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I think I meant spell combat instead of spellstrike. Could I potentially cast Mage Hand with spell combat, have the hand manifest on
or next to my target and use either Ranged Aid or Dirty Magic Trick during that action? I would then not concentrate on it, it would go away, then on my next turn using spell combat just do it again?

Hello! I've been trying to make a build that will have a lot of use of Mage Hand but I'm afraid I'm not 100% on the action economy on how to use it. The biggest question I guess is: do I get to do something with it immediately when I cast it?

I'm hoping to use Mage Hand with the feat Magic Trick to use Dirty Magic Trick and/or Ranged Aid. How exactly would this work? In addition, how would it work if I had the Swift Aid feat? Can I use Mage Hand with Spellstrike in this way? Or maybe Ranged Spellstrike?

Thanks for your help in advance.

Firebug wrote:
Issue 1: Scribe Scroll
Creating Scrolls wrote:
Creating Scrolls:The creator must have prepared the spell to be scribed (or must know the spell, in the case of a sorcerer or bard) and must provide any material component or focus the spell requires.

You can't scribe Major Image if you don't have it memorized as a Wizard, and since it's a 3rd level spell and you only have 1st level spell slots, that's not going to happen.

Issue 2: You may have issues getting the GM to approve a goat being able to use a crossbow/artillery team.

Eldritch Guardian's Share Training wrote:
Eldritch Guardian's Share Training: The familiar doesn’t have to meet the feat’s prerequisites, but at the GM’s discretion may be precluded from using certain combat feats due to its physical form. For example, an eldritch guardian’s pig familiar with access to Exotic Weapon Proficiency (spiked chain) would not gain the ability to use spiked chains, since it doesn’t have any limbs capable of properly handling them.

Issue 3: If your Goat can use Artillery Team and you are planning on being mounted on the goat, you will have other issues. Specifically, you can't "trace a line from your space to the target’s space in such a way that the line passes through the ally’s space" since it's the same space.

Issue 4: Artillery Training doesn't apply to a Heavy Repeating Crossbow. Light Crossbow, Heavy Crossbow and Musket only. Unlike weapons like a Scorpion Whip or Orc Hornbow, the Repeating line of crossbows don't have special rules saying that you can treat them as regular...

Thanks for the reply! I knew there would be issues.

1) I guess I'll just have to buy them. Did not see this part on d20pfsrd anywhere.

2) I was hoping my GM would allow it considering the unseen servant will be the one loading it instead of the goat. Perhaps I'll have to take one of my alternative routes. Figment familiar with limbs evolution or get a monkey and make it small somehow.

3) I do not plan on mounting the goat as well as using it for artillery feat at the same time.

4) I think that is a small enough of a distinction that my GM shouldn't have a problem allowing it.

I have an idea for a build that I think would be pretty fun but I'd like to make sure it actually works. The idea is to take the feat Artillery Team and take a goat familiar with shared training through the Eldritch Guardian fighter archetype. I'd eventually have a large sized heavy repeating crossbow that I'd essentially be firing from my goat's back. I'd be a gnome and take the racial trait Utilitarian Magic to gain Unseen Servant to reload the crossbow for me. That's the basics.

Now, I wanted to double down on the goat theme and get a little magical since I'm a gnome. I took a level of wizard to get the illusion arcane school and made my goat the School Familiar archetype so he can concentrate for me. I also took the feat Effortless Trickery so I can concentrate as a swift action as well. Since I'm a wizard I'll be able to learn (not actually cast) the spell Major Image. Then I can make scrolls of it to use with the Scribe Scroll feat I'll get for free from wizard. With this I'll have two goat-men illusions potentially with halberds or something (think diablo 2 cow level) zoning for me.

Also with a level of wizard I'll be able to grab a wand of unseen servant to help with reloading. I'll also grab a wand of Gravity Bow.

I plan on taking a Wayfinder and Opalescent White Pyramid to help me with proficiency and weapon focus. I also took undersized mount for the fun of it.

Here is the build:

12 Fighter (Eldritch Guardian) / 1 Wizard, Gnome
STR: 5 DEX: 17 CON: 16 INT: 14, WIS: 14, CHA: 9

1) Artillery Team
3) Point Blank Shot
3W) Scribe Scroll
5) Precise Shot
5F) Rapid Shot
7) Vital Strike
7F) Undersized Mount
8) Advanced Armor Training - Armor Specialization
9) Effortless Trickery
9F) Deadly Aim
10) Advanced Weapon Training - Warrior Spirit
11) Clustered Shots
11F) Greater Weapon Focus
13) Improved Precise Shot
13F) Improved Vital Strike

Thoughts? Improvements? Does this actually work with a goat?

Hello! So I've got the pieces of a build I've been wanting to put together but I'm not sure what to do with them. I want to be a fighter, specifically an Eldritch Guardian and Mutation Warrior. I want to make use of the UMD skill I'll gain. I want my familiar to have the protector archetype to give me some insane survivability later on. I want to take a level in Tattoo Sorcerer to be able to turn my familiar into a tattoo. And all of this comes together into... what? I don't know what to do with it. Do I just get a greatsword and start swinging? Do I go weapon finesse with an elven curved blade? Grab a reach weapon? I don't have a clue. Help? And before anyone mentions it, I'm not interested in having my familiar have the mauler archetype. I'd prefer something a little more off the beaten path if possible.

I've come up with an idea to have a character that is an illusionist tank. He'll start as a cleric with the Love and Trickster domains tanking with the Copycat and Adoration abilities. He'll use stuff like Compel Hostility and Sanctuary to bring attacks his way. At level six he'll go Veiled Illusionist and gain illusion spells through the human veil at the start of each day. At that point he'll gain some illusion defenses like Mirror Image, Displacement, and Greater Invisibility to help take hits.

Now, he won't be any good at swinging a weapon (which I'm slightly worried about). But I think he'll be able to keep attention off his party by constantly making illusions of monsters and walls and all kinds of stuff to keep enemies swinging anywhere but at his party. Throw in some enchantment spells like confusion and murderous command and I'm hoping he'll be successful.

He'll be using Heighten Spell to keep things like sanctuary and compel hostility relevant along with Reach Spell. He'll of course still have medium armor, toughness, and a shield to keep himself alive along with hopefully a +CON item if the spells don't work out.

He'll take the alternative racial feats Keeper of Secrets and Arcane Focus for defensive casting bonuses and an enchantment DC buff. He's an elf.


STR-7 Dex-16 Con-12 Int-14 Wis-19(+2 4th,8th) Cha-9


1(Race) Spell Focus: Illusion
1-Combat Casting
3-Reach Spell
7-Heighten Spell
9-Greater Spell Focus: Illusion
11-Quicken Spell

Any ideas on improvements or spell selection? Anyone play something like this before and have it fail or succeed?

Melkiador wrote:
There is also a very questionable thing from monster advancement to consider and possibly discuss with your GM:
As a general rule, creatures whose Hit Dice increase by 50% or more should also increase in size, but GMs should feel free to ignore this rule if warranted by the individual creature or situation.

Most agree that this doesn't apply to the guardian spirit, because it never mentions size, but it never says not to change the size either. However, changing size is also noted as being especially open to skipping in monster advancement, so maybe it was neglected for this reason.

Personally, I think it'd be fine to allow the size change. It would really open up the number of usable creature choices for this feat, and shouldn't result in anything meaningfully more powerful than other summoned monsters of the given spell level.

A good point worth considering. I'd love to get it out of tiny so it wouldn't automatically draw an AOO everytime it wanted to get into range to attack.

Alright, got it all figured out now. Thanks a ton Melkiador!

Great! That information helps fill in all but one gap. How do I determine how many feats it would get? I'd guess normal feat progression but it seems to already have two at two HD.

Should I just give it an extra 2 feats for HD 3 and 5 and just assume it is special and got an extra feat early on?

Say I use the spell Spiritual Squire and have it use the 'Aid Another' action on an ally and it succeeds. Then consider that I have benevolent armor as well as the helpful trait improving my own aid another action. Does the spiritual squire provide the normal +2 bonus or do they provide my bonus? I'm leaning towards using my bonus because the spell says "perform the aid another action on your behalf" but I'm unsure. Anyone have the answer? Thanks in advance!

Using the Summon Guardian Spirit feat I'm trying to stat out a Silvanshee as if I were using Summon Nature's Ally V. While I'm able to figure out things like ability scores I'm struggling to determine things like BAB, Feats, Skill Ranks, and Spell DC's. Under Guardian Spirit it says "It gains appropriate skill points, feats, ability score increases, base attack bonus, and base saving throw advancements for its increased Hit Dice." Where do I find the information to stat this creature and to further advance it once I gain more levels?

Hello! I'm running a game in which my players are delving into an ancient ruined city of a very advanced civilization from the distant past. The technology is for the most part all gone and ruined but there are strange things their characters don't quite understand still going on. (Such as things with electricity)

I need some monsters to put in this place but I'm running low on ideas. I've got clockworks and all of their kind as well as golems. I've also got a fair bit of traps and puzzle type situations and 'artifacts'. I've also got a boss that is a metallic half dragon, half sphinx that is pretty crazy. But I'm struggling to come up with anything else that might fit.

I considered maybe a normal monster that roamed inside the city but I've had the clockworks attack just about everything they spot so I'm not sure that would make much sense. Any monsters you guys can think of that might fit the setting?

MrCharisma wrote:

I'd probably go Fighter-2/Alchemist-8 before going into Master-Chymist. This opens up all the 8th level Alchemist discoveries (Fsst Bombs plus Blinding/Confusion bombs makes for a great opening volley before wading into combat). It also keeps your Master Chymist discoveries on even levels, which means you can take Greater/Grand Mutagen at the appropriate levels (12/16, rather than waiting till 13/17).

How does this work? I'm finally getting around to making this guy and wouldn't he get Greater/Grand at 14/18 because of the fighter levels?

I'm loving the Master Chymist idea. What would I go for with feats and discoveries? Do I go all melee or do I spare some points for Infusion or Bombing? While Explosive Missile sounds awesome, especially if I got like a conductive bow or something, could I really reliably hit things if I'm more STR based? I guess I could use my mutagen for DEX when I plan on going ranged.

The whole Panther/Ascetic Style certainly seems interesting but I'm struggling to get it to work here. Scott you have a sample build or something you could tag onto the first 5 levels of mine to show me how that would work out?

Our DM had us create a character that had to have minimum 1 level of fighter and had to be a dwarf. I went on to create an alchemist/fighter that I thought turned out pretty well. (Really good stats because of DM rules)

Lvl 1 - Fighter (Spear Fighter): Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Mobility
Lvl 2 - Alchemist (Grenadier): Throw Anything
Lvl 3 - Alchemist (Grenadier): Combat Expertise, Alchemical Weapon, Precise Bombs
Lvl 4 - Alchemist (Grenadier):
Lvl 5 - Fighter (Spear Fighter): Spring Attack, Whirlwind

The premise is that he'll have a two-hander dwarven weapon with reach and use his potions for Enlarge Person. He'll give it some burst with alchemist fire attached with alchemical weapon plus he can throw bombs. But best of all he has whirlwind attack very quickly. Seems solid IMO.

The question is... where do I go next? Keeping up in fighter would be tough because the Spear Fighter archetype stunts me because I don't actually plan on using a spear. I could keep going alchemist and maybe get stuff for throwing bombs? Or maybe go into yet another class... or maybe there is a prestige class out there that can benefit me? I just have no idea where I'd go with this guy up to say, level 11. Anyone have any ideas?

Thanks for taking the time to come up with a build. It looks like it could work but it is just too far from what I'm going for. I'm keeping Sacred Servant and Unsanctioned Knowledge so those are must keep for me in this character. I also don't want to dip nearly that much. Maybe 1-2 levels top.

I also understood mobility would be a problem which is why the Travel domain really stood out. 10ft speed increase right off the bat and access to Longstrider quickly as well. Plus I'll be teleporting around in no time. Not the same as a mount but workable.

Bewildering Koan is pretty good but I just don't see a Paladin using Bluff. I know it can work but I think I'm going to avoid it. I wasn't sure where to put the last of my skill points so they went into Sense Motive for lack of a better choice.

Mithral Breastplate would be super nice for the much lower AC penalty and tiny bit of speed but the max dex doesn't help me any and the AC is lower. The +2 Fullplate seems better and cheaper.

Secret Wizard wrote:

I think one of the things going on here is that you are building as though you were a potent frontline brawler, but you've given up on several uses of Smite Evil and your Divine Bond. I'd say this build in particular would stand to benefit from a strategy other than "Fey Foundling to sustain Power Attacks", since you'll likely have a harder time punching through the opposition.

Another Unsanctioned Knowledge jewel is access to Haste, which I wouldn't miss out on if possible.

As for general recommendations... Why not lean more heavily into support?
You could take an archetype like Martyr or Oath of the People's Council, get a supportive Variant Divine Bond (Agathion for healing? Angelic for buffs? Archon for debuffs?).
Then, you could have access to special bard spells like Allegro, since Martyr and Oath of the PC gives you full bardic performance.

I'd consider a shield bash route for this build though, since, rather than banking on your lower damage, you could carve a roll as a damage sponge that can cast and buff.

Yeah I considered Haste but I was hoping someone else might grab that. I just like that Good Hope can be cast before battle so I can be swinging during initiative and using my buff time for Divine Favor.

Unbuffed I'd be hitting for +20/+12/+7 1d10+19 with +20 3d10+19 vital strikes. Buffed with Lead Blades / Boots of Speed / Good Hope / and Divine Favor I'd hit for +26/+23/+18/+13 2d6+24 with +26 6d6+24 vital strikes. Even more with (limited) Smite Evil. Is that not good enough for lvl 11?

What would a shield bash build look like here? That might sound fun.

Martyr is cool but I hate the idea of the bleed effect both mechanically and visually. Oath of the People's Council is actually not bad. Do the Oaths stack with the Sacred Servant archetype? Oath of Vengeance would be another option for more smites.

I ran across the Sacred Servant archetype and the Unsanctioned Knowledge feat and I thought it would be fun to make a gnome paladin. A more magic focused one. I want him to be good but he doesn't have to be optimal. (I mean, he is a gnome paladin) I've come up with the following but I feel like there is just something missing.

Sir Bixi Smiggles - LVL 11 Sacred Servant Gnome Paladin
STR: 21(+4 Belt, +2 LVL) DEX: 12 Con: 14 INT: 13 WIS: 8 CHA: 16(+2 Headband)
HP: 120 AC: 27 (31 w/ Shield wand) Fort: 15 Ref: 10 Will: 12
Diplomacy +17, Sense Motive +13, Use Magic Device +18

1)Fey Foundling
3)Power Attack
5)Furious Focus
7)Unsanctioned Knowledge
9)Vital Strike
11)Improved Vital Strike

1)Magical Knack
2)Dangerously Curious

Travel Domain, Gnome Magic
Unsanctioned Knowledge
1) Weaponwand
2) Mirror Image
3) Good Hope
4) Dimension Door?

Wand of Shield, Wand of Lead Blades, Boots of Speed, Cloak of Resistance +3, Amulet of Natural Armor +2, Ring of Protection +2, +2 Fullplate, +3 Greatsword, Belt of Giant's Strength +4, Headband of Alluring Charisma +2, Scolls/Wands?

Immune to Disease/Fear, +2 vs Illusions, +4 vs Poison, +2 vs Death, Darkvision

I just feel like there is something missing. I've messed around with somehow adding Dimensional Dervish feats but that is hard. I'm also looking for ways to make him more magical, maybe adding illusion spells or something (although I'm not sure how'd that work being a paladin and all) but I don't know how I'd use them if I got them. I'm also taking a look at critical feats but I'm not sure. Thoughts/help?

I'm maaaaybe willing to change races but I want to keep with a 'magical' theme. The only feat I'm not changing is Unsanctioned Knowledge and I'm not 100% sold on the Travel domain. Would a dip anywhere help anything?

Say I take the spell Telekinesis. Then I take the 3rd party feat Familiar Concentration. I cast the spell Telekinesis and do a combat maneuver. Then I hand over the concentration to my familiar. What happens next?

Which one of us is directing the spell? Whose stats do I use for the CMB?

My intention is to continue using Telekinesis through my familiar while continuing to cast other spells / do other things. Does this work?

So looking at the changes from the archetype it seems clear that the Eldritch Archer can't spell combat unless they are using spells from the Magus list. The only thing that is changed is the fact that they now use ranged weapons instead of melee. It's a small change.

That being said, Spellstrike to Ranged Spellstrike is completely reworded and has no mention of needing to be from the Magus Spell list. Would it be ok to assume this is the case? Or should it be assumed that this was still meant for magus spells only?

The last bit is the most important question for all of this to work. Do Illusions walk around with you if you continue to concentrate or are they stuck in the original range of their spell?

My next big question I guess is confirmation that the illusion thing I'm planning will work.

1) I use extended Heroism on myself then cast Major Image and use The Show Must Go On to keep it going for the duration of extended Heroism as free actions.

2) I cast Major Image but let my familiar take over with Familiar Concentration. He'll maintain it as a standard action sitting in my pocket or something.

Do those work as intended? What can I do with this? Do I get to change illusions on the fly? Like create an illusion of myself then have it turn into an ogre at will? Also, say I walk a mile. Do the illusions follow me? Does the range of the spell follow me or stay in the area it was originally cast?

I've switched to a scimitar. I'd prefer the rapier but I don't want to worry about getting an agile weapon as well as the lace. I'm going to take Dervish Dance at level 6 since I need a combat feat there and move Skill Focus to replace Precise Strike at level 5. I'm going to remove Piranha Strike because I don't think I can afford the penalty to attack. Spell combat and 3/4 BAB are already hurting me there. I'm going to replace it with Improved Initiative just because I can't think of anything better.

Since I'm going with Improved Initiative I'm switching to a Jerboa familiar for a total of +8 extra to my Initiative. I'm also making the familiar a figment. Makes sense for me to have an illusion familiar. Plus I gave him reach so he can flank with me to help with the sneak attack damage.

I don't want to use Power Attack because I'd have to go STR. I don't want to go Arcane Strike because I feel I have enough swift actions such as Charmed Strike, Spell Recall, and Haste Arcana.

I also switched the rogue archetype to Thug so I can get an extra round out of demoralizing people with Menacing Swordplay.

For lvl 12 and 13 feats I plan on taking Improved Critical and Dimensional Agility to full attack after using Dimension Door during Spell Combat. Almost no need for the rest of that chain as a Magus.

Ok let's see about switching some of this stuff around. Say I go scimitar.

1) I take Dervish Dance at level 5 replacing Precise Strike.

2) I can make my weapon +2 instead +1 agile so I gain an extra to-hit and an extra damage.

3) I take the Ancestral Weapon trait instead of group fighter for an extra +1 to hit at all times instead of just flanking.

With all of this, assuming a normal full attack during spell combat and using my haste arcana, I'll be attacking with +15/+15/+10, 1d6+6. If I'm flanking I add an extra 2d6 to that. If I have Sense Vitals active it'll be an extra 5d6 instead.

The above does not include Piranha Strike. I'm not sure I can afford the penalty to hit from it. I'm also considering not taking Skill Focus. Is it really necessary? Bruising Intellect and a high Intelligence might be enough there. Should I drop those two feats and if I do what should I replace them with?

I'll probably avoid the usual shocking grasp and frostbite for now.

Detect thoughts uses CHA... that is unfortunate. I guess losing that isn't a big deal, it was mostly thematic. I could always take it as a spell if I really wanted to keep it. I'll probably switch it out for moon touched.

Good call on the type of feat. I'll have to move things around to different levels to get Skill Focus. Shouldn't be too much of a problem I hope.

Interesting on Piranha Strike. I saw 'light blades' in the description of rapier and assumed it was a light weapon. As I'm not playing PFS I'll probably pick up the Effortless Lace as I really like the idea of the rapier and I'm not sure what I'd switch to otherwise. If there is another good choice of weapon please let me know.

The hardest hit here is the loss of Precise Strike. I kind of needed that to get any kind of melee damage. I'd drop Flamboyant Arcana too but I want to hold onto Menacing Swordplay. Any ideas on a feat or Arcana to take to replace Precise Strike that will help me in melee? I could also potentially change my Haste Arcana and hope someone in the party ends up using haste a lot.

I do plan on playing this character from level 1.

Hello! I've created a Puppetmaster Magus that I wanted to share so I could get some criticism on it. Ideas on what to change, what to add to make it better, and to point out anything that won't work as intended.

Character Concept:
I always liked the idea of the Enchantment spells and Illusion spells but they've never seemed to be good enough on their own. Then I discovered the puppetmaster archetype and realized I can put illusion and enchantment together along with a character that can actually fight in melee when the spells run out or are ineffective.

The idea is to run around with a cruel agile rapier which will eventually get critical focus. I'll take a level in rogue and the Accomplished Sneak Attacker feat along with the spell Sense Vitals to make myself hit like a rogue. I'll also take the Arcane Deed: Precise Strike and Piranha Strike for more damage. I hope all of this will make me an effective melee combatant.

In addition I plan on taking Arcane Deed: Menacing Swordplay, the Bruising Intellect trait, the Skill Focus: Intimidation feat, and a cruel weapon to Shaken and Sicken enemies that I hit to help butter them up for my spells.

As for the spells, I plan on having two illusions of myself walking around with me most of the time. I accomplish the first one by casting extended Heroism on myself(using a rod) and use The Show Must Go On to keep the spell Major Image going as a free action. I accomplish the second by taking the Familiar Arcana, then taking the Familiar Concentration feat which lets my familiar take over on a concentration spell(Major Image).

As far as spells go I've got the normal stuff you'd think of for an archetype based on illusion and enchantment. I can spend an arcane pool point to increase Illusion spell DCs by 2 and with feats/racials increase Enchantment spell DCs by 2 as well. With a high intelligence and the ability to shaken/sicken I'm hoping a lot of things will fail.

Other stuff include my familiar being a Margay cat with the Prankster archetype for some fun extra illusion spells. Plus I just wanted to have a cat. I can also hide/feint with the fey prankster rogue archetype I took with a move action. I'm not sure how much I'll use that though, it was just the best I found to replace Trap Finding. I also took the elvish racial Sense Thoughts. I figured it was pretty thematic to be able to read people's minds every once in a while. I took the Fey-taken drawback to go with the rogue archetype and have a backstory where I was kidnapped by Fey in my youth. Follow the god Cayden Cailean because of the rapier and how well it fits just about everything.

Eldrin Arathas - Lvl 10 Puppetmaster Magus / Lvl 1 Fey Prankster Rogue
STR: 10 DEX: 18 CON: 14 Int: 24 WIS: 12 CHA: 8
HP: 103, AC: 25 (29 with shield), Fort: +12, Ref: +12, Will: +11
Intimidate: +27, Bluff: +18

Rogue) Weapon Finesse
1) Spell Focus: Enchantment
3) Accomplished Sneak Attacker
5) Extra Arcana: Arcane Deed - Precise Strike
Bonus) Skill Focus: Intimidation
7) Piranha Strike
9) Extra Arcana: Familiar
11) Familiar Concentration

Magus Arcana:
3) Flamboyant Arcana
6) Arcane Deed: Menacing Swordplay
9) Hasted Assault

Traits: Bruising Intellect, Armor Expert, Group Fighter
Drawback: Fey-taken
Racial: Sense Thoughts (Detect Thoughts), Arcane Focus (+2 Defensive Casting), Keeper of Secrets (+1 Enchantment Spell DC)

Level 4 - Dominate Person, Greater Invisibility
Level 3 - Confusion, Charm Monster, Major Image, Displacement, Fly, Vampiric touch
Level 2 - Heroism, Hold Person, Cacophonous Call, Mirror Image, Sense Vitals, Blistering Invective, Gallant Inspiration(bought), Fog Cloud(bought)
Level 1 - Charm Person, Hideous Laughter, Sow Thought, Color Spray, Silent Image, Vanish, True Strike, Ventriloquism, Shield, Liberating Command, Magic Missile

Other Abilities: Treacherous Plants, Spell Recall, Charm Strike, Opportune Parry and Riposte, Derring Do, Spell Combat
Items: Headband of Vast Intellect +4, +1 Agile Cruel Rapier, Belt of Physical Might +2 (Con/Dex), +2 Mithral Breastplate, Ring of Protection +2, Amulet of Natural Armor +1, Cloak of Resistance +3, Lesser Rod of Extend, Pearl of Power lvl 2, Wand of Cure Light Wounds, Wand of Shield

So I've got a character concept that I want to play but I've got a few loose ends and questions I need to tie up to make sure he works.

Half-Elf Scout Rogue LVL 11, Variant Multi-classed Wizard, School Specialization - Teleport
Stats: 13 / 18(+2 from Half Elf) / 14 / 12 / 12 / 8
Feats: 1)Improved Initiative 5)Improved Familiar 9)Power Attack
Rogue Tricks: Cloying Shadows, Shadow Duplicate, Offensive Defense, Multi-talented, Opportunist

Two-Handed Style:

He'll use an Elvish Curved Blade, get it keen when he can, and use the alternate racial trait "Ancestral Arms" to use it. He also has 13 STR to use Power Attack with it later on.

Rat Theme:

He'll be CE and use rat items such as Greater Rat Plague Belt, Cloak of the Scuttling Rat, Rat-Tread Boots. Turning into a dire rat will give him an extra bite attack and I hope to enchant his armor with 'wild' to keep his AC up. It should be pretty high with wild armor and dire rat form.

With the variant multi-class into Wizard he'll get a familiar which I'll take improved familiar for to get a Ratling familiar. The ratling will use Dimension Door to help move me around the battlefield and commune 1/week isn't bad. Otherwise he'll pre-buff me with spells with his scroll ability like Protection from Evil and Vanish. Maybe even stay with me and cast stuff like Remove Fear and etc.

Question: When the ratling casts spells from scrolls does he need to make some sort of check? Is he limited to spells that he has the correct wisdom/int for? Are there any kind of issues I might run into with him riding around on me?

Sneak Attack Enablers:

I took the scout archetype to help with getting in that sneak attack damage when I otherwise wouldn't. I also can teleport via the "Shift" teleportation school ability to help me flank (and get out of difficult positions) along with my ratling using Dimension Door.

I took the cantrip acid splash from the variant multi-class wizard. Apparently I can sneak attack with it out of stealth if I'm close enough, not a bad way to start combat safely without being the first one to run in.

I also want my ratling to cast Summon Nature's Ally 1 for Dire Rat flanking partners.

Question: Does all this teleportation stuff work as I intend or am I missing a rule somewhere that will stop this?

So... there he is. Will he work as intended? I'm also a bit worried about his saves. He should be ok in reflex but his will and fortitude are terrible. I can't wear a cloak of resistance with the Cloak of the Scuttling Rat but I guess I could get stuff like a Headband of Wisdom or Aquatic Ring of Resistance. Or count on Ratling scrolls or party buffs? Thoughts?

So if I got the Toppling Spell route, which I'd really like to, how effective would it actually be?

I'd be getting Caster Level + Charisma Modifier + Tripping feat bonuses. Say at lvl 11 with a +4 headband I'd be around +18.

Am I missing any bonuses here? Does Divine Favor add somehow? Are there other feats I could conjure up with Warsighted to add to this? I know a lot of things have some pretty serious CMDs out there, especially at that level.

Pretty cool character born_of_fire! I actually just finished a campaign as an improved weapon wielding Skald. Ton of fun, but I'll probably stay away from it this round. I like the blacksmith angle too.

How do you like Spirit Shield? Doesn't really seem worth it to me until higher levels. It does save money on buying armor though.

Warsighted... yeah I can see that really helping in the feat department here. Shame that I wouldn't get Spirit of the Warrior at 11. Unless of course I somehow took extra revelation at that level (I'd hate to delay Quicken Spell though).

I plan on using Ancestral Gift for my weapon once I can cast it so proficiency shouldn't be too big of an issue (so I can retrain like you mentioned). Why would crossbow be worse? Just because I'd need reloading feats?

Say I just took a crossbow/bow for fun and focused solely on attacking with spells and making tripping with spells actually work. How would that look? What kind of spells would I even use?

Also, thanks for the great advice so far!

The shaman idea is a good one, but after taking a look at it I think I'm going to stick with Oracle even though it probably isn't optimal. It runs with my character idea too well.

I might strongly consider a reach weapon with the tripping feats. The dwarves look like they have some decent ones.

Think some kind of casting/range build could work? I would prefer it over a melee build but I have no idea how'd it be competitive.

I've come up with a character concept I really like. He's a dwarf whose entire clan/family was wiped out and he is the last of his bloodline. Thing is, he is selfish (with stuff like Treasure Sense and Greed) and just looks out for himself. He doesn't care that he is the last. Turns out his deceased family is determined to continue despite him so they pretty much haunt him to make sure he survives and continues the family line. He is an Ancestor Oracle with the haunted curse.

He'll use these revelations: Wisdom of the Ancients, and Spirit of the Warrior (Consult his dead ancestors and let the battle-hardy ones possess him in battle.)

He'll use spells like: Ancestral Memory, Ancestral Communion (Consult his family out of battle for knowledge)

He'll also use spells like: Summon Ancestral Guardian, Ancestral Gift, Spiritual Weapon, and Spiritual Ally (Summon his ancestors to fight for him as well as his aunt's old frying pan to smack his enemies!) Maybe even Summon Monster I to summon his family dog.

But... I don't know what to do with him past that. Do I make him melee or ranged? While I know he already isn't optimized being a dwarf oracle I'd like him to be an actually decent character. I don't really want him to be support, although I'll probably take stuff like Blessing of Fervor just because it is so good. Save or Suck spells are a tough route because of his negative to charisma from Dwarf.

At first I considered the Spirit Guide archetype to get him channel energy and life link... but I think he'd be too selfish for that and I don't want him to be support. (Plus I don't know what to do with the familiar on this guy. Maybe be Mushu from Mulan?)

Next I considered giving him a crossbow (he'd sit back and protect himself while the ancestors and party took the hits). I was hoping to give him a whole bunch of spell-like weapon attacks like Barbed Chains and Holy Ice but there are just not enough of those that are any good.

I also considered somehow buffing his combat maneuvers so that stuff like Toppling spell, Pilfering Hand, Barbed Chains and Telekinesis would actually be good but I couldn't figure out a way to do that.

So... any ideas? I've got the character concept, class, and a few spells/revelations but I can't figure out how to make him a worthy character past that. I'd love to hear your ideas!

Balsamic Dragon wrote:
I had a paladin at my table that had the same issue. There should be a way to get more than one reaction, similar to how Combat Reflexes allowed more than one attack of opportunity.

I like this idea. If I take too many reaction feats/abilities make it possible by spending a general feat or something on extra reactions. Or if that is deemed too powerful maybe the second/third general feat in a feat chain?

While I understand I took a lot of reaction stuff I'm not really sure how else I would go about it if I wanted to make an optimal tank paladin.

-I didn't take AOO for that very reason, so there is one.
-I'm taking a shield so no matter what it is coming into conflict with retributive strike until lvl 10. (Half the game dealing with this?)
-Orc Ferocity is way too good for a tank not to take, pretty lame to not take an amazing tank racial just because I'm a paladin.
-I could take a better retributive strike talent instead of Divine Grace but I'm already not using retributive strike much because of the other reactions. Plus, IMO, those other talents are very situational and even in their situation not that great. PLUS as a tank I want to take the defensive not offensive talent right?
-I could not get a domain and not get divine ward. This is the only realistic option in my mind of limiting the reactions I have (besides maybe the amazing racial). But I mean c'mon... how could I not take this as a tank? I've already saved at least three people with it.

The reactions may be manageable on a non-tank paladin but with one trying to be as defensive as possible with a shield it is just a little too much. My personal suggestions are to make Orc Ferocity and Divine Grace not reactions and to give paladins the shield block / retributive strike talent earlier. Maybe even level 1/3 earlier.

I'll start by saying sorry if this is already mentioned elsewhere or if this is the wrong place to post this.

I just wanted to give a little feedback on my experience as a tank paladin with the reaction system. I have WAY too many options for my single reaction slot and I feel like this is something that needs to be looked at.

At lvl 7 in Sombrefell Hall I can use my reaction on the following:
-Retributive Strike
-Shield Block (for myself or ally)
-Divine Grace
-Orc Ferocity
-Divine Ward

Each turn is like a massive puzzle as waves of ghouls attack myself and my party. Do I punish the ghouls with retributive strike when they attack my friends? Or do I save my reaction in case I need to block? Or wait no I should save it in case my ranger way in the back might need my divine ward protection. No, I'm low on hitpoints I should save my reaction to use Orc Ferocity just in case I go down in the front. But wait, what if I need that +2 to a save against an enemy spellcaster?

In my opinion the 1 reaction a turn is a huge bottleneck. I find myself not using more than half of my class abilities. I have all of these wonderful ways to defend myself and my group but I can't use any of them because I can only do one thing a turn. I might as well not have the +2 to saves but the other options for that feat level seem pretty lackluster. I also wanted to get Attack of Opportunity to punish all the creatures that just run right by me but forget that. I have no room in my reactions for something else. Also forget about one of the main abilities of the paladin, retributive strike, as a tank. You'll never use it while shield blocking and using all of your other defensive reactions.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of having different options and managing them, but this seems a little overkill for a single reaction slot.

Well dang. Regardless, the question still stands. If a figment familiar had an item and died, what would happen to the item?

I have a character with a Ratling familiar using the Figment familiar archetype. Ratlings have the great ability of being able to cast scrolls from any list. So...

If I gave my familiar a bunch of scrolls, then the figment ratling dies (for the day), would the scrolls vanish along with my familiar or would they drop on the ground where he was holding them?

Scott, while some good advice, it seems to be too far away from my initial idea for me. I'm sure it's a good build though.

Gray Warden, you mentioned you had played two different Warpriests. How'd they both play and which type would you recommend?

Great advice once again! The fact that the level to BAB bonus only applies to the bonus feats completely went over my head. Good to know.

The reason I want to do the swift action aid another is because of the community blessing which changes it to a +4. I also plan on taking the trait 'Fools for Friends' to make it a +5 (Assuming my DM allows it.). I feel like that is high enough to be relevant aid at most levels. The sheer amount of swift-actions I have is a good point however. I'll have to see how it feels.

I was also considering befriending animals then giving them aid another with handle animal. Then with a communal blessing they can be some impressive little buffers. Even use a spiritual squire. Probably harder than it sounds. I was also planning on trying to ride my summons into battle or into the sky since I don't have fly (Unless I use Air Walk).

Also, Gray Warden, how would you extend your build past level 13? More critical feats?

Gray Warden wrote:

You can't pick Power Attack and Lunge at those levels, plus Scribe Scroll, Furious Focus, Swift Aid and a bunch of other feats you chose are pretty much useless, not that useful by the time you get them, or just a waste of bonus feats (which let you count as having BAB equal to your level and as a Fighter, so picking Dodge at level 12 is quite a waste).

If you want to build a melee Warpriest with reach, maybe this build is a bit better (* = bonus feats):

Stats: 16+2, 14, 12, 12, 14, 7

1 Combat Reflexes, Weapon Focus*
3 Dirty Fighting (same as Combat expertise, but it does not require Int 13), Phalanx Formation*(because you can't do AoOs if your allies stand in front of you otherwise)
5 Improved Trip (this feat is not that important to you because at this level foes do not usually have reach, and you can trip them without causing AoO. However you need it for Greater Trip)
6 Weapon Specialization*, Greater Trip*
7 Power Attack (you'll be dealing damage with AoOs, so Power Attack is not a priority for you)
9 Lunge, Improved Critical* (Fauchard is a perfect crit-fishing weapon)
11 Quicken Blessing[Animal] (swift summoning)
12 Pin Down* (get +1 HP at this level instead of +1/6 bonus feat, so that you can get the feat next level)
13 Critical Focus, Staggering Critical*

If you don't like the trip route, you can improve your AoOs skills by picking Dodge, Mobility, Combat Patrol instead of Dirty Fighter and the trip feats. Otherwise, you might want to improve your defenses by picking Shield Focus and Shield Brace.

Whatever your choice is, consider picking the Tusked trait so that you can threaten also your adjacent squared with a primary natural attack (1.5x Str to hit). Also, get a +1 Fortuitous weapon asap.

Good call on Lunge, I must have forgotten the prerequisites while switching feats around. Shouldn't I be able to use Power Attack at Lvl 1 because of the Warpriest ability to count their level in place of their BAB for feat prerequisites?

I have never heard of Dirty Fighting! I will certainly be looking into that.

Certainly a good build and good advice all around. It is appreciated! I'll probably be willing to give up Furious Focus pretty easy, I guess it doesn't make too much sense in this type of build. Losing Scribe Scroll isn't too bad, I can just buy them. Swift Aid however... I plan on keeping that. If I use your build maybe instead of Weapon Specialization. How important is +2 damage anyways?

How viable do you think tripping without full BAB is? I know there are some pretty ridiculous CMD monsters out there.

Also, why push off critical focus for one level? No reason not to get it sooner imo.

I like the idea of carrying around a longbow, I'll probably do that. I'm not sure how much use it'll get but it couldn't hurt.

I want the Fauchard because of the crit range. I'll either get a keen weapon or use Sacred Weapon to give it keen. Saving space in my feats for other things.

I'd love to get Improved Trip and the like but I don't feel like I have the space necessary with all the other things I want. Plus, since I'm not full BAB tripping wouldn't be quite as good for me anyways.

Scott Wilhelm wrote:
Elykscorch wrote:
I am attempting to make a Warpriest of Erastil. I've chosen the animal and the community domains.

Maybe you didn't mean it like that, but Warpriests don't get Domains. Instead, they get Blessings.

The minor Animal Blessing grants you the ability to give any ally 2 Claw Attacks or a Bite Attack for 1 minute at level 1 or Summon a monster at level 10.

The minor Community Blessing grants you the ability to improve allies' and your own ability to Aid Another, raising the bonus from +2 to +4. At level 10, you grant your allies a +2 Insight Attack Bonus against any opponent you hit with a Ranged Attack.

Did you mean Blessings when you said "Domains?"

Yes, I meant blessings. Used the wrong word there.

I am attempting to make a Warpriest of Erastil. I've chosen the animal and the community blessings. I also plan on using a reach weapon, likely the Fauchard using a Cracked Opalescent White Pyramid (so I don't have to waist a feat on it).

I found the feat Swift Aid to pair well with the Community blessing and saw that it took 13 INT as a prerequisite. Whirlwind also takes 13 INT to obtain (through feat prerequisites of its feat chain). This makes me want both for the build.

I will be a half-orc and use the "Orc Blood" racial ability that lets me count as a human to take the Favored Class bonus for humans giving me an additional feat every 6 levels. (I assume this works like this. Tell me if it doesn't.)

This... leaves me with a lot of feats. I find myself trying to fit a lot in there but I'm struggling with putting it all in, and in a good order. I currently have the following:

1(WP): Weapon Focus
1: Power Attack
3: Cleave
3(WP): Lunge
5: Scribe Scroll
6(WP): Furious Focus
6(FC): Combat Expertise
7: Swift Aid
9: Combat Reflexes
9(WP): Greater Weapon Focus
11: Quicken Blessing
12(WP): Dodge
12(FC): Mobility
13: Spring Attack, retrain Cleave to Whirlwind.

I also struggled with stats a bit with the fact that I need both INT and WIS for this as well as being a reach melee fighter. I ended up starting with: 17/13/14/13/14/7 with the Half-Orc +2 in STR and plans on adding +1 to STR and DEX at 4/8 respectively. It is a 20 point build, but I only ended up with 19 which is annoying.

I am making an Improvised Weapon using Spell Warrior Skald and I was hoping for some advice. This is what I have so far:

Half Elf - LVL 11
19 / 12 / 14 / 10 / 10 / 18 (Headband of Charisma +4)

-Surprise Weapon

-(1)Catch off Guard
-(3)Skald's Vigor
-(5)Lingering Performance
-(7)Power Attack
-(9)Extra Performance
-(11)Discordant Voice

Rage Powers:
-Lesser Elemental Blood
-Elemental Blood
-Clear Mind
-(lvl 12) Greater Elemental Blood

LVL 1 Spells:
-Cure Light Wounds
-Disguise Self
-Saving Finale
-Charm Person

LVL 2 Spells:
-Gallant Inspiration
-Mirror Image
-Honeyed Tongue

LVL 3 Spells:
-Dispel Magic

LVL 4 Spells:
-Dimension Door
-Dance of a Hundred Cuts
-Heroic Finale

The idea is to be mostly support, but stand my own in combat by picking up whatever suits me. I like the idea of dragging a bar stool around, picking it up and using Weapon Song, and beating people with a flaming magical bar stool. Heroism, Surprise Weapon, Catch Off Guard, and Weapon Song should let me hit often enough despite being a little behind in BAB. I can use Dance of a Hundred Cuts against a boss or something.

I am helpful to the team with my Weapon Song, my counterspell abilities from Spell Warrior, and spells such as Haste, Gallant Inspiration, Heroic Finale, and Saving Finale. I can also give them some minor elemental damage with my rage powers with some decent energy resistance and a reroll on a Will save. At level 12 I can give everyone flying.

So, what do you think? Advice? Suggestions? Will it work? Am I missing something? Did I do anything wrong?

Bonus Question: If you look up Skald on D20pfsrd and go to Versatile Performance, then look at the very bottom of that, you'll see "Masterpiece" in bold. It doesn't look like it fits there very well. Does it mean I can take a Bardic Masterpiece as an advanced versatile performance choice?

Hello, I'm trying to come up with a character. I'm not too fond of swinging an axe or firing a bow each round so I tend towards characters with extra utility and normally spells. Maybe you can help me think of a fun idea?

Let me explain more what I'm looking for. I want a build with spells, but it doesn't have to be a full caster. (Although I would prefer it.) I don't want to go in there on a wizard and do the normal wizard stuff like fireball, haste, summoning, etc. I want something unusual like a spectral hand build or something. It doesn't have to be optimized and min-maxed, but I do want it to be good. I'm not sure what campaign i'll be playing yet, so a character that can fit in anywhere would be ideal.

I've recently come up with an improvised weapon spell warrior skald, an illusionist gnome, and a sylvan sorcerer if you want an idea of what kind of builds I'm looking for/like.

Thoughts? Ideas? Surely ya'll know about some fun caster builds!

Android Scholar Mechanic w/ Exocortex - LVL 5 (Aballon/Yaraesa)

11 STR, 20 DEX, 14 CON, 18 INT, 12 WIS, 8 CHA

Skills: Athletics/Computers/Engineering/Life Sciences/Perception/Physical Science/Piloting/Stealth

-Weapon Spec: Longarms (Exocortex)
-Skill Focus: Perception (Exocortex)
-Deadly Aim
-Improved Feint
-Technomancer Dabbler (Transfer Charge, Mending, Supercharge Weapon)

Mechanic Tricks:
-Distracting Hack

Weapon: Azimuth Laser Rifle, Glamered (as mechanic tools), Gear Clamp
Armor: Basic Lashunta Tempweave, Targeting Computer, Jump Jets(Android)
Augmentations: Standard Datajack(w/ Custom Rig), Personal Upgrade MK 1 DEX +2
Gear: 2x Smoke Grenade, 2x Battery, MK 1 Ring of Resistance, MK1 Healing Serum, 105 Credits
*Equipment Selected Using 9k recommended for 5th lvl, using 25% weapon/armor rule

The idea is to be an Android who seeks knowledge above all else, but recognizes the galaxy is a dangerous place. He has become exceedingly good at killing things knowing he must to obtain the knowledge he seeks.

He should be a pretty decent shot with Exocortex buffing his BAB with a Targeting Computer and Improved Feint/Distracting Hack to aid him. His damage should be good with deadly aim, weapon spec, overcharge, and supercharge.

He'll siphon energy for ammo off of dead enemies with Transfer Charge and hack things during combat with the Exocortex to give him an edge. He can also throw smoke grenades and ignore the concealment they give his enemies with the Targeting Computer. And last and maybe least, once per day he can repair 1d4 hitpoints with Mending.

Oh, I get it now. Thanks for that. Both charge spells are 4th level spells so not much of a point in getting both of them. I'll probably roll with Telekinetic Charge just because it guarantees the charge while terrain or something could potentially block Flash Forward for the second target.

Also, how did you manage to survive without invisibility? Did you just not get attacked or just simply play it smart? A sorcerer in melee is a dangerous thing. Did mirror image do enough for you?

Looking forward to the spell list!

Absolutely great advice! Thank you!

I really like the Horsemaster's Saddle and Improved Spell Sharing feat. That will let me realize my dream of casting Form of the Dragon and turning us into TWO dragons. Plus the extra +5 to ride is much appreciated.

I've switched out the bonus spell Improved Initiative for Quicken Spell, and I've switched Dimension Door to Telekinetic Charge. I thought Dimension Door would be better, but upon reading it again I wouldn't be able to use it with my wolf on animal growth until level 12. Plus, Telekinetic Charge is pretty cool. I could start a fight potentially by charging TWO different enemies and potentially tripping them both.

I don't understand why Flash Forward is so good. Isn't the point to get into melee and then stay there for full round attacks? I feel like my animal companion can tank pretty well with this build.

Blade Tutor's Spirit from the spell ring is a great idea. I've never heard of the spell before. I've also never heard of the bloodline mutations. I was trying my best to find a way to switch out my lvl 3 bloodline ability and here it is! I'll be taking the intensify one.

Any chance you could show me your spell list? I've been having a rough time managing mine and I'd be curious to see it. Also, why do you use frostbite? Just as something to do during your actual character's turn?

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