Up until now, my characters have seemed to be lagging behind on xp. This was mostly because in Life's Bazaar we had 5 players, plus Fario and Fellian occasionally, and later Maple and the other freed rogue/fighter (forget her name) all sharing xp.
So going into Flood Season the PC's were still 3rd level. That was fine, I ran a barroom brawl with the Stormblades (our rogue ended up giving Todd a hotfoot and he's now known in some circles as "Hot Toddy"), gave them XP for that, and edged them right up to 4th (they were less than 100 xp short, so I just ad hoc'ed them to 4th.) It seemed pretty clear that The Lucky Monkey was for 4th level PC's and the Kopru Ruins was for 5th. The got through the LM and didn't level-- which seemed par for the course thus far, so went into Kopru Ruins about 250xp short of 5th.
So we've just finished our second session in the Kopru Ruins. The first session was basically the Skulvyn and then a bunch of Mooks. That gets them enough xp to level to 5th (it puts them right smack dab in the middle of 5th level). They retreat to the ledge on the other side of the lake and rest (which brings me to another problem-- which I'll get to after this question).
Last night the rest of the mooks set up an ambush (after Skaven arcane eye'd them all sleeping) on the beach. Totally ineffective archery for all six rounds of the PC's crossing (they used the spare boards to tie together a barricade in the cage and then hid behind it for 1/2 cover). 10 of the 11 mooks are slaughtered, one running away to warn the higher ups. At this point Skaven has a personal bodyguard reserve of 3 fighter mooks, and Triel has her 4 rogue mooks, there's the fleeing rogue mook that joined up with Skaven's party, but that's it (and the undead guy is just nuts and not bothering with the defense of the lair).
So they head towards Triel and big fight later Triel and her 4 rogue mooks are dead. So last night I figure out the xp and it's another 2000+xp each (even docking the beach mook fight to 2/3 xp because they had help from the Kopru). That puts them just into 6th level. Given that they've still got to do all the spider stuff and all the undead stuff, I can see them well into 7th by the time they finish Flood Season.
Up until now the xp has been working out to be a little stingy, I don't think I'm calculating wrong (this is the first 3.x campaign that I've run) does anyone have any help or explanation for this? I don't want to just arbitrarily not give them xp to keep them at the right levels for the adventures, but this seems off.
Here are the details of xp from last night:
10 mooks (CR2) at 500xp each = 5000 x 2/3 because they had help = 3334
750 for the CR3 trap on Triel's door.
2000 for the 4 rogue mooks with Triel
3000 for Triel
So 2270xp to each PC which levels them to 6th after one session at 5th.
Tried to post this before and it didn't post, so excuse the double post if it shows up twice.
Wow ... why divide the xp by 2/3 because they had help?
Page 167 of DMG3.0-- "Modifying Encounter Levels" if it was significantly easier (and it really was, those archer mooks were sitting ducks once the Kopru told the fighter what to expect) multiply the XP by 2/3's.
What I'd do is give the NPCs each an equal share -- so if there were 5 players and 2 NPCs, divide the XP by 7. Of course, I'd also only reward the NPCs with 50% experience -- they are NPCs, after all ...
Okay, I wasn't clear in my original post-- in Life's Bazaar they had all these NPC's to share xp with, so they leveled more slowly. Now the NPC's are gone, and I've lost a player, and they're leveling very quickly. I've got 4 PC's and it's looking like they're going to be 7th or 8th level by the end of Flood Season, which is much too quick, given that Zenith Trajectory is for 6th to 8th.
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Hmmm. I was also concerned by XP and levels because I only have three players. That's why I ran Evil Unearthed from Dungeon # 82 first, because the original Dungeon #97 Life's Bazaar 3.0 seemed a bit much for 4 1st level PCs unless the accepted consistent help.
My lot started Life's Bazzar at 3rd level, finished it at 5th level. They have just left the beach at the Kopru Ruins (where they killed the skulvyn) and entered near Skaven, killed his first two rooms of guards and then just killed him and his elemental. They just made 7th. Even though they have the vast majority of the ruins left I doubt they'll earn the 21,000 xp between them to get to 28,000 xp each and get to 8th level.
Remember though, there are lots of encounters that can be missed (skulvyn and kopru spring to mind) and NPCs should really only earn XP like cohorts at best (they get half a full share with the remaining half share divided equally amongst the PCs).
By now it's probably a moot point considering how long ago this post was written, but here's something to consider: the SC Hardcover describes the adventure path as being a difficult campaign designed for 6 PCs. This means that the intended Character Level for each of the adventures was designed with 6 characters in mind, not 4. The self-correcting nature of the XP system ensures that if your group is low on characters, they'll gain experience faster and be higher level in order to cope with challenges of the campaign. So, if you've only got four players now instead of 5 or 6, it's actually a good idea for them to be one or two levels ahead of each "Chapter" of the campaign, because with their lower numbers they'll need to extra skill and power to tackle the challenges ahead of them.
I see your point. The original magazine articles said it was a campaign for 4 PC's, and up until the end of Flood Season I've been running out of the magazines (we didn't do Chapter 2 because it didn't exist when my players should have done it.) They're almost finished with the Kopru Ruins and it looks like they'll be around 7th level give our take a couple of hundred XP.
It's interesting that I've got the "classic" group-- a fighter, a rogue, a cleric, and a mage-- and they've had less trouble with everything than I've read about here on the boards. They're all pretty plain vanilla 3.0 characters-- the mage is an Evoker, but that's about it for specialization, and they play pretty well.
I'm thinking that the only real way to have 4 PC's at the suggested levels given the xp of the monsters present is through character deaths. Lower level deaths and the raise dead spells taking levels away will definitely reduce the average party level. I've come close to killing at least one character in just about every fight of the last three sessions. Hell, the fighter was actually pinned in the razor door trap at Triel's room, then had a hold person cast on him, and one of the rogues coup de graced him-- but a lucky roll had him make his fort save so he didn't die.
The dice don't lie.
I see your point. The original magazine articles said it was a campaign for 4 PC's, and up until the end of Flood Season I've been running out of the magazines (we didn't do Chapter 2 because it didn't exist when my players should have done it.) They're almost finished with the Kopru Ruins and it looks like they'll be around 7th level give our take a couple of hundred XP.
It's interesting that I've got the "classic" group-- a fighter, a rogue, a cleric, and a mage-- and they've had less trouble with everything than I've read about here on the boards. They're all pretty plain vanilla 3.0 characters-- the mage is an Evoker, but that's about it for specialization, and they play pretty well.
I'm thinking that the only real way to have 4 PC's at the suggested levels given the xp of the monsters present is through character deaths. Lower level deaths and the raise dead spells taking levels away will definitely reduce the average party level. I've come close to killing at least one character in just about every fight of the last three sessions. Hell, the fighter was actually pinned in the razor door trap at Triel's room, then had a hold person cast on him, and one of the rogues coup de graced him-- but a lucky roll had him make his fort save so he didn't die.
The dice don't lie.
Amen.
And in the end, this simple fact will unfold: players who work well together, regardless of any character difficulties, and who utilize the STRENGTHS of each of those four classic archetypes rather than spending time compensating for inherent weaknesses, will be VERY difficult for the bad guys to put down. As their levels continue to rise, and they hit the proper threshold of power vs. the villains per their party size, the skill with which they work together, each doing their thing and making it easier for the others to do the same, will be what ultimately decides their success.
But then, no amount of skillful cooperation can save you from a badly timed botch on a Fort save.