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Thanks for all the clarifications. I think my character is all ready for the session and I'm grateful for the detailed answers. Just one more set of questions for our barbarian (sorry for being off-topic):

- He is definitely planning on using a shield and heavy armour, is there anything else he should be doing/equipping/building to survive these battles?

- What is the best shield to use? He wants to use a tower shield and use shield block as much as possible (once we have the money to replace/fix them).

- He wants to use the gnome hooked hammer to trip enemies and two-hand when he rages. Is this an acceptable weapon for a barbarian? What is the best reach weapon for when he is raging?

OK, I have a few more questions here (some not relating to my character specifically).

- Would the giant barbarian be better served taking a dedication to get heavy armour proficiency? I do notice that their proficiency for all armour progresses very slowly, but he really is dead-set on being a giant barbarian. We originally we thought this class would equal a frontliner that can afford to stand in the thick of battle (perhaps not against tough bosses, but still concerning to hear the words glass cannon).

- If I were to take elven weapon familiarity instead of halfling, is the longbow considered a good weapon? Volley shouldn't be too much of a factor since it would only be for long ranged battles. As a side note, we have submitted these builds to the GM and he gave full approval for the variant rules/non RAW decisions made. So any other cool instances or rules would be good to know.

- Am I reading it correctly that sheathing a bow and drawing two weapons would cost all 3 actions?

- Is poison at all worth investing in? It looks sort of bad, but there will likely be ample opportunity to purchase/craft it (as well as opportunities to poison weapons before fighting)

- For that matter, is crafting worth investing in? Our Wizard will likely be busy crafting scrolls and wands, so I could potentially create healing or alchemical items if they are good.

- Speaking of boots of speed, are there any other essential items that I or my party should aim for?

Sorry for all the questions, but your answers have been great and expanded the scope of what I originally had in mind. Really appreciate the community for this game and am looking forward to starting.

Thanks for the advice (again), I think I understand what needs to be done in order to make a rogue in this game (that doesn't die instantly). Our DM is known for creating cruel and unusual encounters that really test the party, so I just wanted to make sure I could pull my weight here (other players have previously quit because of the combat focus of his sessions). My final questions would be as follows:

- Is the Elven weapon familiarity line worth it over the halfling one? The branched spear that was recommended before sounds like an interesting option. However, my original intention was to have the fork as a close range throwing weapon option and the sling staff for long range. Not sure which is better.

- If medic is the recommended archetype, should I just drop dual-weapon warrior? I originally planned to pick it up early for double slice (for use on high AC/physically resistant enemies). The archetype also gives some (what I believed to be) great feats later in the game such as dual-weapon blitz and two-weapon flurry.

- Is the giant instinct barbarian truly a glass cannon? Our barbarian player wanted to be a tank who could also deal out damage.

- Is preparation worth it over bloody debilitation?

- Is the Shadowdancer archetype good for this build? With free archetype it seems like there is some freedom to take it (only for shadow jump and the dedication).

- What runes/weapons should I aim for in later levels?

Did not expect so many responses to this, thanks for everyone's input - it has helped a lot with understanding the system.

Firstly, this is the article I read that recommended assurance for stealth - https://rpgbot.net/p2/characters/classes/rogue/#skills

Here, assurance for athletics is a green option while stealth is blue (however, after reading your responses I will likely take athletics).

The elven branched spear sounds good, but I'm not sure I can spare the elven weapon proficiency feat in my build. Additionally, I was hoping to have a dual weapon build (mainly for flavour). Is the gang-up spear build much better than the dual weapon warrior hit and run style? Moreover, which weapons are best for the rogue in this game? I was originally planning to use a rapier + filcher's forks (to throw 20ft). Time where I am forced to use ranged weapons would result in me using the sling staff. Are these good weapon choices? Also yes, our gunslinger is likely picking up the sniping duo archetype for free (you called it), as our campaign will have many battles outdoors.

Our barbarian is dead-set on doing fighter as their free archetype, likely taking the intimidating strike attack to help with my dread striker pick up. Our gunslinger will be focusing on survival and nature, so I assumed that taking medicine up will help the party (especially in combat as the gunslinger will likely be aiming to stay far away from the frontline). Another question I had, is whether the prescient planner/consumable line of feats is worthwhile? To help paint the picture, the campaign will be similar to a game called Gloomhaven where there is a hub town we travel back to after doing a quest (in order to help build the town up). This means I could use it every day potentially, but I'm not sure how good it is regardless.

Finally, just wanted to make doubly sure, are explorer's clothes a viable strategy? Using the gradual ability boost rules, I would reach 20 DEX by level 7 (which would put it ahead of strength). As we are likely starting at level 3, would it be worthwhile take the -1 AC? PF1e and 5e this wouldn't matter that much, but that might change with the critical hit system in this game.

Thanks for the responses everyone. I'm not sure how to quote different people's responses in one message, but these are my thoughts after reading:

"It's not barb or gunslinger you compare dpr to, but fighter... As it is, thief rogue is considered the second best martial class in the game behind the fighter"

More than one person here has re-iterated this, but I read this write-up on Reddit (https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder2e/comments/cqgft0/analysis_average_sin gletarget_dpr_across_fighter/) and was of the belief that they never really catch up to the other classes in DPR. Would it be safe to say that the write up is wrong? After playing a knife master in the Pathfinder video games the damage seems much lower here.

Also, speaking from your experience, do enemies often have attack of opportunity? I was hoping for a build in which I would often run behind enemies that are being engaged - strike - then run away which would eliminate the need for much CON. I will definitely raise it as per your suggestions, but is there a way to squeeze in more INT (our gunslinger is adamant on handling WIS)? Its mainly for RP, so it doesn't matter if not.

Assurance for stealth was another thing I had read from a guide: "Get a consistently high result on Initiative, and never worry about being spotted because you rolled terribly". In general, I am really not sure what the best skill feats are (besides the obvious like battle medicine and the stealth line of feats). What are the best for other skills? Do prescient planner/consumable come into play ordinarily?

Finally, is it worth not boosting strength and just wearing explorer's clothes? At level 6 I would have enough DEX to catch up to leather and we are starting at level 3 it seems. Athletics assurance definitely seems a must, but would it also be worth investing more boosts into it? Wall jumps and such sound pretty interesting, but I'm not sure how much it would come into play.

Hi. Looking for any advice regarding my build. I have never played PF2e, only played 5e so far (played through both Pathfinder Kingmaker and WOTR with a friend for some 1e experience). Our party is looking to be a giant instinct Barbarian, Way of the Sniper Gunslinger and a Universalist Wizard. Aiming to make rogue build that can put out some solid damage (at least staying competitive with our damage dealers). Also want to add some healing to the team (during emergencies) and out of combat utility. Our Barbarian is hoping to do a lot of tripping and intimidating, so I made some choices based on that. Any advice is welcome, build will most likely change as we understand what our DM wants from the campaign (homebrewed). He is crazy and allowing several variant rules (such as an unrestricted free-archetype and ancestry paragon rules). The build is as follows (the game will likely go to level 20 but no point in planning that far ahead yet). From what I can understand, rogues (especially compared to barbs and gunslingers) are no match in the DPR department and things need to go perfectly just to match them. But I'm hoping that most sessions I am up there with them. The build is as follows (some formatting errors or mistakes inbound):

Ancestry: Halfling (Half Elf)
Background: Once Bitten (Trained in Medicine and Undead Lore)(Bonus feat: Battle Medicine)
Class: Rogue (Thief)
Initial Ability Scores: STR: 8 DEX: 18; CON: 10; INT: 16; WIS: 14; CHA: 12
Initial Skills: Trained in Acrobatics, Athletics, Crafting, Deception, Diplomacy, Intimidation, Undead Lore, Medicine, Stealth, Survival, Thievery
Rogue Feat: You’re Next (or Nimble Dodge?)
Skill Feat: Assurance (Stealth)
Ancestry Feats (Including Ancestry Paragon): Halfling Luck, Halfling Weapon Proficiency

2nd: Rogue feat: Dual-Weapon Warrior Dedication; Free Archetype; Scout Dedication; Skill Feat: Quiet Allies; Skill Increase: Expert in Stealth; Ability Boost; Charisma
3rd: Deny Advantage; General Feat: Prescient Planner; Skill Feat: Ward Medic; Skill Increase: Expert in Medicine; Ancestry Feat: Nimble Elf; Ability Boost: Wisdom
4th: Rogue feat: Dread Striker; Free Archetype: Scout’s Charge; Skill Feat: Intimidating Glare; Skill Increase: Expert in Intimidation; Ability Boost; Intelligence; Skill training (Intelligence): Nature
5th: Ability Boost: Dexterity; Ancestry feat: Distracting Shadows; Skill Feat: Trick Magic Item; Skill Increase: Expert in Deception; Sneak Attack 2d6, Weapon Tricks
6th: Rogue feat: Gang Up; Free Archetype; Scout’s Speed; Skill Feat: Assurance (Medicine); Skill Increase: Expert in Thievery
7th: Evasion, General Feat: Prescient Consumable; Skill Feat: Swift Sneak; Skill Increase: Expert in Stealth; Vigilant Senses, Weapon Specialization; Ancestry Feat (Paragon): Adroit Manipulation
8th: Rogue feat: Opportune Backstab; Free Archetype: Flensing Slice; Skill Feat: Terrified Retreat; Skill Increase: Master in Intimidation; Ability Boost: Charisma
9th: Ancestry Feat: Guiding Luck; Debilitating Strike; Great Fortitude, Skill Feat: Paragon Battle Medicine; Skill Increase: Master in Medicine; Ability Boost: Wisdom
10th: Ability Boosts: Intelligence; Rogue feat: Precise Debilitations; Free Archetype: Dual-Weapon Blitz; Skill Feat: Foil Senses; Skill Increase: Master in Thievery
11th: Ancestry Paragon: Shared Luck; General feat: Fleet; Rogue Expertise; Skill Feat: Battlecry; Skill Increase: Master in Deception; Sneak Attack 3d6
12th: Rogue feat: Bloody Debilitation (or Preparation?); Free Archetype; Scout’s Pounce; Skill Feat: Quick Squeeze; Skill Increase: Expert in Acrobatics
13th: Ancestry Feat: Incredible Luck; Improved Evasion; Incredible Senses; Light Armor Expertise; Master Tricks, Skill Feat: Kip Up; Skill Increase: Master in Acrobatics
14th: Rogue feat: Instant Opening; Free Archetype: Dual Onslaught; Skill Feat: Quick Jump; Skill Increase: Expert in Athletics
15th: Double Debilitation, Ancestry Feat (Paragon): Ceaseless Shadows; General feat: Incredible Initiative; Greater Weapon Specialization; Skill Feat: Legendary Sneak; Skill Increase: Legendary in Stealth