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Honestly, my policy is to have them start off at all Neutral alignments and move from there. I suppose LG could be an exception. I have found some new players have great difficult differentiating from good (getting them to be selfless than pro-player orientated) and evil (getting to be anything BUT dumb).

Most starting players are gold and experience motivated, can will follow with the story. So long as there is a reward. They may have their LG character turn a blind eye to a CE PC's actions however, so having evil and good is perhaps something that should be organic from a base.

Noob question, how do I know what is defined as a 0HD race?

Oh no, I meant in the end where the Thrall is used to call the beast. After the fight against the monstrosity and the beast is still around.

So I've finished book 2 with my group last night and the fight in the end was too easy. With the beast's raw power, it beat the other one to a pulp while the group kept it slowed with fire and ice spells.

But that's beside the point, the point is that the beast survived. The book doesn't seem to delve too much into details how the count and the beast would reunite. If at all. What are some of your outcomes? I'm at a loss to close this cleanly.

After playing through it, I'm starting to wonder that myself. The riot was pretty neat scene but everything else seemed out of character. I had the Count trapped with his 'honour guards', just so the PCs won't think of crossing him for a castle.

Cold Naplam is cold. He merely declared level 8 since he assumed it was a level 8 game when it was really a level 6 game, which he then argued level 7. The situation is still up in the air as he hasn't played yet to made a character. Having played this game recently (but played much AD&D in the past), I was merely concerned if this was some broken combination that I have not heard of. I suppose most answers around here say no, it's only if the GM allows it to be.

Talking briefly to him last night on the phone, he claims that you can get to assassin at level 3 which then I reminded him of the skill rules. He relented to "well, that rule is open to interpretation..." but settled to make a rogue, for now. I still haven't seen his sheet yet but will obvious work backwards once his sheet is present given his understanding of the 'rules'.

Sounds like something went horribly wrong in your game...

While people are saying that Death attack takes 3 rounds, but wouldn't something like that be exploited before combat? I can imagine the player would go ahead and wait three rounds to get one off as a surprise attack then say that they HIP to go for another death attack. I'm sure that he'll argue that since he's nearly 'invisible', there's nothing that could be done about him.

He's coming by tonight supposedly, he'll likely get afar as a sheet but I don't think he'll be taking part (I'm close to wrapping up book 2 of Carrion Crown and it's late to join in).

I really want to meet this regular GM of his, he must be extremely jaded or something.

This is SO ending in fire. Have you played with this group before? Because they're all asking for a GM to sacrifice.

Yes. :| I try not to think about that.

Honestly, I'm in favor of starting him at level 4 for a few reasons.

1. I can police this "super" build early. See where he's going and planning.
2. Humble him. I think he had a build in mind at level 8 and likely at 25pt spend. My game is a 15pt spend. I'm the same GM to his usual crowd.
3. As bad as the player's attendance is, he only missed a few sessions. It wouldn't be fair to him with the sessions he spent. The question if he could get to level 5 by being new would pop in.

I'm actually curious how he figures shadow dancer/assassin/whatever else is breaking the game. Both shadow dancer and assassin are kinda "meh". Assassin especially so, since it got nerfed in Pathfinder while everything else got buffed.

Honestly, at first glance, I'd imagine he was the type to picture himself some sort of mad mechanical genius, master of breaking games, only to...not be.

I haven't been given the sheet yet, I expect a horror show. I was only told in passing of his intention to join the game and his build. Bragging that you can have infinite prestige classes and it's going to break the game.

To the second point, this 100%. I've played with him before with another system where I set the 'level' to two. What ended up rolling was a character who was 2/2/2, by lack of understanding to be honest rather though.

At the moment, the group is at 6/6/5/4. Being a level 8 X/Y/Z is already out. Starting at level 7 is out. The level 5 isn't too far off, while the level 4 is unfortunately bad with his attendance. They are started off at the same level.

Some additional details I have to bring up, I'm in a slight pickle

1) The banning evil NPCs are out as a majority of the players are evil. They were adamant that it would create more RP opportunities, and thus I've allowed it.

2) The player is friends with everyone and they want him in. However, they know of his shenanigans and suggest that he start at the same level as the lowest level player (being level 4)...rather than one level -higher- than the highest level (as HE wanted).

Every time a potential player I have thinks they have a game breaking build one of the following usually happens:

A) A misunderstanding or misuse of the rules (I am looking at you Synthesist)

B) The build is actually not game breaking because the player didn't understand what the average power level of a character is to an encounter and grossly overestimated just how good there were going to be

C) Is using "Compatible" material from another source or 3rd party material

Reactions usually go somewhere along these lines:

A) "No it isn't against the rules look here!" Then I show the the errata, then they get mad. Another fairly common reaction is for the player to just leave after a few sessions or just never show up, blaming me or whoever is GMing for "Being a loser".

B) As soon as the player realizes they didn't do anything spectacular they ask, "Can I rebuild my character?" or "Can I make a new character?" If you do not let them, they will usually try to find a way to retire or kill the current character, cycle starts again at B.

C) "What do you mean 'X' isn't allowed?" Begs furiously to get material approved, pouts then quits if it isn't.

Thank you for that. I think you've gone through most situations, except I don't think the quitting part would be so easy.

Player: I am going to break the game.

GM: Well, don't, do something else.

Does this person have no self control? I mean, I could go out my way to ruin my friends fun, but I don't.

He has his own Pathfinder group that has been RPGing 3.5 for a while, who apparently are wholly made out of twinkers and it's the norm there. It's a habit and personality. That said I know my table doesn't have to be that way.

Maybe he's thinking his shadow companion will kill everything? It being incorporeal and having an at will ability damage attack makes it quite formidable in many (but not all) circumstances.

I've had a shadowdancer in a game or two, and I'll tell you this: most Paizo modules are wholly unprepared for shadowdancers, or more specifically, their companions. I've had entire dungeons cleared out by a single shadow that went ahead of the party, avoiding all the traps and killing enemy monsters with impunity.

Maybe you've stumbled on the true plan. That would be perhaps FAR more annoying than an assassin sitting about for three rounds per death strike...

I wouldn't know what to do if that happened, other than penalize the party for doing NOTHING but that seems wrong.

I think you should post the full character and make certain it is legal...

many times such a character concept needs to be reviewed.

Here is one problem that is often over-looked
starting a character at level 1 and rising through levels, the skill points and feats have to be viable....at each level

Making a character at level X
results in an abundance of points and the hand-waving requirements to enter a class..

He's been playing far longer than I have but there was I noticed. His claim is that you can start being an assassin from level 3, not true as you need a stealth of 5, making the earliest at 6?

I can only guess that his intention was to spam death attack.

A Light elemental will be hard to put in since it's Carrion Crown, but I think a lot of things have dark vision. But better yet, reevaluate his build and admission.

To be slightly fair to him, he meant breaking the game mechanically rather than roll around and player-kill & disrupt the story (...I hope). Apparently such a combination turns every encounter to dust.

So I had a potential player approach me the other day telling me that he was going to roll a level 8 Shadow Dancer/Assassin/and something else, thus breaking the game. I know he comes from a mechanic breaking heavy background, apparently.

What do I do about this? From a GMing pre and during game stand point?

Players like that would be awesome.

Done and done.

Well say the PCs are more mercenary than do-gooder. Plus what stops them from leaving their undead in the outskirts and fetching them later when they go out of town?

So I realized there's a level 2 spell called Command Undead, which is very useful in this campaign and I don't have too much of an issue with it. However it doesn't seem to present the PC from stockpiling undead encounters to turn into allies. Worse still, there's book 5 to think about, how would it run when PCs can use that spell on the Vampires? While there's a good chance they'll resist, I don't trust my luck (it fails me at the worst times), and will probably end up with 1,2,3's...

Help?

After a few days of looking through people's builds that have 20 and sometimes 25 points involved (starting at 22 stats no less!), I was wondering what was the suggested build for this AP? I had my players (four in total) go with 15 points, would that be too hard?

Summon Monster is a neat spell, when it comes to animals and monsters with 2 intelligence or less. At later levels, when devils and angels are summoned and other intelligence creatures, does such a creature have their own will or just work on the will of their summoner? That's something that never quite sat right with me...

Could a caster summon a devil to attack other devils? Can't they be encountered later on, unsummoned intentionally? I would feel rather annoyed as any summoned devil/angel.

I assumed all 'summon' spells are creatures that are mind controlled to attack X target on the spot without consideration... But that is a neat way to squeeze in some RP.

How essential is the Gamemaster guide? I skipped that book but haven't found too much of an issue running games and APs.

So I wouldn't have to add in more treasure per encounter then from the ones already given in the book?

I guess in essence, if one of your friends see the monsters, you don't automatically see it yourself.

I'm playing through an AP for the first time as gm. I'm wondering if the treasures have been accounted for in each encounter or we're expected to add treasure based on CR?

And the flesh golem that's being lend around the house, all the doors are one tile large! I suppose the gate house could be larger but the house proper, the golem might have to be shrunk to a really big medium creature or the house might have a love of double doors....

Looking through Schloss Coromac, I noticed that the whole place is rather narrow and small, especially for several creatures of large sizes! Especially for the last guy in the end, they barely, if at all, have space to move! I think a few could squeeze through the doors (I don't know about the stairs or trap door though). It doesn't seem much of a threat if the PCs could just close the door in front of them and back away. Am I missing something there?

I was wondering if stealth was used in the combat (like slipping away or with an obstacle), or somebody was using stealth to sneak up to one person, how would perception checks work? Who would get to roll and what would be the action be considered as? Immediate or as a move action?

If one person in the party spots the person but not the target of a sneak attack, would the sneak attack still work?

After reading through the Adventure Path, Episode 2 doesn't seem to have any thing too long term attached to the adventure other than the Eye and the item (which was stolen and long gone). I was thinking that that Palentine Eye would employ mercenaries and bounty hunters on the look out for this new madman. Additionally, the recent murders after the beast was locked up only convinces everyone to double up on competent security.

My players are unfortunately not in the role-playing (more roll-playing) stage yet to be willing to give up their items to circumstance without some protest. I'll use the chart for guidance but the wishlist idea is something I haven't heard of and will probably implement.

Is there a particular formula that GMs follow when it comes to giving out magic items? Some are rather powerful with simple effects, fire or keen, etc. Personally, I'm wary of handing them out.

I also notice that sunder item is an option to destroying them, how often do you apply this to players? Sometimes it doesn't seem too hard to turn someone's +2 vorpal blade into scrap metal.

This was unfortunately a staunch player decision rather than something of my creation, believing that there would be more fun RP opportunities because of it (I posted this somewhere else, more Chaotic Madman than Chaotic Evil).

XP and money are the reasons for now...

A small report, one unfortunately butchered the 3 sisters at the abandon town. I tried to punish them by relying only on recorded testimony... saying that they couldn't pin the wraith to it, but they discover his cache of bodies...Sigh.

Thank you for the input everyone! Meta reasons is unfortunately something that happens in RPG, even if the character was say, the destroyer of your homeland. The best solution is to be handled with the setting itself.

With a group consisting of a Chaotic Evil, Neutral Evil and Lawful Evil character...I'm wondering how it's suppose to work out when it comes to conflicting view points. The Chaotic Evil character is a loose cannon ala serial killer. If that character were to commit a murder/crime without reason, what would be the typical reactions of the other two characters?

I'm trying to find two things, one views point where they can all continue to exist together and another where they can realistically be outraged at each other. Perhaps determining a middle ground and a way that they would police each other.

As a GM, I'm tired to hearing players go "Oh, well my character is evil and would look the other way" without taking Neutral and Lawful alignments into consideration.

Thank you in advance!

Whoops, forgot there was a forum for that.

With most of my player deciding to play evil player and picking up Carrion Crown two, I've hit a bit of a road block. With Daramid's quest to find more evidence for the Beast, one of them have gone under the pretenses of the 'cleaner', who basically takes out the witnesses in the smaller towns so that there will be fewer things to pin crimes on the beast.

While probably a good idea at first, I can see this backfiring in the a few ways. Does anyone have any suggestions on making this tougher or perhaps even some achievement there could be XP given in place of investigation?

Thank you much for the explaination.

Just read the above on level drain, thanks. But how about ability loss?

Oh, so then somebody with a permanent negative level doesn't lose HP and abilities? How about drained abilities, would HP and bonuses be affected as a result or do they fall in the same rule?

Reading through the bestiary made me know of some low CR creatures that have energy and ability drain, which are quite powerful. After 24 hours if they're not restored, they're subject to a saving throw roll for each level. Players could potentially lose 2 levels or more without help. Is this true? How do you go about a game when some players are 1 or even 3+ levels behind the rest?

I was wondering if size bonuses were relative to your opponent or something you get regardless of your opponent's size. For example, if a halfling were faced against a goblin, would both still get their bonus AC and attack? If a halfling was against something that was large, would their bonus increase beyond normal.

Bonus question, are the monsters in the book, have they (AC) been calculated with Medium opponents in mind?

Thank you.

The argument comes that if they can be affected by sight and illusions. Wouldn't having no head render them senseless? Also, can constructs/undead be deafened (but how can they hear?).

I just took a quick look at the rules for creature types and subtypes and I didn't notice anything about immunity to sight magic (unless you meant patterns and phantasms). Is it a quality of a specific monster you were using? If so which one?

Sorry, I should have mentioned. I mean just that.

This has been brought up by one of my players and it's irked me that suspension of belief wasn't a good enough answer in explanation.

They're argument is that...

Undead/constructs are not affected by sight magic (smoke too I believe?) nor require their heads to see...it must mean that they're always blind because they have no senses...

How would you explain science on a magical creature?! Silly argument I know, just a bother that a player thinks I'm cheating.

I think it's been a policy of mine to enforce all towns and services with CR5+APL guards ever since my PCs killed someone because they didn't want to pay them in one game...

I suppose that does enforce PCs if they found themselves in say, Galt or worse.

It's not a video game. It's supposed to be about roleplaying a personality and a character that it happens can do fantastical things. Not about playing stats and powers which is what your players are telling you with that attitude.

My players have NEVER tried to do anything like that and if they did I would tell them NO.

You know...that's actually the mindset I was hoping to get them out of. At the moment for them, it's far more about cool powers than personality...

Thanks for the input everyone, I've decided to pick up Carrion Crown!