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SillyString wrote:

Anyone able to tell me the specifics of just the 1st level bloodrager bloodline power? (i think someone said it was damage, so... 1d6 on all attacks for x rounds? x attacks? only against certain foes?)

Nope. While we can give previews of stuff, specific mechanics have to wait until the release date.

Ah well, thanks :)

Anyone able to tell me the specifics of just the 1st level bloodrager bloodline power? (i think someone said it was damage, so... 1d6 on all attacks for x rounds? x attacks? only against certain foes?)

Wild Ryskys are primarily known for their aggression... and their love of Jubilex.

So... Demon worshipping barbarian archetype? (I'd play that)

First off, there's absolutely nothing in the archetype that requires or encourages the character to be a "douchebag". They're all about vengeance and violence.

Secondly, since they have fallen, no, they do not have to follow the code or alignment anymore.

Oooooh, so they have fallen and the archetype says that? That's awesome then!

(Understand my interpretation is based off other peoples messages, I have still yet to see the book, though this info makes me more excited to do so!)

Thanks :)

From the info here, I'm very confused as to whether the "Vindictive Bastard" is actually an ex-paladin or just a douchebag paladin that still has to follow the same strict conduct rules. I see people referring to it as being an "ex-paladin" but... is it actually? :/

It is quite intriguing, but I hesitate to divulge it all until available in print.

That's ok, I don't even need to know any ability details, but before I get too excited I would like to know if it is still going to be locked into lawful good & small deity selection with a stick up the butt code of conduct, if at all possible :)

Cant wait to get my hands on this.

What does the paladin archetype trade out? Does it still get spells for example?

Oh, and does it lose its code of conduct/alignment restriction?

New bloodrager bloodline? Sold. (Assuming it's not super niche)

Surprised by the shifter becoming a class when we have mutation fighters, shapeshifter rangers, beastkin berserker barbarians, flesheater barbarians, mooncursed barbarians, barbarian beast totems, agathiel vigilantes, wildsoul vigilantes, beastmorph alchemists, Prowler Bloodragers, Shapeshifter bloodline bloodragers/magus, Shapeshifter bloodline Sorcerers, hunters, druids, all the beast races, skinwalker race (+subraces) and a handful of other archetypes that focus on transmutation and shapeshifting are able to fit just about any playstyle or fantasy.

That being said, it makes me very interested to see how they're going to make the class feel different to the existing options, and to be honest if it's a full-bab class as opposed to yet another 3/4 bab then I'm on board!

The Shifter aside, I'm mostly looking forward to the new martially-inclined archetypes and potential feats that this book will bring to the table, and *fingers crossed* there wont be too many reprints.

What things are you guys looking forward to about the book?

PS: Is it November yet? :)

This is one of the more anticipated books on my list. How about the rest of you guys?

Honestly, prior to seeing the description I was super-psyched about this one. After; I'm far less so. That's not to say that I'm assuming the things mentioned in the description will be boring/low quality, simply that they aren't the kind of things that I get excited about from new material.

But who knows, there might be planetouched stuff and/or unusual things in there too (Barbarian/bloodrager love *fingers crossed*). From what we know at the moment though, its not one i'll be picking up on release... but if I hear from others that it has some interesting things, i'll consider it for my "maybe" list.

Or to put it in the words of Gorbacz:

4/10.

Product description is cool and all, but anyone know if there will be any new options for sylph, ifrit, undine, oread or better yet the Suli or the bloodrager class? (Ideally, top of my wish-list is a jann bloodline/archetype for the bloodrager) That's what I'd be interested in seeing from something elemental themed :)

...moving from 15' to 10' would provoke with the spear (moving into threatened square) and moving from 10' to 5' would also provoke (moving out of threatened square) with the spear. I would be willing to accept that this would work along with the FAQ since the character is crossing two different lines and not provoking twice for 1 square of movement.

Does that make sense?

I think that's the most logical conclusion, yes.

Thanks everyone for the input, rules quotes and the FAQ links :)

This FAQ may suggest it is only 1 AoO still.

The FAQ isn't directly applicable in this case, thus I say may, but it does seem to suggest that movement related AoO's are only generated once, regardless of whether that is entering or leaving a square.

Personally I think you get only 1 AoO from the your combo, but I could certainly understand others not agreeing with my viewpoint on this.

Yeah I'm not seeing that FAQ being too similar/comparable to the situation as in that their AoO from moving into another creatures square is essentially just the standard AoO for moving out of the adjacent space already (and essentially written prior to entering AoOs becoming possible, so they used entering/exiting somewhat synonymously), and not something that's called out as additional... But it sure points towards the answer to question 3 being no if only due to the FAQ's approach to simultaneous opportunities. Limiting it in total to 2 AoOs if they charge to an adjacent square.

Nope, You're right. The limit is per Movement, but rather moving out of a threatened square. You would get 2 AoOs.

Ah good, i'm not going completely mad then.

Moving on, question 3 was just whether or not you could AoO for both him moving out of the 10ft sq and moving into a 5ft sq one after the other (one with the spear, then one with unarmed) due to the boon. (Taking the total to 3) From RAW I could see it being a little grey due to potentially happening simultaneously(?).

I assume you fall on the side of the two opportunities becoming one opportunity due to them happening simultaneously, therefore only getting the one attack for that section of 5ft movement from the charge?

Still just one.

Errr... why?

It was my understanding that moving out of a threatened square was an opportunity, not the whole movement?

Hence the:

This feat does not let you make more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity from you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity (since each one represents a different opportunity). Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity for that opponent.

having to call out moving out of squares to say that in that specific instance of multiple opportunities an AoO from moving out of squares can only done once for that movement. There's nothing I can find to say thats the case for other instances of multiple opportunities... such as the bonus AoO from the boon.

As far as I can see it doesnt say you get only one opportunity per movement, it only says:
A: You can only make one AoO per round unless you have combat reflexes, or similar. (Which this build does)
B: You can only take one AoO per opportunity
C: Moving out of threatened spaces would create opportunities (but...*)
D: *..."Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn’t count as more than one opportunity." (A specific rule for moving out of threatened sqaures)
& E: (With the Boon) "In addition, you may attempt an attack of opportunity whenever a charging opponent enters a space you threaten." (No stipulation for once per round)

(Sorry, I don't mean to be argumentative, it's just not something i've come across much and I'd like to see where you're getting your understanding, because - based only on what i've found so far - it seems like a bit of a leap to assume that the rule that specifically calls out opportunities created by moving out of squares actually applies to all possible opportunities related to movement...)

As follow-up questions, if I have the celestial obedience feat & worship Arqueros, gaining the following:

"In addition, you may attempt an attack of opportunity whenever a charging opponent enters a space you threaten"

-

1) If that enemy were to charge to me, would I get a spear AoO when he got to within 10ft, then another spear attack when moved out of that square?

Basically, is the AoO granted by the boon from entering a square usable alongside the AoO provoked by moving out of a square?

2) Would I get an additional unarmed AoO from the boon when he entered the square adjacent to me as well?

You can only take a single AoO from an enemy movement, even if the movement passes through multiple threatened squares. However, you can make an AoO with any weapon which you threaten with. If you took an AoO with your spear at 10', and then the enemy took a non-move action that provoked at 5', you could take an AoO with your unarmed strike.

Wow I'd completely overlooked that. It hasn't come up much but I know a couple of GMs that I should point that out to.

Lets say I'm a brawler and I have an elven branched spear (Brace & Reach) and combat reflexes.

An enemy moves through a square 10ft away from me, so he provokes an AoO from my spear. As he continues moving, he also passes through a square adjacent to me. Can I make an AoO unarmed as well? (someone said you're only able to make AoOs with the weapon you made the first AoO a round with, but I'm not sure if that was a home rule, a mistake or something I didn't know)

Diagram:
- - 1 - -
- - - 2 -
- - x - 3
- - - - -
- - - - -

x = me
1 = start of enemy movement
3 = end of enemy movement

Potentially Interesting... I'll have to keep an eye on this one :)

Well, that's kind of what I feared... oh well, in a home game the feat might be useful, otherwise I see no use for it. No pirates shall ever exist in pathfinder for it. That is my opinion at least. Thanks for clarifying the bad news.

Don't be so glum, it's still one the few ways for you to dump str and get dex to damage!

"When wielding your chosen weapon one-handed, you can treat it as a one-handed piercing melee weapon for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon (such as a swashbuckler’s or a duelist’s precise strike) and you can add your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to that weapon’s damage"

^ All one sentence, also part of the designated "benefit" section of the feat, 99% sure it's all the benefit.

Benefit: Choose one kind of one-handed slashing weapon (such as the longsword). When wielding your chosen weapon one-handed...

As far as I can see its a simple layout thats designed to avoid any confusion, which might explain why you cant find anyone else answering (or asking) the question, but that's just my take on it. If you can convince a GM to discern a different understanding then all power to you! :)

I believe the "You do not gain this benefit while fighting with two weapons or using flurry of blows, or any time another hand is otherwise occupied." text sums it up pretty well, if you have your off-hand occupied, its not treated as a piercing weapon, so no panache for you...

But out of curiosity, did you just overlook that text or was there something to make you think otherwise? (I'm not sure if that text was part of the original printing or if it was errata)

Good point, I forgot about the captain america brawler...

Perhaps something war themed? A warpriest that loudly exclaims his religious views while beating people to death would be a good character for simulating a more cynical portrayal of america ^-^

I don't have a build but:

Vigilantes = Superheroes (pretty american)
Agathiel Archetype = Turn into a bald eagle (Very American)

Maybe find a way to get color spray or some kind of firework-esque spell aswell?

Or just be some kind of (preferably shirtless) class with an eagle companion / familiar.

There are domains and a few class features that include the word "freedom" prehaps dip into every class to collect as many freedom themed things as possible?

Oh, and 1 level has to be in gunslinger, because 'murica.

I'm hoping for a bloodrager archetype that makes the elemental bloodline much more appealing...

We did it! (about two weeks ago @ level 15)
Turns out it was (kind-of) a hydra-dragon (called it) that smashed his way out from under a city (creating wonderful instant ruins - called it), but it was hunched and bi-pedal with a head for each dragon color and four arms. Something I didnt expect was that it would be wielding a trident as its main weapon.

Long story short*, my character played bait trying to intimidate him and got smacked around a little while the rogue rallied the cities wizards to topple a building on to him - the other barbarian was having some trouble navigating the terrain after some wonderful climb checks. After the building fell the dragon then got pissed and nuked the wizards, rogue's behind was lightly singed. Using the newly flattened area we fought the giant dragon, who kept burrowing underground and shooting divine lightning breath at us. Other barbarian struggled a bit but did some huge amounts of damage before being zapped. (the gm asked how much health they had and definitely fudged it so they wouldnt be 1-hit so soon into the fight.) Some time later my barbarian ended up getting impaled on the trident after he got stunned by some kind of aura that the dragon's blood created. Thankfully before the dragon could slam my barbarian into the ground and finish me off the rogue stabbed him up the ...er... and finished him off very ingloriously. Meaning we all technically survived!?

*There were also a few rounds where nothing much happened / we got hit by a few movement restricting spells, attempted mind control, fear effects or just whacked eachother, but they weren't as interesting.

Anyway, the rogue's deeds were cemented into history and they ascended to godhood at the moment of slaying the dragon, with the two barbarians growing to enormous size and becoming immortal heralds of the new rogue-god, one donning gleaming armor of the dead dragon-god and becoming an invincible warrior - and my barbarian taking up the trident and possibly gaining control of some kind of dragon-demon hybrid horde trapped under the earth. (Which the hydra dragon god was trying to unleash / use to control the world).

So, overall, rogue became a god of anything he chose to be, the other barbarian got to become a battle incarnate avatar and my barbarian got a trident and an evil invincible army. The other guy with the derp character didn't show up since I first posted, so we're told his character oversaw the evacuation of the city and became a lord or something for his troubles and efforts rebuilding the city. So ended the BBEG and the campaign.

Advice noted, thanks! I'll try to pick up something that'll help with fear or illusions!

@Mysterious Stranger
Thankfully(?) the GM doesnt put much stock in charisma skills / charisma scores (I dont think ive ever seen someone have to make a roll or reference their charisma in the last few campaigns, which bugs me to no end because it disregards that part of the game and every player (except some casters) are free to dump it*, but it actually manages to work in my favor in this case - and similarly people with low wisdom have been able to make plans and follow through on things rp-wise in spite of what their wisdom score would represent.) so aside from the saving throws and perception, having the low score wont be making me too much like rain man. I think your assessment of making it an "old school type game" is accurate, given that he's been playing for a loooooooong time and is very stubbornly set into his way of GM'ing.

In regard to android, I noticed that online but the GM decided it was too exotic, which I agree with because I like my rpgs mostly sci-fi free anyway, otherwise it could have been a nice option, I could downgrade my elf to a half-elf if that's any help, but I dont think that'd open up many more options(?).

* possibly leading to the ugliest adventuring parties known to man...

Illusions are pretty common and other minutae like glitterdust or ear piercing scream with maybe a boss encounter having a dominate or something along those lines. You have any point of reference on what the campaign will be?

Well we've started (as most campaigns seem to) in a tavern, talking about bandits or goblins but in previous campaigns such things have had little bearing on the weirdness of the quests that followed, the only thing that worries me is he's VERY fond of throwing casters at us (usually with a group of a few 1-hittable minions), and that usually means saving throws every round.

I would have been a dwarf instead of an elf if you want to boost saves. Racial Hardiness plus the Glory of old trait plus the steel soul feat is good for a +5 to all saves vs spells and slas which will protect you more than elven immunity. Barring dwarf, Sacred Tattoo half orc with fates favored is good for + 2 to all saves.

The problem is that the 3d6 no retools can only be used to make powerful SAD classes such as full casters. Any class that is MAD such as every martial is going to be underpowered, whiles wizards will still be able to start with a 19 primary ability score and a decent con.

There is only so much you can do with a wis 5.

Indeed, we've had the first session and the elf isn't something that will be changing now though. Oh I forgot to mention we aren't gaining starting traits.

I figure if there's other feats / items that I can pick up to sneakily bypass the bad will entirely then that'll probably be the best way to deal with it at this point, but i'm not too familiar with such things.

@tarik & avr
Hmmm bummer, but I'll look into the items anyway, and possiby see if I can wrangle a way to get something similar to protection from alignment for myself (self reliance n' all that). So would you say fear is likely the thing that'll be hitting me most? What are the other main dangers? (if I can identify the main things that'll be hurting me, I can at least try to find ways to cope better with them)

Let's say my slayer's bonus to will saves was -3 at level 1 due to very poorly rolled stats* (and they wont be getting much better due to low class save progression). What ways would there be to cope with / bypass this weakness?

For example, I have already chosen to make the character an elf in order to become immune to magical sleep effects, covering that corner of will-based saves.

Are there simple ways to become immune to other will-based effects?
Is it worth trying to invest in feats like iron will that grant a static bonus, when the character will likely fail the saves regardless (and I could use the feats elsewhere)?
Is there a way to use a familiar/animal companion/ally's modifier in place of my own?
Are there any good tricks that'll allow me to ignore will-based spells (entirely or a percentage of the time)?

Also curious to see what people's opinions are of how much the character's low will is likely to hurt him throughout his (possibly short) adventuring career.

* We used 3d6 (no rerolls or dropping): My lowest stats were two 5s and an 9, so I dumped charisma and wisdom and put the 9 in intelligence (elf boosted to 11) because I really didn't want my slayer to be thick as a brick... the stats werent all bad mind you, getting 17(dex, elf boosted to 19) 16(con, elf dropped to 14) and 12(str) suited the martial nature of the weapon finesse/ranged slayer I was wanting to play.

Planning on making a oni-themed bloodrager, specifically one with the elemental (fire) bloodline that uses high strength and a Tetsubo. Recognizing that the elemental bloodline has quite a few weak powers, I was thinking about trading out most of them using the primalist archetype.

What rage powers would you recommend I pick up if i trade out my 4th, 12th & 16th powers? (Thinking I'd keep the extra speed from the 8th level power)

PS: This is not for pfs, so suggest anything paizo-based. If you'd like more info to help you make informed suggestions, let me know :)

The only new weapon in the Monk Fighter Weapon group is the Sanpkhang.

The waveblade is in the Close Weapon fighter group though, which makes it a nice weapon for Brawlers to use.

Hmm that's interesting, thanks!

I'm curious to know how the damage on the drow blade works, and i'm also curious to know what exactly a sanpkhang is, googling it doesnt reveal anything relevant in images, so i'm assuming its something very unusual / created for pathfinder?

Is the wave blade part of the monk weapon group, or does it just have the monk property?

Drow razors are light exotic weapons that can be treated as if they were martial by creatures with the drow weapon familiarity racial trait. They deal extra damage on a critical hit or a sneak attack.

Cool, what's their damage / extra damage?

Whats the damage on the drow razor?

Is there a picture of the wave blade? I'm assuming something like this?

Gisher wrote:

SillyString wrote:

Are any of the new weapons 18-20 crit range?

The Fauchard will, if it matches the original stats. From the name, I wouldn't be surprised if the Drow Razor does.

Yep, and some more.

Ohhh more? How many are there and are they just "reskinned" versions of scimitars/kukris? Seems like this companion may have some more unusual weapons and i'm curious to know if they bring anything interesting to the table mechanically.

Are any of the new weapons 18-20 crit range?

There's Bullseye Shot to spend a move to get +4 to attack for ranged, but I don't see much that would be useful for melee:

Mobile Bulwark Style
Reverse-Feint
Team Up

"Strike True" would be the melee equivalent of bullseye shot, but hitting isnt hard when you're vital striking.

Interesting suggestions though, got any other ideas? :)

Other than moving around, what are the best uses of your move action when using vital strike? Off the top of my head I can think of (improved) feinting, but what else do you think is a good use of your turn's move action?

(I'm aware that many people don't think vital strike is very good, but please refrain from starting up conversations about why you do/dont think vital striking is a waste of time/feat investment, i'm merely looking for ideas on how make the most out of otherwise unused move actions during your turn.)

What does the slayer archetype get / trade out?

FREE PREVIEW TIME because I love you all!

Here are the classes who get archetypes in Adventurer's Guide. It's certainly not EVERY class, but I tried to get as close as possible while still picking archetypes that made sense for each group.

Alchemist
Arcanist
Barbarian (2)
Bard (3)
Bloodrager
Brawler
Cavalier (2)
Cleric
Druid (3)
Fighter (3)
Hunter
Magus (2)
Medium
Monk
Occultist
Paladin
Ranger (2)
Rogue (2)
Shaman
Spiritualist
Summoner, Unchained
Swashbuckler (2)
Vigilante (2)
Warpriest
Wizard

Wow, I'm glad I asked! :)

I say, I'm getting hyped now.

I'm very curious to know which classes will be getting new archetypes in this book...

Preview? :)

I'd say the jungle lord archetype is the closest thing that exists already, show it to him to see if it's pretty much what he's looking for.

As "Secret Wizard" said, you can find it on nethys :)

Even if it's not, showing it to him should give you an idea of what he actually wants, at which point we'll be happy to suggest things that better suit his "vision" for his character. Chances are there's an archetype that exists to fit just about any concept!

Bah, thought as much, thanks :)

I knew i would get one of these.

thank you for the sujesttions and advise. BUT i like to do stuff different and try new things. i could make a Go To Sleep witch or some other Cooky Cutter Build but that is no fun doing the exact same thing. under stand? because i can :)
besides im having fun wiping waves of minions killing them before they can touch me at low levels

Heh, I must say i've never made a cooky cutter build in my life, I usually go for more unusual flavor-based "average-ish" characters. I'm just pointing out that trying to make a D6 1/2 BAB martial character without any martial class abilities/bonus feats will probably mean you wont even be close to average unless you have something that compensates for that (Hence me asking if there's something that makes it a more appealing option).

That being said, I certainly don't disagree with how flavorful/visually interesting your character could be, I merely see practicality as a factor to consider.

Does empower spell allow more of your attacks to benefit from the hermean potential spell?

also i would love some suggestions on how i can boost my attack bonus or BAB because being a wich my BAB stinks. i know i can stack strength

You could cast transformation for full BAB, when you get 6th level spells. Spell perfection + quickened spell = cast transformation and full attack in the same turn.

(Given the requests for suggestions and build advice, wouldn't this be better suited to the advice forum?)

Do any metamagic feats increase the number of attacks hermean potential applies to?

Contingent action's readied actions arent the same as making multiple standard actions on your turn, thanks for pointing that spell out though.

Is monk of the four winds the only archetype that's capable of taking more than one standard action attack on their turn? I've tried searching for similar wording but I can't seem to find any others... Outside of mythic stuff, that is.

Are there any others like four winds?

Something I didn't realise was possible in pathfinder rules, but I just stumbled across the monk of the four winds which can get three standard actions in one round. What other ways to get more than one standard action in one round have I missed?

At the risk of showing off my ignorance here, how does one get a crit threat of 17-20? I'm not aware of any statted weapon with that range nor a way to increase an 18-20 to 17-20 within the pathfinder rules.

Hence the "Lets say there was a unique weapon that could crit on a roll of 17-20" part of the question, it's theoretical for the purpose of discussion :)