WotC is following the same model that is has been following for years now, computer companys.
(in the case of Dragon Mag)
In this case I strongly believe that it is following the MMO market. A low monthly fee for "new and Fresh" online contian. things like errate (ie patchs) will still be free, and some web enhancements (ideally) but for the "golden ticket" level content you will pay a small fee.
(coming future)
I also think that this is leading up to 4th Ed. Core Books sell Lots more then add ons (complete [fill in the blank])
What made me think this. This year we are getting a new Core Star Wars book they start of the "reboot".
I FEEL (no facts to back this up) that next year we will get a new D20 Modern book (notice that they aren't releasing any new d20 Modern books this year), and the following year we will get 4th ed (would fall on the 40th Anniversy that way).
(stray thoughts)
As a side note I think that FR is getting the Ax as of this year, they have learned that they can kill a game line and still make lots off of the books (Dragonlance) and at the end of the year they are releasing "Anauroch: The Sundering of the World" & "Grand History of the Realms"
If they wanted to bring some old hold out back in with 4th e, this would be a great time to bring back Grayhawk IF they do it on the 40th anniversy "ie Bigger, Better and Back to it's Roots"
Either that or it will be the finial nail in the coffen and it will all be Ebberon by then, but hey there's no telling
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I also feel this is a lead up to 4th Edition. I do not think they are going to wait until 2014 to release a 4th edition to match the 40th anniversary (first publication was in 1974).
I do suspect however, that this move presages that 4th Edition will not be OGL compatible.
I would not be surprised to hear an announcement as early as January or so. Just looking at the planned releases for 2007, it is a pretty bland year.
My bad I ment 30th anniversy, 74 saw Chainmail release, 79 saw D&D's first release (pretty sure that it was 79 anyway)
Dear Krome. This may seem wierd.
Thank you for being the first person of my acquaintance to use the word presage.
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My bad I ment 30th anniversy, 74 saw Chainmail release, 79 saw D&D's first release (pretty sure that it was 79 anyway)
2009 is D&D's 35th (Chainmail was '72, D&D was '74). 2010 is the d20 System's 10th.
Assuming D&D 4E will continue with the d20 system (no reason not to, and WotC has said explicitly - even in their company FAQ - that they will continue to support the d20 system as long as they are in the business of supporting D&D), I would strongly suspect that 4E will be announced at DDX 2009 (for the D&D 35th anniversary) and released at DDX 2010 (for the D20 10th anniversary).
If D&D is in the process of being vaporised by Paizo, Wizards and Hasbro, then these companies are about to lose a customer. I never saw much purpose in Magic: The Gathering with the marketing induced restrictions on which cards were "common", "uncommon" and "rare". Miniature play is fine when used in conjunction role-playing games, otherwise you are just playing a version of a version of the Siege of Borodin wargame, or even a very weird game of chess. The alternate realities of the D&D game were actually soothing to me; giving me a opportunity to lay my day-to-day ultra-Vulcan Borg personality aside in favor of something far more human.
By Van Neumann, Turing and Dijkstra!
I will assimilated long ago: there was no resistance!
While the table top RPG industry languishes with people whining that they have to spend $60 on a new set of core books every 2-4 years. The industry flounders because gamers are generally CHEAP. They expect a 10$ investment from a 50% off rack to be supported and static until they die.
Maybe we are cheap, but most gamers are younger than most movie-goers. When your market segment is 15-25 year-old students you shouldn't expect anything other than 'cheap'. Also, $60 is not accurate. The core books may be $60 (on sale), but they support all the other books that together may be worth hundreds or thousands of dollars. Those may have to be replaced as well. I think anyone, in any hobby category, would be upset at having to replace "working equipment" worth a thousand dollars every 3-4 years at the behest of a marketing executive.
I own quite a bit of expensive camping/climbing equipment. If the companies that produced it said that every 3-4 years they would come out with new equipment that was not compatible with the old stuff, I'd be pretty angry too.
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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Maybe we are cheap, but most gamers are younger than most movie-goers. When your market segment is 15-25 year-old students you shouldn't expect anything other than 'cheap'. Also, $60 is not accurate. The core books may be $60 (on sale), but they support all the other books that together may be worth hundreds or thousands of dollars. Those may have to be replaced as well. I think anyone, in any hobby category, would be upset at having to replace "working equipment" worth a thousand dollars every 3-4 years at the behest of a marketing executive.I own quite a bit of expensive camping/climbing equipment. If the companies that produced it said that every 3-4 years they would come out with new equipment that was not compatible with the old stuff, I'd be pretty angry too.
Neh. Every 5 years a new console comes out and people purchase it to play video games. Sure, they're generally backwards compatible, but big deal, most people don't play old games.
Also, the demographics are skewing older for the hobby. Most of the regular posters on this board are adults in the 25-40 range. By contrast, the movie going audience actually does skew young into the 15-25 year range.
Gamers are cheap whiners. You don't have to buy the new books, nor do you have to buy every book. If you want to just download the SRD and sit there and play that, go for it. Short of the people's revolution though, the gaming companies need to make money or they go out of business. Making money requires that they sell products. Etc, etc, etc.
If you don't want it, don't buy it. Simple as that.
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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If you CANNOT afford a Harley do NOT blame Harley Davidson. If you CANNOT afford $60/ year in D&D books... well, I hope you don't drag anyone else down with your terrible financial decisions.
Yeah, I can agree here. Honestly, I don't see how anyone with a job (even a part-time one) CAN'T manage to afford gaming. Let's assume you take home $100/week at your job (assuming you work 20 hours a week and make $7-8/hr., that should be accurate). If you spend $25/week on food, $30/week on gas, and $30/week on miscellaneous expenses (rent, utilities, whatever), you've still got $15/week left over. Multiply that by 4 weeks in a month. That's $60. This is assuming ROCK BOTTOM income levels. Save that money for two months and you've got enough for core books, dice, and pencils plus some spare change for character sheet photocopies (assuming you don't have access to a printer). Every month after that, you buy a supplement. If they didn't come out with anything you wanted that month, save the cash or buy a battlemat, minis, more dice (you can never have too many), or whatever you want.
Most people don't work part time. Full time jobs provide twice the hours (and thus twice the income) of the example above. Unless you have SERIOUS debt problems, a full-time job should keep you gaming until doomsday (assuming you aren't trying to live beyond your means). One of the reasons I love this hobby is because it IS so affordable. A movie ticket costs $9 for 2 hours of entertainment ($4.50 an hour). A night at the putt-putt course is $6 for 3-4 hours (if your friends screw around like mine do) and that's $1.50 an hour. The core books cost $60. If you play once a week for 4 hours at a time, that's 208 hours of entertainment a year! That's $0.28 an hour! Plus, those books will last you more than one year, so it's even better than that!
You don't NEED supplements to play the game, but even part-timers should have ZERO difficulty in affording one supplement a month. I usually save up for a long time and buy a whole pile of books all at once (I buy 4-8 books at a time, two or three times a year).
It becomes expensive for 12-15 yr. olds who still operate on an 'allowance' I think. If you only get $10-20/week then yeah, $60 represents a significant investment. My advice? Get a job. ;)
(Sorry, I work in insurance and financial services. Seeing people complain about little things like this strikes a nerve with me.)
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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...replace "working equipment" worth a thousand dollars every 3-4 years at the behest of a marketing executive...
$1000 every 3-4 years? Let's see....
$1000/3 = $333.33
$333.33/12 = $27.77
$28 a month to support the industry that has brought me thousands of hours of entertainment over the last 12 years? Sounds like chump change to me. My water bill costs double that and that's the LEAST of my expenses. I do not consider myself a terribly wealthy man, either, so I'm not taking the stance of a high-and-mighty millionaire or anything. I'm a working stiff like most of you.
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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The core books cost $60. If you play once a week for 4 hours at a time, that's 208 hours of entertainment a year! That's $0.28 an hour! Plus, those books will last you more than one year, so it's even better than that!
Plus, the above calculations assume it takes 0 time to read the book, 0 time to prep for the game, and 0 time to whine about the rules on these forums.
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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Plus, the above calculations assume it takes 0 time to read the book, 0 time to prep for the game, and 0 time to whine about the rules on these forums.
Haha! Point taken. Most people would handle these sorts of things outside of the usual 'game time' alloted in the 4 hours per week. Like me, for example. I do my forum-complaining from work. ;)
Oh no! The sky, she falls!
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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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My biggest complaint about the possibility of 4E would be that I'm running out of room for the books. Damn them!
I'm having that same problem, Zombie. My biggest gaming-related expense this year might be a new bookcase, hehe.
Hmmm... well, no. I can get a quality bookcase at IKEA for under $50 and I've already spent $300 this year on the new World of Darkness stuff. Nevermind.
It's all going to boil down to making money, because that's what companies do. TSR did it, Wizards does it, and The Grand Order of the Illuminati will do it when they acquire the D&D license in 2074.
The problem therein lies that the games will always be on a cycle of self-destruction and self-renewal, simply out of the necessity of the industry. I HATED Second Edition, myself, because it was wonky, and extremely bloated from too many optional rules spread out across as many suppliments as there are stars in the sky. Although I'm not 100% behind 3.5, I liked it more than 2e, because they streamlined the things I really wanted so that they were easy to find, and easily understood. Although I've never read it, I'm willing to bet that a very likely same scenario happened in the transition from 1e to 2e. Clarifications, additions, streamlining.
Inevitably like its predecessor, 3.5 will get so bloated and bogged down by "optional" rules that always seem to replace "core rules," and optional content, that it will become hopelessly afloat in a sea of its own creations. When this happens, it'll be time once more to bite the bullet, condense, and streamline. And that is when you'll see Fourth Edition. And the process will begin anew.
Admittedly, I don't mind paying $20 or so for an adventure, nor $20-40 for a well-thought out suppliment or campaign setting. I DON'T however, enjoy replacing all of the above because they are incompatible with a new set of "core" rules. But hey... that's the beauty of books, I guess; they never become obsolete.