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Thanks MrSin I now know my abc's

Ok what's MAD mean? Thanks

I did a what type of character are you test. I am a human Level 5 Druid

Dex- 10

I guess, I know just how dumb a 7 int character is :0 Dumberer then me :Þ

I am a lawful neutral Human 5th level Druid. But I'm a dumb $hit with my
8 int
13 wis
13 cha
10 str, dex and 10 con

If I rolled those number I'd ask to reroll :)

I've Played a gay character many times but I don't role play out the romance stuff. With me being gay it's not a big deal to me. I always wonder why people ( older then teenagers ) want to role play "sex" stuff? I know when I was a teenager many a moon ago that stuff came up a lot understandingly. Being that sex was something me and my friends could only dream about. For them girls and for me David Hunt :)

I wouldn't have just walked. I would have told the GM how I felt about having a much lower overall PB then the rest of the party. If you explained that having a character who's going to be so much weaker than the rest of the party isn't going to be fun for you. If he then tells you that the way we play politely say maybe I'm not going to be a good fit with your game. Thanks for inviting me and have a nice day and then leave.

Is this a new GM?............. If so he may not realize how unfun it is to play a character that is so much weaker than the rest. I know I've played weaker characters then this. But everyone was pretty much just as "bad". I've played a character who was much weaker then the rest of the party and it wasn't fun for me. So I get where your coming from. ( OP )

I wonder what this thread would have looked like if the OP asked How smart is my 7 int character? Just food for thought.

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I think some people are not understanding one another. If your fighter has a 7 int he is not a fountain of information you could play him like he's not super dumb no problem. He's just not going to offer the correct answer to every riddle that comes along either.

The other issue is that multi dump stats can and *should* affect how you RP your character. Not must or be dammed kind of thing. Just should.

If you have a 7 int 7 wis 7 cha. All those stats are connected and you *should* RP that. There are no rules on any page that states that is how it should be done. There are no rules that say you have to be polite to the person hosting the game. You can show up and be a world class jackass but don't expect to get invited back. If the group as a whole thinks that a 7 dump is a big negative in that ability then RP that way. If your group thinks it's not a big deal then RP that way.

If you find yourself at odds with most gaming groups either as a player or GM, That a good indication that the problem is you and not everyone else.

Piccolo I was joking :) I didn't think you were really insulting me.

For the whole thread - I can prove my 7 int fighter is not slow because he has a 16 Dex :)

Thanks :)


I was just hiding my Smarts Behind my dumbness :)

Piccolo said I had a psychological problem. I was wondering if that was a nice way of saying I'm stupid like I'm some kind of 7 int simpleton :)

No I wasn't going for a fish called Wanda but now that you mention it that works too.

I didn't call anyone stupid! I was wondering if someone called me stupid. Stupid :)

strydr316 wrote:

Rasmus Nielsen you said you have autism. Autism is not a low int score but a disorder. I have a learning disorder as well. Which is not the same thing as a low int score. I think an adequate example of autism might be an allergic reaction to a bee sting. You could have a 20 con and be in great shape and rarely get sick but when a bee stings you are toast.

Sort of. He's got a mental illness, not a disorder. An illness is crippling, while a disorder is merely troublesome. He literally needs help with certain tasks, and to have people he can trust to watch his back. You, however, have a much less intense form of psychological problem.

Did you just call me stupid ?

I understand your thinking and reasoning Rasmus Nielsen and you make a good case. I still somewhat disagree with you but not enough to split hairs. Have a good night

Rasmus Nielsen you said you have autism. Autism is not a low int score but a disorder. I have a learning disorder as well. Which is not the same thing as a low int score. I think an adequate example of autism might be an allergic reaction to a bee sting. You could have a 20 con and be in great shape and rarely get sick but when a bee stings you are toast.

Dire Elf, I too have worked with disabled adults and children and teens. I totally agree with you.

In a rpg characters aren't players. I don't think anyone is saying that a player has to just sit there like a lump on a log if they are playing a 7/7/7. Players can help each other out OOC. The problem is when the 7/7/7 player has his character in game say " listen dumb a$$ E= mc2 means that Bla Bla. His 7/7/7 would have no freaking idea how E= mc2 affects anything. It's a bit of realism that I think most people are looking for.

I've got the perfect 7/7/7 guy example.
Kid comes home from school and say Mom we were comparing winkie sizes at school and I had the biggest one. Mom states you should have won your 17 and still in third grade. :)

Ok, I know old joke but still funny.

More importantly, I would ask what kind of cha score would the strong guy have if he needed to go to a little kids school and change them to arm wrestling matches? I would assume he would win and then what? Would he feel all kinds of powerful? Would he say I'm the strongest guy in the third grade? I'm being silly here.

Littlehewy wrote
PS Hi there strydr316 :)

Hi . I hope you are having a good day littlehewy


First off lets take a deep breath everyone :)

I know some people have an issue with IQ = int. It's not that it can't be used or is wrong to use. We are trying to measure int. We need some sort of measuring cup to determine a rating. An IQ test score is a reasonable measuring cup. It's not perfect but it's the most widely understood method, ( I believe )

Second off
Here is a second way to try and measure the concept of int. Take your Bestiary books and take a look at what has a 7 int and then say I'm as smart as a ....

P.S. Good morning everyone

The classic George Carlin comes to mind:

Think of how stupid the average person is, and realize half of them are stupider than that.

That was over the top funny!... I saw him in concert a long time ago he was very funny.

I'll be chuckling all night now. Thanks I need that.

I think everyone has stated good points. This has been a great discussion thanks.

But on a less serious note Can I still call the 7 int character Muffin head :)?


A low int score in not the same as uneducated. If you don't have a formal education you can still be smart.

For example If you were Mentally retarded. I'm not saying you can't learn new things but you will always be mentally retarded. I'm not saying that to insult MR people. I have a learning disability and weather I like it or not that does come into play with my everyday life. It doesn't mean I can't do or get things but I do forget things every now and again. I have made some really bad decisions in life because of my " low int " But I have made some really good ones too. That is what it means to have a 7 int. I sometimes have good ideas or at least I thought I did until someone else points out that my good idea is not a good idea.

On a side note when you play a 7 int character how often do you have them do dumb things? I don't mean party crippling dumb stuff, just general not bright things. ie forgetting to get oil for the lamps? That won't cripple the party but make the wizard have to cast the spell light a lot.

It's not that 7 int characters can't come up with a good ideas every now and then. It's when the 7 int character has good ideas in every situation that some players and GM's have issues with.

If you go straight 7's in mental scores the answer is yes. You are the kid in the back of the class picking your nose and eating the bogeys thinking no one sees you. :)

The black raven

For me I don't penalize anyone. I have taken advantage of players who have made bad decisions though :) Mind you I'm kidding. The whole point is to have fun and making a game not fun is like a GM with a 7 int :)


I am very much for Players to help out other Players. I have no issues with a really smart Player helping out a Player who's not. For instance instead of saying do this or do that, maybe say something like try making a knowledge check. If that doesn't work. Than yes just tell him answer. But please give the player a chance to learn on his own. If it's not going to end up with dire consequences then let him make a mistake and then after very nicely point out where the mistake was or let him know that doing X would have worked out better.

On a side note I do give my characters minuses when I feel they are called for. ie my character gets drunk as a skunk I'll just give him a minus 2 on all rolls that being drunk might affect. Like a balance check or concentrate check If he is a wizard trying to cast a spell but I wouldn't take off any points from damage. I just find it more fun to play that way. But, you if you don't that is ok too.

I prefer a heavily role playing game over a PFS style game. I don't think I'm any better then others because of this. There is nothing wrong with PFS games they are fun too. Everyone is different which is a good thing.


I'm not saying the player has to act like a muffin head if he plays a 7 int character. I agree with your example of the go-to big stick until someone else suggests a silver sword. I'm not saying he has to handicap himself but in game let the guy with knowledge's skills point out that Were creatures need to be attacked with silver. One round of not using the most effective weapon shouldn't kill your guy off.

But far to often I've played with the muffin head who says " they are Trolls we need to use fire to kill them because they ( the Trolls ) can regenerate, only acid and fire can really hurt the Trolls on there 1st encounter with Trolls. Or the even more crazy is party kills (whatever)and then said muffin head states " I going to take the heart because it's worth a zillion GP to wizards who are trying to do cast a 9th level spell" ..........imho

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7 int is just stew ped. :) It's a role playing game not a roll playing game. The difference is if you chose to dump a stat. You should role play that score. I'm not saying you ( the player ) can't help out other players come up with ideas but in game your 7 int fighter is not going to come up with a multi layered escape plan. If you don't role play your scores then the number on the character's sheet are just numbers and if that's the case why bother writing them down?

one more quick question would an adamantine non magical weapon by pass the werewolf's DR?

Dal Selpher

Thanks that how I'd think it would have worked. It's how it worked in 3.5.


Question would the sneak attack dmg bypass the DR?

That website was pretty cool-tombxoom

The argument is going around in circles.

One can not argue specific points and generalities. IE It snows in New England during winter. Point of fact! Well it didn't snow on Jan. 17th so I don't see how you can say it snows in new England during the winter.

An other example This person was going to stab my mother in the face with a knife so I shot him. Not evil. Know change stab in face with kiss on the check. That would make it an evil act. So changing the details matters a whole lot.

In most cases it boils down to intent behind the act.

I think you should go mad bomber. I have this pretty cool picture in my mind's eye of a goblin bomber. Plus who doesn't like the idea of blowing "stuff" up :)

I was just going to say you don't have to have a high cha because you'll only cast level one spells. and then you'll be multi classing to something else. So in a nut shell blackbloodtroll beat me to it. Consider my thunder stolen :)

Is the Bard's main stat cha ?

That Rape was just an example. What if it was rape man on man no women invioled?

Back to the point, It's what you do not what you won't do that matters.

As far as weather ( I can't remember the other spelling of weather ) He'd be ok to play with, That depends on you. If you and the other players like him then no problem. But if he plays characters that causes you concern try talking to him. Or if you find the things he does disturbing then you should try and distance yourself from him. Always keep your self safe.

He is clearly evil! He takes pleasure from, other peoples' pain! Yes that makes you a evil person. Ted Bundy came across as a really nice guy. Maybe Ted wouldn't kill little kids. But since he would take pleasure from torturing and raping women then killing them HE IS EVIL. It's not what you won't do that determines weather you are evil or not but what you are willing to do!

P.S. Sorry for the poor spelling

I've played both ways hard and soft. I have a friend who GM's most of the time and he plays it hard core, he doesn't fudge anything!

On one hand when we complete a mission I know we earned it and it feels really good. On the other hand I find that being hard core ruins a good story and makes the game seem like a waste of time. One time we played a game where we were all first level and the game was basically a competition . A horse race and a bow shot at different ranges. The guy I faced was level three. The competition ended in a tie with one event left, The combat ( we were both fighters ). Now so far the game is going great everyone at the table is having a great time. Here is were it went south and just made the whole game suck. We rolled int. he won and went first. Mind you I'm 1st level and he is 3rd. GM natural 20 threat next role confirm crit. drops me to negative HP. Game over. It's not that I lost I was expecting to. But I didn't even get to make one swing. I think that he should have fudged the confirm and just do a bunch of DMG and give me at least one swing. To me it just ended on a random roll. To me it made the rest of the game pointless. One of the few times I left at the end of the night disappointed.

Thanks for the 411.

I've got a quick question. I admit i skiped several posts but what does WOW stand for? I just can't figure it out. It took me the longest time to figure out what RAW ment. Rule as written. Thanks

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When i read this thread i'm hearing a lot of "the DM should do this or he should do that". Basicly the DM should do everything and go out of his way to make me the players happy and if thinks that i as a player have to left a finger and take part of something he wants well screw him! who does he think he is?

I'm thankful that someone has taken the time to put together a game for us to play.

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The thing with gaming is people have become entitled wanting everything their way and are not interested in what others want or care about but if you take a sec. to think about it. How hard is it to take a minute and think about "it". To you it may not matter but to someone else at the table it matters and by taking a minute to make someone else happy is not a big request

I think most everyone is missing the real point that ciretose is making. He is only asking for a player to make an effort. I know there are a million different play styles and a million expectations. Ciretose has put an amount of time and energy to make up the game. He's invested in the game as a whole. And would like to feel that the people around the table are willing to give something back to make it feel worth it to him.

When you hold the door open for someone or help in some way. They don't have to say thanks but it sure in nice to hear!

pc's have to tell a better story then Grog the Troll story teller!

I'd say go human rogue with the feat Fast Learner. Which gives you the extra hp and skill point. I would not max out dex because you don't need to. I'd spread my points out so i could good at a lot of things and not just really good a one thing.

When it does come time to fight, sneak attacks dmg and specail abilities can really add up.

I'd spread my points out so i could be good at a lot of things and not just really good a one thing.

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