Bear with me for the long post, I've got a unique and interesting dilemma here . . .
So my players have trudged through the mistmarsh and arrive at the Twisted Branch Lair. The Druid (whose player is famous for unorthodox thinking) decides to cast Speak with Plants and Speak with Animals to gather information about the lizardfolk tribe living nearby. With some good rolls, he found out that (a) there have been no young lizardfolk for many seasons; (b) some of the lizardfolk are different than the others, and (c) a large evil thing was here recently (Ilthane).
Hearing all of this, they have pieced to gether that something is not right within the tribe, and the plan is to enter the lair and attempt to parley with the lizardfolk - a real "take me to your leader" situation.
The party is two halflings (Drd and Ftr), a goblin (Sor/Rog)(reincarnated human), and a teenage human (Rog), and not one of them speaks Draconic.
So the quiestion is how do I handle them attempting to get across "we come in peace" to a non-common-speaking lizardfolk who encounters then inside their lair?
My first thought is a Diplomacy check to move the Lizardfolk from Hostile to Unfriendly. However, that DC is 20, but since this would be a hurried attempt, it would be another +10 on the DC, and to top it off, there should be some penalty (-5, perhaps) for not speaking the same langauge, making a whopping DC 35 Diplomacy check - a pretty tough call for 5th-level characters.
So what about an opposed wisdom check just to establish that the party isn't a threat at first sight, allowing them to take the full minute to try a regular diplomacy check at the much more reasonable DC of 25?
I'd like to reward this unorthodox and decidedly non-hack-n-slash attempt to resolve things, but I don't want to make it a cake walk. I dunno, maybe I should just allow it to work regardless of the rolls involved, just because of the ingenuity?
Anopther problem is that if they *are* taken directly to Shukak, they miss the opportunity to meet Hishka and possibly forge an alliance - unless I can come up with some reason they would be brought before Hishka first?
Once they are brought before Shukak, it would most likely be a death sentance for the party, which they would resist, thus bringing all the lizardfolk into the fight . . .
But if they can be brought before Hishka first, she can get them in cahoots to kill the king.
But if the king is killed, won't the Lizardfolk go crazy and try and kill the intruders? How can Hishka calm the remaining tribe before they swarm the party and get slaughtered? what good is it to Hishka if she is the only surviving Twisted Branch member?
Ugh! My brain hurts! Stupid players and their outside-the-box thinking!!!
Chris
I'm assuming the Sorcerer has no access to tongues/comprehend languages.
Easiest is to let some of the rank and file lizard folk know enough common for a parley, if only to reduce the diplomacy check DC to something a bit more manageable.
Or maybe the lizard folk druid is doing their own round of talk with animal/plants, and one tells them about the outsiders they where talking to the other day... also sets up the possibility for a meeting with someone other than the king first.
There is still the option of body language. If the party enters the lair with weapons sheathed and their hands up as a sign of peace, the lizardfolk might understand that they mean no harm. This would be a combination of Diplomacy checks and Sense Motive rolls to determine how successful the plan is.
I would not make the attempt a rushed on, but would impose a penalty of some sort as the lizardfolk are at war with humans, and they cannot understand them (-2 to -4).
I prefer Richard Burlew's Diplomacy system (www.giantitp.com) as it allows for a more in depth resolution and also has rules on using offerings to sweeten the deal (if the players come in slowly, and place their weapons on the ground, hands up, and back away, that should grant some sort of bonus to the check).
Rather than stretch the attributes of the lizardfolk into understanding common, why not have the PCs brought (none too gently) into the presence of Shukak. Shukak speaks common and so the lizardfolk peons might do this anyway if they aren't attacked immediately.
Once in front of Shukak, the peons might back off and guard the entrances. Hishka can be present to observe the "negotiations" with Shukak. Inevitably Shukak decides to kill the PCs and his barbarian friend comes in raging to help out. Peons stay out of the way partly out of fear/respect for Shukak and partly because Hishka sees it's chance and urges everyone else to stay back. They just ensure that the PCs can't run away.
Then when Shukak and barb friend are dead, cue Hishka to start talking to the PCs. They can attempt their diplomacy a second time, though Hishka might start off a notch further towards friendly since the PCs just did the work for it.
This way they feel good that they tried diplomacy and that it eventually succeeded, they get to fight a little, Hishka get it's goals accomplished, everyone wins! You might give them a little extra ad-hoc experience for not going in guns ablazing (and since they didn't fight harpies and bunches of lizardfolk).
I also suggest possibly encountering Hiska or even a lesser Lizardfold (maybe with a +2 Int) who also speaks common away from the rest of the tribe, outside the Twisted Branch lair. Its a lot easier to befriend one (say, saving him from Giant Spiders or Crocodiles) than to suddenly pull the full monty on the whole tribe. I think this is more feasible for your PCs than a straight up fight. Though its been posted otherwise, I believe Shulak to be a tough fight, potentially capable of killing many PCs. Having a guide who doesn't agree with tribal policy can make for some interesting role-playing encounters..
I think I would try and let the "Take me to your leader." moment happen away from the Lizardfolk lair. A wandering group of hunters for instance. These hunters would take the group captive and start bringing them to their leader. I would probably allow some sense motive checks on the parties behalf to let them know that their captors don't necessarily think things will turn out in the PCs favor even though they can't understand the language.
Before arriving at the lair the Druid meets up with the group and finds that the PCs are interested in making a deal. He then helps them break free and do what they can to infiltrate as necessary to save the tribe.
Another option during this would be to have one of the members of the hunting group infected with a slow worm and give the PCs a chance to identify and save this (as per the normal adventure encounter).
Sean Mahoney
My PCs had lizardfolk prisoners from the battle at the Keep, and their strategy was to arrange a parley to conduct a prisoner exchange. I had the lizard king refuse to come out of the lair, so the party opted to enter his throne room for an audience. Hishka was present.
Since the lizard king is obviously implacable, I had the party bard do a diplomacy check to see if he could shift his attitude from hostile to something better. The bard failed, so midway through his speech, the lizard king jumped up off his throne and threw his trident at him. This started a free for all. I had the lizardfolk close in and surround the party, and the barbarian came in to support the king at the sound of battle. It was a tough fight, but the party survived. The mooks could barely hit the party, and I opted not to have them use "assist another" because the fight with the king and the barbarian was tough enough. When those two had been brought down, I had Hishka order the mooks to back down and the parley began. (Hishka wants the king overthrown, so she is grudging with healing him and ready to stop the battle). Since the two leaders were the only ones the party killed, it was relatively easy to come to terms.
Details in my campaign log.
Ah...yeah.
Peruhain's campaign log might have been where my suggestions grew from. Maybe.
Ok, it's what I was thinking of. Fine.
It's worth reading.
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Somewhere on the boards I remember reading a suggestion that I'm going to use; Hishka is going to be outside of the main lair. It's going to have a separate shrine area guarded by a number of slightly advanced lizardfolk who are only loyal to Hishka. I'm hoping that my players, who are going to probably by-pass the assault at Blackwall Keep will be interested in this strange buidling...
This whole adventure is going to be slightly different for them. They've been chasing the abducted son of the local baron for the last six levels, and they're finally going to recover him. Thus Hishka has an interesting deal for them; kill Shukak and his goons, and it'll give them all the prisoners they want. I haven't decided if Marzena will be down there, but I think keeping the angle that Hishka wants to ensure a peaceful resolution wtih Blackwall Keep is a good idea. I'll probably expand the kobold area to give them a few more encounters down there.
Ukos
Ah...yeah.
Peruhain's campaign log might have been where my suggestions grew from. Maybe.
Ok, it's what I was thinking of. Fine.
It's worth reading.
Well, since you gave me a plug, I guess I'll forgive you for plagiarizing, Eltanin. ;-)