Fourleaf's page

Class: Unchained Rogue, archetype swashbuckler
Race: Human
Traits : Bruising Intellect and bloody- minded

str 13
dex 16
con 13
int 14
wis 9
cha 10

Progression:
1. Martial training(star-knife), Feat: exotic weapon proficiency; Bladed Scarf, Bonus Feat(human): combat reflexes

2. RT: weapon training; Bladed Scarf

3. Finesse training; Bladed Scarf, Feat: power Attack

4. RT: Bleeding Attack

5. Rogue's edge; intimidate, Feat cleave

6. RT: combat trick; Dazzling display, BRT(favored class): offensive
defense (if GM approves) or whatever you like/need

7. Feat: Great Cleave

8. RT: combat trick; shatter defenses

9. Feat: violent Display

10. RT: Double Debilitation, Rogue's edge: Perform (maybe)

11. Finesse training: star-knife, Feat: lunge

12. RT: Stalker Talent; strike the unseen (or shadow's sight), BRT(favored class): Skill master

13. Feat: stand still (or combat expertise taking Feat for RT at 14 and greater trip at 15)

Weapon special abilities that work for the are Dazzling Radiance and Cruel.

Affects you can apply at LvL are bleed, shaken, frightened, panicked, bewildered, disoriented, and/or hampered. You can also trip with the Bladed scarf. Plus whatever enhancement bonuses on your gear.

So what should be changed added and do i do after Lvl 13? Is there something here that doesn't work?

There are not any core rogue talents i can see that are better the the unchained ones, not even minor major magic (other then minor doesn't tell you casts per day in unchained would say 3 till FAQ-ed).

So what talents are you looking at?

On a side note...

Will players ever, please oh mighty gods, EVER stop playing CN as a pre-fabricated excuse to get away with endless dick-moves vs. NPCs and/or PCs alike?

Ever???

This is the first time I've played something other than a NG-G cleric. As for my next guy, he is going to be lvl 5 musket master that found religion and became a holy gun LG. so one level into holy gun now and will stay that way. Staying ranged because this is a group of ten and six of them are melee I'd like to stay out of the cluster. Being LG is the GM idea because the party is getting so off the rails and thinks have a LG paladin telling them they can't kill everyone and anyone for anything they want.

As for getting caught i can just out those plotting to kill party members and the sorcerer that is a Dhampir also most likely to be E. Hope this causes enough of a distraction to get away making me into a npc that might show up later...

Muleback Cords Aura faint transmutation; CL 3rd Slot shoulders; Price 1,000 GP; Weight 1/4 lb. Description These thick leather cords wrap around the wearer's biceps and shoulders; when worn, they make the muscles appear larger than normal. The wearer treats his Strength score as 8 higher than normal when determining his carrying capacity.

Found in Ultimate Equipment pg267.

just to point to the op.

being kitsune and using hat of desgiuse give the same bonus when you apear to be human. as both work using the same spell. so it wont stack. is like wearing two sets of shoes so yo uwont be barfoot.

Change Shape (Su): A kitsune can assume the appearance of a specific single human form of the same sex. The kitsune

Alter Self
School transmutation (polymorph); Level bard 2, sorcerer/wizard 2
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S, M (a piece of the creature whose form you plan
to assume)
Range personal
Target you
Duration 1 min./level (D)
When you cast this spell, you can assume the form of any
Small or Medium creature of the humanoid type. If the form
you assume has any of the following abilities, you gain the
listed ability: darkvision 60 feet, low-light vision, scent, and
swim 30 feet.
Small creature: If the form you take is that of a Small humanoid,
you gain a +2 size bonus to your Dexterity.
Medium creature: If the form you take is that of a Medium
humanoid, you gain a +2 size bonus to your Strength. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/a/alter-self

Disguise Self
School illusion (glamer); Level bard 1, sorcerer/wizard 1
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range personal
Target you
Duration 10 min./level (D)
You make yourself—including clothing, armor, weapons, and
equipment—look different. You can seem 1 foot shorter or taller,
thin, fat, or in between. You cannot change your creature type
(although you can appear as another subtype). Otherwise, the
extent of the apparent change is up to you. You could add or
obscure a minor feature or look like an entirely different person
or gender.
The spell does not provide the abilities or mannerisms of the
chosen form, nor does it alter the perceived tactile (touch) or audible
(sound) properties of you or your equipment. If you use this spell
to create a disguise, you get a +10 bonus on the Disguise check. A
creature that interacts with the glamer gets a Will save to recognize
it as an illusion. http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/d/disguise-self

So alter self does not give +10 bonus on the Disguise check its racial. Using disguise self is a spell that adds +10 bonus on the Disguise check. They are also different spells so they can stack. As well as taking the feat No name next lvl and getting +10 more is possible. All three are different type of effects.

I also agree with this, but only for an Evil or Chaotic Neutral alignment Character. I wouldn't imagine other alignments would be down for doing that. Maybe an excuse for CG alignment if no one else is around, but not while companions are actively around you. (compelled good or neutral characters though because of some mysterious reason where they get tempted.... like a drawback that sometimes kicks in, maybe. maybe. but that would really be pushing it.) Hilarious for a group of all CN and/or Evil characters. Everyone trying to do it at times... You get caught the other players take an item form you as punishment.

I'm CN as is most the party with a few N and one NG and one NE. The GM has said that I'm playing a paladin if i die or have to run because I get caught. This is so I don't play the same alignment and to add RP because people are killing each other.

One: Only small type items and no taking 10 or 20 on the SoH check obviously. Like daggers, rings, potions, headband, maybe a short sword or a belt. Belt could be pushing it as the time intensiveness of the nature of trying to get it off (maybe give a bonus to the companions' perception check if allowing that while companions are around when trying to get something like that.) That being for active group around you. If you are alone and find stuff, you could go after bigger things if you are able to put it somewhere, like a bag of holding for instance. But be careful with that as that is a bit more labor intensive(noises being heard.....,) and could increase your chances of being caught by a returning companion. Getting caught while you were by yourself can try to make an excuse with teh DM doing both your Bluff check if you are lying, or Diplomacy check if the item they see you are putting away you were actually going to let them know about, and their Sense Motive check and then the DM saying whether they believe you or not.

Talking 10 or 20 would be so broken and doing this is standard action with free action being -10. Yes small items only and I only have about 4.5bls I can take till I'm put a medium load. only have 8 Str.

Two: If you are doing this in a current and/or ended combat area where others are, they will probably start to wonder why you are staying so far back and not doing anything except huddling over by the dead bodies. Sure, there are ways to get around this. Say you are hurt and are searching the body for a heal potions. That being said because as players you don't have to tell someone how far down you are exactly in hit points (they could do a perception to see how you look,) but exact numbers is technically metagaming. When doing this type of thing there will be opposed perception checks, but honestly according to the written out rules of the books, that roll is to be done in secret by the GM.

As a gunslinger I sit in the back sometimes holding actions to make a casters day hell. Also bullets aren't cheap so i don't use the to kill this that die in one hit unless its to save a party member. They do know this I'm not the only gunslinger.

Three: If you get caught, something bad may happen to your character by the other players' characters... If that Character ends up being removed from play for some reason because of being caught. Would probably make a consequence be that you had to then play a character with the opposite alignment before you could go back to that alignment again. Gotta be consequences for having got caught......

Four: Completely viable thing to do by a CN or Evil alignment character.

Five: Be far easier if the rest of the group headed on if you were still looking around for hidden rooms (this actually happened in a campaign I was in. A friend, who is quite more duplicitous than I, and I who were both CN alignments stayed back to finish looking around the room. Others went on to the next couple rooms. WE searched, found a secret room. We split everything between ourselves as it fit for the characters... lqtm.) Definite added elements to group dynamics and story within the group.

I am and most the party is CN. In a group of ten people. This also means based on my the amount of stuff I can take is limited 4.5 to stay under light load, but getting the free time to move stuff to my bag of holding and this will not happen in combat or when the party is around.

Six: Already stated this but if they are around, definite perception checks, but done by the GM with penalties, because of all the stuff going on, or bonuses if nothing is going on or another players "Character" is suspicious. etc.

Yes the GM is making these rolls because there is far to much meta gaming happening as well as people lieing about rolls and their HP. Now he has to do more work be babysitting ten players because singling out the few might cause problems. We play in a store that anyone can show up and play as long as they fallow store rule. This is one of the reasons party members want to kill others is so that those people wont want to play. This I don't like but people are people.

Seven: Most metagaming would be frowned upon. If a player just starts going I am gonna stay with the Thief because the player knows he is stealing, something could happen to the metagaming character.

I say most because probably one would be doing a lot of secret messages with the GM. If you get caught because you are constantly sending secret messages to the DM, that metagaming would be ok to me but that would translate to a bonus on their perception rolls to catch you because that would be in game and only metagaming by the GM, which is ok. lol. But as said if they try to catch you "lifting" the dead body or such because the player thinks you are stealing and not the Character actually suspecting/figuring it out, something would happen to the metagaming character.

Meta gaming is very big in my party with only two people and me RPing in this RPG. The newer people are not and people that have been playing table to RPGs for years don't like that.

If you don't agree with allowing this, One thing you should do as a DM/GM.

One: If you aren't cool with the idea, don't allow evil or chaotic neutral player characters. That would solve everything. As those types of alignments can do just that. Or just don't allow it even if you allow CN or Evil alignments

Doing this is role playing in a role play game and you should always want that.

why are you so sure your safe?

remmber the leason from the southpark's episode about game of thrones. while you were out there some1 else was also taking a walk in the rose garden....

I'm not 100% sure I'm safe, that's why I'm investing in items that help my bluff, disguise, perception (no one else in the group puts ranks in) sense motive and sleight of hand. With this I'm at the point I'm extremely unlikely to get caught and if i do I will be able to get out of it.

With disguise I am kitsune, so there's ten with change shape (they have never seen my human form) the hat of disguise which is another plus ten and next feat I take will be no name which is another plus ten. My normal bonus is plus six, so with all these bonuses that's a plus 36 to my disguise check. So if I do get caught I can run off and disguise myself so well, I can rejoin the party as a human gunslinger.

To clarify for those of you who seem confused, I am not stealing directly from my party members I am looting the dead {the ones I kill/do the most damage to) before the rest of the party checks the bodies, they don't even know the things I'm taking exist.

No. As a DM I have a house rule that being a jerk to other players provokes attacks of opportunity.

So in this group some of the party is looking at kill one member because they don't like him(and if they do I'm planing on do this to his belt of +2 Str. Also if they kill him there is a second party member that might die because they a friends. Everyone is looking to back stab everyone.

I want to loot bodies of dead foes while my party fights on without out my party seeing me. What I would like to know is what kind of DC would it be to do this. Is there a differences if an ally is next to me, has their back to me, or is behind me all the while they are fighting? I'm a CL5 Musket Master/ CL1 Ninja. SoH +11 Stealth + 15

As the GM ruled it (at the time and is asking the same thing) the DC for me was 10 plus their perception bonuses. As long as they continued fighting. This is not for things like armor/most weapons. Its for looting money/gem/jewelery/papers etc unseen. Is there a better way of doing this.

Also would like would you let your players do this to their party. As a player that sees them doing this what would you do?