Ian Meadows's page

I am wondering if the reduced damage from the young template is due to being smaller or in addition to that. For instance, would a young satyr wielding a small longsword do 1d6 damage or 1d4?

Here is a build for Rogue to make an assassin that uses concealed weapons and poisons.

Build uses Dagger, Wrist Launcher, Heavy Wrist Launcher, and Drow Poison.

Race: Human

Primary Class: Unchained Rogue
Archetypes: Bandit, Phantom Thief, and Underground Chemist

Variant Multiclass Secondary Class: Alchemist
Archetype: Vivisectionist (trades Bombs from Variant Multiclass Alchemist for Sneak Attack from Variant Multiclass Rogue)

Lvl 1: Take feats Racial Heritage choosing Nagaji so you can take their Alchemist favored class option every level and Fast Learner so you can also take the Human Rogue favored class option as well every level. Skill choice for Refined Education is Craft:Alchemy. Take traits Trap Finder and Roving Range.

Lvl2: Black Market Connections.

Lvl3: Finesse Training choose Dagger. Refined Education choose Diplomacy.

Lvl4: No choices available

Lvl5: Refined Education choose Stealth and take Feat Master Alchemist

Lvl6: Combat Trick choosing Expert Sniper and Vigilante Social Talent due to favored class options choosing Mockingbird

Lvl7: Refined Education choose Sleight of Hand

Lvl8: Eerie Disappearance

Lvl9: Refined Education choose Disguise and take Feat Quick Draw

Lvl10: Master Tricks choose Assassinate

Lvl11: Refined Education choose Bluff and Finesse Training pick any valid option

Lvl12: Quick Shot and due to favored class options Discovery picking Sticky Poison

Lvl13: Refined Education pick Sense Motive and take Feat Pernicious Stab and get an extra skill rank instead of 1/6 Rogue talent at this level

Lvl14: Combat Trick choosing Silent Kill and get an extra skill rank instead of 1/6 Rogue talent at this level

Lvl15: Refined Education choose Perception

Lvl16: Hide in Plain Sight choose Urban

Lvl17: Refined Education choose Disable Device and take Feat Extra Rogue Talent choosing Hide in Plain Sight choosing Underground

Lvl18: Stalker Talent choosing Perfect Vulnerability

Lvl19: Refined Education choose Acrobatics, Finesse Training choose any valid option

Lvl20: Discovery choosing Preserve Organs and due to favored class options Discovery choosing Mummification

Alchemical Assassin
Alchemist Archetype

Weapon Proficiencies: Simple Weapons weighing 1lb or less plus Wrist Launcher and Heavy Wrist Launcher.
Armor Proficiencies: None

Weapon Restrictions: If using a weapon that can not be concealed without magic, that weapon does not benefit from any of the features of this class. In addition, if dual wielding, and only one weapon can be concealed, that weapon halves it’s number of Sneak Attack dice rounding down.

Replace Throw Anything Feature with Finesse Training of Unchained Rogue
When you would select a weapon to add your dex to damage with you may instead take the Extra Rogue Talent or Extra Discovery feat.

Replace Bombs with 1d4 Sneak Attack that increases to 1d8 for any weapon that you can add your dex to damage with due to Finesse Training

May select a Rogue Talent in place of a discovery. After level 10 may select advanced Rogue talents instead of a discovery. Rogue lvl = Alchemist lvl must meet all other prerequisites.

Reduced Spellcasting: Lower the value of extracts per day of all extract lvls by 1 (min 0) if this would make you have 0 in extracts per day of a level you would normally have 1 in then you can’t cast extracts of that level unless you gain bonus spells per day of that level. You may still learn spells of that level though.
In addition you do not gain spells known from leveling up except the bonus spells at 1st level from having a high Int bonus.

Skill Ranks per lvl: 6+Int bonus

Class skills: Lose Appraise, Fly, and Profession. Gain Stealth, Bluff, and Disguise

Add 1/2 level to Sleight of hand checks to conceal weapons and Add 1/2 level to Stealth checks to Snipe. (replaces poison resistance +2)

You gain the Accelerated Drinker and Hidden Hand traits. (replaces poison resistance +4)

Gain Death Attack as per Assassin prestige class. Assassin lvl = 1/2 Alchemist lvl round down. (replaces poison resistance +6)

Gain Quiet Death as per Assassin prestige class. (replaces immunity to poison).

Mine is a Vivisectionist Alchemist build to make essentially a poison rogue. I've been tweaking this build for a long time including custom races for it.

Currently, the custom race is a variation of a Kobold using the standard guidelines. The options I took were Humanoid(Reptile)0pts; Weakness traits +2Dex,+2Int, -4Str -1pt; Small 0pts; Darkvision 120ft 3pts; Light Blindness -2pts; Negative Energy Affinity -1pt; Prehensile Tail 2pts; Swift as Shadows 3pts; Silent Hunter 2pts; and Flexible Bonus Feat 4 pts.

The character build is 16 levels of Alchemist(Vivisectionist), 3 levels of Unchained Rogue(Underground Chemist), and 1 level of Kensai(Mindblade).

The feat selections are Kobold Sniper, Combat Casting, Extra Discovery x4, Master Alchemist, Signature Skill (Craft Alchemy), Kobold Ambusher, Extra Talent, and Uncanny Concentration.

The Alchemist Discoveries are Chameleon, Extend Potion, Preserve Organs, Poison Conversion, Alchemical Simulacrum, Combine Extracts, Doppelganger Simulacrum, Mummification, Greater Mutagen, Sticky Poison, Eternal Potion, and Grand Mutagen.

The Rogue Talents are Offensive Defense and Quick Disguise.

For the martial weapon choice for the Mindblade I choose Sword Cane and the levels of Rogue let me use Wrist Launchers as my ranged weapons. This way it always looks like my character is unarmed and if his weapons are ever taken away from him he can simply make some temporary replacements with his Mindblade powers.

Looks like they stack, I found a Paizo prestige class that has an ability that gives them the same bonuses as Master Alchemist and it says that if you also have that feat, you can craft 2x Int bonus poison doses at a time and you use the PP value of the doses to determine progress.

Both the Master Alchemist Feat from the Advanced Players Guide and the Beaker of Plentiful Poisons from Pathfinder Unchained, allow you to use the gp value of poisons instead of the sp value when crafting. So, if you have both, does it act as a further 10x manufacture rate for the doses you are making with the Beaker, or do you just not gain a benefit from that ability of the item since you already can do that due to the aforementioned feat?

I use Drow poison mainly w/ my characters for combat situations. It doesn't cost too much, as far as poisons go, so once you get to level 5 and take the Master Alchemist feat you can start getting a daily supply. I think the DC increases would help to make it stay moderately useful for a longer time.

Oh, and either as an additional thing or a discovery, you could have the damage be typed like fire, acid, cold, etc., with the type of damage being determined on application. This would help tie it into the traditional alchemical weapons like acid flasks, alchemical fire and so on, and give a nifty way to stop certain things from regenerating.

I think a simpler solution for Ciaran's build is to just call it someting other than poison if he's not messing with the core mechanics of poisons. Maybe call the ability "Alchemical Weapons". You can leave the rest pretty much the same. Since it wouldn't be a poison anymore you wouldn't have the immunity problem anymore and the high DC makes sense for a class ability that should work most of the time like sneak attack does. The one thing that I might change about it after that is probably remove the uses per day, but keep it so it only functions for the character.

I think you shouldn't dismiss Ciaran Barnes' approach so quickly.

Poisons have really messy rules in Pathfinder. If players feel the need to create a flowchart, it's a safe bet that a rule is too complex. In addition, debuffs can be a real nuisance to handle for GMs who already have to keep track of many other things ('Ability damage--seriously? You are going to make me recalculate my monster's stat block for the remaining 3 rounds that it's going to live?').
Having poison deal direct damage is much easier to track. Maybe it would be more appropiate if the ability dealt damage over time and could be combined with rider effects to apply penalties, but I would actually prefer such a system over one that causes damage/penalties indirectly (via ability damage). I don't have experience with the poison rules from Pathfinder Unchained; maybe they could be used as a basis for a poisoning ability?

I am not arguing with you on the messy rules for poisons, and that is why I like Drow Poison it simply knocks people unconscious, no debuffs. For the most part I see most other poisons as things you use outside of combat. Also, I would have less issue with his idea if he were simply revamping the poison system to do damage instead of saying that just this archetype gets it. Finally, while as a poison it is overpowered, as a class ability that is replacing either sneak attack or bomb, since both are valid options for the bomb feature slot already through core paizo books, I think it is actually not worth the trade since poison immunity is fairly common starting around level 10 and there is even an amulet that can provide it.

This is a homebrew archetype for alchemist. Please let me know what you think about it.

Sneak Attack: replaces bomb class feature same damage progression

Powerful Poisons: replaces poison resist +2 with an increase to poison save DCs of poisons crafted by the alchemist by +2, replaces resist +4 with DC+4, resist +6 with DC +6, and replaces poison immunity with bypass immunity which lowers a creatures resistance to poisons created by the alchemist by one step, from immune to +6, +6 to +4, +4 to +2, or +2 to none, if a creature has no resistance to poisons this has no added benefit.

Fast Stealth: can select the fast stealth rogue talent in place of a discovery.

Perfect vulnerability: can select the perfect vulnerability vigilante talent in place of a discovery once level 8 or higher.

Oh, I'm realizing I didn't explain the bypass immunity ability very well. If a creature has immunity to poisons they would instead be given a +6 bonus to save against poisons created by the alchemist. If the immunity was given by a class feature or item that progresses in power based on level and previous abilities gave an increased resistance to poison you get either +6 or the previous ability, whichever is greater, this applies to all instances of immunity. If a creature is not immune to poisons, their total added bonus to resist poisons is lowered by 2 to a minimum of 0.

Here is an example. A level 10 alchemist normally has immunity to poisons, so instead they get a +6 bonus on their fortitude saves versus poisons from their class since their previous class feature providing poison resistance does not give a greater bonus. This bonus stacks as normal with other resistances to poison. Now, let's say this same alchemist also bought a Periapt of Proof against Poison. This item also provides immunity to poison, so against poisons created by an Alchemical Assasin of level 10 or higher it would instead provide a +6 bonus to saves against poisons since it does not have a previous ability providing resistance to poisons. Together a normal level 10 alchemist with this item would have a +12 bonus to saves against poisons created by an Alchemical Assasin of level 10 or higher, plus any racial bonuses or trait bonuses. Repeat this for all instances of immunity, however multiple instances of immunity from the same type of source do not stack. Sources include item, race, classes, or traits. Now a level 8 Dwarf Alchemist would normally have a +8 bonus to resist poisons, +2 from the race and +6 from the class. Since it is not immune to poisons you simply reduce the total bonus by 2 to a +6 bonus to resist poisons created by an an Alchemical Assasin of level 10 or higher. Finally, let's take a base Human Fighter with no gear affecting resistance to poisons. Since they have no added bonus or immunity to poisons the bypass ability doesn't affect them since it doesn't reduce a creatures bonuses below 0.

Personally, I don't like it. You aren't really making a poisoner, you are simply trying to give an alternate method to apply sneak attack, and adding your Int bonus onto the Sneak Attack damage. None of the abilities that you are adding are useful for actual poisons. Also, if you are going to have the DC go up based on that ratio, it is more powerful than my initial suggestion that you thought might be overpowered. Let's compare it to Drow Poison, one of the most useful poisons in the game in my opinion and one that you can afford to make and are able to make at low levels and in decent quantities if you get the Master Alchemist feat at 5th level.

Your ability assuming you start with a 20 in Int which considering it is your primary casting stat and now your damage stat as well is not unreasonable.

Toxin DC would be 15 at lvl 1 and go up to a DC of 25 at level 20 not counting any boosts to Int you would surely get considering how important the stat is to your character.

Drow Poison DC for my initial build would be 13 at lvl 1 and go up to a max of 19. At level 2 when my build gets it's first bump to DC Drow Poison would be a DC 15 yours, DC 16, at level 5 my build catches up to your build in DC but yours got there the level before, at level 8 both of our builds get to 19, but this is where mine maxes out and yours continues to go up in DC every two lvls after that. This is again not touching your builds initial Int of 20 which would mean your build would be even better than this comparison suggests as soon as you get stat bumps.

In addition to the DC differences my build still needs to make the poisons, which means I need to spend gold on them, yours does not. Also, in order to make them in useful quantities to have a daily supply, I need to take a feat, you don't. Also, for my build, you need to keep craft alchemy maxed in order to be able to make the poisons faster, yours now treats it as an unimportant skill.

On top of all this, your ability does not function like a poison. Poisons have an effect that happens once per round, minute, hour, or day for at least two of those increments and while affected by it additional applications do not reapply the effect, they raise the save DC and increase the number of increments that it will last for if not cured or saved against. On top of this, only the poisons that deal Con damage and Hemlock actually kill and they will take multiple increments to even have a chance to do so and on top of this these poisons either have one to 2 of these other downsides, a low save DC, an onset time of a minute or more (which means the poison doesn't even start to do anything even if they failed their save for at least 10 rounds of combat), or a price between 1800 gp per dose to 6500 gp per dose. All other poisons have nonlethal effects since reducing an attribute to 0 or negative renders an individual unconscious unless it is to Con.

Oh, and I also had an idea for a custom wondrous item for an alchemist based off of the Beneficial Bandolier. Instead of it holding ammunition, have it hold extracts, potions, poisons, and splash weapons with a 200 item capacity just like the beneficial bandolier and just like that item, retrieving items from it would be a swift action.

How about still removing the resistances and immunity, keeping the bypass ability, but making the DC increase progress at +1 per 4 alchemist levels? That way poisons can still have a decent DC at late levels but don't spike up to that DC so fast.

This is a homebrew archetype for alchemist. Please let me know what you think about it.

Sneak Attack: replaces bomb class feature same damage progression

Powerful Poisons: replaces poison resist +2 with an increase to poison save DCs of poisons crafted by the alchemist by +2, replaces resist +4 with DC+4, resist +6 with DC +6, and replaces poison immunity with bypass immunity which lowers a creatures resistance to poisons created by the alchemist by one step, from immune to +6, +6 to +4, +4 to +2, or +2 to none, if a creature has no resistance to poisons this has no added benefit.

Fast Stealth: can select the fast stealth rogue talent in place of a discovery.

Perfect vulnerability: can select the perfect vulnerability vigilante talent in place of a discovery once level 8 or higher.

Thank you, I thought they could only be used on the 'deal damage' checks, however the item description is rather confusing still on the damage they deal as it mentions they "allow you to deal extra piercing damage on a successful grapple attack". If you have to use the armor spikes instead of another form of damage, how can it be extra?

Honestly, while this combination is quite powerful, I believe Acolyte is probably right that it probably does make the wearer of the amulet immune to the damage type specified by the weapon trait. That being said, it probably will get banned by Pathfinder Society as they have banned a class archetype that can give itself immunity to all energy types permanently without a gold cost by level 7, namely the Synthesist Summoner.

In non Pathfinder Society play, this combination is probably not overpowered considering the myriad of ways that players already have to enhance themselves.

In Pathfinder Society play though, considering the massive amount of restrictions placed on players to tone down their power level I believe the weapon traits will probably be banned in that format or not be allowed to be used with the amulet once it comes to light to the people who make the rules for Pathfinder Society.

Ok, first of all, I have looked through these posts and found a variety of opinions but I am not sure if there have been official rulings. As such, I am looking for answers to these questions and if you answer, please state whether this is an opinion or if it is an official ruling.

So, first of all does Armor Spike damage get added on only to grapple maneuver checks made to 'deal damage' as an extra amount of damage above whatever damage you would normally do with that check, or does it apply the Armor Spike damage also to all other grapple checks?

Second, when grappling do you add your strength bonus to the additional damage that Armor Spikes add, in essence giving you in a grapple check to 'deal damage' your base damage roll plus strength plus your Armor Spike damage plus strength?

Third, when grappling, are Armor Spikes considered an attack as constrict is? If they are applied to all grapple combat maneuvers it would not make sense for them not to be, however if they are only added as additional damage to grapple checks to 'deal damage' it could be ruled either way.

Thank you ahead of time for your responses.

Thanks, that's what I thought but I just wanted to check. Thanks for the quick response too.

I tried to look this up in this thread but I did not see it mentioned. If I want to take a listed item that normally has charges per day and buy a version of it that is constant instead, using the formulas in magic item creation from the core rule book to find the increased price, as there are very clear rules as to how this item would be priced, is this allowed?

Hi, I recently joined PFS and I'm trying to get some help filling out the form for my first character. There seems to be lots of stuff missing from the online form. For instance, there was no section to fill out what feats you have selected or what skills you had ranks in. Am I not supposed to enter all the details of the character? I also don't remember a field in which to write down gear. Any help anyone can give me in how to properly fill out the online form would be greatly appreciated. To clarify, I have made Lots of DnD and Pathfinder characters before, what I need help with is the online form for Pathfinder Society for a new character.

For the Bandolier, it reads that "You can use the 'retrieve a stored item' action to take an item from a bandolier."

I believe that that was probably meant to read, "You can use the 'retrieve a stored item' action to take an item from a bandolier as a swift action.", or without provoking an attack of opportunity, due to how easily accessed the items are. Though I would believe the initial to be more likely. Otherwise, there is not much of a reason to have that sentence.