The Mighty Thrar's page

Nathanael Love wrote:

There's a feat from 3.5 that makes any Paladin spell for a Paladin a swift action too. . .

Good thing this is Pathfinder and not 3.5

Not yet, thank goodness.

Anyway... Thanks for the clarification.

Yes, you've got it correct.

Great, so it works fine with a composite longbow as well... just hold the bow in one hand while you swift-action heal, take a step, and fire your volley of arrows.

Hi all, I just want to confirm if I am interpreting this correctly, but I assume a paladin can do all of the following in one round: (1) lay on hands on his/her-self (swift action), (2) take a 5-foot step, and (3) make a full attack.

Points
1-Lay on hands on oneself is a swift action. A swift action is like a free action except you can only take one swift action per round.

2-The only movement you can take during a full attack is a 5-foot step. You may take the step before, after, or between your attacks.

This came up under discussion in a recent game.

Thanks in advance for your responses and clarification.

In addition to what you gave we need the craft DC for the slow burn arrow. The DC multiplied with the craft result gives you the worth in silver you can craft in one week.

PFSRD wrote:

1.Find the item's price in silver pieces (1 gp = 10 sp).

2.Find the item's DC from Table: Craft Skills.
3.Pay 1/3 of the item's price for the raw material cost.
4.Make an appropriate Craft check representing one week's worth of work. If the check succeeds, multiply your check result by the DC. If the result × the DC equals the price of the item in sp, then you have completed the item. (If the result × the DC equals double or triple the price of the item in silver pieces, then you've completed the task in one-half or one-third of the time. Other multiples of the DC reduce the time in the same manner.) If the result × the DC doesn't equal the price, then it represents the progress you've made this week. Record the result and make a new Craft check for the next week. Each week, you make more progress until your total reaches the price of the item in silver pieces.

1 Price: 1500 sp

2 DC let's assume 20 or your skill + take 10 would not be enough.
3 irrelevant
4 Your craft check would be 20.

20*20=400 so you would need 3,75 weeks to craft one slow burn arrow.

Hmmm. It seems strange to me that it would take ~3.75 weeks to craft one 150gp arrow when compared to the Craft Wondrous Item feat. That feat allows you to craft a 2k item in two days.

Anyway, thanks for your help.

I am new using the downtime system and wanted to understand the calculations.

How much time would it take to make these Slow Burn Arrows?

I assume that the cost to buy of 150gp is 150gp per arrow.
It seems that skill also factors into the time, so please also assume a craft (alchemy) skill of 10, and a craft(bow) skill of 10 and that we 'take 10' on the check(s).

Slow Burn Arrow
Cost: 150gp
Behind the head of this arrow is a small receptacle of alchemical material that heats up when exposed to air and eventually bursts into flame; barbs on the arrowhead pierce the pouch when it hits a target.

Benefit: On your turn, 1 round after impact, the burst of flame deals 1d6 points of fire damage to the target.

Drawback: The extra weight of this arrowhead gives you a –1 penalty on attack rolls with the arrow.

Source: Elves of Golarion

PFSRD wrote:

(Stealth Skill) Action: Usually none. Normally, you make a Stealth check as part of movement, so it doesn't take a separate action.

In melee I would assume that the character wants to maneuver to an advantageous position so I'd go with a move action.

Ah, that makes sense. Thanks to you both!

The Shadowdancer's Hide in Plain Sight is a Supernatural ability.

Per the CRB "Using a supernatural ability is usually a standard action (unless defined otherwise by the ability's description)."

Hide in Plain Sight (Su)
A shadowdancer can use the Stealth skill even while being observed. As long as she is within 10 feet of an area of dim light, a shadowdancer can hide herself from view in the open without anything to actually hide behind. She cannot, however, hide in her own shadow.

A player in my game wants to use this in melee. I don't see why it would not be a standard action to use.

Thanks, Carter. That's good stuff.

Hi, I have a few GM questions for Curse of the Lady’s Light (Spoilers).

Q1: The sentinels in area K10 are described as linked to Ashamintallu and she would be alerted to 'intruders'. If so, how would you run this since the party should not encounter her until the end battle? What alternatives could you think of besides just ignoring the alert?

Q2: The module describes how some would handle encountering the PC as Sorshen clone (i.e. Grey Maidens), but what about Daefu or Gnaeus Gnaru? I imagine Daefu is 100% crazy and would just attack the non-clone PCs. I think Gnaeus might want to duel the individual party members to show off to the clone to prove he should still be Sorshen’s ‘champion’. How would you handle these?

Q3: Would the Glass Golem attack any of the party if the PC as Sorshen clone is with them? Also, any ideas for hinting that the Sorshen clone could control the glass golem without being too obvious?

Thanks, Sylirinight. I look into that, but what I'm really looking for is feat combinations for a level 3 (or 2) melee NPC. Maybe a trip build or a dirty fighter. I thought about crane wing style monk, but that would be tough to beat one on one.

Bearlock, since you brought up story (and good ideas, thank you) I'll share a bit...

We're playing Shattered Star book one. Without spoiling the plot (and we've gone a bit off-script anyway), the party got on the good side of a certain female crime gang by eliminating a bad management layer in the gang. The former second in command (an 'evil' NPC)got away and swore vengeance on the party. It was supposed to be an idle threat. But now, a couple members of the party are obsessed with finishing the job.

So, I thought I would put a non-lethal combat in town (Magnimar) as a side quest toward their goal... rather than saying 'you walk into a bar' and 'Look! She's over there'.

The gang the party has made an alliance with is a Czarni gang (I think of them more as Varisian gypies and not violent criminals). So, I want to reward the party (for not just trying to wipe out or kill the gang) by showing them that their new allies can be a valuable source of information.

Tongues curse is a good one. Not very limiting.
Haunted has a lot of RP potential.

This would definitely be non-lethal. I was thinking that everyone would use non-lethal versions of their regular weapons (like a wooden greatsword wrapped in padding).

There would be breaks in between the matches. Healing could be taken in between matches, but perhaps there would be a limited amount of healing such as x number of cure light potions plus x amount of good berries. That way if they finish the earlier matches easily they are in better shape for the later matches.

I agree that the initial matches should be with the weaker opponents. The last fight could be with the contact the party is supposed to meet... beating him/her would not be required to move the plot forward.

I'm just looking for some creative low level builds for the PC's... surprising, but not unbeatable. Perhaps something they would imitate in alternate PCs.

I am thinking of making an encounter where the party has to meet a contact by participating in a fighting contest in town. It would be the party's main melee character competing one on one with other opponents.

I'd like to come up with 3 interesting level 3 opponents to fight one after the other. I wanted each opponent to have a different fighting style (ie. monk, barabarian, some combat maneuver specialist, bard?, etc.), but still be beatable by the level 3 PC. I haven't picked up the NPC Codex yet. Any advice on fun solo combats?

@Bearlock: I think his ranger idea is to have the two-weapon feats essentially without the pre-reqs. If he doesn't have to worry about pumping up Dex for TWF, he can focus on STR.

@Charender: I have thought of inquisitor and suggested it to him. He's not very familiar with it. I thought my 'variant' cleric would be good for him. I hope it is balanced.

Thanks for the advice.

A player in my game wants to play a cleric who has the two weapon fighting skills of a ranger. The two weapon fighting and the relationship with his deity are integral to his back story.

He is thinking to take alternating levels in cleric and ranger. My concern is he may end up not being happy with the result. He is not the best optimizer.

I am thinking to offer him a custom cleric archetype very similar to the Crusader. He would get the two weapon combat feats of the ranger, but he would have 'diminished spellcasting' (like the crusader) and thus have to give up one domain and one spell slot per spell level.

Do you think this is a good balanced alternate archetype for him?
Would half levels in cleric and ranger gimp his character?

The Mighty Thrar wrote:

Even a 25 point buy will be a drastic reduction in stat points.

Ok, I'm curious!

What point buy did they use originally? Between '25 is a drastic reduction' and 'the original DM was very generous'... I'm really curious :)

Most I've ever rolled up was a 29 point character, and while he's a little MAD... he still has plenty of weak spots. AND he's nearly died twice by third level.

Phantom, the 'effective' point buy equivalent was somewhere between high-50s and mid-60s... rolled off screen... re-rolling 1's...

This is the party they built?

Ranger 3
Ranger 3
Ranger 2, Cleric 1
Cavalier 3

Fine, give them 25 points. They're going to need all the help they can get.

LOL... you noticed that, eh?

Thanks, all. I am thinking that 25 point buy might be best.

Dispel Magic

Even a 25 point buy will be a drastic reduction in stat points. So, it might be enough. The party class balance is so-so: 2 rangers, 1 cleric-1/ranger-2, 1 cavalier. The fifth player may be a sorcerer or alchemist. Also, they are not the types to check every five feet for traps. So, there is a good opportunity for the game to have a good pace with the right difficulty balance.

I took over running the Shattered Star AP. The previous GM was too generous with PC stat generation. He agrees with me. Adjusting the module for each encounter is getting tedious for me. So, I have decided to adjust their stats to a reasonable point buy.

The party is experienced with 3.5, new to Pathfinder, and not overly cautious or tactical. I want the campaign to be thrilling enough for the PCs, but not too stressful for them. There are four player with possibly a fifth coming.

For my part, I want to be able to play through the story without having to adjust the difficulty level up so often.

I am going to adjust the PC stats to either 20 point buy or 25 point buy. My question is which point buy would be best 20 or 25? Any advice would be welcome.

Wind Oracle with'Wings of Air' revelation:

Wings of Air (Su): As a swift action, you can manifest a pair of translucent, cloud-like wings that grant you a fly speed of 60 feet with good maneuverability. At 10th level, your speed increases to 90 feet and your maneuverability increases to perfect. You can use these wings for 1 minute per day per oracle level. This duration does not need to be consecutive, but it must be spent in 1-minute increments. You must be at least 7th level to select this revelation.

I think I'll try the advanced simple template. That's pretty helpful. Thanks.

The encounters were a little too easy without the tweaks.

As for magic/gold... I suppose I could cut back on the treasure by say 25%? Perhaps that would do it. I don't want to have to re-price everything in the book.

I'm not sure how they would take the re-rolling stats. I had suggested point-buy originally with the group (before I took over GM'ing, at the start of the campaign) but a couple of people balked at the idea. Perhaps if I explain the consequences (beefed up opponents, less gold rewards) they will be more receptive to re-setting stats.

Thanks for all the input.

I inherited the Shattered Star AP as our DM had to go out of town for a few months. He was 'very' generous with stat rolls and the PC have on average about a 60 point-buy. They have no dump stats and too many skill ranks.

The Plan

I'm thinking to run the AP almost 'as is' but to increase everything as follows: enemy AC's all +2, enemy to hit +2, enemy damage +2, all save DC's for PC's +3 harder, all PC skill checks +3 harder. Is that too much of an adjustment? too little?

This approach seems like the simplest way for me to deal with the PC stat imbalance vs. the AP... I don't want to have to customize a perfectly well-designed AP. Does anyone have any alternate suggestions?

The Party

The party is 4-5 players: two rangers level 2, a ranger-1/cleric-1, a cavalier-2, and a sorcerer-2 (npc). The sorc is my character from before; I tend to keep him out of the combat, but have him help move the plot along with suggestions and knowledge checks.

Fortunately, the party is all new to pathfinder. So, they are not too min/max at this point.

cwslyclgh wrote:

My point is that no other spells have changes to their area of effects based on the size of a creature that cast them (or that they are cast upon), logically then, why would a 'creature centered' emanation?

Because emanations emanate from something. Normal emanations are centered on a point in space. That means they are all the same size/shape because a point in space is always the same "size." Anything within 10' of that point in space is affected.

But emanating from a creature is not emanating from a point in space that happens to overlap with a creature, it is emanating from that creature.

And when a spell emanates from a creature, it emanates from something with a variable size. Therefore, since it emanates 10' from that creature, anyone who is 10' away from the creature or less should be affected. It is very simple logic.

cwslyclgh wrote:

Where in the magic rules is it even suggested that such is possible?

Where in the magic rules is it suggested that when a spell emanates from a creature, that creature should pick some intersection it is touching to be the center point? I have to say, there is far less evidence for that sort of interpretation than the alternative.

Edit: It doesn't really even make sense. Who chooses the corner? The caster? The target creature? What happens when the creature moves? There's no facing, so you can't really be sure which corner is the correct corner after moving, so it needs to be adjusted. Can I spin in a circle in my space to have the emanation spin around me and hit more than it could otherwise? There's just no precedent for this sort of interpretation.

+1, +1

Thanks, Xebeche.

I think the handy haversack and scrolls/potions are a must. As for armor, I will use the air barrier revelation at 7th onward for my armor needs with a buckler and shield of faith spells. Also, I was thinking a metamagic rod (perhaps 'heighten') for SoD spells.

As for skill boosts, the ioun stones look interesting. I am looking for something to boost flight or perhaps a ring of featherfall.

Anyway thanks for the suggestions.

Any suggestions?

I have a 6th level buffing/summoning wind oracle in PFS with about 15k gp to spend. The only equipment of note which he has at present is the charisma headband, +2 cloak of resistance, +1 mithril chain, and a few low level wands.

My usual tactics are using invisibility and buffing or summoning (with augment summon). However, I have a 23 in my primary stat and the Eastern Mysteries (Qadira) trait. So, I can de-buff a bit (especially once/day) as well.

I am thinking of getting a ring of revelation with the sidestep secret for a boost to AC and reflex saves.

I am putting skill points into stealth, diplomacy, fly, UMD, and spellcraft.

Any ideas on useful or interesting items to buy?

Hi guys!

Furthermore, I would like (and again i know that it is highly ineffective) to boost his magical abilities, i.e. give him as many spells as possible.

For a little extra spell selection, you might want to look at the Unsanctioned Knowledge feat. The pre-req is (I believe) at 13 int, which it looks like you will have anyway.

1 - Crusader of Sarenrae

The one I already created is a human crusading style cleric of Sarenrae. By crusading, I don't mean the crusader archetype. She's not primarily a weapon fighter - more of an "I took Fire and Glory domains so I can blast the evil doers with Fireball and Holy Smite" type of crusader.

Oracle of Flames... it has Sarenrae written all over it...

KenderKin wrote:

Hey this has come up before and it was answered....

FYI

@KenderKin

You stated this came up before and was answered. Could you provide us with said answer and who answered it?

Or a link.

If you were asking about the Evil Eye hex in particular... it was mentioned in a thread from July 2011 titled "WITCH CAN CAST EVIL EYE HEX MANY TIMES ON SINGLE TARGET?". In that thread, there is a link to an FAQ from Sean K Reynolds.

From the FAQ:
Witch: Can I use the evil eye hex more than once on a target?
Yes. As long as you apply a different penalty with each use of the hex (AC, ability checks, attack rolls, saving throws, or skill checks), you can have multiple penalties on the same target. Applying the same hex penalty to a target just resets the duration to the most recent use of the hex.

Example: On round 1, you hex the target's AC. On round 2, you hex the target's attack rolls, so the target now has two evil eye hexes on it. On round 3, you hex the target's saving throws, so it now has three evil eye hexes on it. On round 4, you hex its AC again, resetting the duration of the AC-hex (which does not add an additional –2 penalty to its AC). The same thing would happen if two witches were using evil eye on the same target--as long as each evil eye hex applied a penalty to a different thing, they'd all apply.

This doesn't violate the general rule for stacking penalties--each evil eye effect is basically a different source, even though they stem from the evil eye hex (the evil eye hex is much like 5 separate weak hexes under a common umbrella). In the same way that multiple castings of bestow curse on the same target should stack as long as they do different things (penalize Strength, penalize Dex, penalize attack rolls, take no action, and so on), multiple uses of the evil eye hex stack as long as they're targeting different game statistics.

—Sean K Reynolds, 07/26/11

I am not sure about the hair as you don't want to get into combat.

You might also consider Improved Initiative as a non-Hex feat as you really want to go first to reduce the encounter CR and get out of the way before it kicks off. Otherwise Extra Hex seems the way to go.

Your Hexes are mostly your primary weapons, so spells are to fill in character weaknesses, add strong controller spells, gather information, for fun and for thematic purposes.

Cantrips prepared:
*Stabilize (you may be the only character with this)
*Light
*Detect Magic

1st spells: My must haves (* = prepared)
*Command (controller/de-buff, thematic and not arcane)
*Burning Hands (anti swarm)
Charm Person (because you wont be charming anyone with your charisma, for creative solutions, useful for faction missions)
*Mage Armor
*Obscuring Mist (thematic, defensive and standard battlefield control)

Other suggestions:
Comprehend Languages (useful utility, useful for faction missions)
Cure Light Wounds
Enlarge Person (standard buff)
Mount (so you can move and cackle)
Unseen Servant (thematic, utility)

2nd spells: My must have
*Glitterdust (too good)

Suggestions:
Alter Self (thematic, for creative solutions to problems)
Blindness/Deafness (thematic, for when slumber fails, also bargaining card to dismiss for immediate cooperation/information)
Feast of Ashes (thematic, again a bargaining card to dismiss and for long term cooperation/information)
Zone of Truth (possible information gathering spell)

Wand: CLW
Possibly: Mount, Mage armor

Scroll: See Invisibility, Comprehend languages

Thanks, ZomB... great suggestions... I played my first game with the witch this week and Burning Hands came in handy. Also, I had not thought of buying a wand of mount.

As for prehensile hair, that is definitely thematic... but then I also found it can be useful for range touch attacks, using wands... buffing allies, etc.

Hi, I'm starting a human witch character for PFS play and wanted to get some advice on spells at low level. Thanks in advance for any suggestions.

Specifically, I'm looking for input on not only spells known but also prepared. Note: I'm looking to be a de-buffer... starting Int at 18... then bumping up at 4th and 8th.

Also... feat and hex progression would be...
Level 1 Feat -> Extra Hex -> Evil Eye
Level 1 Bonus Human Feat -> Extra Hex -> Slumber
Level 1 Hex -> Cackle
Level 2 Hex -> Misfortune
Level 3 Feat -> Accursed Hex
Level 4 hex -> Prehensile Hair
Level 5 Feat -> Extra Hex -> Flight

Any advice on the spells to select for a fairly low level witch?

Witch Levels 1,2
Spells Known:
Spells Prepared:
Scrolls:?
Wands: CLW?, Mage Armor?

Witch Levels 3,4
Spells Known:
Spells Prepared:
Scrolls:
Wands:

Is ability focus: hex a feat option? In general if playing a build entirely focused on save spells doing as much as you can to make those saves more difficult is good.

Your level 8/10 hex choices seem largely a flavor decision. But I will try to point out some objective points to compare:

Tongues gets you an ability that can already covered by the witch spell list.

Feral Speech and Disguise get you spells that are only level 1 spells for other classes. While they are not on your spell list it would be relatively cheap by level 10 to acquire a wand of those spells and use magic device is in class.

Charm: the main advantage this has over just using diplomacy skill is it takes 1 standard action instead of 1 minute. The only time that likely matters is combat. However if the target is in combat with us it is probably a hostile attitude so the best result is indifferent. Depending on the opinion of the GM this could be of fairly little benefit.

That's very true about the flavor. I guess my rationale is that if you can use talk to animals all day or speak any language or stay disguised all day... there are more rp possibilities from that. Plus, for disguise you could disguise yourself to look less like a squishy.

/me looks up. It seems I have argued that everything is worse than everything, my work here is done.

LOL

Hi, I am looking for some advice on building a Witch for Pathfinder Society play. I am looking for a combination of Feats/Spells that would be fun and useful with a variety of party compositions and tactics.

It's always interesting to hear from other people about their experiences regarding what works/doesn't work and what was fun/wasn't fun.

I like the idea of making a de-buffer. I also think the Hexes add a lot of flavor. So my first thought is to take a number of Extra Hex feats. I'm also interested in SoD spells for occasional saving-the-day.
So far, I have put together only Race, Stats and Feats.

Race: Human
STATS: Str 10, Dex 14, Con 14, Int16+2=18, Wis 10, Chr 10

Feats/Hexes by Level:
1 - Feat - Extra Hex - Evil Eye
1 - Feat (Human Bonus) - Extra Hex - Slumber
1 - Hex - Cackle
2 - Hex - Misfortune
3 - Feat - Accursed Hex
4 - Hex - Prehensile Hair
5 - Feat - Extra Hex - Flight
6 - Hex - Healing
7 - Feat - Improved Familiar
8 - Hex - Charm, Disguise, Feral Speech, or Tongues?
9 - Feat - Spell Penetration
10- Hex - Charm, Disguise, Feral Speech, or Tongues?
10- Major Hex - Ice Tomb
11- Feat - Split Hex or Greater Spell Penetration

Level 1 - Plenty of hexing right from the start
Levels 2-3 - Double, double, toil and trouble
Levels 4-6 - Reach, flight, and heals
Levels 7-8 - More character building
Level 9 - More effective against SR
Levels 10-11 Finishing touches

We were fighting a bunch of skeletons (level 4) and I had kinda built for defense, Lore oracle with sidestep secret, +1 chain shirt, +1 heavy steel shield, shield focus feat. Had a 23 AC. The skeletons were having a difficult time hitting me (and tbh, all of us). I was rolling pretty bad myself and was thinking about burning a CLW spell to just kill one off. For whatever reason another player asked how I was going to cast a spell while using a weapon and shield.

At that I mentioned we've always kinda glazed over that aspect of it for divine casters. GM agreed with me and then decided that's not how we're going to do it anymore. And then mentioned the same goes for Divine Focuses, you've got to hold them.

I was more than a little miffed at that, rolled and missed another attack on a skeleton with my sword, pulled open my books and verified that Cure spells do indeed have a somatic component. At that point I simply stated that apparently people weren't going to be getting cure spells in combat until I figured it out (yes, it was being juvenile, I fully admit that), to which that previous player asked if the group was going to have to suffer because I didn't build my character right, to which I did state yes. The GM then decided to revoke the decision for the rest of the session until we could work it out.

And yes I was not quite being immature (hell, I was probably pouty about it), but it's still better than going nerd rage. It's just irritating to me that I play a character for awhile, with a (though unspoken) house rule we've used for a number of years, and when I toy with using my spells offensively (first time fighting undead), DENIED!!

FYI later on in the session we fought some kinda big named undead thing and others were happy I was able to channel offensively (and defensively).

As mentioned, Oracles don't need a divine focus. However, the next time you're playing a cleric you could paint your holy symbol to the tips of your middle fingers and equip a light weapon and buckler. You never know when you might need to double-present your holy symbol. Feel free to demonstrate to your more inquisitive party members how that works.

Thrar wrote:

My questions are for PathFinder Society play so...

Traits? Yes, 2.
Books? CRB, APG, UC, and UM
Campaign? Pathfinder Society
Point Buy? 20 points
Dump Stats? as low as 7

Thanks, all, for the great info so far...

Hi again.

How did it turn out?
It would be great if you like to share your build or class. I think any of the two classes will be fine and provide you with a lot of fun.

Hi Zark, thanks for asking I have not finalized, but I am looking at the following...

PALADIN - Human
STR 12, DEX 16+2, CON 12, INT 13, WIS 8, CHR 14
Add Dex +1 at lvl 4&8
The Int 13 is for unsanctioned knowledge for some spell variety and more skills... acrobatics, escape artist, perception, diplomacy, UMD.
Also, the higher int is also for RP, although RP'ing a low int character is fun also.
Alternatively for stats, I am looking at:
STR 14, DEX 16+2, CON 12, INT 8, WIS 10, CHR 14
Add Dex +1 at lvl 4&8
Deity: Sarenrae... scimitar as backup weapon for flavor

INQUISITOR - Human
Preacher archetype
STR 14, DEX 16+2, CON 14, INT 10, WIS 14, CHR 8... or...
STR 14, DEX 16+2, CON 14, INT 12, WIS 14, CHR 7... or...
Add Dex +1 at lvl 4&8
Deity: Abadar - Travel domain
Alignment: not sure yet
I think worshiping Abadar would be fun... like being a bill collector... "my employer wants his two dollars, sir..."

Thanks for the suggestion of the Preacher archetype... I also thought that the inquisitor's solo tactics would go to waste with a ranged character.

I'll probably create both these characters for PFS and alternate as needed.

Thrar wrote:

I'm interested in making a new ranged character with divine powers and/or spells for PFS. Any advice on which would be (1) more combat effective, (2) tactically more interesting, and (3) better party support?

Hello.

I need some more info and then I will gove you some more info.

Do you use traits? If yes, do you start with one or two?
What books are OK with your GM? Will you use UM and UC?
Do you play an Pathfinder Adventure Path or what kind if campaign will you play?
Will use use 15 PB, 20 PB or 25 PB or will you roll the dice?
Do you use dump stats?

Hi Zark, My questions are for PathFinder Society play so...

Traits? Yes, 2.
Books? CRB, APG, UC, and UM
Campaign? Pathfinder Society
Point Buy? 20 points
Dump Stats? as low as 7

Thanks, all, for the great info so far...

Thrar wrote:

I'm interested in making a new ranged character with divine powers and/or spells for PFS. Any advice on which would be (1) more combat effective, (2) tactically more interesting, and (3) better party support?

1) More Combat effective is realative, I think both would be on equal ground depending on situation.

2) I think you will find the Inquisitor a bit more interesting, they have a bit more in options to start with.
3) Once again due to the increase in options I think the Inquisitor better fits the role of support.

Thanks, Nimon.

As far as combat effectiveness, the Paladin has a much better BAB. So, against evil opponents (where the Paladin's smite applies), I wonder how a ranged inquisitor would be able to compete?

I'm interested in making a new ranged character with divine powers and/or spells for PFS. Any advice on which would be (1) more combat effective, (2) tactically more interesting, and (3) better party support?

With a battle cleric in the party already with 'lucky' dice, good gear and a greatsword, I don't quite want to copy what he does..

Wind seems tempting because 8 armor AC seems sweet (though I guess it doesn't stack with magic vestment?) and flight ability as a swift action sounds fun, and automatic shock weapon doesn't hurt to have. Still figuring out how to build it though... Once again, with the battle cleric in the party, if I'm just a caster I'm half the character he is (never mind oracles don't actually get good fort saves like clerics).. do I go rapier, buckler and spring attack and fly-by attack?

Tiefling offer nice racial options for cha plus dex or str depending on what kind of character you'd want..

The Wind Oracle can get the Invisibility revelation at level 3. One minute increments per level per day.

Summoning Monsters does not count as an attack so Invisibility would not be broken by the summons. Invisibility would remain in tact even after the summoned creatures attack. I think Wind Oracle with Augment Summoning and a high stealth would be effective starting level 3.

Hi all,

I am trying to 'plan out' my feat chain for a human Inquisitor for Pathfinder Society who is melee-focused and favors a two-handed weapon.

I have two feat chain choices below for which I am looking for critiques. But also, I would like to know if anyone else has any interesting feat chains to recommend for a melee-focused inquisitor.

Thanks in advance for any suggestions/advice.

Stats: Str 16, Dex 14, Con 10, Int 10, Wis 14, Chr 10

Human Favored Class (Inquisitor): Will opt for extra spell known at each level.

Note: Due to BAB +1 restriction, cannot choose Weapon Focus before 3rd level and thus cannot choose Dazzling Display before 5th level.

Choice 1 - Prioritize Build for Dazzling Display
Reason: Being a party-friendly de-buffer is always fun.

Human -- Weapon Prof (Falchion)
1 ------ Intimidating Prowess
3 ------ Weapon Focus (Falchion)
5 ------ Dazzling Display
7 ------ Power Attack
9 ------ Toughness <- To make up for low Con score
11 ----- Improved Critical (Falchion)

Choice 2 - Build for Whirlwind Attack
Reason: I just thought this might be interesting...

Deity -- Weapon Proficiency (Glaive) <- From Shelyn
Human -- Dodge
1 ------ Mobility
3 ------ Spring Attack
5 ------ Combat Expertise
7 ------ Whirlwind Attack
9 ------ Wind Stance
11 ----- Power Attack

Team Work Feats
Note: Teamwork Feat choices are based upon Ice Titan's comments from an Advice thread titled "Help with optimizing an melee inquisitor". Sorry, I don't know how properly link it here.
3 ------ Paired Opportunists
6 ------ Precise Strike
9 ------ Outflank

Thanks, Asphesteros and the rest. That clears it up.

I am looking to see (through examples) if my interpretation on the Perception DC to (A) notice an invisible creature and (B) pinpoint an invisible creature.

Per the srd under Perception...
Noticing: A creature can generally notice the presence of an active invisible creature within 30 feet with a DC 20 Perception check.
Pinpointing: It's practically impossible (+20 DC) to pinpoint an invisible creature's location with a Perception check.

Perception DCs:
Perceive DC to Notice: 20
Perceive DC to Pinpoint Location: 40

Modifiers to Perception DC:
In combat or speaking -20
Moving half speed -5
Moving full speed -10
Running or charging -20
Not moving +20
Using Stealth +Stealth Check +20

SCENARIO 1 - Caster is Invisible and Silent
-Fighter PC is engaged in melee combat with monster.
-Caster PC has invisibility.
-Caster PC moves full speed.
-Caster PC arrives at a spot adjacent to the allied Fighter PC and within 10 feet of monster.
-Caster PC activates wand (pointing, non-verbal activation) and buffs/heals Fighter.
-Caster PC has a stealth skill bonus of 4
-Monster has a perception skill bonus of 4
Modifiers:
Moving full speed -10
Caster's Stealth check
Stealth ranks +4
Stealth check roll (an average roll) +11
Monster's stealth ranks -4
Total Modifiers: +1

Required rolls for
(Modified) Perceive DC to Notice +21
(Modified) Perceive DC to Pinpoint Location: +41

Results for creatures w/ equal opposing bonuses to stealth and perception:
(A) On an average roll, a silent caster would not be detected.
(B) A silent caster would be 'practically impossible' to pinpoint with a Perception check. Although 'actions' could be spent to pinpoint.

SCENARIO 2 - Caster is Invisible but 'In Combat or Speaking'
Same as Scenario 1 except that…
-Caster PC casts a spell with a verbal component
Required rolls for
(Modified) Perceive DC to Notice +1
(Modified) Perceive DC to Pinpoint Location: +21

Results for creatures w/ equal opposing bonuses to stealth and perception:
(A) Caster speaking or in combat w/in 30 feet is almost always 'noticed'.
(B) Caster speaking or in combat w/in 30 feet is still very difficult to pinpoint just through a Perception check.

So...
1-Does this rule interpretation seem correct?
2-In principle, does this seem balanced?

Thanks for the feedback…
Belafon, thanks for pointing out about the gaseous form revelation not being available until 7th level.

Here are some further thoughts on 1st and 2nd level spell choices… Apologies in advance for a long post...

1st Level

Bless – Sounds like a ‘must have’ everyday useful spell. (Morale bonus... will stack w/ Prayer later on)

Bane – Sounds like this would be very good at low levels. I think the usefulness could be extended w/ Heighten Spell. I think the penalties would stack w/ Prayer.

Cause Fear – Debatable. As Selgard mentioned, the HD cap means it is not useful long-term and would have to be swapped out fairly early on.

Command – A lot of people like this. I can see the benefit of setting up a round of attacks of opportunity for your melee team. I think Heighten Spell would help here as well. Probably not so useful if you take the Oracle’s Tongues curse.

Protection from Evil, Obscuring Mist, Remove Fear, Shield of Faith – Is it perhaps better to get a wand of these?

Regarding ‘Protection from Evil’, ‘Shield of Faith’ – Shield of Faith for when encountering non-evil dangers.

Regarding ‘Obscuring Mist’ – I have never used this much. I have always thought that since it is centered on the caster that that is a big limitation on its usefulness. So, I am curious about how others have used it effectively. With Oracle, it might be especially useful for the Waves Mystery and, I believe, the Flame Mystery as well since both ‘Water Sight’ and ‘Gaze of Flames’ grant normal vision in ‘fog’.

Divine Favor – It scales. Perhaps this is useful to take at level 6 for the +2 (+1 per 3 levels).

Sanctuary – I have seen this used very effectively. I think with Heighten Spell it would be even better. Any thoughts?

2nd Level

I like the following 2nd level spells: Hold Person, Resist Energy, Lesser Restoration, and Align Weapon, (from Calagnar’s list)… plus Remove Paralysis… plus the buff spells Bear’s Endurance, Bull’s Strength, Eagle’s Spendor. However, since it takes several levels to learn this many 2nd level spells, the question becomes one of priority.

Hold Person – At 4th level (with extra point in the primary ability) the DC would be 10+4+2=16 Will save.

Lesser Restoration, Remove Paralysis – Are these better as a wands? I agree w/ Irontruth that Lesser Restoration is critical at times. I just do not think you would need it every day.

Resist Energy, Align Weapon – Wand or Known? Like Lesser Restoration and Remove Paralysis I do not think these would be needed every day. However, the increased duration would be situational useful if you are prepping for an assault.

Bear’s Endurance, Bull’s Strength – Both good buffs. I think Bear’s Endurance would be useful to everyone, not just melee. Plus, melee might be more likely to have at least the +2 to strength item.

Eagle’s Splendor – Useful for an Oracle. It is a good boost to the Oracle’s primary stat (and thus spell DC’s for Hold Person, etc.) until the 16k gp ‘headband’ is affordable. Who else in the party would have this memorized?

Spiritual Weapon – I think this is not as good for Oracles as for Clerics. A big drawback for this spell for Oracles is that the BAB uses your Wisdom modifier instead of Charisma modifier (unless there is errata that changes this).

Admonishing Ray – I think this would be useful starting level 7. At level 7, you would have 2 touch-attack rays of 4d6 non-lethal damage. It is not support/buffing, but it has utility and as quoted on the boards it is ‘almost a damage spell’.

Silence – I think this would be good as a wand. It could be very interesting with fly plus invisibility.

Regarding Summon Monsters… Is this generally less/more/as powerful than it was in 3.5?

I’m looking for advice on spell selection for an Oracle. This character would be a general support/utility character. Details below.

I’m looking for advice on picking the best everyday-use spells considering just the generic Oracle/Cleric spell list and not the spells gained from Oracle Mystery selection.

I have taken a pass at spell selection for levels 1 thru 6 for this character.

I would certainly appreciate advice and discussion on the merits of specific spells.

RACE:
Human w/ Oracle as favored class for the bonus spells known per each level gained.

ABILITIES:
Oracle L1 - Str 8, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 12, Wis 10, Chr 19
Oracle L1 - Str 8, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 12, Wis 10, Chr 20

MYSTERY:
I’ve chosen the Wind Mystery for defense and low profile once the invisibility and fly revelations kick in.

FEATS:
Oracle L1 – Additional Revelation, Spell Focus (Conjuration)
Oracle L3 – Augment Summoning
Oracle L5 - ??

REVELATIONS:
Oracle L1 – Air Barrier, Gaseous Form
Oracle L3 - Invisibility

SPELLS:
Oracle L1
Spells 1st Level – 4/day – Bless, Cause Fear

Oracle L3
Spells 1st level – 6/day – Bless, Cause Fear, Summon Monster I

Oracle L4
Spells 1st level – 8/day – Bless, Cause Fear, Summon Monster I, Sanctuary
Spells 2nd level – 4/day – Summon Monster II

Oracle L5
Spells 1st level – 8/day – Bless, Cause Fear, Summon Monster I, Sanctuary, Protection from Evil, Shield of Faith
Spells 2nd level – 5/day – Summon Monster II, Resist Energy

Oracle L6
Spells 1st level – 8/day – Bless, Cause Fear, Sanctuary, Protection from Evil, Shield of Faith, Divine Favor
Spells 2nd level – 6/day – Resist Energy, Remove Paralysis, Hold Person
Spells 3rd level – 4/day – Summon Monster III