So my players are wandering through a forest as they travel between adventures. After reading the Ecology of the Ettercap, I decided they'd make a really cool "random" encounter. They're different, and the authors did a nice job making the ettercap seem like a fun encounter (kudos, gents).
So this morning, I popped open the SRD and looked up the Ettercap. And I noticed their "advancement" line only advances them by hit dice. I distinctly recall, though, the authors had an advanced critter in their article that included class levels. So is this one of those "designers can get away with bending some rules when it makes something cool" things, or is there an explicit rule somewhere that discusses this sort of thing?
I'm pretty anal retentive, and I like to follow the rules as much as possible. ;)
You can add class levels to any creature intelligent enough to take them. The monster advancement line represents typical creature advancement. Exceptions are outside the norm, but not against the rules.
Got a rule quote from somewhere, Ghetto? Like I said, I'm anal retentive; I like having a rule I can point to. ;) I guess it's more or less implied in the rules... I think that should be good enough to go on.
Director of Games
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Got a rule quote from somewhere, Ghetto? Like I said, I'm anal retentive; I like having a rule I can point to. ;) I guess it's more or less implied in the rules... I think that should be good enough to go on.
Ghettowedge is absolutely right on this one. Monster get advanced through class levels all the time, even though their advancement line states that they advance by Hit Dice.
Jason Bulmahn
Managing Editor of Dragon
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On page 290 of the monster manual, in the first paragraph it talks about the various ways of improving monsters (including adding hit dice and class levels) and says that they are not mutually exclusive, and that a monster can both increse in hit-die, and gain class levels.
I think the intent of "By Character Class" in the advancement line is that the monster only increase by character class, unlike other monsters who can imrpove by character class or by the listed hit-dice (or both).
Got a rule quote from somewhere, Ghetto? Like I said, I'm anal retentive; I like having a rule I can point to. ;) I guess it's more or less implied in the rules... I think that should be good enough to go on.
The book never says it straight out, but there are a few creatures like the aboleth that do it. Also there is a paragraph in the Monster Manual in chapter 4, p.291 that implies it. It says:
"If you choose to equip a monster with gear, use its ECL as its character level for determining how much equipment it can purchase. Generally, only monsters with an advancement entry of "By character class" recieve NPC gear; other creatures adding character levels should be treated as monsters of the appropriate CR and assigned treasure, not equipment."
If you can imagine a monster taking levels in a class, he probably can. If he normally advances by hit dice, he'd probably have to have above-average intelligence for his race to justify why he can learn swordplay/armour use/sorcery when his fellow monsters can't.
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Of course, one thing to note is that a monster that advances by Hit Dice should probably be receiving treasure for its EL, not equipment for being an NPC (though some items to get its AC up to an appropriate level, like basic armor, is not bad to do). Any monster that gains power "by character class" should get equipment worth (Total for NPC of their CR) - (Total for NPC of their base CR).
I messed this up in my first major campaign, and was giving full cash to monstrous NPCs (a common occurence), resulting in yuan-ti half-bloods with 7 levels of cleric (CR 8.5) that were definetly tougher in all ways than their base race 7th level counterparts.... The extra cash was making them even nastier, and it only got worse at the highest levels.
The general guideline I go by is that if a creature has an Intelligence of 3, it can take class levels.
Poor half-orc with an int of 2; he'll never get to be a barbarian ;)
The general guideline I go by is that if a creature has an Intelligence of 3, it can take class levels.Poor half-orc with an int of 2; he'll never get to be a barbarian ;)
A Half-orc with an Int of 2 can't even speak.
Just to make sure I understand this correctly, the advancement by class levels does not affect the size increases or any other abilities gained by advancement of HD alone, correct?
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Correct - except possibly for SR.
Excellent call, Aubrey, I see this fact missed a lot in adventures, even in Dungeon (it's easy to miss). I think this is actually a new rule from 3.5, so a lot of older GMs forget about it in the midst of everything else.
I was particularly at fault for counting class levels in raising the DCs of a classed monster's supernatural and extraordinary abilities...
Use this formula:
1. Normal monster with 3 Int - use as is.
2. Bodyguard monster or similar tough representative of race with 3 Int - add hit dice.
3. Leader or very important character monster with 3 Int - add class levels and/or hit dice.
Remember that advancing a monster by class levels does not change its size, but advancing its hit dice might. Also remember that except for possibly dragons and outsiders advancing class levels adjusts CR more quickly than advancing hit dice.
Mmmm... should read people's previous posts more closely (since someone already answered the size question). O'h well.