STEEL SHADOWS Dungeon #115


Dungeon Magazine General Discussion


The publication Dungeon #115 includes an article adventure claiming to be "Steel Shadows".

This claim is false and the title of the adventure, despite being identical to the 2003 Pisces All Media publication "Steel Shadows" has NOTHING TO DO WITH PISCES ALL MEDIA, other than the title and the identical subject matter.

This matter has been brought to the attention of Paizo Publishing, Wizards of the Coast and Hasbro.

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uh oh...

Paizo Employee Chief Creative Officer, Publisher

Thanks for posting, CEO. Unfortunately, we were unaware of your "Steel Shadows" PDF when Keith Baker wrote "Steel Shadows" last year. While the name dupilcation is unfortunate (no moreso than Fantasy Flight putting out a book called "Dungeoncraft," but I digress), your contention that the two "Steel Shadows" cover "identical subject matter" is flat-out false and misleading.

"Steel Shadows," the adventure by Eberron creator Keith Baker, is about a serial killer hunting warforged in the depths of the city of Sharn.

Near as I can tell (and it ain't easy to tell), your "Steel Shadows" is a d20 pulp source-PDF detailing "still more Feats and Negative Feats, a new monster race, explanations of Gangsters and G-Men for your GOLDEN game, a short story and a JazzpunkTM Lexicon - translating all that wonderful slang from the era between the World Wars!"

While that sounds interesting, it is hardly "identical subject matter."

Thanks.

--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dragon & Dungeon


Erik Mona wrote:
...snip...

As our friends in online gaming might say...

p\/\/n3d.


To Erik Mona et al-

I have contacted your CEO over this, and await a proper response from her.

Posting the declaration of rights and admonition to inter alia your messageboards is no more than the attempted impugning of our trademarked property requires. This may not be realised by people at your level of your organisation but I trust that soon it will be.

In the meantime please note that I have noted your response in this thread. I would personally caution you against such jejeune language. I presently assume that you use informal and disrespectful language and tone on your own behalf rather than on behalf of the firm for whom you act as agent.

I further note that in any event nothing that you have said, presumptively on your own behalf, affects the gravamen of our dispute with your company and its partners.

Jonathan Nolan


"Near as I can tell (and it ain't easy to tell)"

Nice insult. Is everyone treated with this much esteem, or is Pisces All Media a special case?

If there is even the slightest chance that Pisces All Media is in the right, wouldn't a more diplomatic approach be more tactically valuable?

Outwit and punch on.
- Nightwing

www.piscesallmedia.com.au


Nightwing wrote:

"Near as I can tell (and it ain't easy to tell)"

Nice insult. Is everyone treated with this much esteem, or is Pisces All Media a special case?

It may just be a statement of fact. I couldn't find anything about this "Steel Shadows" PDF on your site. (As a matter of fact, the site in your sig is not working. You might want to update it.) I couldn't find it on DriveThruRPG. I finally found the same description Eric found on some Geocities site.

Maybe you would have gotten a more professional response if you had behaved professionally to begin with. Shotgun-style attacks on messageboards are probably not the best way to resolve a legal dispute. Or, to borrow your words, "If there is even the slightest chance that Pisces All Media is in the wrong, wouldn't a more diplomatic approach be more tactically valuable?"


The sig has been fixed up. The mistake was simply adding the ".au" at the end. (While Pisces All Media is an Australian based firm, the .au ending is not needed for the web-site.) So now the

http://www.piscesallmedia.com/golden/

is all fine and can take you to the Pisces All Media site. If you want to go straight to the Pisces All Media forum then

http://p218.ezboard.com/bgoldenuniverse

is the address you need. I hope this helps.

Outwit and punch on.
- Nightwing

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Nightwing wrote:

"Near as I can tell (and it ain't easy to tell)"

Nice insult. Is everyone treated with this much esteem, or is Pisces All Media a special case?

This certainly isn't intended as an insult, but I can see how it might be interpreted that way. In fact, drnuncheon is right; at the time the initial post to this board went up, it wasn't easy to find information about a "Steel Shadows" PDF online.

In any case, public messageboards are not the appropriate forum to discuss legal matters.

Contributing Artist

I agree that this was a pretty inapropriate thing to bring up on message boards.


Well, there's a White Wolf gaming group known as Steel Shadows in Pittsburg, there's a Steel Shadow company making whimsical metal garden sculptures in Washington State, the content of "STEEL SHADOWS: Murals and Drawings of Pittsburgh" is probably obvious from the title, the Worley-Bugge.r Fly Co ("For fly fishers by fly fishers") has a product known as Steel Shadows, there's a Marvel fanfic piece entitled "Steel Shadows One", and then I gave up after page 5 of the search results on Google.

The White Wolf group certainly has the prior claim on "Steel Shadows" in the context of gaming, going back to at least 2001 from the information I found on their website.

Mr Nolan, I can guarantee you that I will not be purchasing any products from your company. Had I known about it before now, I quite possibly would have -- I have a deep interest in the Pulp era and a game in that genre would be very appealing to me -- but thanks to your unprofessional and distasteful display on here, you've lost a customer.

(Edit: Bugge.r shouldn't have a period in it, but the censors get the company's name otherwise. Very funny. :-) )


pisces all media CEO wrote:

The publication Dungeon #115 includes an article adventure claiming to be "Steel Shadows".

This claim is false and the title of the adventure, despite being identical to the 2003 Pisces All Media publication "Steel Shadows" has NOTHING TO DO WITH PISCES ALL MEDIA, other than the title and the identical subject matter.

This matter has been brought to the attention of Paizo Publishing, Wizards of the Coast and Hasbro.

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Jonathan,

Thanks for bringing your concerns to the attention of our CEO. It is Paizo Publishing, LLC's policy not to discuss any issues of a legal nature relating to our company or our products on our messageboards.

Any further responses will occur via email from the appropriate people at Paizo.

Keith Strohm
Chief Operating Officer
Paizo Publishing, LLC

Paizo Employee Senior Software Developer

This thread has been closed.

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