Ah, that it has! Sorry for the severity of tone, my frustration was reaching its peak. Thank you to all involved for finally making this happen.
Search Posts
IT IS NOW JUNE. My patience has been depleted. Is this order happening, or not?
Hello, it's now been 58 days, 7 days longer than what the maximum estimate was. At this point, should I even be expecting the package to arrive at all?
Thank you for the reply! There is no rush, as long as it gets to its destination.
Ordered a gift for someone and I just realized that the order is still pending! Now I'm worried! What should I do??
...If I already have the Advanced Race Guide?
Yes, it did give me that page. I understand that the bug is just a bug and these things happen, but it should be relatively easy to fix regardless...
What questions have you heard or been asked that really got you thinking about your character? Not the basic ones that you answer out of obligation, no, I mean the ones you hear and then REALLY want to know the answer to. These are subjective opinions, but mine are: 1. Why did your character become an adventurer? Others:
I personally like to leave family questions at least a little bit open ended to give the GM some toys to play with and also so I don't lead myself into the MY PARENTS ARE DDEEEEAAAADDDDDDD trap. It's a DC 20 trap, and my will save is terrible. Questions about childhood make my eyes glaze over. I figure that out much, much later. So, what are your favorite questions?
And these are real people making these accounts. It's not going to stop them. It will likely just slow them down. We're creating tools to do what needs to be done. Ha! What nerds.
When clicking Submit Changes after writing in all the details of a character, it deletes everything the first time it is clicked. I spent an hour and wrote several pages about my character, it was all deleted because of this bug, and this makes me upset. I can't simply replace what was written after spending an hour on it. Other material has been deleted because of this in the past. Can this bug please be fixed?
Not sure where else to put this, so here it goes. I made a design that uses one of the Aeons from the aforementioned book, and I'd like to properly credit the artist for their work. It must be one of these people, but attempts to google search them one at a time have been both a major pain and give no definitive correlation with the art. Anybody know for sure which artist did all the Aeons?
If a GM is going to bother to use the Tarrasque, he is probably going to take the 'cannot be killed' seriously. I appreciate this sentiment quite a bit, and wanted to address it; I hope it doesn't count as a thread resurrect. That logic makes sense, and not only does it make sense thematically, it has the potential to make mechanical sense as well. I am a big player of Magic: The Gathering, and if I may be tangential, there is a rule in MTG called a "replacement effect". The way it works is that some cards have an intervening cause that effectively replaces the effect of another at it's fundamental execution. If a replacement effect says "if you would draw a card, instead do something else", all effects that say "draw a card" are treated as if they were printed to do whatever the replaced effect says to do. For those of you still following me, I see Tarrasque "death" tricks the same way. The Tarrasque explicitly states "it cannot be killed." PERIOD. To me, this means that any effect that would result in death instead does not kill it, because the ability of the Tarrasque "replaces" any spell or ability that says kill/slay with NOT kill/slay. Thus, any tricky soul-meddling shenanigans would ultimately not work IF it resulted in the Tarraque's body dying, because this cannot happen. Ability drain resulting in the death of it's body.... couldn't happen. Whatever the technique, the Tarrasque CANNOT BE KILLED. Arguments can be made that transporting it's soul away could leave it braindead, or that ability-draining a stat to zero would leave it immobile or something similar. People could also simply disagree with my interpretation. Pathfinder certainly has its flexibility of interpretation in many, many, many, many, many instances, but to me, when something states a creature cannot be killed, IT CANNOT BE KILLED. Anything that still dodges that stated truth is all good in my eyes, but otherwise I would argue that no, it wouldn't work.
More good content to work with, thank you! I had a talk with my friend and I think I'm ready to make some conclusions on the character. As is always for me, I'm going to leave some flexibility in the initial "final" draft so I can flesh out some of his backstory through role-play; I prefer to get to know my characters over time rather than have everything set in stone from the beginning. Anyway, about the "darkness" in his character... general when I make Monks they tend to be like that. I prefer my disciplined characters to learn discipline through a difficult life instead of sitting in a monastery. In life, when someone is forced to learn self-learn discipline, it isn't pretty, hence the further inclination to the emergence of a darker aspect.
Also, I myself am an autodidact, so not only do I have an easier time role-playing autodidacts, but it also works fairly well for a Pathfinder/adventurer origin. Anyway, character details: Hordac is 1/4 orc, but it isn't very apparent. His boyhood home was comprised of an intelligent half-orc single-father who was distant and demanding. I will leave what happened to the mother open to possibility. He grew up in Riddleport. Riddleport is NOT a good place to grow up; the nature of the local has enough flexibility to assume bullying would be commonplace, especially for those that stand out to the extent Hordac does with his feathers and whatnot. For the way the bullying progressed, I'm sticking with what I said earlier, except I'll use a quote from American Gods, majorly cut down: "In spring of his thirteenth year the local kids had been picking on him, goading him into fights they knew he could not win after which Shadow would run, angry and often weeping, to the boys' room to wash the mud or blood from his face before anyone could see....
That book is really, really good by the way. Basically, Hordac had a similarly defining event. After this event, he felt that Riddleport had nothing more to offer him and that he had a sense of closure over his own safety and personal identity, e.g. "I am an aasimar and I don't fear it because anyone who has a problem with it can taste my fist." These reasons led him to the decision that he wanted to travel away from the city. Due to his aversion to social contact he ended his brief expedition in solitude in the mountainous regions of eastern Varisia. Hordac is a Garuda-Blooded assimar, and it says specifically in the description of them that "Plumekin are drawn to high, mountainous regions"; as such this choice of location wouldn't be unusual or surprising. My friend made the suggestion for Hordac to be, or at least act, slightly autistic. What he meant by this was for Hordac to interact with others that way; infrequent eye contact, misinterpreting social queues, one-word answers, situationally tone-deaf comments, etc. The thing I reminded my friend of though is that Hordac has high Wisdom, not high Intelligence. Therefore, he is observant and intuitive about what he learns and goes by instinct over analysis. Ultimately, it isn't really misunderstanding that leads Hordac to alternately act out of turn or withdraw from social situations, it's deep distrust of people and their motives. He has a hard time accepting anyone has benevolent motives when they interact with him. I mean, he grew up in friggin' RIDDLEPORT in additional to his abysmal personal experiences. (Growing up in Riddleport would also explain the roguish talents he has like disable device etc). Hordac being Good or Neutral is still something I'm trying to decide. I myself enjoy playing good characters a lot more. This is a game. I don't really feel the need to criticize myself or grow a more nuanced idea of a character or character development; really, the goal I have for myself is role-playing challenges instead. I've been trying to make and play characters beyond straight white males such as myself for a while now(gay, other races, different gender, etc). I considered gender-flipping Hordac, but it wouldn't really work for many reasons, the biggest being that women simply don't bully each other the way men do, nor do they resolve the bullying in a way that would have Hordac develop the way he needs to have his skill-set. Focusing in unarmed combat could simply be a casual obsession of his; again I should mention the idea of autistic tendencies. It still seems odd to me that he chose this of all things to focus on while living in SOLITUDE, but hey, semantics. It could easily be any of the explanations you provided, and it's not like he's planning on explaining it to anyone anytime soon. The pinnacle of his pre-adventurer character development was his decision to leave his solitary life, however. It was a choice. After so many years, he felt he needed to travel more. Some kind of urge to leave what he had behind. This urge was actually the urge to socialize and be around people, but he would hardly conclude or recognize this as the reason. As opposed to making the somewhat lazy concession "and eventually he became a Pathfinder" I had an idea formulating that he was barely over the southern border into Nirmathas when he witnessed an adventuring group of particularly good chemistry in a town/tavern, and found to his surprise that his first thought was: "I wish I had that." Coming back to the good vs. neutral alignment quandary, Hordac wants to believe that people are good, and in his heart he does. But, I don't know if this makes him "good"; his motivation is still ultimately for the sake of himself. His 2-3 year long training to be a Pathfinder(which all Pathfinders have by the way; see Seekers of Secrets) would definitely teach him some sense of cooperation, though I expect him to have learned that he accepts his role mostly silently. Choosing to put his neck on the line for others would indicate goodness, but I'm not sure when and why he would do that. I guess I'll have to wait on his alignment until after I start using him more often, but he'll be neutral for now. One more thing that's worth mentioning about Hordac is how his social behavior doesn't mesh with his looks. He looks very striking and unique, and often gets exactly the kind of attention he doesn't want wherever he goes. He feathers are a remarkable cardinal-and-gold color, and he himself is tall with soft features aside from his nose, which is more thin and slightly beak-like. Him being a gorgeous man doesn't really mesh with his Charisma score, but it honestly doesn't have to, and I feel that it will make him more interesting to play. As a concise package, think of his personality as Gerome from Fire Emblem: Awakening, for those of you that know who that is.
I'm also toying with the idea of him being 1/4-1/8 Orc.
If my character with Diehard gets to negative hit points, can I have him collapse as a free action and pretend to be unconscious without needing a skill roll to fool anyone? I mean, it's the middle of combat, and a guy collapses after taking catastrophic injuries... should they really be entitled to a Sense Motive/Perception check?
Fighter:
Magus:
Monk:
Oracle:
Rogue:
@SanKeshun: Great post! Seriously, that is some awesome material. I like the idea of him being forced from wherever he settled though circumstances such as the one you named. That makes sense. Perhaps he lived along the border of Belkzen, a mountainous region, and encountered an orc scout/raiding party. I don't like the idea of him fleeing because he hurt someone, and especially not feeling guilty about it. With 17 Wisdom, I feel he would see it differently. Wise people reflect on their mistakes, learn from them, forgive themselves and move on. Thus, a wise character burdened with guilt from hurting someone who in actually really deserved it doesn't jam. Once you become superior to your bullies, you teach them a painful lesson one time, and they never bother you again. In fact, I have witnessed this. All you have to do if prove you aren't weak, and they pick on someone else; it seems that Hordac could have also reached this conclusion and held nothing back... I'll think about it. If he hurt someone and then CHOSE to leave, I could see that. It could be that once he developed, he reached a level of skill and fitness that essentially put him above them. After teaching them the aforementioned lesson, perhaps he felt he had the freedom to finally leave whatever awful place he was in with a sense of closure... but they why would he go in solitude? Perhaps there was a different reason that he learned Iron Mountain archetype and also is bad with people...? He also specializes in non-lethal combat actually, so I couldn't see someone dying easily as a result of his action. Although perhaps he specialized in non-lethal AFTER this happened...? I could see that too... Okay, I think what would make sense is if he lived in one of the more seedy cities in Varisia like Riddleport. Varisia is adjacent to Belkzen, so it works with the idea of him living in a mountainous area in which he was disturbed. I could use a few more ideas on why/where he started travelling and how he learned to target weak spots.
You could go Monk flurry shuriken, then invest in feats that make shuriken better. Slashing Grace: Choose one kind of one-handed slashing weapon (such as the longsword). When wielding your chosen weapon one-handed, you can treat it as a one-handed piercing melee weapon for all feats and class abilities that require such a weapon (such as a swashbuckler's or a duelist's precise strike) and you can add your Dexterity modifier instead of your Strength modifier to that weapon's damage. The weapon must be one appropriate for your size. If you are using the one-handed weapon for throwing, I don't see why it wouldn't work...
LG Male Aasimar Monk Stats:
Used for PFS. What I have so far: This aasimar character, Hordac, is Garuda-blooded. Instead of growing hair, he grew feathers. This and other bestial traits led to a hard upbringing. Being tormented and bullied relentlessly, he became more and more socially isolated and withdrawn until he literally isolated himself on a mountain where he trained and meditated for 4 years in solitary. Having grown into adulthood, Hordac is incredibly beautiful with his soft features and graceful cardinal/gold feathers, but is terrible with people. His own experiences as a victim and his isolation have led him to be very direct and uncouth in social situations. When questioned or criticized for this, he often points to the arbitrary nature of social exchange. He is only really comfortable in 1 on 1 talks, and even then initiates only tentatively and can become quickly hostile if he faces any level of racism or is reminded of past trauma. He is much more likely to make insightful singular statements occasionally than actually engage in a discussion. ---------------------------------------------------- That's what I got. Any suggestions for retroactive change are welcome as well as some help fleshing him out. Questions I don't know the answer to:
I'm in PFS and I just reached second level with this character. His first level is already locked in pretty much... Thanks for all the suggestions guys!
Just wanted to point out that the natural armor from the Monk of the Sacred Mountain archetype is a +1 natural armor bonus. Barkskin provides a +2 enhancement bonus to your existing natural armor. So they stack. If they didn't, Barkskin would be almost useless to any wildshaping druids, or combat animal builds. Well then... Barkskin it is! I always forget the wording because almost nothing else works like that. I've looked at the Qinggong list dozens of times after all the monks I've made, and it's just kind of hilarious how nothing even remotely compares to Barkskin. Even when you get to level 8 Barkskin still holds up, if it's not still better. His AC is looking like it's going to scale nicely. Almost perfectly 1 a level. Mage Armor throughout:
That won't really be necessary. The Mage Armor potions last an hour. If I don't take them before a fight(like at a cave entrance, or right before we meet whats-his-face and my Sense Motive check tells me things might not go as planned), the most it would inconvenience me is a move-standard, after which I would then probably be set for all/most the fights that happen for the rest of module as well as the one I'm in. Not to mention the fact that I don't actually know if I'll still be using potions far down the road, making these possibly obsolete...
But but but I actually am proficient with a weapon... Unarmed. No way could I fight against armed assailants though. No one can do that except in the movies. Would I get Improved Unarmed Strike? No idea. The AoO rules, while central to the game, make no damn sense. You use a full round worth of actions that all happen simultaneously, but you suddenly gain an extra second during this when someone else moves...? I guess this thread depends on ignoring turn-based in-combat oddities.
That test gave me 9 DEX. I have incredibly fast reflexes, can run 100 meters in 12 seconds, and can throw 4 punches in 1-2 seconds... but I can't juggle, so I get a 9... :X I was told a couple years ago that real world intelligence is simply the score multiplied by 10. This makes perfect sense because the average, 10=100 IQ, is correct, and it gives you an idea of just how handicapped having 7 intelligence really is. I've used this metric when deciding how to role-play my characters ever since. Ever since I was a kid, my IQ has fallen just short of MENSA; I even at one point literally got a 129 on an IQ test. (Not that IQ tests are a good way to measure psychometric intelligence anyway...) 12 was therefore the conclusion. I have no idea about my STR. I am in pretty good shape and practice full body calisthenics, but I don't lift, so I don't know what the measurement of how strong I should be really is... Honestly, even when I was doing sports I never gave a sh** about lifting. It seems like a completely arbitrary way of measuring strength, and likely misrepresentative at that. If I'm being even more honest, I also didn't like it much because I wasn't very good at it... My center of gravity is at my core, not the shoulders like most men. Here is what I gave myself after some thought: Strength 12
I've always liked Rogue/Fighters, and I think if I were fictionalized I would be a Rogue/Fighter. No matter what, DEX would be the stat I focused on. And do I really have to mention this rule?: Core Rulebook Spellcasting:
To cast a spell level 1 or higher, you need to have the teen equivalent; 11=1, 12=2, etc. This is the most basic requirement. Average people aren't adventurers for a reason. Because they can't be. But hey, at least we aren't being murdered by our cats anymore...
There is a reason you don't wrestle alligators in the sewers right now. Because you wouldn't do that. Play someone who isn't you. Playing yourself gets uncomfortable really quickly, if not outright boring. I've made that mistake too many times, and if I'm honest, the real reason I did it was because I didn't want to go outside of my comfort zone.
Also, since this is for PFS, you cannot take monk of the sacred mountain. You can't multiclass old monk and unchained monk, and unchained monk can't take any archetypes. I'm not using Unchained Monk. I'm using Unchained Rogue + regular monk archetype.
Have you tried searching for a game online? Try roll20 or d20pro. There are usually plenty of games looking for players. I'd love to join an online game if it's really that easy. How does that work anyway?
I've been trying to put together a game for a while now. I don't feel comfortable attending my local PFS for my own reasons, but it's been rapidly shrinking within the last year or so anyway. After about two years of not playing, I'd be happy to join just about any Pathfinder game at this point.
I much prefer to be a player, but if recruiting a GM takes longer than putting the rest of the group together, I could run a few PFS scenarios I have laying around to warm everybody up.
The caravan vanity can be used to let you use bluff to make a dayjob check. Perfect! Now I don't need to spend feats, skills, traits OR gold! Awesome! Thanks!
My character in PFS is a halfling rogue who, when not pathfindering, is a very active member in the Bellflower Network(halfling-founded anti-chelaxian slave liberator underground railroad type deal). What day job would he take to reflect this? Profession(spy)? His wisdom is terrible, so I would much prefer to have it reflected by a charisma skill if possible. The job is more about interacting with people than things anyway. Bluff or Disguise would honestly reflect the required skills much better, but I can't use those for a day job check to my knowledge.
My character in PFS is a halfling rogue who, when not pathfindering, is a very active member in the Bellflower Network(halfling-founded anti-chelaxian slave liberator underground railroad type deal). What day job would he take to reflect this? Profession(spy)? His wisdom is terrible, so I would much prefer to have it reflected by a charisma skill if possible. The job is more about interacting with people than things anyway. Bluff or Disguise would honestly reflect the required skills much better, but I can't use those for a day job check to my knowledge.
I don't want dive too deep into the build since that's not the question I asked about and I don't want to waste anyone's time, but I've decided that potions of Mage Armor are the way to go. Perhaps I should have explicitly stated from the beginning that the AC I was looking for was one I needed ASAP; my bad for not being more specific. While I have a few ranks in UMD, charisma is my dump stat, so there is no way that would go. I don't have any levels to spare taking a magic class; rogue/monk multi-class needs to be leveled carefully. Potions of Mage Armor are dirt cheap; 50gp each. I have 5 of those, 5 Tanglefoot Bags(always sooooo good) and a wand of Cure Light. Besides thieves essentials like MTW thieves tools, I honestly can't even think of needing anything else. I have 1,000 extra gold and I just got to second level. Levels, in order:
Yeah, I'm going Unchained. At 5th level, he'll get +4 Dex damage on his flurry, as well as 2D6+4 Sneak Attack on each hit. I've had this Dex-based aasimar monk sitting on the shelf for like two years without really knowing what to do with it once I got to second level. Once Unchained came out, I had some interesting ideas about a monk-rogue build, and then remembered that he existed. XD Next level I'll be getting toughness and nat. armor +1 from my archetype, which makes my AC 23; that should be enough. I'll also take the Mantis Style feat(I had totally forgotten about that feat; thanks for the reminder!). The foes that aren't immune to non-lethal should be down before they even become a threat with 2D6+2 or 3D6+4 damage a round and the stun making my allies attacks pretty much auto-hit.. My fourth rogue level(8th level) will entail Rogue Talent->Ninja Talent->Vanishing Trick, because better late than never, right? I don't know about Barkskin with this build... I'm multi-classing and already have a static +1 nat armor starting next level. Since the archetype replaces my 4th level ki power, I won't get to use Qinggog until my 6th monk level, at which I have many other options. I'll definitely be going Qingging though... they are so broken... WHY ARE THERE NO DOWNSIDES??? I can always wait to take Barkskin when the caster level overcomes the inconvenience of nat armor bonuses not stacking. Since I have 4 non-monk levels stymieing my growth in that area(totally worth it though!), Barkskin won't really get the chance to reach the caster level it needs to be really good(6th-9th monk level). I want to save up for a (PERFECT for Multiclass), but that may need to be a long-term plan since 13,000 is so much at this level. Bracer's of Armor, as good as they are, will likely never be relevant to a monk that spams Mage Armor. Items that increase Dex/Wis, items that give miscellaneous AC bonuses(such as Ring of Protection) as well as the aforementioned robe are what I think I'll go for in the long run. Surely, after the 3 years of training that a Pathfinder goes through, you'd have a passing familiarity with basic buff spells. I don't see that as a role-playing issue. You're a professional adventurer, not some wide-eyed farm boy fresh out of the countryside. Excellent Point! Man, Seekers of Secrets is an awesome book; I need to read it again. It explains Pathfinder initiation in detail and I really recommend it to anyone who wants to learn more about that process as well as almost all the venture captains and some really cool items.
Of course, most people would probably be happy if they just started letting us use photo copies from the books again. I realize they stopped this because of some specific incidents of people cheating, but was it really that wide spread of a problem? SERIOUSLY! That's what I want to know. People going out of their way to get a book from the library or a friend and scan it themselves doesn't sound like a pandemic.
Funny thing is that I already do this... About a year ago I bought a 64GB flashdrive and I wear it has a necklace. It has: -Every picture I've ever taken(thousands)
If I owned the PDFs I needed, I would already be carrying them wherever I go. I already carry Seekers of Secrets and Pathfinder Unchained everywhere via this method. I'm tempted to simply save the relevant urls on my phone, and if a GM doesn't accept that, I'll give them a copy of this thread and said: "Hey, I tried, alright?"
I'm trying to finish up a Monk-Rogue build in PFS. Stunning Fist + Flurry of Blows + Sneak Attack is godly. Sap Adept at level one. Currently, I just reached level 2. My AC is 18. Wis=3, Dex=4, +1 Dodge bonus from Dodge. I have no extra feat slots available, and roughly 1,400 gold to spend. UMD is a rogue skill, but not an option. The best solution I got so far was a suggestion from a really old thread; "get a wand of Mage Armor and give it to somebody else." Not only is that majorly inconsistent, but I can't make head or tails of it from a role-playing perspective. I don't have knowledge arcane or spellcraft. "I went to a magic item store and told the guy at the counter I get hurt too often. He handed me this wand. Not sure what it does. Poke me with it and we'll see what happens." Maybe AC potions? Shield or Mage Armor? I vaguely remember some spells are arbitrarily banned in PFS as potions, like True Strike, so I'm not sure how that would work. Any ideas?
I'm trying to finish up a Monk-Rogue build in PFS. Stunning Fist + Flurry of Blows + Sneak Attack is godly. Sap Adept at level one. Currently, I just reached level 2. My AC is 18. Wis=3, Dex=4, +1 Dodge bonus from Dodge. I have no extra feat slots available, and roughly 1,400 gold to spend. UMD is a rogue skill, but not an option. The best solution I got so far was a suggestion from a really old thread; "get a wand of Mage Armor and give it to somebody else." Not only is that majorly inconsistent, but I can't make head or tails of it from a role-playing perspective. I don't have knowledge arcane or spellcraft. "I went to a magic item store and told the guy at the counter I get hurt too often. He handed me this wand. Not sure what it does. Poke me with it and we'll see what happens." Maybe AC potions? Shield or Mage Armor? I vaguely remember some spells are arbitrarily banned in PFS as potions, like True Strike, so I'm not sure how that would work. Any ideas?
I would interpret Charisma 1 as a complete inability to communicate in any way, as Charisma 0 is permanent unconsciousness(until it raises above 0). In that interpretation, people would likely think you're asleep most of the time. Perhaps think of it as being "locked-in". Your intelligence and wisdom remain, but any function of communication simply doesn't exist in your brain, including body language and facial expression. How about you become someone's familiar? Familiars in practical application have little physical use, so you basically just act normally as a party member with that as a fluff explanation. The concept of being a familiar allows you to roleplay without communicating; just your existence indicates a purpose. "I am a familiar and I never communicate." How would you play that? What would it be like to be a familiar? That's a roleplaying challenge for you. You could even cheat the system a bit by using the mind-link rule, meaning you have limited communication, having only the ability to speak through your "master". In session, beyond declaring physical action, you whisper anything you say to that player, and they say whatever the hell they want. Maybe they tell the party what you said. Maybe they paraphrase it. Maybe they make something up. You role-play the consequences of that. "I don't think you look fat in that, but my familiar does." It's more fun than is sounds. I played an Oracle with Tongues in a language no one else spoke. I was being too meta, so the GM challenged me, as a player, to NEVER SPEAK during combat. It was a good challenge and was a blast to play out. It would be even funnier if you get your charisma back later; "I DID NOT think she looked fat in that, you jerk!"
I had to put this disclaimer eventually...:
I spend 20-30 minutes or more on each comment I make. This is because when I talk online, I come across as very blunt and inconsiderate, because of the lack of vocal and visual elements of communication. So I either:
1. Put in the disclaimer that I respect everyone and consider what they have to say carefully even though it may not come across(what I'm doing here) 2. Carefully and laboriously revise every comment I make to sound less confrontational and remove offensive overly-broad statements or opinions(what I did with every other comment) As long threads continue, I generally get gradually more blunt and people start getting insulted. Might as well say something now in case that starts happening.
Thank you for communicating that in a non-condescending way. It proves such things are possible. The observation about the solution and their feasibility was also very insightful, as many of the alternatives others provided seemed perfectly logical and compromising. That perspective is very helpful, even if it kind of sucks to hear. As I stated above, books were the only way to obtain the material while following this rule. I also had about $200 of store credit at a book store from selling old textbooks, and got a lot of the material that way. I own books and not PDFs BECAUSE OF ACTUAL REASONS. One of the many, many, many reasons I hate online communication is that people assume I don't have basic problem solving skills or that I haven't eliminated incredibly obvious alternate options. Thus, I have to explain every single reason as to why I didn't use other solutions, such as bringing less books, or why I bought books in the first place. I know the other obvious solutions, and they either don't work, like carrying less books, or aren't acceptable, like spending 50+ dollars for material I already have. I've tried providing other options and so have other people here but the people who have the greatest credibility keep reminding me that ZE RULES ARE OBZULUTE! It really does not seem like a lot to ask when I've already spent the money on them. I mean seriously, come on; this thread demonstrates that PFS is anal about finding solutions to rules that are overly anal. Bottom line, this still needs to be solved. I own the books. I used them to make characters. I followed the rules carefully. I made my purchases thoughtfully. I did everything right. Now what?
My comment was referring to the knowledge upon purchase that PDFs would be undebatably better for PFS specifically, not better in general. E.G. Besides Starred GMs, who the f*** is going to think upon purchase "I better buy all my books as PDFs because otherwise some vestigial non-gameplay related rule in PFS will screw me over. This realization will definitely motivate me to not use the store-credit I have for my book store or any of the other reasons one might prefer to purchase books over PDFs, such as not having a portable device to display them on." So it was your misunderstanding. That's what happens when you take a single sentence out of context. As such, I will save my witty sarcastic remarks, as they are not applicable. However, I suggest that you save your smug technological superiority for when it's applicable, instead of at a comment you misunderstood. You have absolutely no clue as to why I bought books over PDFs, and your presumptions proceeded you. As a matter of fact, one of the reasons I bought them as books was specifically to adhere to said rule. At the time I had no way of using a PDF portably, so I couldn't demonstrate that I owned the material. Rather ironic, isn't it? Anyway, moving on...
No one answered my question...Now, you might labor to get the rule changed, or find some way to help yourself and others in that situation, but frankly that is not the question you asked. Actually, the first three posts did indeed not answer my question, so yes, it was about the question I asked. I made the post you quoted REALLY early in the thread. Now that I received the answer, we are having a discussion about a possible fix. Seems pretty fair to me. The rules need to be available to the GM. The GM can't be expected to know your character, and needs to be able to check the book if they want to. I already addressed that! As I said, every session, without fail, someone has internet. Problem solved(mostly). I list every source I use on my character sheets, and as well as the exact pages of confusing or dubious abilities(see the Misfortune example). If that + internet isn't good enough, I don't know what is. This wouldn't even be a problem if player weren't forbidden to bring print-outs because of "marketing".
The reason for bringing it with is to be able to make knowledgeable rules adjudications at the table when some things interact strangely, or to make sure that both the player and the GM understand how some of the odder results can come up. This is NOT what I'm asking! I've been playing PFS for YEARS, and I've ran a few sessions myself you know. I understand all the whys and hows. I'm looking for an ALTERNATIVE to the rule. Unfortunately, the only way they've come up with to do this is to have the player bring the rules. I bought books, not PDFs. Now I'm being told that PDFs are pretty much strictly better for use in PFS. Does that seem right to you? Should I be REGRETTING the fact that I bought books from my LGS or Paizo instead of PDFs? That's what you're implying. If that IS what you think should happen, I have all sorts of witty sarcastic remarks prepared.
^This. This so much. I don't like the rule, but I'm fine with it existing. Being so anal and inflexible about its enforcement is what's biting my ass.
Do they really get totally screwed if caught? Have you ever witnessed (or even heard of) someone being forced to leave the table (or reported up the chain) for not bringing correct source materials? I can only say this for myself, but it's much more frequent and likely to get caught before the game starts. I have been asked by GMs half a dozen times about abilities/items, the most frequent being Weapon Cords(which have been errated since then and are not nearly as good) and Misfortune(which I can't blame them for because it's really broken/meta). Since I have been asked that frequently, I assumed it was normal for everyone to get asked now and then. If I didn't have my source material, it would have been problematic. But in the case of what I have observed for other people... The worst I have ever seen is people being told to "make sure you bring it next time." And that's only from those few times anyone actually checked. ...it's usually this^. Again, I follow these rules because they are the rules. I understand that it's easier to go without the material, but why should I get to choose which cases apply and which don't? Should I use utterly broken third party content? "Fix" chronicle sheets I feel are unfair? Adjust pre-gens? Should I ignore the retraining rules? etc. As much as I hate this rule(and boy do I), I respect my venture officers and PFS at large and thus I follow the rules without exception. I guess when I am forced to make an exception for the sake of realism, such as now, I will... ...but should I really have to? If some of the rules are so blatantly impractical that I have to not follow them in order to attend/play, why should I be punished, even a little, if I'm caught intentionally ignoring them? This is the kind of rule that I feel really needs to be fixed.
Besides, most Cons I have been to sell those bars of soap with dice embedded in the middle of them to 'encourage' gamers to use the soap. I wish... I could imagine an April Fools update to Addition Resources that makes bathing daily required to play and bans all magical items and classes under the explanation that magic doesn't add enough the game world.
Occasionally, I see new players come to PFS, have a good time, then get told that they cant even play a non-pregen without investing $40 into a Core Rulebook, and I never see them again. That was from a while ago, to be honest. It hasnt happened recently. In further attempt to lay out my situation, I haven't played PFS in over a year. I left because there were problems with the system that made me unable to enjoy my time there anymore. I want to get back into it, so I've been making many threads hoping to address these problems.
Some classes/feats/traits have features that require either drinking or being flat-out wasted. I know it's mentioned in the DMG, but in PFS are there effects from either of those or is it simply a role-playing thing?
If the rules are going to punish me for having more material that seems pretty ass-backwards. Im just saying. Not to mention that, given the current level of enforcement, the rule punishes those who follow it far more than it punishes those who don't. That... is a really good point. The only offset of it is that if someone doesnt follow it, they get totally screwed when caught. But that seems like entirely the wrong intent of how ANY rule shod be made enforced. I stayed away from this in the OP, but Im going to be candid and admit that I HATE this rule. It punishes veteran players by forcing them to bring everything for their characters(especially those with multiple characters that play whatever the party needs), and it puts new players at a disadvantage when they cant find/afford the Advanced Players Guide, the Ultimate Magic and Absurdly Broken Adventure Path #17. It also creates a warped view of "cheating". According to this rule, using perfectly legal builds following PFS regulations is "cheating" if the player doesnt have ALL the source material they wanted to use. The right feats can make or break a build, and if you invest in a book for a feature and that feature is banned, you feel cheated. Occasionally, I see new players come to PFS, have a good time, then get told that they cant even play a non-pregen without investing $40 into a Core Rulebook, and I never see them again. Additionally, I have never been to a session in which there wasnt someone with internet. Often when there is a question of rules there are three people looking it up on their phones at the same time. I understand that the GM needs to be able to check abilities every now and then but access to them is rarely the actual problem. If the player knows they're doing, they should know the source/ability nane. Them having NO IDEA where their abilities came from is a small exception, and generally players like that are problematic for other reasons already. Sorry, I went on for a bit long there. Im thinking my beef with this rule might deserve a thread of its own considering there are no established solutions to my original question.
I'm the kind of guy who likes to tell the GM upfront about any unusual aspects of my character. I do that too. For my rogue with Trap Spotter I made a little index card for the GM to use that includes my characters perception for traps that also the quoted ability from the CR. Thats just one example. Blame the cheaters for the fact that you have to carry books or buy extra PDFs. I want to meet you half way with this, but I cannot. I cant accept "other people cheat and you pay the price" as a simple premise because its not that simple. I always try to make all my abilities crystal clear and also provide resources for the GM. I follow the rules. Im almost never asked for the source material, but I bring it anyway because the rules say to. If the rules are going to punish me for having more material that seems pretty ass-backwards. Im just saying.
No one answered my question...
I once played with someone who had a half-orc monk named "thud".
I am a long time PFS player, and as a result I have 5-10 characters using a variety of sources. Carrying all the books I use(8 hardcover, 4 pamphlet things, 1 small binder, plus my character binder) has become overwhelming. (I don't own a car) I've been doing this for YEARS, just to follow the "you must provide source material" rule, and I can't keep bringing the books to every session anymore because it's simply not realistic.
Obviously a photograph wouldn't be enough, but something along those lines. Small portable or perhaps digital. I acquired my own laptop recently, so a PDF would be ideal, but I've already spent hundreds of dollars on PRPG and am not intent on spending $50+ more to get copies of books I already have. So that isn't happening. Are there an official rules about proof of ownership beyond the bring it with you/PDF rule?
1. Flurry of blows is very restrictive. If flurry of maneuvers did not have the unarmed restriction, it seems like they should mention it, as it is much more powerful with weapons(reach, potentially bonuses, etc). 2. Quote "...checks suffer a –2 penalty when using a flurry." This is the biggest point of confusion for me. I find that confusing because it makes it seem like the flurries are equivocal, which would by extension mean that the unarmed restriction applies to both. If it said "a flurry of maneuvers" instead "a flurry" it would be much more clear. 3. The unarmed restriction is further implied, just a little, by the continued presence of the Improved Unarmed Strike feat. 4. Better safe than sorry. This is a rule I've adopted from PFS. I do extensive research before making ANY character to make sure that I understand EVERY rule, that EVERY ability works the way I think it does, and that everything I use is legal. I make threads like this one all the time. I usually already know the answers, but if there is any ambiguity I don't like to assume.
Can I use Flurry of Maneuvers while holding a weapon? The text is very unclear. I don't see why not, so my interpretation is yes... but I thought I'd ask. Edit: Sorry about the repeats guys. Very random and Im not positive as to why that happened.... Just finished deleting them all.
Bob Bob Bob I appreciate the advice and I like most of it but maybe you could tone it back from saying the build sucks/abysmal/sh**? Its really rude and it makes me defensive. No one likes people calling their builds sh**, which you literally did. I had forgotten whips arent light. Thank you for reminding me. Ill try taking TWF at a later level, perhaps. This isnt a first draft. Ive tried many of the things you suggested. Whip characters are NOT easy. I tried it with bard. It was beyong awful. Utterly unworkable. Pretty much all Im getting is whip prof and cure light. Everything else is useless. Performance simply replaces the BAB it screwed my out of. Yeah, damage sucks at first. Thats just how whip builds are. I also tried the same build without both summoner and without TWF. It was terrible. I go from racking up the sneak damage from 2-4 attacks to wow-anything-is-better-than-this. I didnt consider druid, because Ive never made a druid in Pathfinder before. My companion would be better certainly, but MY AC would be garbage. Ill consider it. Here's a big difference to consider Bob: If the eidolon gets killed, it can come back the next day. My companion gets killed? Not so simple. If Im having a puny monster following me around, it would be better if there were no real consequences for its death. It can die every session and it wont matter. :) But again, enemies attacking tiny monsters that arent even threatening them seems really meta. Why would they do that unless they knew how flank/sneak attack worked? "Yes, Im going to waste my round attacking an eagle or eidolon that does no damage instead of the fighter, caster, or literally anyone else." Plus I still have other party members, AND I have 4 summon monster 1s... or at least I think I do. I had *just* finished making the build when I discovered the Summoner was banned, so I havent made those adjustments yet. I got the PDF and skimmed it. At first glance there didnt seem to be much difference, so I didnt notice the change in evolution points. The eidolon would use wands when warranted and flank when warranted. Its called "flexibility". With a UMD of 14(12, +2 for wands Ive used before), my success rate is actually 70%, which is not bad at all for UMD at THIRD LEVEL. The eidolon doesnt need to be good. It needs to be good ENOUGH. When I get into higher levels, this will become more of a problem. I knew these problems would happen, hence asking for advice. BTW, moving in Grease makes them flat-footed. Just saying. Yeah, the will save isnt great. He cant be good at EVERYTHING; a rogue with a crappy will save? Heavens above! ...but Ill work on it to see what I can do. I think Ill ditch Dirty Fighter for a +1 will trait. F***ing of course my damage isnt going to be as good as a strength based power-attack user. Not until much later, that is. There is NOTHING I can do to change that. Im not expecting to get sneak on AoOs. Why would I need to? The AoOs are ADDITIONAL damage. Calm down. Yeah, creatures that cant be sneaked/non-lethaled are going to be a b**** to fight. So I either go in with a greatsword of trip them relentlessly. Im not sure I understand the criticism of a whip build for having weaknesses that come from it being a whip build, such as the above two paragraphs I wrote. Of course it does. The whip builds Ive seen were made by GMs and STARTED at 8th level. I dont have that luxury. I have to make it workable as soon as possible, and I dont have feats to waste on alternative options. Martial proficiency with greatsword and longbow will have to do.
|