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New Paths 8: The Trickster (PFRPG) PDF

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Most tricksters are always two steps ahead of the competition. A few know how to win before the race even begins!

The trickster is a new Pathfinder Roleplaying Game compatible class which combines arcane magic with roguish skills. Use your special Forte ability to perform incredible acrobatics, summon a magical familiar to act as an accomplice, beguile enemies, or steal spells as they're being cast! Outwit your foes and outrun your enemies.

New Paths 8: The Trickster gives you everything you need to play a trickster whose understanding of the arcane is matched only by his charming and debonair style.

Designer Marc Radle has provided a daring and risk-taking new base class including:

  • 5 new Fortes such as Arcane Accomplice, Beguiling, Spell Pilfering, and Shadow
  • 8 new base class abilities such as Sneakspell and Ranged Legerdemain
  • a full 20-level class that knows when to walk away, and when to run!

Whether you use these powers for good, for seduction, or for power and wealth is entirely up to you—but who says you have to choose just one? Get The Trickster today, wield great arcane might, and have the satisfaction of always being ahead of the pack!

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An Endzeitgeist.com review of the second revision

5/5 —

This second revised installment of the New Paths-series clocks in at 13 pages, 1 page front cover, 1 page editorial, 1 page advertisement, 1 page SRD, leaving us with 9 pages of content, so let's take a look!

This pdf was moved up in my review-queue at the request of my players.

The trickster class presented herein receives d8 HD, a now reduced 4+Int skills per level, proficiency with simple weapons plus rapier, longsword, sap, short sword, shortbow, whip light armor and shields (excluding tower shields) and may freely cast spells while only wearing light armor and/or using a shield. The class receives 3/4 BAB-progression as well as good Ref- and Will-saves and gains spellcasting.

Spellcasting of the trickster is slightly more tricky (I'll punch myself later for that one) than you'd expect: The trickster's spellcasting is governed by Intelligence and thus is prepared according to convention. However, spells prepared are not expended upon being cast - instead, the spell slot of the appropriate level is expended. Metamagic is handled as for sorcerors and similar spontaneous casting classes. High Intelligence influences the number of spells a trickster can cast, but not the amount of spell-slots he has - this is pretty important for balance, so bear that in mind. So, in summary, we have an actually working blend of prepared and spontaneous casting here for a surprisingly unique take on the old vancian system. And yes, concise rules for cantrips gained (often overlooked) and spellbooks (ditto!) are part of the deal here. This section is rather elegant - kudos here! Tricksters begin play with 4 cantrips known and 2 1st level spells and increase that up to 6 for each spell level, barring 5th and 6th, which cap at 5. 5 is also the maximum spells per day limit. Akin to the alchemist and similar classes, spellcasting caps at spell level 6.

The trickster also receives access to sneak attack and begins play with +1d6, increasing this by +1d6 at 4th level and every 3 levels thereafter. Similarly, at first level, the trickster gains trapfinding. So far, so rogue-y, right?

Well, second level becomes a bit more unique, as the trickster gains a forte on which to focus, of which 4 are provided. Structure-wise, the fortes provide immediate benefits and unlock new abilities at 5th and 9th level. The first would be Acrobat, which not only provides skill-bonuses to movement-related skills and eliminates the need for running starts to get the associated bonus. Additional movement while not carrying heavy load or the like and no armor check penalty for Dex-based skills can also be found here. At 5th level, the trickster gains a scaling bonus to AC and CMD and may also act as though under freedom of movement for trickster level round per day, but only for movement purposes. The 9th level ability has been similarly redesigned - provided the trickster has at least 10 ft., he can dimension door as part of the move action expended, but, in a unique twist, the total distance he can thus travel is limited and capped with a daily max.
The second forte is arcane accomplice, which nets a familiar, though the familiar receives Disable Device and Sleight of Hand as class skills and can deal sneak attack as long as it's within 30 ft. of the trickster - and yes, this means you can basically double-team on your own, greatly increasing the validity of sneak attack, though, for balance's sake, a familiar's sneak attack uses d4s, which proved mathematically feasible in my tests. 5th level goes one step further and nets the familiar all teamwork feats of the trickster as well as AC +2, while 9th level provides basically spring attack for the familiar, but only with regards to delivering harmless touch attacks - and yes, this is more versatile than you'd think.

The third forte is Beguile and provides +1 to DCs and +1 to rolls to overcome SR, scaling by +1 at 5th and 9th level - but only when targeting creatures that would be denied their Dexterity-modifier or that are helpless. At 5th level, when successfully feinting, the target would be denied his Dex-mod to AC for the next melee attack or spell targeting by the trickster, but only when performed on or before his next turn. 9th level decreases the required action to feint to a move action, a swift action if the trickster has Improved Feint.

The fourth forte is Spell Pilfer, which is easily the most unique of the fortes: As an immediate action, the trickster can make a Spellcraft check (DC 15 + spell level) to identify the spell and, if successful, the trickster may attempt to pilfer the spell. The caster receives a Will-save versus 10 + 1/2 trickster class level + Int-mod to negate the attempt. If the caster fails, he loses access to the spell known or prepared spell, while the trickster temporarily (1/2 class levels, minimum 1) adds the spell to his list of spells known. While the spell is pilfered, the original caster may not cast it, but the trickster may, provided he has an available spell slot. Only one spell (again, VERY important for balance) can be pilfered at a given time - pilfering a second spell, the previous spell immediately reverts to the owner. This ability can be used 3 + Intelligence mod times per day. It should be noted that tricksters can only pilfer spells they can cast, another VERY important limitation. Now you may have noted that Will-saves are pretty easy for most casters - thus, at 5th level, the trickster's Wisdom modifier is also added to the DC to resist the pilfer attempt. I am usually fiercely opposed to dual attribute-mods to anything, but considering that Wis is NOT a trickster's crucial stat in any way, in practice, this is not problematic. 9th level allows the trickster to pilfer spells above his casting capacity, but thankfully with the caveat that the trickster can't cast such spells - so no abuse possible. This is a very impressive ability in my book, since it makes spell theft work sans holes in the wording, sans abuse. Love it!

The new, fifth forte would be shadow, which nets a +2 insight bonus on Stealth checks in dim light or less and it also nets low-light vision and darkvision 30 ft. (Or +30 ft., if the trickster already has darkvision.) 5th level nets something unique - the option to 3* Int-mod times per day animate shadows of targets to attack them (cool). Shadow and darkness spells are cast at CL +1. At 9th level, the trickster can basically hide in plain sight while within 10 feet of a shadow other than his own and at that level, the shadow may use the trickster's sneak attack, which is a pretty cool revision. The revision of the shadow forte is more intriguing and unique. Kudos for making it more interesting.

Starting at 3rd level the trickster adds +1 competence bonus to Bluff, Disguise, Escape Artist, Sleight of Hand or Stealth, increasing the bonus by +1 every third level, though the new bonuses gained may be freely distributed among aforementioned spells. 3rd level also nets evasion and 6th, 12th and 18th level provides bonus feats from a limited list. 8th level provides uncanny dodge, 11th improved uncanny dodge.

At the level, as a standard action, the trickster can cast a spell with a range of touch and deliver it as part of a melee attack, with the restriction of only working in conjunction with spells that have a casting time of 1 standard action or less. If the trickster hits, he also deals sneak attack damage in conjunction with the touch spell. Important: Misses mean the spell is lost, not held! This, combined with 3/4 BAB, is an important balancing mechanism...At least until high levels, for at 17th level, it is no longer lost - as a minor nitpick, while it is clear from the wording, it would have been nice to see the class explicitly specify that the trickster can hold only one sneakspell charge to avoid stacking them up.
Spells thus delivered may also not be enhanced by metamagic and, have a crit mod of x2. 9th level provides ranged legerdemain, though the ability is thankfully MORE precise than that of the arcane trickster PrC, specifying how far you can propel stolen objects and increasing the required skill ranks to 5. At 14th level, the trickster receives Filch Spell, which allows the trickster to hijack spells requiring direction (flaming spheres etc.) as a move action 3+Inttelligence modifier times per day. 15th level provides Surprise spells - but unlike the imprecise original take on the ability, this one clarifies from the get-go how it works with magic missiles or AoE-spells. As a capstone, the trickster treats all sneak attack damage 1s and 2s as 3s and automatically confirms all crits when using sneak attack. Additionally, the trickster may add metamagic to sneakspells sans increasing the casting time.

It should be noted that the trickster, still exceedingly powerful, now has a suggestion to decrease the power of the class: The suggestion is to eliminate necromancy and evocation from the spells they can cast. While this may be a sound idea and a quick and dirty elimination of the blasting capabilities of the trickster, it only marginally addresses the issue of power - an alternate, more conservative spell-progression would have been a more prudent solution in my book and maintained the universality of character concepts one can realize - instead of restricting the options, reducing the resources available, especially considering the strong framework of the class, would have made sense to me.

The previously horribly broken archetype has been completely redesigned and basically been split into two mutually exclusive archetypes both of which feature diminished spellcasting to 4th level. The first of these would be the Dual-Forte master, who gains a second forte at 6th level. He is treated as -4 levels for this forte, .2 levels at 11th and use full level for the second forte at 20th level. Feat-exchanges further balance the archetype. The second archetype would be the forte master, who gains a further upgrade for the forte chosen - one ability is gained at 11th and at 14th level, with the respective abilities depending on the forte chosen. Acrobats can inflict sneak attack when moving more than 10 feet and maintain actions after using dimension door. Arcane Accomplices increase familiar potency and may teleport them to an adjacent square 1/day as a swift action. Beguilers get enchantment tricks, shadow masters darkness-related tricks that blend the dark with nice tricks and spell pilferers may now steal divine spells as well. And yes, these significantly powerful upgrades are further balanced by 2 lost feats in addition to the spellcasting

Conclusion:
Editing and formatting are top-notch and precise, I noticed but one minor fringe case; other than that - all around precise and well done in both formal and rules-language departments. Layout adheres to Kobold Press' gorgeous two-column full-color standard and the pdf sports multiple gorgeous pieces of original art. The pdf comes with bookmarks in spite of its brevity - nice.

Marc Radle's trickster is interesting - it is a testament to how much we love the concept of a rogue-y character that the by now pretty broken (as in: too weak) base class continues to see truly excellent takes on the trope. Regarding customization options, both the talented rogue and in particularly, Legendary Games' absolutely brilliant Legendary Rogues-book provided options for the "mundane" rogue that retain their viability in the system. Why "retain"? Well, simple: You see, the rogue has been pretty much a casualty to changing design-paradigms in PFRPG - when the core-rules were releases, the value of a rogue talent was obviously set to about a feat or less, while later classes have increased the value of class-specific options - compare alchemist discoveries and rogue talents if you need proof of that...or look at the ninja's framework and unique tricks and you'll notice the paradigm-shift.

The trickster, however, is not a simple rogue redesign - it could be summed up as a magus/rogue-hybrid, but that does not do the class justice: Instead of cobbling together two classes, the trickster is a completely unique class. Let me sum up the unique benefits here: The trickster streamlines problematic arcane trickster class features, has a unique spellcasting-blend that plays different from standard classes while being easy to understand and it provides a balanced, strong means to represent the sneak attack double team as well as, most importantly, creating the AWESOME spell pilfer mechanic.

Where am I going with this history lesson/comparison? Well, the trickster is stronger than the vanilla rogue - no doubt. It frankly SHOULD be - there are three classes that need versatility/power-upgrades: Rogue, monk and (versatility-wise/unique class feature-wise) fighter. The trickster is stronger than the rogue can deliver solid damage - much like a magus, this class is a glass cannon, though one that also is a rather good face/skill-monkey. Personally, I very much welcome the decrease in skills per level, though this in no way decreases the potency of the class.

Here's what I really like here: Marc Radle has actually listened to the feedback of the first revision and improved the file significantly. The new archetypes are balanced and do fun things and the totality of the trickster can now truly be called a great little class. The second revisions improvements catapult this to the rating-echelon of 5 stars + seal of approval.

Endzeitgeist out.

Magic + Skills = Winning

5/5 —

When the Advanced Class Guide came out, one of the major hybrids a large number of people were surprised to find missing was a Rogue/Caster combination. Fortunately, Marc Radle and Kobold Press have filled that hole, and they've done so with flair and skill.

The Trickster, clearly inspired by and borrowing elements from the Arcane Trickster PrC, is a 20 level base class that elevates and enhances the ideas embodied by the Arcane Trickster and makes the concept playable right from first level. The Trickster features a 3/4 BAB, 6+Int skills, good Reflex and Will saves, 6 level Int-based arcane spellcasting that works similarly to the casting system seen in the Arcanist class, and sneak attack scaling up to 7d6. In addition to these solid mechanics that form the functional skeleton of the class, the Trickster also gains Trapfinding, bonuses to thematic skills, evasion, a pseudo Spellstrike ability called Sneakspell that can be used with melee sneak attacks, three bonus feats, Uncanny Dodge and Improved Uncanny Dodge, Ranged Legerdemain as the Arcane Trickster, Filch Spell which allows him to attempt to redirect an enemy's spell, and the Master Trickster capstone, which allows him to treat all 1's and 2's on his sneak attack dice as 3's and apply a metamagic feat he knows for free when using his Sneakspell ability.

In addition to the class features mentioned above, the Trickster also selects a Forte at 2nd level. The Forte the Trickster chooses gives him a packet of abilities that help customize him and enhance his abilities within a certain area. The Fortes available are:

  • Acrobat- The Acrobat Forte enhances the Trickster's mobility, reducing ACP in light armor and even increasing his AC in light or no armor.

  • Arcane Accomplice- Grants the Trickster a familiar who gains a variety of unique abilities that assist it in aiding the Trickster.

  • Beguile- A set of mechanics presumably inspired by and presented in homage to the 3.5 Beguiler, Tricksters who choose this Forte find that their spells are more effective against enemies who would be denied their Dex to AC, as well as bonuses to Bluff and feint. This Forte really makes the Trickster's Sneakspell class feature particularly effective and potent when used intelligently.

  • Spell Pilfer- Another mechanic that the reminds me of a 3.5 class, this time the Spellthief, Spell Pilfer allows the Trickster to steal an enemy's spell, removing it from their list of spells known/prepared and adding it to the Trickster's.

Overall, the depth and potential of this class is really impressive to me, and I'm looking forward to spending more time playing with the numerous characters this class enables. I strongly recommend this to anyone who's a fan of the Arcane Trickster class, anyone who found themselves missing a skilled/caster combo from the ACG, and really anyone who likes the idea of an effective and versatile class that offers a broad array of potential character builds.

An RPG Resource Review

5/5 —

In this, the eighth of the New Paths series, we meet the Trickster, a crafty scoundrel who always seems to come out on top using a mix of stealth and other dubious skills, arcane study and innate casting ability. Outwitting and outthinking their enemies is their specialty, but a sneaky well-targeted spell or a dagger in the back will do as opportunity offers itself.

There's a magnificent full-page illustration, then the text launches into all the game mechanical information required for this new base class. The Trickster's spell casting abilities are particularly interesting: although he has to choose and learn his spells in advance, he can cast any spell he's learned as many times as he likes until he's used up his daily capacity to cast spells of that level. Sneak attacks, the ability to cast spells with a range of touch sneakily, and more are in his repertoire, and he can choose to be an acrobat and can even pilfer other people's spells... and cast them!

The character sounds great fun to play, with an innate curiousity and mischievous nature which would be particularly suited to urban adventuring and games in which interaction as well as combat feature large. There's no exemplar character, though, if you want to play one you'll have to settle down and create the character from scratch.

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Good deal!

I rolled up a Spell Pilfer Trickster as my backup character for an upcoming game. I'm currently playing the cleric in that game and have no intention of stopping, but should something happen to her then I'll have Lokesh to fall back on! (I kinda hope something happens to her).

Also, having had some time to reflect on the Trickster some more, I think I would've like to have seen three or four Trickster Feats included in the pdf. I realize that might have bumped the page count up by 1 or 2, but it would've been worth it. Any such supplement in the idea mill?
The Exchange Contributor; Publisher, Kobold Press; RPG Superstar Judge
1 person marked this as a favorite.

Trickster Feats is definitely in the idea mill now! Seems like there could be some fun options down that path.
Liberty's Edge
1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'm sure we can spin up some Trickster-specfic feats at some point! I also have an idea for a cool Trickster archetype ... if I can just carve out some time to write it up! :)

When is the next new class expected to drop? Next month?
The Exchange Contributor; Publisher, Kobold Press; RPG Superstar Judge
2 people marked this as a favorite.

Not that soon, I don't think. Still in playtest, but April is not out of the question.
Liberty's Edge
DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Good deal!

I rolled up a Spell Pilfer Trickster as my backup character for an upcoming game. I'm currently playing the cleric in that game and have no intention of stopping, but should something happen to her then I'll have Lokesh to fall back on!

Looking forward to hearing the adventures of Lokesh, the Spell Pilfer Trickster!!!

As soon as I get to play him I'll let you know it turned out.
Liberty's Edge

Sounds great! :)
Liberty's Edge
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Huzzah!!!!!!!!!

The Trickster is the TOP DOWNLOAD this week on Paizo's Top Ten from Other Companies List!

That is just awesome! :)
Liberty's Edge
Marc Radle wrote:
I also have an idea for a cool Trickster archetype ... if I can just carve out some time to write it up! :)

Found a little time this weekend to work on my Trickster archetype idea a bit - I'm liking how it's turning out. I might actually have it ready for some playtesting in the next couple weeks! :)

Had an idea for a Trickster feat. I'm not much good at wording these things for "professional use", but it goes like this:

Steal Any Spell: This allows the Trickster to steal non arcane spells just as he does arcane spells. He can't cast them, but they dissipate keeping them from his mind and preventing the cleric or psychic from using it against him. The DC of the attempt increases by 5 to steal an non arcane spell.

Just to add to the discussion about how balanced this class is, I always consider how balanced the class will be in my world and the types of games I play. That said I should probably give some specifics about it so others can understand why I see absolutely no problem with this class.

All casters use Spheres of Power, so this keeps the spell list aspect in check. I also usually run Gestalt games without allowing multiclassing, so dipping isn't allowed and the class itself needs to be fun and interesting for at least a good stretch of levels.

With that in mind, this class doesn't have any action economy abuse, which is the big thing I watch for. I understand that many games are not like mine, so criteria for judging will differ dramatically. I thought it might be useful to show a different viewpoint on balance.

Congratulations Marc!
DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Had an idea for a Trickster feat. I'm not much good at wording these things for "professional use", but it goes like this:

Steal Any Spell: This allows the Trickster to steal non arcane spells just as he does arcane spells. He can't cast them, but they dissipate keeping them from his mind and preventing the cleric or psychic from using it against him. The DC of the attempt increases by 5 to steal an non arcane spell.

What if stealing the spell and holding its energies in his mind also grants him a small bonus on saves against spells of the same school as the stolen one? Maybe a followup feat would let him use the stolen energies for something like an Arcane Strike effect?

That's a good idea. Like I said, I'm not very good at writing up new rules and feats and the like, but maybe something suggested here by us ends up in the feats document!
Liberty's Edge

Interesting feat ideas! Keep 'em coming :)
Liberty's Edge
Wraithguard wrote:

Just to add to the discussion about how balanced this class is, I always consider how balanced the class will be in my world and the types of games I play. That said I should probably give some specifics about it so others can understand why I see absolutely no problem with this class.

All casters use Spheres of Power, so this keeps the spell list aspect in check. I also usually run Gestalt games without allowing multiclassing, so dipping isn't allowed and the class itself needs to be fun and interesting for at least a good stretch of levels.

With that in mind, this class doesn't have any action economy abuse, which is the big thing I watch for. I understand that many games are not like mine, so criteria for judging will differ dramatically. I thought it might be useful to show a different viewpoint on balance.

Congratulations Marc!

Thanks so much!!!

DungeonmasterCal wrote:

Had an idea for a Trickster feat. I'm not much good at wording these things for "professional use", but it goes like this:

Steal Any Spell: This allows the Trickster to steal non arcane spells just as he does arcane spells. He can't cast them, but they dissipate keeping them from his mind and preventing the cleric or psychic from using it against him. The DC of the attempt increases by 5 to steal an non arcane spell.

I forgot that if the Trickster doesn't cast the spell he's pilfered it reverts back to the original caster. It would do the same with divine or psychic spells with a possible feat of the above nature. But the extra +5 to the DC to pilfer the spell would stay the same (20 plus spell level to identify the spell instead of 15) and the opposing spellcaster receives a Will save (DC 5 + 1/2 the trickster’s level + the trickster’s Int bonus) to negate the spell pilfer attempt to reflect the different source of the spell being cast.

Kinda disappointed with the last game I played in. The GM initially said I could play the Trickster, then pretty much said I should play my cleric instead, which worked out as the adventure needed a healer constantly. I was really itching to try out the Trickster. He was hesitant to let me play 2 characters, saying it would unbalance the party (not because of the class itself, but the number of players at the table), but believe me, the foes he threw at us demanded all hands on deck and he still wouldn't let me play it. And there wasn't a single spellcaster among the enemies, so the Spell Pilfer attempt wouldn't have come into play. But by gum I'm playing it next time if I had to beat him with a stick to let me do it.
Liberty's Edge
1 person marked this as a favorite.

And by gum, I'm anxious to hear how it goes (I can't advocate beating anyone with a stick though!)

If you only knew this guy.....lol
Liberty's Edge
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Just saw that The Trickster is #1 on Paizo's list of Top Downloads From Other Companies for the second week in a row!!

I'm absolutely thrilled, honored, and, frankly, more than a little humbled!
1 person marked this as a favorite.

Reviewed first on endzeitgeist.com, then submitted to Nerdtrek and GMS magazine and posted here and on OBS. Congrats, Marc!
Liberty's Edge
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I haven't even bought it yet but all the discussion and reviews are already giving me ideas for feats and archetypes. Soon it will be mine
The Exchange Contributor; Publisher, Kobold Press; RPG Superstar Judge
1 person marked this as a favorite.

Thank you for the review, EZG!
Liberty's Edge
2 people marked this as a favorite.

Let me second that - thanks so much for the review! Agreed that this was on the shorted side, but I think we packed a lot of goodness into those pages :)

Speaking of additional material, I'm currently working on pretty cool Trickster archetype that opens up some interesting new play options ...

Raven Black - looking forward to hearing what you think once you do!

Hey you're really bored and looking to kill some time, here's an interview with some guy from Kobold Press :)

Liberty's Edge
1 person marked this as a favorite.

I've been noodling away at the archetype I mentioned earlier (in my copious amounts of free time:) and an interesting thing seems to have developed, without being intended ...

In addition to being (in my oh so humble opinion) a pretty darn interesting archetype, it also appears to pretty nicely address the issue that a small but vocal number of folks have expressed, i.e. feeling the class might be a bit too powerful due to having access to the full wizard/sorcerer spell list (albeit up to 6th level spells, of course).

Mind you, I think the power-level and balance of the Trickster is just about right as is, BUT, for those that feel otherwise, I think this archetype might just offer a great alternative.

Basically, I guess what I'm saying is I'm really happy with how this bad boy is shaping up :)
Liberty's Edge
3 people marked this as a favorite.

Wow!!!!

The Trickster is #1 on Paizo's list of Top Downloads From Other Companies for the THIRD week in in a row!!

That is so awesome! Thanks everyone! :)
Pathfinder LO Special Edition, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Well, if you write something this interesting, it *should* make the top of the list. :-)
Liberty's Edge
Ed Reppert wrote:
Well, if you write something this interesting, it *should* make the top of the list. :-)

Well, thanks very much!!!! :)

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I haven't read it thoroughly enough to review it but so far I really like this. Its kind of to the Arcane Trickster what the Magus is to the Eldritch Knight. Like New Paths Compendium I've seen the niche filled before but this way keeps it simple and bold at the same time making it somewhat safe and trustworthy.
Liberty's Edge
Malwing wrote:
I haven't read it thoroughly enough to review it but so far I really like this. Its kind of to the Arcane Trickster what the Magus is to the Eldritch Knight. Like New Paths Compendium I've seen the niche filled before but this way keeps it simple and bold at the same time making it somewhat safe and trustworthy.

Thank you! If you get a chance, we'd certainly welcome a review :)

Liberty's Edge
2 people marked this as a favorite.

Wow AGAIN!!!!

The Trickster is #1 on Paizo's list of Top Downloads From Other Companies yet again!

That's the FOURTH week in in a row!!
Liberty's Edge
2 people marked this as a favorite.

Catching up on e-mail and saw I'd missed my Paizo e-mail!

The Trickster is on the Paizo's Top Ten from Other Companies List again! It did drop the number one spot to the number 5 spot (wow, I sound like Kasey Kasem :) but that's totally OK! 4 weeks as the top download is awesome and we're thrilled to still be in the Top Ten again this week :)
Liberty's Edge

Hey! I've been sick as a dog, but I just saw that the Trickster remains on Paizo's Top Ten from Other Companies List!

I think that makes something like 6 weeks as the top ten list! I really can't thank everyone enough!
Dark Archive RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32
Marc Radle wrote:

Just saw that The Trickster is #1 on Paizo's list of Top Downloads From Other Companies for the second week in a row!!

I'm absolutely thrilled, honored, and, frankly, more than a little humbled!

That's AWESOME Marc!

Dark Archive RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32
Marc Radle wrote:

Hey! I've been sick as a dog, but I just saw that the Trickster remains on Paizo's Top Ten from Other Companies List!

I think that makes something like 6 weeks as the top ten list! I really can't thank everyone enough!

Yew old trickster you!

Liberty's Edge

Thank you good sir!

I'd love to see a few more reviews should you be so inclined :)
Dark Archive RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32
Marc Radle wrote:

Thank you good sir!

I'd love to see a few more reviews should you be so inclined :)

Actually I've promoted it to the players in my Tuesday night game. We're starting a new chapter in an ongoing AP of mine and they need to design some new 5th level characters. I'll get some feedback from them to see how it plays. Should be interesting!

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I've found this class last week and have mulled it over since. This is probably the best incarnation of the arcane trickster concept we've seen so far for Pathfinder, especially since you don't have to wait several level for a Prestige Class or need to compromise with an archetype (is it just me or is it weird that the Magus doesn't have any real trickster archetypes except Stygian Striker?).

While I would agree that the Trickster is definitely on the strong side of class balance, it's not as overpowered as some of the "reviews" claim it to be. Yes, having access to the entire Sor/Wiz spell list is a huge deal, but the Trickster's spell progression is worse than a sorcerer's. Also, Sneakspell comes online late enough to not steal the Magus' spotlight prematurely and there aren't tons of feats and options to customize it. The Trickster also doesn't get rogue talents, which I think is a huge balance point.

Claiming that the Trickster is stealing the Rogue's thunder strikes me as unfair since we already have Traits like Trap Finder that allow classes like the Bard or the Magus to beat the Rogue at his own game (or at least part of it).

My only criticsm right now is that the 5th-level ability of the Beguile Forte seems... I dunno, redundant? Either I'm missing something or this ability is already covered by the standard Bluff skill.

I'll definitely allow this class in my next game, hopefully one of my players is interested enough to give it a shot.

@Antariuk: I had similar observations.

@Antariuk
The 5th level beguile is what allows you to feint and then have a spell benefit. Otherwise Feinting would only effect your next attack, but not spell.

What Insain said.

Ah, I see. Thanks for the clarification. That makes it a bit more interesting. If there'll ever be an expansion or revision, I think I'd really love to see a few additional Fortes - I get that the class has a tight focus and that a Forte is intended to emphasize this focus rather than shifting it around, but I think Forte branches like Stealth and Divination (as in gathering information by some obscure or illigetimite means) would be perfectly in line with the Trickster. Just a thought ;)
Liberty's Edge
Antariuk wrote:

I've found this class last week and have mulled it over since. This is probably the best incarnation of the arcane trickster concept we've seen so far for Pathfinder, especially since you don't have to wait several level for a Prestige Class or need to compromise with an archetype (is it just me or is it weird that the Magus doesn't have any real trickster archetypes except Stygian Striker?).

I'll definitely allow this class in my next game, hopefully one of my players is interested enough to give it a shot.

Thanks so much for your comments Antariuk! I'm really glad you like the class!!!

I'm also pleased that you recognized the various balancing elements built into the Tricksters spellcasting.

If you're so inclined, please consider posting an actual review (heck, your initial post could practically BE the review :)

Oh, as for additional Fortes ... excellent idea. I really want to keep the number of Fortes reasonably small, but one or two more is certainly doable. I already have what I think is an interesting new Trickster archetype written, when I have some time I'll start mulling over an additional Forte or two!

I agree a few more Fortes would be interesting, maybe as many as a half dozen to be better able to create more varied Tricksters. Imagine a party of mostly or all Tricksters, each with different Fortes. *drifts away in a pleasant daydream*.
Marc Radle wrote:
If you're so inclined, please consider posting an actual review (heck, your initial post could practically BE the review :)

I can do that no problem, but it would be a capsule review at this point without any actual play behind it.

Marc Radle wrote:
Oh, as for additional Fortes ... excellent idea. I really want to keep the number of Fortes reasonably small, but one or two more is certainly doable. I already have what I think is an interesting new Trickster archetype written, when I have some time I'll start mulling over an additional Forte or two!

I'm not the world's biggest fan of archetypes these days (way too many of them around), but any additional option for the Trickster is much appreciated. I'll be waiting then :)

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Antariuk wrote:
While I would agree that the Trickster is definitely on the strong side of class balance, it's not as overpowered as some of the "reviews" claim it to be... .

Why the "quotation" marks on "reviews"? Reviews don't "claim" things, they are people's thoughts and opinions. However colored by preference, bias or table variation. I found both of the low star reviews exceedingly informative about just what is missing - page count, and options.

Oceanshieldwolf wrote:
Why the "quotation" marks on "reviews"? Reviews don't "claim" things, they are people's thoughts and opinions. However colored by preference, bias or table variation. I found both of the low star reviews exceedingly informative about just what is missing - page count, and options.

I think that a review should be a bit more than ranting about feeling ripped off of lamenting the power level or lack of balance without any explanation - which two of the 1-Star reviews do. Its ok to not be satisfied with a product and give a negative review, but if you just want to let off some steam we have the product discussion threads for that.

Also, I am tired of people trying to sell reviews as a neutral thing - a review is always, ALWAYS a subjective affair. Which is totally ok. But just as every user here can post a review, I can decide to find a review to be improper or lacking. If you can't handle that, don't post a review.

My impression is that some people looked at the Trickster, saw a) access to the sor/wiz spell list and b) sneak attack and rogue class features and dismissed the entire thing immediately. I'd say that skill-wise the class is indeed too strong, but everything else is balanced within the Pathfinder system as it stands today. If you compare the Trickster to the Rogue or Magus, both of which have a huuuuge list of options and customizations available by now, the power level is pretty much even.

Table experience can and will of course vary between different groups and GMs, but that's true for the entirety of the game.

For a single class PDF I don't consider anything less than an explanation and discussion of the class' features a review.

If you have something to say, positive or negative, back it up.
Liberty's Edge
Antariuk wrote:
Marc Radle wrote:
If you're so inclined, please consider posting an actual review (heck, your initial post could practically BE the review :)
I can do that no problem, but it would be a capsule review at this point without any actual play behind it.

Nothing at all wrong with an honest capsule review :)

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