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![]() Scarlette wrote:
Here is what I learned attacking a lone Ogre Brute(Orange), plenty of kite room, using first a Wardens Longbow +0, then a Hunter's Shortbow, +2. The only Longbow feats I possessed are Half-Draw, Precise*, and Overdraw along with the basic longbow attack and long bow exploit. I had the entire gamut of shortbow attacks trained, and had Point-Blank Shot, Running Shot, and Quick Shot* along with Snap Shot, Clustered Shot, and Deadly aim equipped. *(As I can't currently log in, I may have Precise and Quick shots confused as to which weapon they belong to) I'm set up with Daredevil 8, Scout 10, and Footpad's leather +0. I have Bleeding and Slow Reactions equipped as my reactive feats. Longbow test: First I go in and acquire my target, move to exact full range of the longbow, and fire. First 2 shots: Overdraw. Begin crawfishing(kiting), 3rd shot Longbow exploit, begin spamming half draw(~ 4 shots), and stop to take an Overdraw shot. Result: no damage to myself, kill in 8 shots, minimal kiting. Shortbow test: This time I stealth in to Deadly Aim range(20), set up at the exact breaking spot for Deadly Aim. First Shot: Deadly Aim. Due to the much longer cd of Deadly Aim vs Overdraw, and the considerable range difference, my 2nd shot I snapped off a Clustered Shot. Immediately begin drawing back, caught in Ogre's shout, Stunned, take 2 hits. Use Snap Shot to get a boost back, resume kiting, begin spamming running shot. After ~90 seconds of kiting, I chance a Deadly Aim. Bad mistake. I get the shot off, but Ogre closes to melee in the time it takes to do so. Take another hit or three getting out of dodge, using Snap shot to open up some breathing room. Resume kiting/spamming Running Shot. After another ~60-75 seconds of Ogre baiting, I need to try another Deadly Aim, as running shot hasn't made any significant impact on this mob's health. Shot off, Ogre closes to melee, and I'm dead. I'm not saying that the longbow needs a whack with the nerf bat, but it is either that or shortbow needs a boost. ![]()
![]() Leithlen wrote: That would also work. Seeing an enemy camp from a distance, but not knowing what it is would be interesting. I just don't want to be able to run down a road and know where every enemy camp is on each side without having to ever leave the road to investigate. I agree. If scouting is going to be meaningful, having a constant stream of info just handed to you nearly negates the need for stealth and perception skills. If I'm in a valley, and all the local mobs are above me, out of LoS or hidden due to my low perception, my mini-map should indicate I'm all alone. ![]()
![]() After having spent nearly the entirety of my first Alpha Weekend tinkering with a Rogue, I came away from my experience with a few takes on the the above mentioned mechanics. Stealth: After having found that I couldn't get in melee while coming from behind a mob, I was a bit frustrated. After Mr. Dancey reiterated the GW design philosopy: Ryan Dancey wrote:
I understood what they were going for and why I couldn't just cruise up behind Monsieur Ogre and drive a pointy bit of steel through his back. That being said, with the current formulae being used for stealth: ((Perception - Stealth + 300) x 0.15% + 10% ) x normal viewing distance you're likely to never get closer than about range 15-20. I think this is great as a median coverage, but could perhaps be modified to allow for ambient lighting, terrain, weather, or if the mob is being approached from the front or rear arc as a bonus or penalty to the +10% in the formulae, while preventing anyone from ever getting within melee range. I'm fine with not being able to backstab, but I'd certainly love to be able to squeeze through a tight spot of mobs at a choke point, or slip by guards in/into a town, if the conditions were right for me to do so. On the flip side, I shouldn't be able to get close enough to chuck a spear in open terrain without being spotted at least @ 50-75% view range if all I've got to hide behind is a nice spot of low grass and some very small rocks UNLESS the viewer is a/ blind, b/ deep into a cask of Warstein Ale*, or c/currently distracted by some partially momentous event OR I've got a/ magical advantage, b/greatly exceptional skill and equipment and a VERY, VERY great amount of time to close the distance at somewhere between a snail's and sloth's pace, or c/ a distraction affecting my target. There also needs to be a definitive set of actions that instantly breaks stealth, such as combat or gathering(I'm sorry but a pick clanging on stone or pitching over a rusty shield to gander what's underneath isn't exactly stealthy) and in my Alpha experience to date, gathering doesn't break stealth, and it should. Take all of that together, add in perception & the mini-map, and we should have a mini-map that doesn't display stealthed characters until their stealth breaks, an opportunity to add perception boosting feats(i.e. Sixth Sense, Eagle Eye) and perhaps some situational modifiers that might help a sneak-thief steal into an enemy town and do a wee bit of mischief after the trebuchets start raining stones on the luckless populace. At least, I hope that is where PfO will take us. *All Rights Reserved. A Product of the Warstein Brewing Company, Callambea, Golarion. Please drink like a dwarf. ![]()
![]() Leithlen wrote: None of the 3 starting ranged feats required me to slow down or stop when I tested it. I couldn't find any additional to buy, so maybe some do, but none of the 3 I tested did. Just curious, did you visit the skirmish trainer? I had @ least 8-10 ranged attacks, and several rooted me while in use. One, Snap Shot, provided a small damage component along with a range 10 evade(jump back). ![]()
![]() Ryan Dancey wrote:
Having been out of the D20 game involuntarily for several years now, I was unaware that this was the way the Sneak Attack mechanic now worked. Consider me enlightened. :) Bluddwolf wrote: You could have just as easily run by them, and running does not cost xp. Having tried that, and having been stunned, then immobilized by the Purple and Orange leveled mobs to my death, I'd argue that Stealth saved me an intervention from Pharasma. ![]()
![]() KoTC Edam Neadenil wrote:
If you are approaching a mob from his frontal arc, I can see the 10%, but the goblin turd being approached from the rear arc? I think the 10% should go away. My two pence worth, anyway. I'm not so sure it is useless, Bludd. I was able to slip by some High level Usarlav(sp?) groups in chokepoints, using stealth that I'd otherwise had no way of slipping by without engaging them. ![]()
![]() Gaskon wrote:
Both. A perfectly sneaky type should be able to ninja close enough in to get in a good backstab or sap. ![]()
![]() I received my Alpha invite this weekend(Thanks, Caliphis!)and I thought I'd add my comments to the list. My first impression was the same as most: No tooltips, tutorials, and an overwhelmingly large number of choices for spending XP with next to no in-game information. Add in tool-tips, have the boxes pop-up in front of open windows showing needed/required prerequisites, and skill info, along with color-coding to separate the different skills into their respective categories, and a way to separate skills into primary/secondary/defensive/reactive/etc. categories. My second impression was how difficult it was to target outside of using the tab key. My next overall awakening came as I was randomly attacked in town by a PC Wizard(who happened to be "nude"). I had just freshly leveled the rogue toon I was experimenting with to just shy of Level 8, focusing solely on ranged combat and the prerequisite rogue talents to reach Rogue 7. I was, however, equipped only with the equipment I spawned with. Despite using my hardest hitting skill(which I found later could nearly one-shot an Alpha Wolf, and did one-shot a bandit with later) I did ABSOLUTELY NO discernible DAMAGE to my Wizard attacker. I assume that he was categorically not much higher in level, and was at least not wearing any clothing type gear. I recall a blog quite awhile back that said that power creep was going to be negligible. and like leveled characters should have an equal chance to win in a fight(it mentioned a group of level ones having the ability to take down a Level 20 toon if they fought in coordination), but there wasn't any thing like that here. Either his other equipped gear outstripped mine to such an egregious extent as to offer him juggernaut status, or the wizard class is exceptionally overpowered. Stealth- I like the way it is implemented; the detached wig floating through the forest is slightly humorous, but even at the highest skill I was able to achieve(Stealth 8, Scout 8, 18 Dex; Stealth skill at 101)I was never able to approach closer than range 15-20. I'm sure there may be other factors at play, but I believe that approaching standard mobs(or PC's with low Perception) from behind, with ~maxed out Stealth, a PC should be able to get into melee range. Overall, I really enjoyed myself! Once I burnt though a month and a half's worth of xp(using outside resources to guide me through), and I got out in the thick of things, I could tell the game is headed in a great direction. Combat is still a bit clunky, and navigating Character Training is a nightmare, but overall, thank you Goblinworks! ![]()
![]() Wyldethorne, a member of Aeternum & Pax Gaming. I was starting to be fairly active on the boards about 18 months ago when real life(work) decided I had places to be other than at home and with internet access. I read several times a week, follow threads I have a vested interest in daily, and only post when I have something constructive to offer. I've been gone so long, I really feel behind the eight ball in trying to catch up. Can't wait for EE, and the eventual introduction of Druids( my passion). ![]()
![]() Ryan Mercy wrote: Wyldethorne - Out of curiosity, is the Pax Gaming Community the same Pax from SWTOR Sanctum of the Exalted? Sorry for the 2 week delay in posting this reply, I lost the thread in the swamp of forum activity. To answer, yes it is the same Pax as was on Sanctum(Pax Imperius, now on Ebon Hawk) and Pax Dominus(originally on Lord Ardraas, now also on Ebon Hawk). ![]()
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![]() Rafkin wrote:
This isn't a bad suggestion, but I think it forces you to choose too narrowly how you play a Druid. Wildshape is too core to the class, in my opinion, to give up if you choose to be a caster. It is, essentially, what makes a Druid a pure hybrid class. Another issue I see is many will want to play their Druid as a healer, a common role in other MMOs and PnP, and your example relegates them to being 2nd rate healers. These are some of the reasons I prefer option 4, you can, eventually, truly rise to the status of Master of the Wilds, an Archdruid, with time and dedication. Now, to play Devil's Advocate: A Druid in fast animal forms can attack like a rogue. Outside of that, I don't see a Druid having a rogue's utility(Picking Pockets, Opening Locks, Deciphering Languages, etc.) so in this one instance I don't quite follow how a druid is assuming the full role of a Rogue outside of combat and stealth(I'll defer to finding/removing NATURAL traps and snares). What I do see(and I fully expect the backlash from making this statement) is a Druid focusing on Wildshape having to pick and choose certain skills and/or earn merit badges along this path that can unlock both the rogue and fighter styles of combat. It should take a period longer to fully be able to engage in this role as a capstoned fighter or rogue, but not a full "training cycle" more. While we are on the subject, what of elemental shapes? Does a healing archetype druid eventually unlock Water Elemental forms? A dps caster archetype unlock fire? What if he is a "Storm Druid"? Wouldn't Air Elemental forms make more sense? Or are the elemental forms to be the pinnacle of following the Wildshape archetype path? Just some thoughts. ![]()
![]() Bluddwolf wrote:
Which reminds me of the Count of Monte Cristo. His payment was revenge. ![]()
![]() "Who would Batman be without the Joker?" I see exactly where Hobs is coming from, a true nemesis makes for great "good vs. evil" style role play. Kaiser Soze is a great example of an arch-villain. I'd love to see some of these types of role-players arise in PfO, as they will provide great entertainment value, and hopefully long term and far reaching struggles as a foil to the goodly players in the world. Which gives me an idea for my Destiny's Twin: an evil druid hell bent on reclaiming the River Kingdoms from the creep of civilization... ![]()
![]() Being wrote:
This is what I was going for, in more elaborate detail, and much more succinctly. Thank you, Being. I'd like to add there is nothing stopping a player from choosing a generalist route along his 2.5 year development, but he will have chosen to truly chosen to be the proverbial "jack of all trades, master of none". @ Andius: A Druid and Paladin are quite different alignment wise. In PnP games, you couldn't play both and remain within alignment restrictions of both classes. Also, all Druids aren't tree-huggers. Within the PF lore the Druids of the Wildwood Lodge allow and provide protection of logging in a sensible fashion. Some druids are "Red in tooth and claw" and border along a evil psyche, viciously defending nature from any and all as the most bloodthirsty of predator. Some choose a more diplomatic approach. As many players of druids as their are, there will be as many different paths that they follow in their defense of nature and its denizens. ![]()
![]() Stephen Cheney wrote:
Option 4, hands down. This allows a Druid PC to customize his archetype as he grows, so all Druids will be different, and a player will have tough choices to make along the way. ![]()
![]() Greetings!! I am The Wyldethorne, an Ambassador of the Kingdom of Aeternum, a division of the larger Pax Gaming Community. It is a pleasure to make your acquaintance! High Thane Thunderkeg and Thane-Blade Krows have tasked me with opening diplomatic relations with the Kingdoms and Companies of like minded bent within the River Kingdoms. Though we understand that it will be sometime before launch, we would like to open lines of communication, establish friendships, and participate with you in the crowdforging and community building of PfO. It is with great anticipation that we look forward to further talks and interaction with our fellows. I encourage your representative(s) to come forward and make contact with our Embassy, at the Pax Gaming forums, and meet our brethren. Well Met! ![]()
![]() Bluddwolf wrote:
Not unnoticed, merely unheeded, Ser Bandit Lord... ;) ![]()
![]() Greetings, I am The Wyldethorne, an Ambassador of the Kingdom of Aeternum, a division of the larger Pax Gaming Community. It is a pleasure to make your acquaintance! High Thane Thunderkeg and Thane-Blade Krows have tasked me with opening diplomatic relations with the Communities and Companies of like minded bent within the River Kingdoms. Though we understand that it will be sometime before launch, we would like to open lines of communication, establish friendships, and participate with you in the crowdforging and community building of PfO. It is with great anticipation that we look forward to further talks and interaction with our fellows. I encourage your representative(s) to come forward and make contact with our Embassy, at the Pax Gaming forums, and meet our brethren. Well met! ![]()
![]() Greetings to you merchants! I am The Wyldethorne, and I would like to introduce myself as an Ambassador of The Kingdom of Aeternum
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![]() Gloreindl wrote:
As a Druid player myself, these are also questions I'd like to know. ![]()
![]() KitNyx wrote: This for me is actually a good thing. People who are trying to sell stuff...obviously want to sell stuff, so they will do thinks to promote their ability. Specifically, a good solution is have everyone trying to sell stuff gather at the same place at the same time...aka, a market. Then, we the customers can browse the market and we the customers can pit merchants against each other to find the best deals. Hawk your wares...this sounds like an awesome dynamic to me. Great idea! ![]()
![]() Being wrote:
I think I should have said 'Interface' instead of mini-game. But perhaps with some skill elements involved. ![]()
![]() I love the idea of an in-depth crafting system. Thanks for pushing the idea, Purple! I think my idea of an enjoyable crafting system would be part experimentation, part modular, and part bonus from exceptional materials, additives, and the like(some crafted, some acquired). I'd like to be in a moddable mini-game, with an option to vary certain elements(i.e. using starmetal in place of mithril, or displacer beast hide instead of standard leather) and be able to experiment that way. Add in the ability to get a bonus on your crafting check for using, say, white dragon blood to quench the blade, or elemental fire while tempering, or an alchemical flux during smelting. ![]()
![]() Greetings to you, stalwart mercenaries of the Carrion Corps! I am The Wyldethorne, and I would like to introduce myself as an Ambassador of The Kingdom of Aeternum
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