nothingpoetic's page

The first time I ever played D&D, I was a human bard in a year long campaign a friend of mine ran. We had 5 characters, and one of them was his cleric. The other three guys were interested in the combat, optimizing aspect of the game, while the GM and I loved the RP aspect. In fact, my character and an NPC had an impromptu 20 minute conversation that left the other three in amazement. Though far from his greatest moment, still was pretty cool lol.

The greatest moment came about 8 months into the year, we as a group had gone back to my characters home town, and I was captured and imprisoned, sentenced to death. My allies battled through the dungeons underneath the arena, finally broke through the surface as I was placed on the chopping block. The guards rushed them, and as they killed the last one, the barbarian looked up just in time to see the executioner cut off my characters head with a vorpal battleaxe. At the moment IRL, the guy playing the barbarian let out a WTF, and then gave me a hug and apologized for not saving me.

After they killed the executioner, my character became a risen martyr and the entire party treated me (both character in game, and myself out of game) as if I was a cherished treasure. LOL... still remember the look on his face, I definitely thought he was going to cry lol.

I think the OP was saying the source of damage would come from the fall damage done to the creature that the spell was cast on. You know... what goes up must come down kind of idea.

The familiar damage would actually be done to the familiar, or atleast, that is how I read the OP.

I have never done this, but what is the harm in giving every character a hit die of common, aristocrat, or expert. Treat it like any monster with a racial hit die, and say that that particular hit die is not counted in any spell or ability that specifically states HD.

Would that be plausible or too much?

I did a search with the forum stuff, but didn't find anything helpful after quite a few pages, so I figured I would post my own question, sorry for the redundant post.

Can't comment on the Shield Mastery numbers, but I can tell you that no, you cannot move your 4th iterative attack from your main hand to your offhand. You have to have Greater TWF for the third attack with your shield. At least I think that was the consensus the last time we argued about the order of TWF attacks

That seems to answer my Iterative attack question on whether you can choose which weapon takes what attack.

Normally you choose which hand is primary, but I think shields are always offhand:

Shield Bash: "You can bash an opponent with a [light/heavy] shield, using it as an off-hand weapon"

Though this seems to be the sticking point, does the shield have to be an off-hand even though the TWF entry says:

on page 187 it says in the full attack rules, that: "If you are using two weapons, you can strike with either weapon first."

Makes me think you can use either weapon as your first attack, but whichever one you use for your first attack will be your main hand for that round. At least that is how I read those entries...

I think I understand this, but I would like to double check with the paizo community. So here are a few of my questions:

At say... level 20, if I were TWF with a longsword/shield combo, and had the Imp. TWF feat, then my attack line would look like this (if we are only looking at BAB of course) - +20, +20, +15, +15, +10, +5

Add in Shield Mastery and the Penalty for TWF, I am looking at +18, +20, +13, +15, +8, +3 because the attacks used with my main hand (longsword) would still have the TWF penalties even though Shield mastery takes them off of the shield. And obviously once you throw the other feats and enhancements and stuff those numbers change, but at the base is that the correct way to figure them up?

Also, with a full round action, and TWF, can I only take two attacks with my off-hand? The Double Slice feat makes it so that my offhand is often as good as my main if not better in some instances, and I was wondering if I could use my shield bash for say.. the last attack in that line. My line would then change to +18, +20, +13, +15, +8, +5 and I would have 3 attacks with my longsword, and 3 with my shield.

I know on page 187 it says in the full attack rules, that: "If you are using two weapons, you can strike with either weapon first." Makes me think you can use either your primary or your off-hand and it doesn't matter, but I wasn't quite sure, so I come seeking clarification.

James - Thanks for catching my mistakes, still relatively new at character creation in PF and I always seem to miss something.

Doc - My apologies, I thought you were looking for a ranged rogue build that used spells. In that instance the Arcane Archer looked to be your best idea, but if you are looking at going melee when you aren't sniping away with your rays, than I think I would agree with what many said in that Arcane Trickster seems to fit the mold. It progresses both spellcasting and sneak attack as base classes, meaning you could take a level in wizard/sorcerer/witch/bard and the rest in rogue, and you could still be packing a pretty hefty sneak attack along with your spells.

The only class that has a 3/4's BAB out of those is the Bard and it doesn't really give you a ton of spells that are direct damage though. You might just want to look at investing a level or two in sorceror, and then progressing spellcasting via arcane trickster.

And sniping would be the same action I would assume with a ray as it is a ranged attack. You could use a standard action to cast the ray, then your move action would be a stealth check to remain hidden from who you just hit and you would take a -20 penalty, (-10 with halfing swift as shadows) and size doesn't effect your damage output.

If they are at a local vendor or discussing plans for a fruit smoothie for lunch, wouldn't it be just as likely as a DM to say, "As you discuss the benefits of a banana smoothie against those of a pineapple smoothie, you are bumped from behind followed by a sharp pain radiating up your back, your hand instinctively grips the spot, and you look and see your hand covered in blood."

And then the battle commences. At that point, it is assumed instinct in the 6 second round in which this pro-banana party member got stabbed, that the rest of the party might turn their heads to see what/who did something. I think that would be how I handle the situation. Rolling initiatives before a surprise round, makes the surprise round seem less surprising to me. And if they are doing something else.. especially with their backs turned, they would have huge penalties to their perception check, even if they are just circumstantial at the time.

20 point buy
Halfing with Swift as Shadows alternate class feature
Lvl 13

Str - 10 2 pt
Dex - 21 10 pt
Con - 10 0 pt
Int - 16 10 pt
Wis - 12 2 pt
Cha - 9 -4 pt

Fighter 1 (longbow prof.)
Rogue 3 (Sniper Variant)
Wizard 3
Rogue 3
Arcane Archer 3

BAB + 9

1 Feat - PBS
Bonus Feat - Precise Shot
3 Feat - Weapon Focus (Longbow)
3 Talent - Bleeding Attack
5 Feat - Focused Shot
7 Feat - Deadly Aim
8 Talent - Fast Stealth
9 Feat - Skill Focus - Stealth
10 Talent - Sniper's Eye
11 Feat - Vital Strike
13 Feat - Stealthy

Area Spells that seem worthwhile -
Level 1 - 4 spells
Burning Hands
Colorspray

Level 2 - 3 Spells
Arrow Eruption
Fire Breath
Glitterdust
Shatter
Stone Call

Level 3 - 2 Spells
Dispel Magic
Fireball
Lightning Bolt
Sleet Storm

Level 4 Spells (avaiable at Lvl 16)
Black Tentacles
Detonate
Dragon's Breath
Fear
Ice Storm
River of Wind
Shout

Level 5 Spells (available at Lvl 18)
Cone of Cold
False Vision
Fire Snake
Transmute stuff
Waves of Fatigue

Not counting any kind of magical items, which at level 13, you will have a substantial bank account to get those, you are looking at a sniping action that does 2d6 +3 (Focused shot) +4 (deadly Aim) + 3d6 (sneak attack) + 6d6 (fireball)

I think that might accomplish the feel that you were looking for, and allows you to still be very good at sniping.

13 ranks + 3 Class skill + 3 Skill Focus + 2 Stealth + 4 Racial +4 Dex = +29 to stealth and a dc of their perception +10 against you. Once you start counting some items in there... that will get disgusting fast.

You can do a lot of damage, play the concept you want, and stay out of the line of fire all at the same time.

Your dragon born then look like even if I am only picking 1 -

+2 Con, +2 Cha, -2 Dex
Medium
30 ft base speed
Darkvision
+2 Fly skill
+2 perception skill
+1 Nat. Armor
5 resistance, that increases over time

and then you get to choose between flight, breath weapon, nat. attacks, blindsight....

Human - +2 floating bonus
Medium
30 ft base speed
+1 Skill point per level
Bonus feat

just saying, but those don't compare at all... you would have to scale back some of the lizardfolk racial abilities to bring them inline with other playable at 1st level races...

Titan, why is he not getting more than one sneak attack off a round? If here had invisibility than the first one and it drops he loses agreed. But if the target is just actually flat-footed, he can pelt away and every attack (not the manyshot though) would deal sneak attack damage, at least thats how I understand Pathfinder to work.

I think Doc you can totally pull it off, but I think you need to specialize. Do you want to snipe? Do you want to be a buffer, do you want to be a damage dealer? In terms of that concept, a rogue/arcane archer that can imbue their arrows with say, elemental burst and an Area of Effect spell which added to sneak attack makes a pretty effective sniper.

At 2nd level, an arcane archer gains the ability to place an area spell upon an arrow. When the arrow is fired, the spell's area is centered where the arrow lands, even if the spell could normally be centered only on the caster. This ability allows the archer to use the bow's range rather than the spell's range. A spell cast in this way uses its standard casting time and the arcane archer can fire the arrow as part of the casting. The arrow must be fired during the round that the casting is completed or the spell is wasted. If the arrow misses, the spell is wasted."

That is the imbue arrows ability mechanics at least, which means you could imbue a spell and add it to your single attack as a standard action. The one thing you need to figure out is what spells that means. An area spell, isn't just an area of effect, which is what I thought, but 3 levels in wizard might be able to get you enough spells.. as it gives you some level 2 spells. The spell list would be the biggest question for me and that would determine the build.

However, if you want a sneak attack, sniping, elemental bursting, spell character.. you could totally make it happen.

Or you could give them a taste of their own medicine... just refuse to heal. "Thats what my character would do..." If anything it would piss them off and make you feel better, though probably wouldn't resolve the situation at all lol.

In terms of mechanics, the monster class itself gives +2 str. +2 Con -2 Int, not bad, but player races are a +2 to one thing, or a bonus to one physical and one mental trait. Though the rest of their racials pretty much suck - +4 racial to swim, +4 to acrobatics, hold breath.

Not bad circumstantials, but definitely not something to write home about. You could probably keep the +2 str. +2 Con, -2 Int just to make up for it, and call that race done. No special vision, but a bit beefer stat bonuses. I like the idea of a civilized lizard society, something that has trade routes, and alliances, has history and arts. Even the possibility of enslaving or using kobolds for forces labor or something like that. They could be the cursed of the dragonkin..

just some thoughts

Doc -

Going with an Arcane Archer and Imbuing your arrows with some elemental damage, would add to the 1d3 elemental you will be able to do via sorceror. There are some huge benefits and drawbacks to sniping, the main one being still doing a pretty decent amount of damage in one shot without actually becoming a threat.

That being said, in terms of being able to still actually do something while not stealthed. Vanish is a rogues dream spell I have decided.. a lvl 1 spell that lets you go invisible for a round per caster up to 5 rounds. Not much, but enough to get a sneak attack started as well as pumping out a full round action on your target. The grease spell makes opponents flat-footed if they move through the square, whether they make the save or not, and that would allow for a full round sneak attack which seems to be pretty nasty.

Deadly aim, Vital strike, focused shot, and such should help to add some static damage to all those d6's. The surprise round talents for the rogue also will get you a full round sneak attack against most opponents as well.

There are some things you can do, but the idea here would be to limit the amount of attention you draw to yourself and hitting someone in the first round with 4 arrows and 18d6 (since manyshot doesn't get sneak attack) of sneak attack, plus a slew of elemental damage, might be a bad way to fly under the radar.

On a slightly more serious note, if something like that storyline were adopted as a way of making lizard folk a player race in Pathfinder, do you incorporate the varient bloodlines and if so do all those abilities replace the hold breath ability?

The stats seem to be +2 Str, +2 Con, -2 Int, though both con and strength might be a bit much, anyways, I see a racial modifier to Acrobatics, but it looks like there should be one for swim as well. How do you figure out ranks vs. racial in this instance?

Where is multishot from? Can't find it on the srd, so I assume its from another source. Thanks abraham for the clearing up of the extra attack.

Improved natural attack can't be applied in this instance either can it? Or did I just read the feat wrong?

I am confused on a few things here...

Imp. Natural Attack - Benefit: Choose one of the creature's natural attack forms (not an unarmed strike). The damage for this natural attack increases by one step on the following list, as if the creature's size had increased by one category. Damage dice increase as follows: 1d2, 1d3, 1d4, 1d6, 1d8, 2d6, 3d6, 4d6, 6d6, 8d6, 12d6.

A weapon or attack that deals 1d10 points of damage increases as follows: 1d10, 2d8, 3d8, 4d8, 6d8, 8d8, 12d8.

Doesn't seem to allow you to choose unarmed strike, which it looks like you did as your human feat. So you are back down to 2d8 (thanks to monk robe.)

In your attack bonus line, you have a +1 Comp... no idea what that is, the closest guess that I had was your composite bow, but that doesn't infer a benefit to the to-hit, just the damage. and the +1 enchantment bonus covers the +1 from a masterwork weapon. so I came up with a 19 as your max attack, subtracting one of from each subsequent attack.

Edit - Scratch that last one... +1 competence granted from bracers of archery... forgot to double check what those did. Alright I am better.

Lastly, It looks like you have one too many attacks with a +20 to hit. For haste, you only get one, rapid shot doesn't work and neither does many shot with flurry, so that can't be it. The Monk's Robe only adds class levels to AC and to damage, not to attacks, so I don't think that is it either. A level 11 monk has two hits at his highest attack bonus, add in the one from haste, and you should have a line like this:
20, 20, 20, 15, 15, 10

I would assume those things would change the damage output significantly, but I don't really know how you went about calculating damage, so I will leave that one up to you.

Last question... with the Zen Archer, at level 3 you can use your wisdom instead of your dex as your to hit. Why not just crack up your Wis score if you are starting after lvl 3 that is, so that you also are boosting your ki pool? I have never played a monk, but ranged anything intrigues me so I was curious as to your thoughts.

Shadowlord wrote:

Ori Segel wrote:

No, it isn't, because (reptilian) is a "subtype that indicates type" (humanoid, in this case).

This is in fact the correct answer. Upon reading the Zombie template section again I see that I was mistaken.

"And in other news today, someone on the internet admitted they were wrong. Which brings us to our breaking story from our station chief in Hell. Josie, you had a report of snow?....."

Dang... Josie got screwed in the job placement department didn't she? Station Chief in Hell.. that has got to be worse then working in New Jersey right?

Calagnar

Short Sword - 1d6 - 19-20 x2
Falcata - 1d8 - 19-20 x3

I can see the draw of the falcata, but you are locked into losing for yourself one racial trait to get it, and you get a negative to hit. Without a feat like oversized two weapon fighting, the -4/-4 on your falcata's is pretty devastating. I can't see the benefit of it compared to something like two short swords. You will crit the same amount, and in your build it will do more damage, however, in mine, you will have about a 10% better chance to hit than in your build. That is a lot of extra sneak attack dice.

Isn't the next die step from d8 a d10, or at the most 2d4? How does it go from a d8 to 2d6, that seems like 3 steps to me

So basically you are choosing to be a bit less combat effective (in terms of damage that is) in a trade off to survive much much longer. So its like Combat Expertise ;)

I get the idea, however, it just seems like such a huge trade off..