in the morning, thats guys for the information you gave me im pretty sure now that my games will be alot more fun and if i have to teach some one else how to DM now i can tel them all this great stuff you guys have told me thank you a million times. i can't wait to create crazy little quirks for my players that are embarassing but hilarious for the other players at the same time, and instead of flooding my PC and myself with Detail just let it slowly leak out and gain speed as the adventure progresses. thanks again guys.
Jake
It might seem odd - but I did it this way with new players and it worked very well - in fact I repeat this when the roleplaying part comes to a standstill in one of my d%d campaigns. D&D is a game that sometimes makes players loose grab of their characters - or the setting, or make it hard to come to touch with it. Take a game that has a more realistic setting and less "superheroic" possibilities of problem solving. Call of Cthulhu works best for me, since it has tons of very good published adventures and lends itself well to almost "pure" roleplaying. Play a one shot adventure with characters that are simple, archetypical and have roleplaying hooks to go with the adventure (some adventures have pre-made characers for this purpose). Make clear, these charakters are used only for the ongoing adventure, so most players won`t fear that "to much roleplaying" gets into the way of the campaign or the other players. Most likely the Adventure and the change of pace will encourage the players to more playing than you experiencced so far. When returning to your ongoing d&d campaign keep encouraging your players to show roleplaying and develope their characters.
Do something that injects a bit of "real life" into your game. Maybe one of the characters' siblings show up to cause trouble (because we all know they do...), or their parents are sick, or the local mob boss is strongarming Dad's mercantile business.
Something I used to do was start every session with a RP-type question to the players. "Who was your character's childhood hero?" "Who was your best friend?" The game did not proceed until those questions had been answered. Not only are they good ways to get people into character, it's a treasure trove of plot hooks and adventure ideas for the DM.
Don't forget to give each character a day in the sun, either! It's those adventures that they'll be talking about years later.
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RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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In a somewhat more comical vein - they don't want to create a backstory? Ok...do it for them.
I did this once, for a player that essentially only ever wanted to roll dice to determine how much damage he would do. That's it. Flat out refused to create any kind of a character for his figther with 18 strength. He was essentially a walking 18 strength score with a greataxe.
Ok, so guess who was raised by fairies in the magical realm of unicorns? Guess who always had fresh flowers tied in his long hair? Guess whose axe had a giant bunny etched into the blade? Guess whose surname was Ponyprincess? Yup.
Don't want to do it? I'll do it for you then.
My advice is to make it easy for your players. Don't lump them with a bunch of work they're not interested in. Try asking them questions directly, so that they can build up a character background over time as their character grows in power. You may like to hand out small rewards of XP and/or gold, so that in effect, the question/answer session becomes a minor encounter in itself, rewarding players for interesting backstory.
Don't forget to hand out roleplaying XP if you want to encourage that. Remember that unless your players are into roleplaying for its own sake, the rules only reward players for combat, traps and looting.
I feel for you, Jake.
I felt the same way many moons ago when I would go to great lengths to create what I thought was an exciting, engaging adventure, and most of my players were more interested in the paint brand I used on the miniatures or the latest Warhammer 40K rules from White Dwarf magazine.
I finally had to lighten up (as the prior poster advises above) and try to embrace the FUN of being with my friends, even though they seemed to care less about the game and more about getting together and chucking some dice for a while.
We took breaks now and then to play boardgames and wargames, since they were a little "easier" than RPGs, since there was less to imagine as we played, and that helped prime us for upcoming adventures, too.
You could also post on message boards or advertise in your local gaming store for players who are as serious as you are about the game.
Good luck in your gaming, Jake.
Ok, so guess who was raised by fairies in the magical realm of unicorns? Guess who always had fresh flowers tied in his long hair? Guess whose axe had a giant bunny etched into the blade? Guess whose surname was Ponyprincess? Yup.
Don't want to do it? I'll do it for you then.
Oh god. I totally want to do this to some people I used to play with.
And Jake, I totally agree with what every one else has posted. The game is about hanging out with your friends and having fun. Some campaigns are serious with really developed plots and interesting NPC/PCs spanning worlds and others have halfling rogues named Douche Baggins and elf wizards named Tre Verielfen.
Also, we have found that if we're getting a little too serious with one campaign, doing a silly one shot will do a lot to make us get back into the serious game. It'll work out!
Don't worry too much about it, Jake. It was the same way for me when I was just starting out. I started playing seriously at about 14, I'm currently 22; things have changed. When we started, most of my players really just wanted to fight monsters and goof off; now, they still want to fight monsters and goof off, but they want to do it in the interest of a plot. None of them are into researching character stuff and all that and they aren't really fans of huge amounts of setting info that doesn't impact them directly. I prompt them for character background and usually end up figuring it out with them.
What I do now is type up a sheet of setting information and character building background info, something I can email or print out for the players. Nothing too involved; just immediate information that anyone would know, local places that the characters would frequent and the typical roles of the base classes in the area. I've found that that extra work does the job well enough. It also helps using pre-written adventures, I've found, just because you can move to one thing or another pretty easily and if the players hate what they're doing, you don't have to feel like you wasted a lot of time: just flip through another issue of Dungeon for something they might enjoy more.
And let's not forget the simple fact that your players are teens. With all due respect, they might not be as mature as you and therefore aren't looking for the same kind of experience.
For example, I have a 42-year-old player who still thinks it's really funny when he smacks an NPC in the balls with his mace. Some people just don't grow up.
My players are all like that. Its one of the reasons they plop down at my table every week. Other big attractions are fantasy lucre and XP, working together to try and make the DMs life miserable. Insulting each other in creative ways that draw ohhs and ahhs from the rest of the people around the table, and, because I play in mixed company, an unending stream of double entendres.
Of course in between all this there are moments of heroism, frustration, despair and horror.
Ahh, it's nice to see other DM's putting everything out the same basic advice I was going to give. (and thanks to everyone with Eberron experience for explaining that part).
Anyhoo Jake, I hope this thread helps you and your players enjoy your game better. There's only one other piece of advice I can give: If you want histories, start small. As someone already mentioned, give them a questionaire, and it doesn't have to be written down. Approach them via email/phone & write down THEIR answers. They'll be surprised at the details you give them.
I spoke with a DM of a campaign I play in & gave 2 HUGE details about my character, and something that I know he will (as a devious DM) include in the campaign. I want this as a PLAYER, and that takes years to do, especially with the plan I have for my character.
/d