Bear trap

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My group encountered an evil wizard and we struck first. The druid of the group cast Baleful Polymorph on him and he Failed his Fort save, but passed his will save.

The evil wizard effectively turned into a frog, but retained his spells, mind, and ability.

My question is this: Druids have to take feats to be able to cast spells in animal form, so it stands to reason that the evil wizard can't cast spells while he is "Frogged."

If you turn an enemy wizard into an animal and he passes the will save but fails the fort save is he totally dependent upon someone else to transform him back into a humanoid to be able to cast? Or can he still cast as an animal despite not having Natural Spell?


Do your players have epic perception scores? Rolls of 35+

When a player walks into a room, does he/she demand a perception check upon entry to see everything in the room?

"What do you mean there is an invisible monster standing in the room, my 35 perception roll should have made me fully aware of the monster. I want to attack the monster's square."

Personally I am of the opinion that if there is some sort of invisible creature, the players simply don't get a perception roll until the monster has done something.

Sure if the monster is moving around, doing some sort of activity they should get a roll, but not if the monster is just standing still in the room waiting to attack the players.

Anyone else agree with this or am I being too harsh?


I am just curious if there has been any errata on the number of non-natural attacks an eidolon gets per round, or is it still one per held weapon in an arm?

Given that an eidolon is only limited with respect to the number of natural attacks he can deliver, and that every other attack is made at the eidolon's highest attack bonus. I was just curious if a pouncing Quadruped with a ton of (insert 1 handed weapon and appropriate feats) in his hands was still as broken as it once was, or did pathfinder finally change it?

As max attacks only accounts for natural attacks I have seen players try to argue that they attack with every held weapon, and then drop some to attack with claw attacks upon completion of a full round action. Though I would never allow this in a game I ran, it does seem odd to just limit the natural attacks and not limit the total attacks.


I have forbidden my players to be evil in my campaign.

One of my players got nailed with the insanity spell, he was a monk, and fairly powerful. One player who he attacked thought that the best course of action would be to Baleful Polymorph him into a frog.

He failed both saves..........

How does he get turned back?
When he comes back did his mind return?
I would definitely call the act Evil.

The person who cast Baleful Polymorph now wants to keep the frog as a pet............damn Druids........


In general, I have no problem allowing a player to play a character or race that they want to play, hell I even have a player playing as a half dragon. But I think Pixie is where I will draw the line.

The idea of a player being invisible by default and being able to attack while invisible isn't so bad.

The idea that a player has the ability to cast the following spells 16-20 times per day is freaking terrifying:

Charm: The target must succeed on a DC 15 Will save or be affected as though by a charm monster spell for 10 minutes.

Memory Loss: The target must succeed on a DC 15 Will save or be affected by a modify memory spell (this effect can only eliminate the previous 5 minutes of memory—a pixie typically uses this ability to make the target forget it encountered the pixie so it won't chase the pixie when he flees).

Sleep: The target must succeed on a DC 15 Will save or fall asleep for 5 minutes.

In addition there are the spell like abilities that they get each day.

To quote a horse. "No sir, I don't like it.


So..........one of the players in my campaign just died, and the evil member of the group took his corpse for safe keeping for a few days because the group trusted him with it until they could resurrect it. He knew the spell gentle repose.

Well one Frankenstein's monster night later and I am not sure what to do. The body was given the arms of a minotaur, the tail of a lizard, gills, legs and feet of a merfolk. If they bring this thing back to life with a resurrect spell......I am tempted to just have it start screaming until it dies.

Assuming that I allow this "creature" to do more than scream until he dies, I have no idea what stats to give him as he is certainly not just an elf anymore.

Any thoughts?


So I bought a Pathfinder module called "Hungry Are The Dead." The adventure starts with a creature called Bloody Bones.

It is an aquatic undead with 4 tentacle attacks and a claw attack. My confusion is this, as written the creature has both 1 claw attack and rend....

Should I just assume that the creature has more than one claw attack? Or that each tentacle has 1 claw on it? How should this be played?


This came up in another thread and I am curious about everyone's thoughts.

If you can't read the language that the runes are written in, can you be hit by the rune spell?

Does this make illiterate barbarians immune to all rune spells?

Are there any rulings on this or is this so obscure that nobody has ever asked it?


and we played our first game at level 7, with appropriate gear for that level.

The DM put us in an open field 115 feet away from the bad guys and started combat. I took a step forward and one shotted the Giant who was throwing boulders at us.

My question is, if the DM starts giving every bad guy access to wind wall and Snatch arrows, is there any way around it short of having the group dispel the wind wall or peppering the arrow deflecting target with multiple arrows one and having one arrow per round always be negated?

I realize that I have the advantage in that they must have a free hand to use the snatch arrow feat, but are there any further precautions that I can take to avoid having my arrows harmlessly knocked away?


The Eidolon evolution for pounce states (Paraphrasing):

The eidolon performs a charge action and attacks with everything.

The Beastiary Version of pounce states that the creature who uses pounce can also use the rake ability. Meaning that if a cat with 2 claws and a bite has 2 rake attacks he can attack a total of 5 times.

I am of the opinion that you can't pick and choose the best and worst abilities for a given action, it is all or nothing, so despite the eidolon version of pounce not mentioning it, you should be able to make the rake attacks.

Are there any other opinions on this?


When a player is playing a druid, and can turn into an elemental, how do you make an underground dungeon non-trivial other than saying, "No you can't move from room to room in a stone form because I said so."

I have always been of the opinion that the game breaks past level 4-5 for this type of a reason. Druids wanting to turn into a bird and fly in the vaulted ceilings of a dungeon to cast down spells on whatever they find, staying just out of reach. Players buying adamantite weaponry to bust through walls of a dungeon making short cuts.

At least with the adamantite hammer I can say things like, that is a load bearing wall, smash it and you will cause a cave in.

I am just not sure how to deal with the whole, let's send a druid in to scout, and then use shape stone to tunnel toward the end of the dungeon. Any suggestions?


I am about to play in a game where I am an archer.

I have the opportunity to buy my gear and fine tune it.

The current weapon I am using is a +2 Composite Long bow (+4 Str).

I also have the opportunity to buy a Quiver of Plenty for 1,500g and Upgrade it to a +2, selecting the pre-requisite +1 enhancement and then the +1 Holy Enhancement.

If I fire my arrow from by bow, does my hit count (as +1 and holy) or (+2 and holy?). I am fairly certain that it would not be +3 and holy because that seems to violate stacking, but +2 and holy actually does seem reasonable.

Any opinions?


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I was running my game this weekend and the party happened upon some slavers. The slavers were dispatched with little incident, but one of the slavers was left alive. The player who has a character history of being a slave began his interrogation and questioned the slaver as to where he was taking the slaves.

(I had not planned on this.)

As I struggled for an answer, I blurted out "Bartertown". The player got a smirk on his face as he asked "And who run Bartertown?"

I said.........."Master Blaster runs Bartertown."

So now I am getting ready to design a dungeon and a boss. I was thinking a troll Fighter with a gnome caster strapped to his back. This should be fun.


I was just curious if anyone had an optimized build for a Zen Archer.

Normally I don't think of archery as the best way to do damage, but I have seen some decent theory on how to do it.

So my question is...

If you were to build a new level 7 Zen Archer with appropriate gear for that level, how would you do it?

I am limited to core races and Pathfinder materials, any advice would be greatly appreciated.


Are there any rules that prevent a Cohort from taking leadership?
Prerequisite: Character level 7th.

If I am a level 12 Sorcerer with a 22 Cha.

My Leadership score will be 12+6+6
My Cohort will be a level 10.
I will have 15 first level followers and 1 second level follower.
(17 new party members)

My level 10 Cohort will also take Leadership.
His Cohort will be level 8.
Conservatively his Leadership score will be 10+2
My Cohort will have 8 level 1 followers.
(10 new party members)

The Level 8 Cohort will take leadership to obtain a level 6 cohort.
He will have no followers.
(1 new party member)

I see this as the most useful feat in D&D and Pathfinder, also the most broken. One feat that instantly makes one a party unto himself. As a DM I wouldn't allow it in my campaign, because if you allow a player to take it, then the cohort should also be allowed to take it. The domino effect is devastating.

Any thoughts?


My DM took the nerf bat to my character for the 5th time today and so I retired the character, have been .

I am wanting to play a caster, but have been told that I am not allowed to play a Sorcerer or a Magus.

I would prefer to be able to do spell damage because the group already has a front line tank, and a ranger.

Are there any suggestions of which caster class to play that would be good?

I am hesitant to pick a druid because my DM has said "Animal companions and Eidolons can not take the Improved Natural Weapon Feat because it is in the Monster Manual."
(This was the straw that made me retire my old character.)


I can remember when the text said that any time your movement is hampered or you are encumbered you will lose your wisdom bonus to AC, but I can't seem to find that text anymore.

As a DM, I can't justify a monk getting his full AC bonus when he is partially covered in the equivalent of hardened Plaster of Paris, and has his base movement speed hampered as well.

Am I just being a stickler for the old 3.5 rules or does a rule like that actually exist in Pathfinder?


Lately my DM has been reading a lot game mechanics as RAW. For instance, he forces me to roll handle animal every time my summoned monster attacks or takes damage to determine if the Summoned animal runs away.

I have 3 questions.

1. Since the planes that you summon creatures from are infinitely large, can you just say "I summon an earth elemental that speaks common, the plane of earth is huge so there has to be at least one earth elemental that speaks common." to take care of the language barrier?

2. If the summoned creature attacks your opponents to the best of its abilities as soon as it comes into play, does it automatically know who the bad guys are? As opposed to spending the next few rounds to determine who is friend and foe.

If the creature does know friend from foe, does this mean that in times of non-combat can I summon a creature to determine if someone is hostile toward me?

3. How many tricks does a summoned monster know so that you don't have to make DC 25 handle animal checks to get the animal to attack?

Below is the text for the Summon Monster Spell

Summon Monster Text

This spell summons an extraplanar creature (typically an outsider, elemental, or magical beast native to another plane). It appears where you designate and acts immediately, on your turn. It attacks your opponents to the best of its ability. If you can communicate with the creature, you can direct it not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions. The spell conjures one of the creatures from the 1st Level list on Table: Summon Monster. You choose which kind of creature to summon, and you can choose a different one each time you cast the spell.


In the campaign that I am playing in, one of the party members is in charge of keeping track of group loot. She carefully divides the loot into shares appropriate for the size of our party but she has neglected to tell the rest of us that we have a share of gold coming to us.

When confronted about this, she has stated "WELL I TOLD ALL OF YOU HOW MUCH GOLD I GAVE YOU ALL SO IF YOU DON'T PAY ATTENTION WHEN I TALK THEN YOU ARE AT A LOSS." I am not sure whether she was yelling or just loud but when asked how much gold she has on her character she has stated, "It isn't fair to compare my gold to yours because I have bought a number of potions, wands, and other items."

We have been playing these characters since level 1, and we are currently level 5. Apart from starting equipment my inventory consists of a masterwork set of studded leather armor and an amulet of natural armor +1 and 111 gold.

Any advice on how to fix this problem? The DM has taken a hard line of hate vs my character stating that if a level 5 eidolon hits someone for ~45 damage in one round he doesn't need magic items.

(Any advice other than find a new group?)


A few of my players have requested to play ECL characters.

Example. Player 1: 1/2 Minotaur +1 Level
1/2 Dragon +2 Level
3.5 Feral +1 Level

I am inclined to let the player play his character due to the simple fact that all I really need to do is land one good hit. As the campaign is starting at level 1, he will essentially be stuck with 1 hit die until he hits level 6. His ability scores and natural armor will be off the charts, but magic missile doesn't pay that much attention to armor class.

Perhaps later on he will want to add WereBear for a +4 Level.

Anyone have any thoughts on this?


In the game that I am currently playing in, every player is level 5.

At level 5 we are supposed to have 10,500 gold worth of items.

Each player currently has 1/10 of what we should have as level 5 characters. It has gotten so bad that the cleric refuses to memorize any restoration spells because it is too costly to cast it.

The summoner is afraid to send his eidolon into combat because everything we have been fighting deals ability damage and the eidolon can not heal it.

What class would you guys take so that you had no reliance on magic items provided by your DM?


This has been the source of a lot of argument in my group so I wanted to post a question that answered it once and for all. I can see both sides of the argument, but I was wondering who was correct.

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Multiattack

An animal companion gains Multiattack as a bonus feat if it has three or more natural attacks and does not already have that feat. If it does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the animal companion instead gains a second attack with its primary natural weapon, albeit at a –5 penalty.
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Through levels and progression an animal companion would gain this feat at level 9.

Assuming that you are level 1 and have an animal companion with 3 natural attacks does the animal companion automatically gain this as a bonus feat before level 9?

Or

If the animal companion has 3 natural attacks and reaches level 9 does he gain Multiattack as a bonus feat at level 9?


The feat extra evolution states the following:
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Extra Evolution

Your eidolon has more evolutions.

Prerequisites: Eidolon class feature.

Benefit: Your eidolon’s evolution pool increases by 1.

Special: You can gain Extra Evolution multiple times, but only once for every five summoner levels you possess.

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The Improved Natural Armor evolution states:

Improved Natural Armor (Ex)

An eidolon’s hide grows thick fur, rigid scales, or bony plates, giving it a +2 bonus to its natural armor. This evolution can be taken once for every five levels the summoner possesses. Source: Advanced Player's Guide
FAQ

Errata for Improved Natural Armor:
The description of the evolution says, "This evolution can be taken once for every five levels the summoner possesses." Unfortunately, that text is unclear. A summoner can select this evolution once for levels 1—4, again for levels 5–9, a third time at levels 10–14, a fourth time at levels 15–19, and a fifth time at level 20. This wording will be clarified in the next update document and print run for the APG.

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What's the minimum level for a summoner to take the extra evolution feat twice given this similar wording and the current errata? Can he use his level 5 feat to take the extra evolution feat a second time?


3 people marked this as FAQ candidate.

The Summoner and Eidolon are filled with exceptions and questions so I thought it would be great to have one thread that encompassed everything.

Augment Summoning - Works for the Summoner's SLA but not on the Eidolon in any way shape or form.

Healing - The Eidolon does not heal naturally.

Can the eidolon heal ability score damage or does he have to have restoration cast on him every time he gets ability damage? (This happened when I was level 1, 11 pts of strength damage to the eidolon.)

Use Magic Device - SLAs can not be used in place of a spell trigger.

If a summoner creates a scroll of Summon monster with the help of his SLA, does that monster stay around for rounds or minutes?

Enlarge - If a non-bipedal eidolon gets enlarge person cast on him, does he still gain reach? Is the reach conferred by the spell, or is it conferred by the fact that the eidolon is simply growing in size.

Gear - What happens to the eidolon's gear when he is dismissed? Does it fall into a pile in the square where he used to be, allowing monsters to grab and run, or does it leave with him?

If the gear falls to the floor, what happens if the eidolon goes out of range or falls into a bottomless pit. Do you just lose all of the gear the eidolon had?

If the gear goes with the Eidolon, what happens if the summoner dies? Can a portal to the eidolon's plane be cast to retrieve the gear?

Feats (Unconfirmed)- The Eidolon can not take bestiary feats (Improved Natural Attack) Animal Companions can take Bestiary Feats.

Eidolon Death - What happens if Dimensional anchor is cast on the Eidolon and it dies? Does it ever come back, or is there a mechanism for the Summoner to get a new Eidolon?


It has been pointed out to me that only a Biped Eidolon gains reach benefits from being enlarged, whether it is by the spell or evolution. I was just curious, does anyone actually play with the rules as written where only Huge Eidolons of non-bipedal base form get a reach bonus of 10 feet? Or does everyone tend to just use the general rule of grow to large and you get a 10 ft reach?

Large: Evolution
An eidolon grows in size, becoming Large. The eidolon gains a +8 bonus to Strength, a +4 bonus to Constitution, and a +2 bonus to its natural armor. It takes a –2 penalty to its Dexterity. This size change also gives the creature a –1 size penalty to its AC and on attack rolls, a +1 bonus to its CMB and CMD, a –2 penalty on Fly skill checks, and a –4 penalty on Stealth skill checks. If the eidolon has the biped base form, it also gains 10-foot reach. Any reach evolutions the eidolon possesses are added to this total. The eidolon must be Medium to take this evolution. The summoner must be at least 8th level before selecting this evolution.

If 6 additional evolution points are spent, the eidolon instead becomes Huge. The eidolon gains a +16 bonus to Strength, a +8 bonus to Constitution, and a +5 bonus to its natural armor. It takes a –4 penalty to its Dexterity. This size change also give the creature a –2 size penalty to its AC and attack rolls, a +2 bonus to its CMB and CMD, 10-foot reach, a –4 penalty on Fly skill checks, and a –8 penalty on Stealth skill checks. If the eidolon has the biped base form, its reach increases to 15 feet (10 feet for all other base forms). Any reach evolutions the eidolon possesses are added to this total. These bonuses and penalties replace, and do not stack with, those gained from becoming Large. The summoner must be at least 13th level before selecting this option.

The ability increase evolution costs twice as much (4 evolution points) when adding to the Strength or Constitution scores of a Large or Huge eidolon. Source: Advanced Player's Guide


I just saw this spell today and it confuses me.

If I prepare a spell with a range of touch, so that I make a Melee touch attack, does this spell allow me to use my touch attack spell on 2 targets. (Under the assumption that I divide my damage equally?

The other strange part about this spell is that you get a +2 if the enemies flank you, but that is neither here nor there.

Mirror Strike Description:

You briefly alter the flow of time to split a melee attack into two attacks. Before the end of your next turn, when you make your next melee attack roll, compare the result to the AC of two opponents within your reach. If the selected opponents are flanking you, you gain a +2 bonus on your attack roll (and confirmation attack roll, see below). If you hit both enemies, you can deal half damage to each. Hitting only one opponent allows you to deal that opponent normal damage for your attack. On a critical threat, you can make only one attack roll to confirm the critical hit against both opponents. If you confirm against both, you deal half your critical hit damage to each. Your hit is a normal hit rather than a critical if you confirm against only one opponent. If you fail to use the effect before the end of your next turn, the spell ends.

Any thoughts on this?


When I sat down to DM my first game, it was a 5 person game. The players started off in transport to a major city all riding for days in the same covered carriage.

When the time came for each character to describe themselves, (As they had been traveling in the same transport for days.) each of the 5 players described themselves as such, and almost without deviation from the following list:

My character is dressed all in black.
My character keeps to himself.
My character is a human/elf.
My character refuses to talk to the other characters.

My response: Well, that's a great start. Perfect for party cohesion.

Later on in the game one of the NPCs got killed and the wizard of the group spent the entirety of combat (4-6 rounds) trying to pry the wand from the NPC's cold dead hand. (Broke a window, grabbed the dead hand and pulled it through the window while sitting in the safety of the carriage.) Overall it was a funny image.

Anyone else care to share stories like this?


I recently saw an advertisement for a D20 that lights up when you roll a 20. The die is roughly $10. What I want to know is, how the hell do you change the batteries and is it easy to do?

Does anyone have one of these? See the link below.

Crit Die


I know this seems like a no brainer, but I was curious as to what the majority of people would say.

Another DM and I got into an argument as to whether a particular character was evil, here is what happened.

The chaotic neutral character sold his soul to a devil to get the devil to pay off his debts. The character in question sold his soul and turned on (attacking the party as he would an enemy) the party for the duration of a "Boss fight" which nearly killed the party. The character was later subdued.

When the spell "Detect Evil" was later cast upon the soulless person, he was not detected as evil.

Would other DMs consider this character Evil, or is it just my opinion that he is?


If you are a spontaneous caster who has level 1 and 2 spells, can you cast a level 1 spell in a level 2 spell slot. I could not find the text that says you can, and I could not convince my DM that this was correct.

Situation, my useful spells for a certain situation were all level 1, I tried to use a level 1 spell in a level 2 spell slot as a spontaneous caster. I was told that this was wrong, and that this has never been allowed in the history of the game.

Is this correct?


So I was looking at the Summoner's Life Link ability.
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Life Link:
Starting at 1st level, a summoner forms a close bond with his eidolon. Whenever the eidolon takes enough damage to send it back to its home plane, the summoner can, as a free action, sacrifice any number of hit points. Each hit point sacrificed in this way prevents 1 point of damage done to the eidolon. This can prevent the eidolon from being sent back to its home plane.

And then I looked at the archetype Synthesist life link replacement

Fused Link:
Starting at 1st level, the synthesist forms a close bond with his eidolon. Whenever the temporary hit points from his eidolon would be reduced to 0, the summoner can, as a free action, sacrifice any number of his own hit points. Each hit point sacrificed this way prevents 1 point of damage done to the eidolon (thus preventing the loss of the summoner’s temporary hit points), preventing the eidolon from being sent back to its home plane.
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The similarity between these character features is very close, but the main difference is that Fused Link is a lot better than Life Link, because it can be activated before the Eidolon goes unconscious.

Did the developers mean for Life link to only be activated when the Eidolon is unconscious and bleeding to death? Or did the Developers mean for Life Link to work more like Fused Link?


I have been racking my brain to try to figure out why someone would play a Summoner over a Druid and I really can't see a reason. Perhaps I am simply missing something, and someone can explain it to me. So, I will make a table, to see.

-------------------Druid-------------------Summoner
Hit Die____________d8______________________d8
Gold_______________2d6x10__________________2d6x10
Skills_____________4+int___________________2+int
Saves______________2 good, 1 bad___________2 bad, 1 good
Spell progression__Wizard__________________Sorcerer
Spell levels_______0-9_____________________0-6
Spontaneous________Summon N. Ally__________All spells

Number of times each can summon monsters without memorizing summon spells.
___________________# of spells_____________3+ Cha modifier.

Shape Changing_____Level 4 and beyond______Level 20

Armor______________Non-metal_______________Any
Armor_______________Light and Med__________Light

Shared item slots__No______________________Yes

Class Features
Most of the Druid class features revolve around increasing the number of times the druid can wild shape, most of the Summoner class features revolve around letting him summon better monsters.

The rules for the Summoner are still in flux with large arguments about what is and is not valid. (Most arguments end up not being in favor of the summoner.)

The rules for the Druid are pretty well hashed out.

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(Assumption, noting has been done to increase the Animal companion/Eidolon's Intelligence)

-------------------Animal Companion--------Eidolon
Max Hit Die________16______________________15
Hit die____________d8______________________d10
Saves______________2 good 1 bad____________2 good 1 bad
Starting saves_____+3 good_________________+2 good
Skills_____________2/Hit Die_______________4/Hit Die
Max Natural Armor__+12_____________________+16
Max Str/Dex bonus__+6______________________+8

Max Ability Score increases at Character level 20
___________________+4______________________+3

Animal Dies________24h prayer______________24h of waiting
Ability to heal____Yes_____________________No
Subject to banish__No______________________Yes

Armor/Barding______Yes_____________________No
Feats______________8_______________________8

Starting Stats_____Varies__________________Varies
Starting Max Str___18______________________16
___________________(Camel)_________________(Biped)
Size Advancement___Yes 4th/7th level_______No (Use evolutions (4 pts))
Max Evo pts._______0_______________________26

# of base forms____65 and counting_________4

Vanishes if Master is asleep/dead
___________________No______________________Yes

Max Nat. Attacks___Varies__________________7

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Essentially I see the Summoner as a Druid who is lacking in almost all ways, and the Eidolon is simply an animal companion, that isn't as good as an animal companion. The only clear win that the Eidolon has over the animal companion is the number of natural attacks, but I don't think extra attacks is worth sacrificing level 7-9 spells.

The lack of spell levels for a Summoner also means that Metamagic feats are somewhat useless. (Can't utilize an upper level spell slot, not enough spell levels)

Can anyone think of a good reason to play a Summoner over a Druid other than flavor?

Edit: This chart looked so much better when I was typing it up, I will see what this looks like.


If you cast a buff on an eidolon, and he gets sent back to his plane. Assuming you re-summon him immediately, does he still have that buff?

If the answer is no, what happens if you cast protection from elements(fire) on yourself, and go to the plane of fire?

Now for the fun question. The Eidolon for the most part can be a crappy caster or a decent tank. Through evolutions he can learn to cast the following spells.

Level 1 - acid splash, dancing lights, daze, detect magic, flare, ghost sound, light, mage hand, ray of frost, stabilize, or touch of fatigue.

Level 4 - burning hands, comprehend languages, cure light wounds, detect chaos/evil/good/law, magic missile, obscuring mist, silent image, vanish [APG] (self only), or ventriloquism

Level 7 - acid arrow, cure moderate wounds, darkness, daze monster, glide [APG], invisibility (self only), lesser restoration, levitate, minor image, scorching ray, see invisibility, or spider climb

Level 11 - arcane sight, create food and water, cure serious wounds, daylight, fireball, fly, gaseous form, lightning bolt, major image, stinking cloud, tongues, or water breathing

Can the eidolon use wands and scrolls that are on his spell list without using use magic device?

Shown below are the rules for wands.
Wand Rules

The rules for scrolls state that you don't even have to be able to cast the spell to utilize them, as long as the spells are on your spell list.

That said, can an Eidolon be in combat form and still have the capability of using wands crafted with his particular spell list in mind, even if he doesn't have the specific evolutions to cast the spell like abilities? (Scroll rules state that it simply has to be available to your list not that you have to know how to cast it.)

What does everyone think?


I have been toying with the idea of doing some house rules for hit points.

Namely, if you roll a hit die and get less than half hit points, you take half, otherwise you take the roll.

This was done in response to myself having a level 6 fighter with 32 hit points, due to some of the worst rolls in my history of playing the game.

12 Level 1
3 Level 2
3 Level 3
5 Level 4
6 Level 5
3 Level 6

I later threw away every D10 I ever used for this character.

Are there any opinions on this particular house rule?


One of my players claims to have read a book where one of the weapons is what could only be described as a Bear Trap Hammer and he showed me a picture of it. It is quite literally a bear trap hammer.

He has been pleading with me to use this oversized weapon for his level 1 character, and I keep telling him no, not in a million years, no. Here is why:

A bear trap does 2d6+3 damage because it is over sized it does 3d6+4 and if the player gets enlarge person cast upon him it jumps to 4d6+5. Adding +2 to strength each time it goes up a size category as well.

The hammer that the bear trap is attached to does 1d10 damage, but it is over sized so it goes to 2d8, and if he has enlarge person cast on him it will be 3d8.

His level 1 character is a 20 point buy with a starting strength of 20. So here is the breakdown. If he hits while enlarge person is not cast on him he will do 2d8+3d6+11 (1.5*str + bear trap str). If he is large, he hits for 3d8+4d6+14. Taking just the average of the large hit this is 12+12+14 = 38 damage per swing.

Does anyone else have players that try to attach bear traps, caltrops, or swords to already statted weapons, or is it just me? Please post about the ridiculous things your groups have tried.


In the game I currently play in the DM has ruled in the worst possible way against my Summoner every time a ruling has been called for, which is often, because a person in the game has personal issues against me.

As the game stands, my Eidolon has 10 points of ability damage, ghoul rot, and a broken leg so that it can only move at half of its base speed.

Question 1: What do you do if the Eidolon takes ability damage?

We were playing in a game and the Summoner's Eidolon took around 10 points of ability damage. As the Eidolon does not heal naturally, he technically can't regain these ability score points back. Does he re-heal these when he is sent back to his plane? Or does he simply not heal until the group learns lesser restoration?

(The current ruling is that it doesn't heal ability damage unless I get restoration cast upon the eidolon.)

Question 2: As haste works only with held weapons, it seems like a natural attack Eidolon will not receive the extra attack that the spell would normally allow. Does he get that extra attack if attacking with only held weapons?

(The reason this question must be asked is that there has been a lot of nit picking with regard to the summoner and the way older books and spells are worded.)

(The current ruling is that Haste doesn't affect natural attacks.)

Question 3: Does the Eidolon get full hit points at level 1?

I have heard arguments that the Eidolon is an NPC with no character levels so he does not get full hit points, but the Eidolon clearly does go up in levels the same way a player character would. So which is it?

(The current ruling is that the Eidolon does not get full HP at first level because he is a summoned creature.)

Question 4: Does Augment Summoning work on the spell like ability to summon creatures and/or the Eidolon?

This seems like a no brainer but it has come up many times. Most of the internet community agrees that Augment Summoning works on the SLA summoned monsters, but there is a massive disagreement about the Eidolon.

Those who argue for the Eidolon getting the Augment Summoning ability argue that the power is derived from the same pool. (You can't have an SLA summoned creature out at the same time as the Eidolon) So it seems strange that Augment Summoning would affect only part of the creatures being summoned from that pool of power. The other aspect is that everyone seems to agree that if you use the level 2 spell "Summon Eidolon" the Eidolon receives the benefit of Augment Summoning. One of the first lines in this spell states:

"Treat this as if you had summoned your eidolon normally, except that it only remains with you for the duration of this spell."

If you have summoned the Eidolon normally, then it was by the ritual and he wouldn't get the benefit.
To receive the benefit if he is summoned for a few minutes by the spell, but not if he is summoned normally by the 1 minute ritual seems like splitting hairs.

(The current ruling is that despite being a summoned creature, the Eidolon will not benefit from augment summoning, and because Augment summoning affects spells and not spell like abilities, my summoned creatures won't benefit either, unless I learn summon spells for the summoner to cast.)

Question 5: How does disease affect the Eidolon?

What if the Eidolon was affected by Ghoul Rot? This came up in a gaming session and we didn't know how to deal with it, does he rot away in his home plane? Does he need to get cured too? Is the disease simply cured when he goes back to his home plane?

(The current ruling is that the Eidolon can be infected, but can't heal from the disease, because it doesn't heal naturally. I will have a ghoul eidolon who attacks the party whenever it is summoned within 3 sessions.)

Question 6:

Life link reads as follows.

Life Link (Su)

Starting at 1st level, a summoner forms a close bond with his eidolon. Whenever the eidolon takes enough damage to send it back to its home plane, the summoner can, as a free action, sacrifice any number of hit points. Each hit point sacrificed in this way prevents 1 point of damage done to the eidolon. This can prevent the eidolon from being sent back to its home plane.

The Eidolon gets sent back to its plane when it dies (negative constitution score) so around -13 or so.
Is this ability meant to keep the Eidolon alive so that you can run over to it and heal it, bringing it back to consciousness?
Or
Is this ability meant to be used at any time to allow the Eidolon to remain conscious and fighting?

(The current ruling is that I can only use this ability to keep the Eidolon from dieing, aka I can only use this ability if the eidolon is unconscious, I am tempted to use this ability to kill off the character and make a druid.)

Question 7: If the eidolon has the rend ability, and has landed 4 claw attacks, can he do the rend ability twice?

I have been having a large argument about this, my side has been, if you hit with 4 claw attacks, you should be able to rend twice, because the counter should reset after the second claw has hit.

The person arguing with me has the argument, "That's too strong and is unbalanced, so you shouldn't be able to do it twice in one round, no matter how many claw attacks you land."

Any thoughts?

(The current ruling is that no matter how many times I land a claw attack I can only rend once per round.")

Thanks for your time.