Alchemist / Fighter, Where to Go Next?


Advice


Our DM had us create a character that had to have minimum 1 level of fighter and had to be a dwarf. I went on to create an alchemist/fighter that I thought turned out pretty well. (Really good stats because of DM rules)

Lvl 1 - Fighter (Spear Fighter): Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Mobility
Lvl 2 - Alchemist (Grenadier): Throw Anything
Lvl 3 - Alchemist (Grenadier): Combat Expertise, Alchemical Weapon, Precise Bombs
Lvl 4 - Alchemist (Grenadier):
Lvl 5 - Fighter (Spear Fighter): Spring Attack, Whirlwind

The premise is that he'll have a two-hander dwarven weapon with reach and use his potions for Enlarge Person. He'll give it some burst with alchemist fire attached with alchemical weapon plus he can throw bombs. But best of all he has whirlwind attack very quickly. Seems solid IMO.

The question is... where do I go next? Keeping up in fighter would be tough because the Spear Fighter archetype stunts me because I don't actually plan on using a spear. I could keep going alchemist and maybe get stuff for throwing bombs? Or maybe go into yet another class... or maybe there is a prestige class out there that can benefit me? I just have no idea where I'd go with this guy up to say, level 11. Anyone have any ideas?


Keep going in Alchemist until you have 3rd level Extracts... then go into the Master Chymist prestige class.

Or, there is also the Bomber Rogue archetype that stacks with any Alchemist levels to determine Bombs damage. I don't know if that fits your build, at all.

The Arcane Bomber Wizard probably isn't going to be too helpful here, so it can be excluded even though it does stack with other sources of Bombs.

Depending on your stats, you could start shooting explosive arrows, or Dwarven Pelletbow pellets, since you already are a Grenadier.


So, as a Grenadier Alchemist, you totally need Explosive Missile. Exploding Arrows are cool!

You have Dodge and Mobility, I would totally have you dip a level in Monk, Master of Many Styles and take Panther Style Feats: You get Free Action Attacks whenever you Provoke Attacks of Opportunity by moving out of Threatened Squares, and you are already getting a +5 to your AC when you do that due to Doge and Mobility.

Get your Spear Modified so that it's also a Monk Weapon, and take Ascetic Style as well, then you can make those Unarmed Strikes from Panther Claw with your Spear.

For a Grappler character, I consider levels in Alchemist to be essential. I can tell you how I build Grapplers if you want.


VoodistMonk wrote:
Keep going in Alchemist until you have 3rd level Extracts... then go into the Master Chymist prestige class.

This is the way I'd go. Alchemists have some pretty amazing buffs, so this is probably your best bet for making a melee monster.

I'd probably go Fighter-2/Alchemist-8 before going into Master-Chymist. This opens up all the 8th level Alchemist discoveries (Fsst Bombs plus Blinding/Confusion bombs makes for a great opening volley before wading into combat). It also keeps your Master Chymist discoveries on even levels, which means you can take Greater/Grand Mutagen at the appropriate levels (12/16, rather than waiting till 13/17).

This would give you +18 BAB and 5th level extracts. If you really wanted 6th level extracts you'd have to take at least 11 levels of Alchemist (I'd probably go 12 to keep the discoveries at even levels) before going Master Chymist, which would be pretty good as well.


I'm loving the Master Chymist idea. What would I go for with feats and discoveries? Do I go all melee or do I spare some points for Infusion or Bombing? While Explosive Missile sounds awesome, especially if I got like a conductive bow or something, could I really reliably hit things if I'm more STR based? I guess I could use my mutagen for DEX when I plan on going ranged.

The whole Panther/Ascetic Style certainly seems interesting but I'm struggling to get it to work here. Scott you have a sample build or something you could tag onto the first 5 levels of mine to show me how that would work out?


I'd probably prepare a Mutagen that bumps up your main stat, because that' how you'll get the most out of it. One of the best parts of the Master Chymist is that you get bonus uses of your Mutagen that are spontaneous - which means you don't have to decide until you use it (you still have to decide in advance for the Mutagen you brew in the morning, just not the 2 new ones per day).

I'd probably get Melee feats and let your bombs do the talking when youbneed to go ranged. I'd only take 2 bomb related discoveries: 1. An elemental option (acid/cold/electricity/force) for when gou fight a flying enemy immune to fire, and 2. Fast bombs. Most of the time you'll use your sword/hammer/claws/etc, but if you can't hit them in melee youbjust chuck bombs at them. Because bombs scale in damage and target touch AC you don't really need anything else (and you don't need Precise shot etc because you're only using bombs if melee isn't possible).

I would take Infusion though, it's basically a tax on the class =P


Fighter-2/Alchemist-8/Master Chymist-X

Take the minimum combat feats you have to in order to be effective... Power Attack is probably all you might need outside of the Spring Attack/Whirlwind feats you already listed.

Definitely put some fun stuff into your Bombs.

Try to make your character as well-rounded as possible. That's why exploding arrows is such a strong option... even without any feat investment into archery, having a backup crossbow that shoots missiles is handy, to say the least.


MrCharisma wrote:


I'd probably go Fighter-2/Alchemist-8 before going into Master-Chymist. This opens up all the 8th level Alchemist discoveries (Fsst Bombs plus Blinding/Confusion bombs makes for a great opening volley before wading into combat). It also keeps your Master Chymist discoveries on even levels, which means you can take Greater/Grand Mutagen at the appropriate levels (12/16, rather than waiting till 13/17).

How does this work? I'm finally getting around to making this guy and wouldn't he get Greater/Grand at 14/18 because of the fighter levels?


Yes he would, my bad =P

If you went F-2/A-7/MC-x you'd end up getting your Advanced Mutagens at levels 11, 13, 15, 17 and 19. At character level 13 your "effective Alchemist level" for Advanced Mutagens (Alchemist level plus Master Chymist level) would be 11, meaning you wouldn't be able to take Greater Mutagen till level 15. Since these aren't Alchemist discoveries, and since your actual Alchemist level is 7 you can't just take "Extra Discovery" to replace them, so you want the Advanced Mutagens to appear on even levels to get them as early as possible.

So I'd go Fighter-2, Alchemist-7, Master Chymist-1 (to get Mutagenic Form, so you have spontaneous Mutagens when you need them). Then take 1 more level of Alchemist (bringing you to Alchemist-8), then take the rest of your levels in Master Chymist. The only real downside with this is you never get to 6th level Extracts.

If you really want to get those 6th level Extracts you'd need to take at least 3 more levels of Alchemist, and if you're going 3 I'd go 4 (for the reasons outlined above in the second paragraph), meaning your final build would be F-2/A-12/MC-6.

The final option is to simply dip 1 level Master Chymist for the spontaneous Mutagenic form twice per day. This lets you use your Mutagen more often and doesn't really delay your Alchemy, but your BAB will end up lower and you'll miss out on Brutality.

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