Nezz the White Necromancer's page

26 posts. Alias of Nezzmith.


I'd purchase the Faiths of Balance/Purity/Corruption pdfs.

They're a great look into the faiths of Golarion, and give you insight into the mentality of the faithful. Using the details they give, its easy to come up with some of your own personal prayers for your character's deity.

kenmckinney wrote:

The OP in this thread raises a good question.

Now, I'm no expert on Golarion, but my understanding is that as written, the evil religions in Golarion are essentially scams. They're terrible deals for the people who join them. They don't even , as far as I know, offer anything in terms of power that the good religions don't provide in the temporal world, and they end up consigning the souls of their adherents to torment.

I think that afterlife for devotees of evil gods should be attractive to the sort of person who likes to do evil. It would then make a lot more sense for worshippers of evil gods to be doing the things they do.


The Evil religions are scams? Hardly.

You get exactly the afterlife you paid for by following an Evil God.

Lamashtu's divine realm is an enormous landmass filled with every terrain her monstrous children lived in, in their mortal lives. Her petitioners get to spend an eternity fighting with each other for her affection, just as they did in life.

Urgathoa's realm is a limitless haunted city having a 24/7 'dead man's party.' If you served Urgathoa in life (and undeath) you probably hid away from other people and indulged yourself in all the food, drink, drugs, and warm body entertainment you could get. Then you are sent to her realm as a petitioner, and you get... more of the same, forever. A never-ending frat party.

Zon-Kuthon's followers also get exactly what they wanted. If pain and torture was your kink, well look no further.

From the background material, it seems the only people who lose when it comes to religiously following evil, are followers of Asmodeus and his Devils, and the Four Horsemen and their Daemons. Unless you're powerful enough, going to Hell likely means becoming a piece of masonry for a Devil's abode. And going to Abaddon, means becoming someone's lunch followed by true non-existence.

Obligatory questioning of if the Minor Deities will receive the same treatment or if print space will be filled by other articles?

F. Wesley Schneider wrote:
Say we went the cults route. Would you want to see entries be something more like my Mammon article in Pathfinder #30, something more like Sean's gods articles we do every few AP volumes, or something else completely?

I've purchased Adventure Path books I'll likely not get to play for a long long time, (My group progresses slowly) just so I could read the in-depth articles featured therein of Gods, Cities, and all the little trivia mixed in.

I'd say it's a safe decision to go that route, but I'm just one customer.

Fabius Maximus wrote:
I think that DrowVampyre's character would make a terrific BBEG for a campaign.

A Cleric of Urgathoa, (The Misandrist herself) moving about the land consuming small Erastil-aligned villages in fire and undeath?

So as my characters rapidly approach 18th level, it's time to wrap up this campaign. I decided to use a tried and true high level scenario related to Rovagug's possible release.

The driving force of this plot is a custom Nascent Demon Lord, who has gone completely insane from his constant defeats in the Abyss, and his inability to achieve true divinity. His fractured but still capable mind has come to the conclusion that existence is cyclical, and if he is able to release Rovagug from his prison, the Rough Beast will annihilate all of existence, which will then be remade again in time, including this Nascent Demon Lord who hopes to be more powerful in the next existence.

Instead of directly disturbing the gods themselves and risking a sound and quick destruction, he's traveled to Golarion on the Material Plane to hide amongst the lives of mortals, this has the added affect of allowing them to end him, permanently.

He and what minions he can acquire travel to each center of religious worship across the world, and disguise themselves in forms from divine assistants, to simple knowledge-seeking curates. He'll delve deep into any vaults or libraries of un/holy texts that describe the nature of each goddess or god's involvement in the sealing of the Rough Beast.

The players feel they need to warn every goddess and god, (even the evil ones) which came as a surprise and doubled the number of churches they need to travel to and warn.

So, all that said, I have a few questions and I'd love some input from the community and directors if they care to take a stab at answering:

Do all of the gods participate in the jailing of the Rough Beast, or only the ones who were present for the sealing?

If so, does that include the newly ascended gods or gods who were at one time mortal, such as Norgober, Iomedae, Cayden, Zyphus, Urgathoa?

Any ideas or defined parts of the prison that could be researched, besides Asmodeus, Sarenrae, and Zon-Kuthon's? What should Irori's be for example?

Unlike a previous thread, I'm not asking how the prison is broken. Simply who should be warned of such a danger when the gods themselves are stuck behind all the red tape that prevents them from directly acting in these situations. (I'm looking at you Desna)

Also, I'd love to hear ideas for what each deity's seal should be, as per the third question, and I'll probably need about 9-12 of them for how many different ones the party will learn of in their race to stop the Demon.

c873788 wrote:
I've never played a Necromancer and am curious about 1 thing. How do you guys get around the problem of having a cleric/oracle/paladin in your party that wants to spam positive channeling to keep the party alive in tough fights? Isn't this standard tactic going to make a mess of your undead minions?

Not at all.

When someone Channels Positive energy, they must decide if it's purpose is to heal the living, or harm the undead.

If the Channeler is attempting to heal the party, your zombies can just mingle about while it goes off, it has no effect on them, good or ill.

Channeling energy was established this way, to make sure the event you're describing never happens. Channeling energy would be far too powerful if you could both heal your allies and harm your enemies at the very same time.

As a co-DM for my current game, I have no character on the table, but our most popular character, is a former Pharasmin Priest turned heretic, and then became a Cleric of Zyphus.

When the character worshiped Pharasma, he was the group's confidant, listening to their woes and their concerns, even if he didn't have much to reply with. As the campaign wore on, he grew less distant, and opened up more, revealing he agreed to accompany the group on behalf of his church, to protect his family from the predations of Urgathoa's minions who had just finished erecting a nearby grand temple/feast hall.

Having lost exactly what he was fighting for, the character broke down and became a man without guilt nor empathy.

As a cleric of Zyphus, his role of confidant has become it's own monster. When the rest of the party confides in him about their worries or fears, he feeds their paranoia and expresses similar concerns, often driving the other party members to act irrationally. Schadenfreude is his humor, and irony his preferred method of dispatching foes. He's become obsessed with turning everyday objects into minor hazards, and never hesitates to remind people how easy it is to harm themselves with a handheld item should they slip or tumble with it. He took up the violin in order to play his very own funeral dirge which he plays while formulating his methods for causing the death of any particular individual.

Instead of purging the undead, he has become obsessed with asking them questions associated with the manner in which they died, (If they are intelligent) or luring them into positions where they might cause harm. (Such as a single zombie into a dairy where it murdered all the livestock.)

The rest of the party were bluffed into believing his current actions are just a result of his loss or "PTSD." They think he may return to his old self after he "accepts" he had no way to prevent the deaths of his wife and child.

The Cleric is Neutral Evil now, same as his deity, for obvious reasons.

As a result of this character, Zyphus the Grim Harvestman has received a lot of interest at my table which keeps me on the lookout for information on this Minor God for this character's use.

donato wrote:
When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all.

This familiar quote is exactly spot on.

If the Gods wanted to do everything themselves, their worshipers would be obsolete.

Level 5 PC not prepared for two Shadows?

Yeah, unless you got the drop on the Shadows and knew you were going to be fighting them and prepared for it, then you would have stood a chance. I'm surprised only one character died.

Tels wrote:

Wow, dude thinks he's doing the right thing to protect his family, but his family dies. Turns evil and proceeds to become one of the darkest aspects of his faith, channeling dark powers that most could only dream of (nightmare or otherwise). Universally feared by the good and non-evil religious figures and viewed as a curse by his former comrades.

Darth Vader much?

While Darth Vader is one of the more famous cases of a 'Fallen Character' he's not the only one, and hopefully others might be able to chime in with their own characters.

Because "Falling" is a possible repercussion of not following the tenants of a character's deity, there's numerous ways to play out the act. I wanted the true Golarion experience for my players, so I took suggestions and did my best to fit them into our game. They were well received, so I'm grateful for the imput from everyone.

As for the character "Brother Dirge" he's merely a level 12 Cleric now, and only known by a small portion of the Inner Sea. Its not every day that heroes abandon their faith after serving it for so long, but it does happen and explains the existence of the Huecuva.


The Cleric was healed, and during the day he spent unconscious he subconsciously promised his soul to the Grim Harvestman in return for power.

Where a Champion of Pharasma once stood, a bastion against evil and undeath now stands the pale shadow of a man, an Undead Lord of Zyphus.

The Cleric once again rides beside his party, using methods known only to him to tend to their wounds and heal their maladies.

His former Nosoi on-and-off messenger has been replaced with three Allips, each of them a former grieving widow who took her own life in a short bout of insanity after the Cleric was able to speak to her privately and draw out her suffering. He whispered words like poisoned honey to each of these women, reminding them of all they had lost, and how they would never be the same. After they poisoned or hung themselves and rose as Allips, they were drawn to him, and now he uses ample amounts of Control Undead to whisper sweet nothings to them, acting as though he were the former husband of each individual Allip, securing their loyalty and using their wisdom draining powers as weapons against his enemies.

To the Church of Pharasma, his name has become synonymous with a curse, and the mention of it causes some members to draw the spiral on their chest in response. To the other faiths he is an ill omen, and to the insidious cultists of Zyphus, he is 'Brother Dirge' a powerful wandering servant who can be identified for the funeral marches he plays upon his violin.

Well, that's all for this fallen Cleric, though his story is still continuing that's all that can be said for his betrayal of the Goddess.

Feel free to discuss or use a similar concept, or just plain rip 'Brother Dirge' right from these pages, he really does deserve someone to put him out of his happily-sick misery.

Also, to keep with the original theme of the thread, how would you have handled such a turn of events differently?

Ahh well, seems like I need to wrap this up, sorry for keeping you all waiting!

Well, from where I left off, here's what happened over the next few sessions: (Keep in mind, it might not seem like much, but that's because game-time was shared between the Ex-Cleric and the rest of his party while they were separated.)

After the burning of the warehouse, the Cleric returned to his party and explained that he needed to perform a penance beneath the city in the crypts and catacombs below, to regain his spells. He would do this alone and asked that they remain in town for the duration, which they agreed.

The Cleric sought and gained work as a hired back in the various crews that undertook the construction of canals and other public works, which gave him access to maps and plans of the city and it's underground waterways. These maps pinpointed areas of interest to him, vaults and crypts alike. He chose to make the abandoned Abadarian-vault beneath the city marketplace his new abode from which he would hide from his Pharasmin pursuer.

Having no spells of his own, he emptied the rest of his share of wealth into various materials and magical items. Wands, a Magical rod, a Lyre of Building, some potions, and enough lumber and tools to construct a small ship. Bluffing well enough to the merchants, he convinced them he wanted to open a shop of his own, in time for 'Market's Door' which would occur at the start of the next week. Making his way down into the vault, he fought off the vermin that had taken residence inside, and began to move his materials inside.

The Pharasmin Inquisitor, furious with righteous anger over the loss of his trusted retinue, turned to other means of locating the former cleric and began seeking aid through warning the few faiths based in the town about the Heretic.

During the week, the Cleric used his borrowed Lyre of Building, and constructed scaffolding all throughout his vault, reinforcing the ancient stone walls with wood of all kinds of quality. During one particular night, as he worked his carpentry skills, he was visited by an unexpected presence. Fearing he had been discovered too soon, the demanded the cloaked stranger reveal himself and his intentions. The figure bowed its head in greeting, and stepped somewhat into the light, allowing the Cleric to see that it was in fact a wraith (Knowledge Religion) with qualities that allowed it to pass as a living human from afar in the shadow.

The Wraith introduced itself as a messenger from Blackfingers, and explained that it was sent to bid him welcome into the Church of Norgorber, an offer that would only be extended once, and only for a short time, as Norgorber has no interest in the indecisive and cowardly.

The Cleric, responded that he had little time to consider such an offer, as he was preparing to slay a pursuer from his former church who could possibly strike at any moment. The Wraith seemed unphased by this answer, replying that every moment he spent worrying about his own preparedness, the Inquisitor was at an advantage. The Cleric considered this for a short while, finally deciding on a plan. He asked the Wraith to remain in a known Mausoleum in the city's graveyard, and wait for him to make an appearance. He would strike down his pursuer, and offer the unconscious man to the Wraith as a sign of loyalty to Blackfingers. The Wraith accepted this proposal, and left, allowing the Cleric to finish his final work in the Vault.

During the weekend before Market's Door, the Cleric disguised himself and set about causing mayhem from the shadows, using his wands of Grease, Ghost Sound, and Cause Fear to great effect. There were no fatalities until a use of Cause Fear on some idle carriage horses caused the beasts to trample several people down a busy street killing a young man and a older woman.

What the Cleric's player did next caused a lot of shivers down his fellow player's (And the DM's) spines.

The Cleric attended the funerals, passing as a mourner for the older woman. He sat amongst the rest of her friends and relatives, and quietly soaked in the somber and depressing mood of those attending. The Cleric remembered his own grief and pain, but now as he listened to the others around him- howling with anger at the powers that be- he began to feel a different sensation. The moaning of children, and the wailing of siblings set his stomach on high, and he could hardly contain his mirth at their misfortune. As the funerals went on, he felt invigorated as others fell into depression and angst. Their sobbing was his music, and their tears of sorrow were mirrored by his of joy. He quietly relished the atmosphere from the back of the congregation, until he noticed the Pharasmin Inquisitor was also in attendance, and had just begun to notice the fidgeting cleric and stare.

The Cleric took note of the sun's position in the sky, and then quietly removed himself from the service, still shaking as he tried to appear overwhelmed with grief. He wandered over and entered the large Mausoleum knowing the Inquisitor would follow and hurried down the steps into the main chamber.

Once inside, he found the Wraith waiting in the darkness, and asked that it merely observe. It said nothing and simply floated slightly to the left of the Cleric, and watched as he grabbed a potion from his belt and readied himself to drink it. Sure enough, the Inquisitor cast a long shadow as he entered the room and drew his sword. The Cleric called out into the chamber a mocking challenge to the Inquisitor, claiming that the shadows would hide him from the Inquisitor's sight so he could give him the peace of death.

The Inquisitor paused for only a moment, before replying that if that be the case, he would banish the shadows. He cast Daylight on his weapon and immediately filled the room with a blinding light. With the entire room filled with light as though the ceiling were open sky, the Inquisitor had only one thing before him: An undead wraith, seemingly frozen in terror and awe. The Inquisitor cried out a prayer to Pharasma and set himself to destroying the hated creature. The wraith was at a complete disadvantage, and was obliterated with a final casting of Searing Light.

The Cleric meanwhile, watched the fight and took mental notes while invisible and exited the Mausoleum to hurry back to his vault and set up his final preparations. The Inquisitor knew the undead was not his quarry, and believing that the Wraith was a pitiful assassin to be used against him, quickly left the graveyard to seek Scrying so he could locate the heretic and slay him once and for all.

In the early hours of the morning on Market's Door, the Inquisitor finally was able to Scry the position of the Cleric, who had been in prayer deep within his vault. (And choosing to fail his Will Save when Scry'd upon)

The Inquisitor prepared himself, and gathered all of his belongings, and prayed to Pharasma that this battle would not be his last but he would accept any fate she gave him. He then made his way to the city Market which had begun to see tents raised and traders prepare their wares while shoppers took to the streets. At the back of the old Church of Abadar (Now refurbished as a farmer's market) he found the doorway down into the vault below.

As he entered the enormous vault complete with arched ceilings, the Cleric began to monologue, congratulating the Inquisitor on his sheer perseverance, even after losing so much and possibly his own life. The Inquisitor answered by reciting the heretic's crimes, and by the power given to him by the divine majesty of the Lady of Graves, he will be given to her for judgement for his eternal afterlife.

The Cleric guffawed mockingly, and drew his own sword, calling the "Greying One" to meet him in battle. The two converged and began a sword fight of dizzying speed, with the Inquisitor attempting to use offensive spells at first until he realized the Cleric's saves were too great, and hardly one spell had an effect on him.

The fight continued, with the Inquisitor healing himself and the Cleric drinking a single healing potion, but despite the Cleric's level advantage (11 vs 7) and the quality of his armor, he was beginning to be worn down slowly. As the two continued to fight, scaffolding began to collapse around them and the very room itself seemed to quake. The Cleric took this time to shout corrupted alterations of Pharasmin codes and sayings, all of which seemed to only spur the Inquisitor to fight harder.

In the last moment, the Cleric swung too high, and the Inquisitor ran him through with his sword, letting the Cleric stumble backward in shock. The Cleric managed to squeak out another laugh, falling to a knee, and spitting blood on the dusty floor.

The Inquisitor approached as the Cleric slowly stood to his feet and dropped his own weapon. The Cleric raised his hands upward and called out between a cough of blood, "If this is as the Goddess wills, let it be known!"

On the street above them, Market's Door had come into full swing, and the sheer traffic of bodies and carts full of heavy goods had begun to clog and crowd the Marketplace. Just a few feet beneath them, the keystones that held up the arched ceiling of the Vault had been replaced with fragile wooden copies, which now under the strain and weight of the majority of the town, began to explode and snap from the pressure. The streets of the Marketplace began to buckle and suddenly the heaviest of the traffic began to fall into the earth, as though a sinkhole had opened beneath them.

The Inquisitor below raised his ceremonial dagger to preform a 'Coup de grâce' on the Cleric, when the ceiling above him ripped into sound and motion and several tons in the form of pieces of the stone ceiling and the screaming crowds of Market's Door fell into the room upon him, crushing him instantly and burying the Cleric as well. Reduced to below zero hitpoints, the Cleric fell unconscious with his last thoughts being a mixture of terror and victory, and a voice unlike his own entered his head, expressing its delight at his performance.

The Cleric was dug out from the rubble by his dwarven party member, who quickly took him to where he could be healed.

I feel the same way as the OP, but towards the Minor Deities, instead of the Major ones.

While the Major Gods have the books, and an article in the APs, the Minor gods instead just have a short paragraph.

Three of my five players worship minor deities, which forces me to take my own spin on the lesser gods and take notes so I don't contradict myself in the future on their behavior or views.

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My goodness, I had nearly forgotten about my thread, and yes I believe an update is in order:

Lets see, as Set pointed out, the Cleric's rash and hasty murder did not earn him any sort of powers. As a matter of fact, he had to spend a total of two sessions without any powers at all, except a wand of cure moderate wounds he had created earlier.

The player was very enthusiastic about roleplaying this new path for the character, and though we expected him to lose interest in his cleric (He had no spells or supernatural abilities!) he instead surprised us in the best of ways.

So as it turns out, the Cleric and the Party are making their way out of town post haste as their business here was done. On their way out, the Cleric began his horrible descent.

He held up the party when they came upon a trader with his cart heading into town. The Cleric told the man he was willing to sell his entire ensemble to him for a fraction of the cost. The Cleric was wearing armor and appropriate dress for the area, all Mastercrafted and Magical. The Cleric then distracted the man with idle conversation and did a weak slight-of-hand to swap the Trader's holy symbol with a trinket he had picked up in the Temple of Urgathoa. The trader by the end of their transaction had switched out of his dull brown clothes and into his new outfit. The Cleric gave the man his hat for free, and set off after his party thanking the Trader for filling his purse.

An Inquisitor and his retinue was summoned, and arrived to inspect the crime scene the next morning. They got their information, and getting tips from the locals, they were directed towards one of the city's gates where they came across the trader just outside. His clothing identified, the Trader had crossbows trained on him. The simple traveler panicked and swore he was not the man they were after, and attempted to pull out his holy symbol of Abadar, and instead held out the moth of Urgathoa to the Inquisitor's guards. He received five crossbow bolts to the chest for his error and died at the scene.

After several days of travel, the party made their way wearily into the next town, and immediately the Cleric set off to do shopping, while letting his fellows settle in the inn. His first act was to use his trained linguistics skill to forge a receipt which allowed him to take several barrels of lamp oil meant for a church, and direct it to a small dock warehouse. Following the forgery, he then bought a small keg of gunpowder, and several flasks of alchemists' fire. Then a large amount of wooden lumber and a small table and chair along with some tools. Using his Profession: Carpentry (He used to build coffins) he worked in the small dock warehouse and prepared it as he saw fit. Then upon finishing, met with his party mates at the local tavern.

While his party mates toasted their successes, he paid a local a several gold sum and told him of suspicious activity going on in the dock warehouse, and that it should be passed onto an authority figure.

The Inquisitor and his men road into town that night, and stopped by the tavern. The Cleric watched from the other side of the room, disguised by another party member who was now asleep at the inn. The Cleric nodded towards his commoner help, and the commoner made his way to the Inquisitor and explained just as he had been told to do. The Inquisitor, getting on in his years but not a fool, decided to forcibly take the commoner with him and his retinue to the warehouse to test his honesty.

Drawing their swords and lighting torches, (The inside of the warehouse was extremely dark) the Inquisitor and the six other men entered the building and slowly made their way to the center, where the chair and table were set up, upon which were a small pile of books, a lantern and a mess of parchment which had hastily scribbled, but apparent blueprints.

The Inquisitor and one of his guards attempted to decipher the blueprint, (Which had been written in a foreign language via linguistics) while the frightened commoner asked for a torch and was denied. Not content to be without a light source of his own, the commoner requested one of the guards apply his torch to the unlit lantern on the desk which he would use.

The guard obliged and lit the wick of the lantern, which quickly hissed and sparked, a disguised fuse. All but the Inquisitor froze as the fuse burned down through the inside of the false-bottomed lantern and through a hole in the table to the makeshift explosive attached on the underside. The gunpowder ignited and exploded, sending the shattered flaming flasks of alchemists' fire in all directions which quickly lit the rest of the building on fire, as everything wooden inside the warehouse had been coated with the lamp oil to help it quickly burn.

Only the inquisitor escaped with his life as the others were engulfed in the flame before they could act, and perished. The Other GM thinks that for his superb use of his skills and clever plan, he should be allowed a small bit of favor with the deity he is trying to court. I'm split both ways, and kinda just want to see if he can pull off another trick like this.

What do you think?

ElCrabofAnger wrote:

To be honest, I can kinda see the character's point. Not that the response was warranted (the high priest can only do what Pharasma allows, so murdering him...not so good), but if the safety of this character's family was the main motive, I'd be more than a little peeved (as a player) to be told that my spouse and child had been killed. ("When were they killed, your Grace?" "Oh, they were killed by daemons while you were away fighting daemons. But don't worry, they're in Pharasma's hands now, so it's all good.") To have this happen in real life would quite likely drive me out of my mind.

Oh yes, it does sound like the proper response, and don't get me wrong, we aren't upset at the player for making it. What was going to become a small end to a paragraph has become it's very own chapter.

ElCrabofAnger wrote:

Out of curiosity, did you not see this coming at all? This seems like a very likely result of what you were trying to plan. Also, Pharasma not rewarding this guy with the resurrection of his family seems like a Class A ****** behavior to me.

Oh not really, but don't worry we've already spoken at length with the PC's player and there are no hard feelings, in fact he's eager to see how his actions are received, and hopes that the nature of the High Priest's death, (A case of mistaken identity that lead to an accidental murder of a good person) will spur the divine patron he wants into defending him and granting him power again.

As for, behavior on part of the Gods, while a Goddess like Desna may launch a crusade into the Abyss to save a favored soul, Pharasma has always appeared stoic and adhered to her divine task. She sees a lot of people get unfairly slain and very few get the sort of 'second chance' that a lot of souls probably desire. We feel that to a mortal that doesn't understand, it would appear as though she might be holding out on them, when the reality is that she just knows better, like a parent refusing to grant a child a favor.

The reason I ask if Pharasma herself would act at all in this situation, is that the book 'Faiths of Balance' specifically mentions that killing a Psychopomp of Pharasma is a forbidden act to members of the church. While the Psychopomp obviously simply returned to the Boneyard, it witnessed the cruelty and vileness of the former Cleric when he purposefully named it a Devil, knowing full well what it really was.

Abraham spalding wrote:

Heck it's not like he turned them into undead and she is a neutral goddess of fate and death no less.

Could be this is all playing out according to her plan.

I appreciate a point of view on the other side, but our intention was to test the Cleric with the loss of his NPC family in order to give him a boon for staying true to the faith. We expected him to be upset, (As his family's safety was his main motive for leaving to find the threat) but instead of getting some 'inner reflection time' we got 'Birth of a Supervillain.'

The Psychopomp's remains only hung around for cinematic purposes, and they evaporated as soon as the Cleric was leaving the room.

The only thing I'm trying to gauge is if this event was enough to rouse Pharasma's wrath, (Or any god's for that matter) or if they don't pay attention to such things and let their followers deal with the problems.

Of course, the Church will be able to use 'Speak with Dead' to determine who attacked the High Priest which they left on the floor in his office deep within the church.

Also I think it would be within character for one of the members of the church to have a Nosoi as a familiar, and use it to inform other Churches about the attack.

Currently the Cleric lost all his granted powers and his fingernails continually bleed as a mark of his actions.

As for the rest, I'm still unsure what level of punishment should be levied against the party.

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Sure it seems like a simple enough question, but then every faith is prepared to defend itself or attack outsiders, but what happens when the High Priest condems the faith he has so long adhered to?

I'm the Co-DM for our game and we have a situation thst spiraled out of control with a Cleric of Pharasma.

A little background, the party had just finished cleansing a new temple to Urgathoa and defeated some powerful daemonic fiends that resided within. Upon returning to town and being hailed as heroes, (They left at level 4 and returned at level 11), the Cleric, who belonged to the local Pharasmin Church is taken aside and calmly informed that his wife and only child were slain while he was gone.

Resurrection was not within the party's means, so the Cleric and his party traveled to the Church to plead for them to be brought back. The Head Priest denied the request, stating that they were serving beside the Goddess now and it would be selfish and wrong to bring them back.

The Cleric's resolve broke here and he snapped. He took his party aside and lied to them, telling them that the High Priest was a fiend, masquerading as the former Priest, and that he was likely behind the Cleric's family's deaths, as retaliation for their destruction of the temple.

The party's new method when dealing with fiends is to 'shoot first, ask questions later.' The High Priest made his Sense Motive Check, and realized he was in danger. He summoned a Vanth Psychopomp, which was misidentified as a Bone Devil and both the priest and the Psychopomp were cut down with extreme prejudice.

While the Party left congratulating themselves, the Cleric took the femur, mask, and a rib bone from the psychopomp's remains and fashioned it into a crude Pick, returning his Ceremonial Dagger to the High Priest's corpse, and left muttering about 'if such is the destiny of heroes, he'd rather leave his life up to chance.'

Now, following this situation, what is the proper response for Pharasma, and her Church?

I'd love to know if this event would be noteworthy at all.

Aspiring Agent of the Grave here.

Worship to which gods or goddesses would look best on an application for employment in the Way? Besides Urgathoa of course.

submit2me wrote:
I don't think this is all that diverse, actually. As far as Good versus Evil, you are all either Good or Neutral.

The DM doesn't allow for outright Evil characters, so Neutral is as far down the rabbit hole of pragmatism that the PC's are allowed to start as.

Mind you, this is just for the first level. The Cleric and Fighter will likely end up as Evil, and use a lot of "Undetectable Alignment" spells and other such coverups, as each character is supposed to start with a "Goal" which corresponds to their Deity's desires.

So the Sarenrae Cleric could be, "Save 1000 innocent souls from dying." While the Zyphus Cleric would have, "Ensure that 1000 innocent souls die."

Which do you believe is better and why?

It just so happens my latest party has finally finished their campaign. The group is made of avid roleplayers, and everyone takes their roles and background seriously in relation to the plot. We had a good run with our former group and it finally became time to retire them, afterwards we discussed what we enjoyed and what we felt was missing, and surprisingly enough we all had a complaint, not with the DM, but instead with ourselves.

Our party was made up of Neutral Good and Lawful Good characters, five in total and there were three gods split amongst the five. The characters for all intents and purposes treated each other as siblings and family, and there was never any sense of resentment between them, prefering to come to an agreement quickly so that action was followed up against threats.

The characters never needed to mature, and so the lack of arguments at the table made leveling quick and easy.

This has lead us to deciding to create a very diverse group, and attempting to make it work without bending the background of Golarion too much, preferably very little.

We now have:

A Lawful Neutral Wizard of Abadar
A Neutral Good Cleric of Sarenrae
A Lawful Neutral Fighter of Asmodeus. (Hellknight in the making)
A Chaotic Good Rogue of Cayden
A True Neutral Cleric of Zyphus

Are we in over our heads here, or is such a group possible to form?

Id like to test the waters with your experiences before I jump into this pool.

What do you think of Diverse groups, and would you recommend them, why or why not?

I know the book is about Daemons and their Horseman lords, but will the book perhaps have any information on the other powerful denizens of Abbadon, such as Urgathoa and Zyphus?

Just an innocent inquiry.

Rats Archive wrote:
While we're giving out product advice, don't forget that the second kingmaker adventure has rules on building a whole nation, including cities.

Oh really? That would be undoubtedly helpful in this! I'll purchase a copy right away, Paizo wins my dollar again.

ciretose wrote:

The leadership feat.

Done and done.

While I am familiar with that feat, my GM prefers to play thoroughly and doesn't hand his players anything without having them put forth at the least a small bit of effort to acquire it.

i.e. A full wagon-train of well-stocked and provisioned idealists won't catch up to the party during a journey and say "We heard about your cleric..."

Leadership will, at the least give him a level 4/5 Aristocrat/Cleric for a Mayor/Church leader he can trust and count on. (Cohort)

After that, he needs to do (some) bookkeeping, for our GM to tell him how long it would take to gather the resources and the time/costs for building the settlement one building at a time.

While the NPCs are capable of interacting with each other, he's the "Leader" for a reason to my GM.

Well me and my GM are a little unsure of how to progress here.

The Cleric in our party just inherited a small fortune in gold and jewels from distant relatives who were murdered and happened to be successful merchants. While we tracked down and banished the fiend behind the merchant family's deaths, our Cleric was thinking of what he would do with his new wealth.

While the GM expected him to go on a shopping spree, (His magic gear is just table-scraps compared to the rest of the party's feast) he surprised us all by coming forth and telling the GM he wanted to use the wealth to create a self-sufficient community with a chapel to his god at the center. Our poor GM while not new to Pathfinder, confided in me that the math involved in building a settlement or even just a building, is a lot of bookkeeping he wasn't expecting to take on. We talked it over and agreed that being the founder and leader of a small gated community at level 6 is quite possible so long as it's not treated as a footnote in the character's story.

So I've come here for advice to help my buddy the GM out and I'd like some ideas and advice as to the following:

What kind of incentives can a PC give to NPCs to convince them to move to an unsettled area and begin a community?

Is there anywhere that relative costs are listed or can be calculated for the time and construction of buildings and structures via skilled laborers/craftsman experts and their needs?

Assuming that he intends to keep adventuring and leave the hamlet/community to fend for itself, what kind of defenses both marital, trap-like, and magical should he give it?

Assuming he intends to use the Common Laws of the country it's created in, how would he go about establishing his community as a legitimate settlement to other NPC towns/cities? Any special NPCs he should hire or entice?

Thank you for any advice you can give, and any responses given!