Mite

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Grand Lodge

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To add my two copper pieces:

I think the desire for a clearly stated set of design goals of PF2 is perfectly valid. I myself would very much welcome it.

The counterargument of it influencing the results of the playtest is understandable. If Paizo were interested in the raw neutral reaction to the playtest release, that is indeed the stance they should take. If, on the other hand, design goals exist (and therefore some areas where compromise is unlikely) it is helpful to state these goals so feedback can be funneled to the areas where it is actually considered.

To illustrate: If you want to make a spanish omelette with tomato, and get everyone's opinion on it, it is helpful if you tell them that you want to make a spanish omelette with tomato so as to not have a whole bunch of people scream about how tomatoes don't belong in an omelette. For a traditional omelette they would be right too!

As to how it was pointed out, that mission statements do exist: Yes, we have statements along the lines of "make it easier for new players and less complicated" but that is about as informative as saying "we want to make a delicious dessert". I have no idea as to what recipe, the ingredients of which or what kind of dessert it is supposed to be to begin with. I get the rough idea, yes, but nothing beyond that.

I am quite hungry, perhaps you noticed.

And here I will pull out my second copper piece as material component for Detect thoughts and divine what seem to me to be design goals:

-Make entry into the game easier by removing most choices that require surveying many options at lvl 1 (Feat choice in PF1).
-Make the game future-proof by adopting a general nomenclature (traits and conditions) with specific meanings. Also to remove ambiguity in ability descriptions
-Make character choices more "fun" by removing numerical boni and replacing them with active actions/reactions or thematic path choices, such as druid circles or muses
-Make it harder to create a bad character, by limiting the amount of choices available at early levels
-Streamline gameplay by providing a certain framework of available actions that only changes little as levels increase (no iterative attacks)
-Make it easier to estimate party capabilities by giving +level to everything and reducing the impact of magic on what can be done by the party. This one can be expanded upon, but I want to keep it short
-Make it easier for someone to start and run as a DM by simplifying monster rules, including not following the same creation rules as PCs
-Go for a lower-fantasy setting where not everything can be solved with magic and success is not a foregone conclusion

Alright, my 1min/level of Detect thoughts ran out. Could all of these be wrong and just misinterpretation from limited data? Sure!

Grand Lodge

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Paradozen wrote:
Andoran keeps you relatively safe if you don't support slavery.** spoiler omitted **but most people cannot afford it.

THat's a good point actually, what would happen to a population of humans which migrate to another plane? Long term I mean. Do they turn into a kind of outsider native to that plane after a couple generations?

Grand Lodge

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Rogar Valertis wrote:

The river kingdoms. They may be full of bandits, religious zealots and worse, but at least you are free (until you are dead).

All countries in Avistan have their list of problems, none is the perfect place to live.

Not a great country to settle down in however as a farmer, considering property right is directly correlated to the personal power you have.

What about Arcadia then? As long as you don't run afoul of the locals...
What about Nidal? If you don't like fun, it's certainly a very stable country.

Grand Lodge

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Considering Golarion is a setting where monsters are rampant and nations of devil binders exist, what would be the best place for the average joe to live?

My bet would most likely be on Andoran or Brevoy, considering you don't hear much about catastrophy from there (as far as I know). What is your opinion?

Due to information availability, Inner Sea Region is obviously preferred.

Grand Lodge

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How about some love for the evil healer? Even Cheliax needs a few people to fix their injuries! After all, even the altruistic-seeming healer can be evil. Everyone should act as order dictates. For the greater Law!
Feel free to substitute Jiraviddain for deity if you'd like more freedom to interpret her faith.

Spoiler:

Kyra was one of the few survivors of a brutal raid on her hometown, conducted by a rebel cell leftover from the civil war.On the smoking ruins of her village she swore her life and sword arm to Lorcan, the Infernal Duke of the blood, servant to his infernal sovereign Asmodeus. Possessed of a fierce will, pride in her faith, and skill with the short sword, Kyra has traveled accross cheliax since then. Where another might be consumed by wrath and an unbridled thirst for revenge, she has instead found peace in the Order of Hell, and in the belief that if she can prevent even one death at the hands of disobedient cretins, her own losses will not have been in vain. While she takes great pleasure in ridding the world of troublemakers, she takes even greater pleasure in keeping the order of her infernal master intact.

I would assume that during education, evil healers would still be LN (due to naivité and selective education of initiates), allowing them to channel positive energy. After gathering more experience and being educated in the "other" aspects of their deity, they would slowly drift off towards LE.
Mirror Universe Kyra CR 3
XP 800
Female human (Chelaxian) cleric (merciful healer) of Lorcan 4 (Pathfinder RPG Ultimate Combat 41)
LE Medium humanoid (human)
Init +0; Senses Perception +3
----- Defense -----
AC 20, touch 11, flat-footed 20 (+7 armor, +1 deflection, +2 shield)
hp 35 (4d8+12)
Fort +7, Ref +2, Will +8
----- Offense -----
Speed 30 ft. (20ft in armor)
Melee short sword +5 (1d6+2/19-20) or morningstar +5 (1d8+2)
Special Attacks channel positive energy 5/day (DC 14, 2d6)
Domain Spell-Like Abilities (CL 4th; concentration +7)
6/day—rebuke death (1d4+2)
Cleric Spells prepared (CL 4th; concentration +7)
2nd—cure moderate wounds(D), life pact(ACG), lesser restoration, shield other
1st—bless, burning disarm(DC 14), command(DC 14), cure light wounds(D), protection from chaos
0 (at will)—detect magic, guidance, read magic, spark(APG)
D Domain Spell; Domain Healing
----- Tactics -----
Before Combat Kyra tries to keep her allies in top condition with her healing abilities. If aware of a confrontation, she casts life pact or shield other as needed
During Combat Kyra uses her spells and abilities as best as possible to assist her allies, walking into melee combat after supportive spells have been used as needed. While engaged in melee combat with her allies, she uses her combat advice and saving shield feats as often as possible. If her allies are low on HP, she channels positive energy or uses her cure spells depending on number of injured, excluding her enemies with selective channel.
Morale Kyra serves her role in the order of things and will keep fighting as long as her party is alive.
----- Statistics -----
Str 14, Dex 10, Con 15, Int 10, Wis 16,Cha 14
Base Atk +3; CMB +5 CMD 16
Feats Combat Advice, Saving Shield (APG), Selective Channeling
Traits Armor Expert, Thrune Informant
Skills Diplomacy +8 (+9 to gather information), Heal +9, Knowledge (religion) +4, Linguistics +4, Sense Motive +9, Spellcraft +4
Languages Common, Infernal
SQ combat medic, mercy (mercy: fatigued)
Combat Gear oil of daylight, potion of darkvision, scroll of consecrate, scroll of delay poison, wand of infernal healing (13 charges) ; Other Gear +1 agile breastplate (APG) , heavy steel shield, morningstar, short sword, cloak of resistance +1, ring of protection +1, backpack, bedroll, blanket (APG), explorer's outfit, flint and steel, hemp rope (50 ft.), inkpen, mirror, parchment (3), scroll case, soap, spell component pouch, torch (5), trail rations (4), vial, waterskin, wooden unholy symbol of Lorcan, 11 gp, 6 sp, 4 cp
----- Special Abilities -----
Cleric (Merciful Healer) Domain (Healing) Granted Powers: Your touch staves off pain and death, and your healing magic is particularly vital and potent.
Cleric Channel Positive Energy 2d6 (5/day, DC 14) (Su) Positive energy heals the living and harms the undead; negative has the reverse effect.
Combat Advice As a move action, you can offer useful advice to an ally engaged in combat at just the right moment. Designate an enemy; your ally gains a +2 competence bonus on her next attack roll against that enemy. For your ally to benefit from this feat, you must be able to clearly see your ally and the designated enemy, and your ally must be able to hear you.
Combat Medic (Ex) A merciful healer does not provoke attacks of opportunity when using the Heal skill to stabilize another creature or casting healing spells.
Mercy: Fatigued (1 creatures) (Su) When the merciful healer channels energy she can remove the fatigued condition from one or more living creatures that she heals within her channel energy burst. Feats and effects that affect a paladin's mercy also affect this ability.
Rebuke Death (6/day) (Sp) As a standard action, touch heals 1d4+2 damage to a target at negative HP.
Saving Shield Whenever an adjacent ally is the target of an attack, you can, as an immediate action, grant that adjacent ally a +2 shield bonus to AC. You must be wielding a light shield, heavy shield, or tower shield to use this feat.

Grand Lodge

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In my experience it can be as simple as: "If the NPC keeps talking, it can be solved without combat". In a purely combatative encounter the only verbal interaction tends to be taunting, so the difference is rather profound when an NPC says "It doesn't need to be like this!". Also, if they encounter an unfriendly looking NPC and initiative is not called for, lots of players catch on quickly and try talking to it.

Sure, sometimes people immediately charge ahead but I find most players are hesitant about starting initiative of their own accord.

Also keep in mind that the only avenues for interaction skill-wise that are feasible in combat are bluff and intimidate, since diplomacy takes too long. If you wish to give opportunity for diplomacy, have the NPC hold back with a readied action to defend himself for a round or two, describing the fearful look in his eyes for example.

Most characters in prewritten scenarios are flat, so they have a motivation and some kind of quirk of personality ("I want to survive, because I need to protect my family" for example). If you give a glimpse of their motivation, and the PCs care enough to notice it doesn't conflict with their goals that much, they might just decide the guy doesn't have to die :)

Grand Lodge

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Where:
During our partys fight with black magga, when we were getting our respective derrieres handed to us, the four armed tiefling alchemist decided to bluff black magga (after finding out she was kind of a lamashtu mascot) by telling her that "this town is already scheduled to be sacrificed to lamashtu later". After a critical bluff for around 50, she left back to the lake very confused.

This was the same session where our wildshaped druid decided he would go save the little schoolgirls being washed downriver as a giant octopus. A lot of snickering was had


Also where:
during the trip upriver to turtleback ferry our druid, still as an octopus, convinced the random encounter giant snake to leave via empathy. The rest of the party figured the snake saw the tentacles and thought itself outnumbered.

And:
when Xanesha in skinsaw murders tried to get away by levitating down the clocktower and the heroic Summon Monster I pony of our conjurer was sent after her to kamikaze-airtackle her to death. Falling object rules indeed.

Grand Lodge

To be honest, I haven't encountered this that often (at least that I've noticed).

In rounds I play, generally people comment on others actions, remind about active modifiers, suggest tactical alternatives and such... maybe if you get one or two of your players to do that during others turns the others will follow?

Grand Lodge

Well, as mentioned above I don't think they need any food at all to survive. Seems all that necromantic energy is keeping them stuffed.

Although I think it is a perfectly fine houserule to give a ghoul some intelligence/wisdom penalty for, say, each year without food.

Grand Lodge

I would like some more information about when exactly they are doing this. Is it during combat or during exposition? When talking to NPCs?

If combat turns are taking a long time, then it is understandable (as in more than 2 minutes for someone), if during exposition I would find it very rude and if during talking even more so.

I think you would notice if they didn't pay attention though. The giveaways are generally that they don't know what they want to do on their turn, don't recall key points of information that were frequently repeated etc...