Balazar

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Organized Play Member. 63 posts (215 including aliases). No reviews. 1 list. 1 wishlist. 18 Organized Play characters.


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Possibly inspired by the 'Old Spice joke' meme, the deodorant manufacturer Old Spice released a PF Class today, 'the Gentleman' (just in time for Valentine's day...?). You can see the class here:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1mqawllBh142wrtTUuKtR5zpKHo0as6Ik/view
It's hetero-normative in a way that would never appear in a Paizo product.
While it says "These travelers are sometimes called Old Spice Gentlemen, other times Old Spice Gentle-ladies", it refers to other characters (to whom the character is presumably attracted) only in terms of 'the opposite sex', as if same-sex or non-binary romance is non-existent.


Thugrim wrote:
Lost In Limbo wrote:
Aura (Ex): A cleric of a chaotic, evil, good, or lawful deity has a particularly powerful aura corresponding to the deity’s alignment (see the detect evil spell for details).
Sarenrae is Neutral Good. If you worship her your aura is Neutral Good.

Limbo is correct: there is no Neutral aura; hence, there is no 'detect neutral' spell (see Inquisitors, etc.). (Related to this are special weapon and spell properties (anarchic/axiomatic/holy/unholy)).

If you worship a CG deity, for instance, you will possess BOTH Chaotic and Good auras.

As Sacred Summons specifies that the "alignment subtype or subtypes exactly match your aura", you can only use this feat with creatures that ONLY possess the 'good' alignment subtype, i.e. creatues with both 'good' and 'chaotic' do not 'exactly match your aura', and therefore are not eligible.

Sacred Summons is a feat that is meant to be useful to any character of any alignment with the Aura class feature. Since certain alignments have fewer useful summons (NG, for example), Summon Good Monster presents an alternative Feat for Good-aligned characters, and removes the Aura class ability prerequisite. It augments the list available, but does not decrease casting time.


Are you basically looking to do a 'Captain Andoran' character that is legal for PFS?


Had a great time - thanks again for running and thanks all for the fun!
- Drew aka 'Devanandra'


Rather than a couple examples, could we come up with a short list of typical out-of-combat challenges that are typically present in Pathfinder?
It might serve to generate some ideas of things that could be added to Martials to improve their out-of-combat usefulness, as that seems to be one of the main complaints.


93. Lil' Buddy.
You start play with a mundane pet of your choice, with a value of up to 25gp. It is pre-trained with the appropriate number of Tricks appropriate for its Intelligence.


Spring Attack falls under the category of 'special full-round actions', so it's similar to Charge. The maneuvers Trip, Sunder, and Disarm are normally performed with weapons, and can be 'swapped in' in place of a melee attack. Actions that take a Standard Action usually cannot. This is, for example, why Bull Rush is specifically called out as being able to be performed as part of a Charge.

With Spring Attack, the movement that normally provokes an AoO by entering or leaving a threatened square is overwritten (i.e. doesn't happen). The AoO provoked from using a non-Improved Combat maneuver is a different category of AoO, which Spring Attack does not explicitly cover.

As such, I'd say Spring Attack does not allow any other actions that normally provoke to 'not' provoke.


3 levels of (Lore Warden) Fighter Archetype will net you a +2 Bonus to CMB and CMD, full BAB for 3 levels, two Fighter Bonus Feats, and Combat Expertise (useful primarily for qualifying for Improved combat maneuvers).
Maneuver builds will often use a combination of Monk and this archetype.

Gauntlets of the Skilled Maneuver provides +2 to one type of maneuver.


Here's another basic delineation which may serve to enable Martials to contribute equally in relation to Casters, while preserving the 'Magic/Non-Magic' divide: the division of the narrative 'gamespace' into 'tactical' and 'strategic' spaces:

to wit:

Martials and Casters both should have clearly defined spaces in terms of both strategy and tactics, which may overlap, but are generally interdependent.

In Combat (i.e. 'tactical'):
1) Martials provide cover and support for casters.
2) Casters buff and enable Martials.
3) Casters have limited and precious 'Alpha strikes/nukes/etc.' and crowd control that can critically effect outcomes, BASED ON MARTIAL SUPPORT.
4) Martials target enemy casters as a priority, and are enabled in doing so by caster support

Out of Combat (i.e. 'strategic'):
1) Casters have specific Knowledge bases, critical for Lore and knowledge of enemy Tactics
2) Martials have knowledge of advanced Tactics, allowing for situational buffs, etc.
3) Martials can muster forces, providing supplies, Boons, items, etc.
4) Casters can call upon separate but similar resources..

Here's a question for the peeps out there, based on the challenges presented at various 'levels of power':

Place these challenges into meaningful categories. How are they grouped? Are they tactical or strategic? Are they (Range: Touch) or (Range: Reach), or (.. Close ... Short, .... Medium, ..... Long ..... etc)?


Okay, if we're looking at an overhaul that doesn't disrupt the Class system (which, quite honestly, may be at the root of the problem), here is a basic idea that could provide a template for redistributing 'narrative control' (which in this case only means certain mechanics) without making Martials 'casters', or 'powered', or some such:

I played a side-scrolling, web-based shooter today (which will remain unnamed). You have a number of characters or avatars you use to fight, each of which has a certain strength in terms of ranged or melee combat and possibly a form of 'spell' combat.

To simply create a 'switch-hitter' in PF is a forgone conclusion. Rarely does anyone attempt such a build, but it seems completely legitimate to suggest that a Martial could be efficacious at Melee, at Range, and at...
Area of Effect? Maneuvers? Social Skills? Out-Of-Combat? Etc...

Therefore, have Martials of a given class choose 'Priorities'.
You are given 1,2,3, and if you choose to spend all 3 on combat types, you're an absolutes bad-ass at combat, but don't expect to do much else besides. If you choose 1: Melee; 2: Ranged; 3: Social, you're going to be a great switch-hitter who can also contribute to Social.
If you go 1: Social; 2: Melee; 3: Ranged, as a Martial you'll pick up amazing tactical/leadership skills that give boosts outside of combat, but will not be a total bad-ass as example #1.


After reading about the 1st edition Bard, in particular how dual-classing used to work, I wonder if some very good initial ideas were thrown out along the way.

Allow Martials to Gestalt with other Martial classes as long as they meet certain requirements, and with a limit on the number of multi-classes, is the first (admittedly bizarre) idea that comes to mind.


Thank you sir!


Nice 'So I Married An Axe Murderer' reference >.<


As an example, here's a build I'm going with for PFS. The first thing was wanting to build a Dex-based Reach build around the Elven Branched Spear. The idea is for a general Support Cleric build that can be in melee a bit, use Touch spells at range, Channel a bit and, more than anything, have a very full and robust action economy, that is fun to play, and contributes to out-of-combat in terms of social utility. It is obviously not very good at any one thing, but I hope that in a full group he'll be able to pull his weight and always be able to add something.
Taro Omakase, Kitsune Cleric of Cayden Cailean (Ftr 2 (Lore Warden/Cleric 9 (Separatist)
Starting stats:
STR: 10
DEX: 15
CON: 14
INT: 12
WIS: 14
CHA: 15
+1 to Dex at Lvl 4, +1 to Cha at Lvl 8
Domains: Travel, Druid Eagle Domain
Traits: Rice Runner (Acrobatics as class skill), Magical Knack (Cleric)
Feats:
Lvl 1: Ftr - Weapon Finesse, Exotic Weapon Prof. (Elven Branched Spear)
Lvl 2: Ftr - Combat Reflexes, Combat Expertise (granted)
Lvl 3 onwards: Cleric - Selective Channeling, Eagle Familiar (granted)
Lvl 5: Improved Familiar (Celestial Eagle)
Lvl 7: Boon Companion -> Silvanshee Agathion
Lvl 9: Lunge
Lvl 11: Sacred Summons
Skills (4 per level): Acrobatics, Diplomacy, Sense Motive, Perception


After reading Brewer's Guide to the Reach Cleric, I've been on a Reach Build kick lately. It seems the ideas presented in the guide could be applicable to a variety of other classes, particularly all the hybrid Melee/Caster classes. Obviously a Reach Oracle is viable, but it seems the action economy benefits of a Reach build could be very useful to all classes that use a Standard action for caster abilities.
I'm curious what combos people have tried out, and what they thought worked and didn't work?


I would be very interested in testing.


The PFS scenario that awards the Faerie Dragon Boon is The Sanos Abduction. That's the only way to get a Faerie Dragon s an Improved Familiar in PFS.


2-level dip Paladin (Oath of Vengeance)/Vexing Daredevil. Heavy armor, MWP, Smite, +CHA to all saves and to Will twice (!!!), plus Painful stare abilities. >:)


I agree with Beernorg. If you have a single, specific weapon in mind, blowing your first level feat to pick up MWP would be overkill. There are racial traits that allow you to pick up weapon proficiencies (Ancestral Arms), as well, if you wanted to stick with the base Mesmerist class.
If you want to specifically be better at melee combat, the Vexing Daredevil is a great archetype. They lean a tiny bit towards being Dex-based in concept, with Acrobatics as a class skill, and a Dazzling Feint class ability that improves it, but a STR-based build is just as viable.
If you really wanted to be more martially-oriented, a 1-level dip in a Martial class could net you increased armor and weapon proficiencies (which you can use without penalty as a Psychic caster), and additional Feats or class abilities. Fighter, Cavalier, and even Paladin could work if you want Heavy Armor. The Slayer would give you MWP and the Studied Target ability.


Well, there's also the Hunter. The right pet can do melee duty or act as a mount, allowing full-round actions for casting or ranged attacks. You'll get a variety of buffs and utility spells.

Magus, as 20 STR mentioned above. There's now an Eldritch Archer archetype.

If you're starting at 10, you could potentially create a lean, optimized Prestige Class build. Bloodrager/Dragon Disciple, Paladin/Sorcerer/Dragon Disciple make very distinct PC's

Rangers have a lot of options available now. The Divine Tracker archetype opens up a lot of options (as you get the Favored Weapon of your deity, which can include many exotics, and swap out Warpriest Blessings for your Bond. In combination with the new Ranger Combat Style feats from Inner Sea Combat, they're very customizable).


Sounds like a ranged DPR might fit in? You have a couple skill-heavy characters, but no nature-boy.

Ranger?

For INT-based, perhaps an Occultist (Battle Host archetype)?


Enhancement bonuses in multiple slots can't really happen, as you only get the largest enhancement bonus currently active.


Good thinkin', Aldaris ;)


Whoops. Ninja'ed by OP! >.<


Have you consider being a skinwalker?

Also, considered the feral hunter Hunter archetype? You can stay in a single class whose parent classes are Druid and Ranger, and whose class abilities are all based around Shapeshifting.

With Magical Knack (Hunter), you won't lose casting progression, and since you won't have an Animal Companion, you don't have to worry about losing levels when you dip two levels of Fighter to up your BAB and pick up at least 2 extra feats.

=)


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ZanThrax emphasizes a really important aspect of this Archetype: that it's built for a campaign where the GM and Player can really work together.
There can always be a great deal of imagination, inspiration, and interplay between player and GM when an Animal Companion, Familiar, or Mount are in play, but when a Martial class has a highly intelligent Familiar, whose objective is potentially shrouded in mystery? Well, that's plat-hook gold for a good GM.
I could even see a 'Black Blade' type sentient object, Construct, or Clockwork/Steampunk-type Improved Familiar taking the place of the default Familiar, with a range of potentially (by turns) hilarious, bizarre, inscrutable, ominous, or sage directives emerging from it...


If you combine Boon Companion with Magical Knack (Hunter), so you don't sacrifice either casting progression, or your Companion's progession, there are probably some worthwhile dips. It depends on where they occur. 3/4 caster and BAB progressions are such that even a level dip may have a big impact, as you're really waiting for iterative attacks and higher level spells to open up, and you don't really want to wait for those as you're behind the full-progression characters on either side of the equation, and they diminish in effectiveness rapidly.
With any 'hybrid' or 3/4 BAB class, the safest dips are into full BAB classes, given the safeguards above. A 1 or 2-level dip is often where the 'meat' of the class abilities lie and, even if they have limited scaling or uses per day due to level, can still synergise well with your main class, if done thoughtfully. Obvious candidates would include any Archetype from a class that is based around Wisdom as a caster or pool stat, and either STR or DEX as a combat stat, whatever your base build might be.
As such, here are some things to think about:
Maneuver Master (Monk Archetype):
The big thing about MM's is that they can, by the nature of Combat Maneuvers, use weapons, and their Flurry is not limited in the way other Flurry abilities are (unarmed/bows/thrown weapons).
Gunslinger: I haven't considered this much, but it's possibly viable on a limited scale, with the right feats.
Besides this, full BAB Archetypes of Fighter, Slayer, Cavalier, and Barbarian could all be useful. Think about your concept, play style, combat style, and out-of-combat abilities.
The Hunter isn't really about you; it is, more than any other class, a 'pet class' in the truest sense (even more so than a Summoner); it's all about how you and your full-on, awesome Animal Companion deal with things together, and choosing and developing your A.C. is where the 'magic' is; if you lose A.C. progression, you sabotage yourself, as A.C.'s don't progress as fast as PC's.


Break things with your ever-growing reach of ectoplasmatic tendrils.
Take Weapon Finesse, Weapon Focus (Tendrils), pump your Dex, and take Improved Sunder. Just smash things with your strange ungodly manifested tentacles?


Idea: You're of one of the following races: Aasimar, Kitsune, Undine. Multi-class Spiritualist/Oracle.
You're a young kid who grew up on the streets, not knowing his/her parentage.
You've disguised yourself as a human for so long, you might even think you're Human (each of the races has an option for appearing more human, or being more easily disguised).
Oracle:

Mystery: Nature, Ancestor, Heavens, **LIFE**, Lore, Lunar, *Occult*, Outer Rifts, Time, *Wind*, Wood.

Curse: Wrecker Curse
Source PPC:BoF

The destructive power of the Abyss and its teeming hordes of demons seeps from your very pores and into your belongings and surroundings.

Effect

Held objects gain the broken condition when you use or equip them but regain their actual condition if employed by anyone else. If a held item is restored to unbroken condition, it becomes broken again the following round. Disable Device becomes a class skill for you and you can make Disable Device checks to destroy non-magical traps as a move action without the need to use tools or take any action beyond simply touching it.

At 5th level, whenever you attempt to damage an object with a melee attack, reduce its hardness by an amount equal to your oracle level before determining the damage you deal with that attack.

At 10th level, any attacks you make against objects and constructs automatically bypass any damage reduction they may possess except epic.

At 15th level, whenever you are dealt damage by an attack with a manufactured weapon, you can require the weapon’s wielder to make a Reflex save (DC 10 +1/2 your oracle level + your Charisma modifier) to avoid having the weapon collapse into dust immediately after striking you (magical weapons receive an additional saving throw against this effect).

Spiritualist (Ectoplasmastist/Fractured Mind Archetypes) (they stack):

Ectoplasmic Lash (Su)

At 1st level, as a full-round action an ectoplasmatist can manifest one or two lashes of ectoplasm tethered to her by wispy, ectoplasmic tendrils. If she manifests two lashes, she can wield them both as light melee weapons, each dealing 1d6 points of slashing damage (1d4 if the ectoplasmatist is Small) with a critical threat range and multiplier of 19–20/×2. If the ectoplasmatist manifests only one lash, she can manifest it either as a single one-handed melee weapon that deals 1d8 points of slashing damage (1d6 if the ectoplasmatist is Small) with a critical threat range and multiplier of 19–20/×2, or as a two-handed melee weapon that deals 2d6 points of bludgeoning damage (1d10 if the ectoplasmatist is Small) with a critical multiplier of ×2. Only the ectoplasmatist can wield or use these lashes. Dismissing any or all manifested lashes is a free action.

Emotional Spellcasting

A fractured mind's ability to cast spells is tied to the force of her own spirit rather than her connection to the spirit world. As a result, she uses her Charisma score rather than her Wisdom score to determine the highest spell level she can cast, the saving throw DCs of spells she casts, and her bonus spells per day.

This ability alters spellcasting.

You literally cannot carry anything, but you don't need to, as all the weapons and spellcasting you need is within you.


Wait.. how is STR 4 even possible given PFS rules?


My feeling, if you have a sympathetic GM, is that if you can substitute equipment in the place of feats, especially in the case of a feat-starved build where you're trying to make something work (and the rules aren't helping), is to use equipment where possible. The build I posted above is fairly flexible, I think, where you could find other Favored Weapons that have throwing ranges, and other Deities that have the Air Domain.
The choice between a blinkback belt and the hurling belt stinks, IMO.
In a home game I'd create a 'blinkback harness' that occupied the chest slot.
And make the PC quest for it, of course ;)

Here is an amusing and clever thread about a *cough* throwing build I came across, as well:
THROW STUFF


Here are some things to consider, and bring to your GM if you're interested, as many of them use splatbooks:


  • The Thrown Weapon style from the ACG
  • One of the great (best, IMO) things about Ranger styles is they allow you to skip normal feat pre-requisites: I have a character who uses Power Attack even though she has a 10 STR. This can enable some very effective combinations of abilities that are normally very MAD.
  • There are wonderful combat styles for Rangers who are Devoted servants of Golarion Deities in Inner Sea Combat (splatbook) - many of these could easily be adapted to a homebrew campagin with its own deities. As you said you may take the Divine Tracker Archetype, this seems like it could be a good fit, thematically.
  • Rangers get their Favored Enemy bonuses to combat maneuvers, making them pretty good as battlefield controllers/maneuver specialists
  • Looking at additional weapon properties that can either be crafted or enchanted into weapons can really open up some possibilities

Here's a potential partial build:
Aldarion Silvercrest, NG Devoted Ranger of Gozreh
Half-Elf Ranger (Divine Tracker/Infiltrator Archetypes).
Bessings: Air, Plant
(I wouldn't trade away your spellcasting for Trapper, for this build.)
Ancestral Arms Weapon: Throwing Shield
Favored Weapon: Trident
Starting Stats:
Str:18
Dex:14
Con:14
Int:12
Wis:12
Cha:7
All stat gains to Strength.
Traits: Strong Arm Supple Wrist, Warrior of Old
Favored Enemies: Undead, Aberrations, Humanoid (Giant), Dragon
(The Ranger is a servant of the natural world, and a hunter of the creatures who seek to despoil it, especially the follower's of Gozreh's hated enemies, Rovagug and Urgathoa.)

4th level blessings: Zephyr's Gift (minor): At 1st level, you can touch any one ranged weapon and enhance it with the quality of air. For 1 minute, any attacks made with the weapon take no penalties due to range. In addition, making a ranged attack with this weapon doesn't provoke an attack of opportunity.

Creeping Vines (minor): At 1st level, upon hitting with a melee attack, as a swift action you cause the creature you hit to sprout entangling vines that attempt to hold it in place, entangling it for 1 round (Reflex negates).

The Ranger also uses a Mithral Throwing Shield. He takes a 1-level dip in the Slayer Archetype Bounty Hunter (at some point later in his career), which keeps his BAB at full, and nets him (no pun intended) weapon proficiency with the aklys, bolas, dan bong, lasso, and net (along with the Studied Target ability). He uses his Infiltrator adaptations to grant him Darkvision, +2 Natural Armor, Throw Anything, and Lunge

Feats:
Lvl 1: Point-Blank Shot (It would nice to side-step this, but it will come into play often, and the important thing, as always, is hitting, since he will rely on his lower Dex until the Belt is acquired.)
Lvl 2: Combat Style Feat(Thrown Weapons) - Two-Weapon Fighting (this allows our Ranger to be a switch-hitter, alternating between Thrown and melee styles)
Lvl 3: Precise Shot (Ahhh, finally ignoring that pesky -4), first Adaptation comes online
Lvl 4: Divine Tracker Blessing comes online! (You can conceivably attack at 100' with no range penalty with your thrown Trident, with a 10' move)
Lvl 5: Improved Shield Bash (You can use that shield as a melee weapon, keep the AC bonus, and throw something in your other hand, or the shield)
Lvl 6: Combat Style Feat: Quick Draw (You just started getting iterative attacks, so now is when it becomes essential)
Lvl 7: Shield Slam (You can now use your full BAB, Favored Enemy bonus, gear, etc. to repel opponents who close with you, and draw and throw once they're pushed away. Remember you can Trip with your Throwing Shield!)
Lvl 8: 2nd Adaptation comes online
Lvl 9: Deadly Aim (Bring the pain). Evasion in Medium Armor and carrying a shield (or mithral Heavy Armor... - take that, Rogues!)
Lvl 10: Pinpoint Targeting ('As a standard action, make a single ranged attack. The target does not gain any armor, natural armor, or shield bonuses to its Armor Class. You do not gain the benefit of this feat if you move this round.' - normally requires 19 Dex and a huge feat chain
i.e. no problems hitting anything that has high AC based on armor - ever.)
Lvl 11: Shield Master (You do not suffer any penalties on attack rolls made with a shield while you are wielding another weapon. Add your shield’s enhancement bonus to attack and damage rolls made with the shield as if it were a weapon enhancement bonus. - Notice the text does not specify melee attacks only, so ask your DM whether you can use these bonuses when throwing the shield). Quarry Class ability. 3rd level spells.
Lvl 12: Camouflage ability, usable any time you're using an Adaptation
Lvl 13: Any Feat you can think of that suits your style and that you qualify for. Major Blessings come online. You can now fly at 60' with a Fly score of +15, and do +13 Electricity damage on a charge attack. You can also summon small Elementals and a Pteranodon)
Lvl 14: Combat Style Feat - Shot on the Run (Fly and take a ranged attack at any point during your movement), 4th-level Spells...
Essential Gear:
Efficient Quiver. Contains various throwing weapons of various special materials, a backup bow and arrows, spears, staves, etc.
Belt of Mighty Hurling
Headband of Wisdom
Wand of Lead Blades, Lesser Metamagic Rods
Weapon Enchantments: Seeking, Veering
Possible Gear:
Gauntlets of the Skilled Maneuver (Bull Rush or Trip)


Are you averse to multi-classing?


First off, as an aside, it's important to remember that campaign setting can have an enormous impact on your effectiveness and ability to contribute as a character of any given class. My Ranger often feels woefully under-utilized in urban and underground settings, and my Druid, even moreso.
When you first look at the Cavalier, it looks very under-developed (and I'm not saying it isn't, necessarily). Instead of each level being crammed with class abilities, there's a whole bunch of blank lines.
The strengths of the class are in the fine print, and the abilities that can be inserted by virtue of the Order.
I have an Agation-blooded Aasimar, Beast-rider, Order of the Beast Cavalier, who will eventually multiclass into Mammoth Rider. This is a guy who can transform his Big Cat into a flying mount and charge from the sky, all with no spellcasting. This is an extreme example, but it serves to highlight how versatile the class can be, if you make a decision about what you want. Some things to remember:

  • You and your mount can fight separately
  • Your mount comes fully combat trained
  • Your mount can benefit from a large selection of equipment
  • When you charge, you hit first, then your mount hits!
  • Your mount can benefit from Archetypes, some of which drastically improved his ability to affect combat (Charger, Bodyguard
  • Common teamwork feats like Outflank can drastically change a battle, and your mount benefits from them as well
  • It's all about you and your mount. You are a Full BAB class and you get a super duper Animal Companion at 1st level. You're the only class that gets this.

So, yeah. Are Cavaliers awesome? YMMV, but I think they have their niche.


She takes a -4 to hit (more accurately, the enemy gains a +4 to AC from the intervening character, providing 'soft cover', as CampinCarl mentions above); Ally A provides cover, in this situation.
Review the rules for cover in the Combat section of the CRB; reach weapons use the rules for ranged weapons when determining cover (pp. 195-196).


*Note that there is some ambiguity about the use of SLA's versus supernatural abilities while Raging; SU's seem to be clear, while SLA's may encounter some table variation.
Here's a sample build idea:
A Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser-type, carousing, hard-living Battle Cleric of Cayden Cailean.
Human Cleric 9(Devout Pilgrim)/Barb (Armored Hulk)3
Domains: Travel, Strength
Feats: Weapon Focus (Guisarme), Extra Channel, Combat Casting, Power Attack, Sacred Summons, Combat Reflexes, Improved Initiative
Move 35'/rd in Heavy armor, 45' with Domain ability. Can use your Domain ability on allies as a Standard. Teleport yourself or others around the battlefield, or through/around obstacles. Boost your own or other's Strength or movement, channel, or cast (including Summon as a standar action) and move during your turn, and attack using AoO's with Reach Weapon when it's not.


My first question is, "how much leeway do you have with your Cleric and Barbarian class levels, in terms on Archetypes?"

Most of my characters 'build against type', and are multi-classed, so here are some of the things to look for:
1. DEFENSE/Granted armor and shield proficiencies: Cleric and Barbarians both get Medium armor and shield. Can you build defense around that? Can you take a Cleric Archetype that strengthens offense if favor of reduced armor proficiencies, which your Barbarian levels will offset, as you will gain those proficiencies back? Can you take levels of a Cleric or Barb. Archetype which grant increased proficiencies (Crusader? Armored Hulk?)
The most advantageous aspect here is that Divine Casters are not hampered in their spellcasting or Domain abilities by using Heavy armor. Heavy shields are problematic at times as they prohibit the use of a free hand for somatic components, or presenting a Holy Symbol to Channel Energy.
2. DEFENSE: Saving Throws/DR/SR, etc. : The other things you can be targeted by.
Multiclassing often results in imbalanced Saving Throws; as a Cleric/Barb., you will have a high Fort save, a much better Will save than a normal Barb., and an absolute crap Reflex save. Shoring up your character's weak points can be as important as capitalizing on your strengths. The good news is that failed Reflex saves usually only result in HP damage, and not debilitating status effects.
3. OFFENSE: What is your weapon style? Feats?
The Good News: This is totally doable. Rage is the signature Barb. ability, which normally interferes with casting, vis a vis, "While in rage, a barbarian cannot use any Charisma-, Dexterity-, or Intelligence-based skills (except Acrobatics, Fly, Intimidate, and Ride) or any ability that requires patience or concentration."
This means casting Cleric Spells while Raging is OUT, completely. Even a Quickened spell requires Concentration. What is left are Channel Energy and Domain abilities, which can be quite powerful.
My advice, since you are primarily a Cleric, with Barb. levels, is to focus on being a support build that acts as a second level of defense, and can frontline when necessary. Strength, Travel, War, and other Domains have excellent abilities which can be used while Raging.
Consider the Armored Hulk archetype.
Read the excellent Guide to the Reach Cleric, and build upon that. You have good stats for out-of-combat buffing and support; in combat, focus on Domain Abilities and Channel Energy, judicious use of support spells, and pick up Combat Reflexes, Power Attack, and a Reach weapon.
For your stat boost items, buy a STR belt and a mixed WIS/CHA headband; pick up Extra Channel as a feat, and buy +2 Full Plate. Use Greater Magic Weapon and Magic Vestment to boost your weapon and armor +'s; shore up your defenses where possible with items, and decide how much offense you're really going to try to be doing. Sometimes just pointing a pointy thing in the right place and holding the line while other people smash things is enough.


I agree that the Lawful ethos is more in keeping with sadomasochism, but it's hardly a necessity.
Kytons (Cenobites, by any other name) are the archetypal sadomasochists of the d20 universe; Tieflings have access to a Kyton bloodline, which grants +'s to Con and Cha, and -'s to Wis - fairly interesting bonuses to start a concept with.
Or use the Holy Vindicator Prestige Class; it doesn't have an alignment restriction. So, a Lawful Neutral character with extensive Negative Channeling could become a powerful 'Unholy Vindicator'.
Be a priest/priestess of Calistria. Add a Conductive whip, and Channel smite people silly while you manifest wounds on your body that echo the ones you're dishing out...
Add the Vicious weapon property to make it even more painful.


I have finals today so I won't be posting until tomorrow - my apologies!


Drew C.
# 84475-3
Silver Crusade

Profession (soldier): 1d20 + 9 ⇒ (3) + 9 = 12


Aye, this is my last week of classes for the semester, so I'll post, but they might be brief.


Covert Operator wrote:

I'm making one, and I like to VMC Order of the Star Cavalier. This effectively lets your channel progress at 1.5 times your level. You could take Believer's Boon/Hands too to gain a Paladin channel which is increased by the VMC.

VMC isn't allowed in PFS I guess, but it's definitely worth a mention because of how powerful it is.

I'm not sure as I understand this. Believer's Boon grants a domain ability. Channel Energy is a separate class feature unrelated to domain abilities. Also, BB states that it is only Cleric domain abilities, not Paladins or other Divine classes?


Covent wrote:

I actually was building a very similar cleric for my next PFS character.

The only big change I have is that my cleric has a higher wisdom and the inevitable domain for the free command spells every day.

He is Here.

I've been tinkering with a few Cleric builds lately that have either good touch or bad touch domain abilities. I'm fascinated by the possibilities of a conductive weapon - that Command ability seems perfect for it. >:)


BadBird wrote:

One thing to note is that with a decent wisdom, spells like Archon's Aura and Aura of Doom can smooth the way for your channel DC very nicely.

I wonder how easily a Warpriest of Horus could use Greater Channel Smite to throw daze around with every weapon strike in a full attack... hmm.

Thanks - I should think about making him more of a caster. I think I was partially assuming you either cast or channel well, and generally not both, but as the other sample character demonstrates, you can have your cake and make someone else eat it, too.


Markov Spiked Chain wrote:
Envoy of Balance at 5th is worth thinking about. By 9th, you'll be able to full channel positive energy, or channel to heal and daze at the same time.

Wow. I was unaware of this PrC. Seems like a good fit!


I'll be bringing a different character as well. When are we looking to start this shindig?


Here is the big question about the build: how Variant Channeling interacts with Versatile Channeling.

In the description for Variant Channeling, it says (emphasis mine): wrote:
Variant channeling has the same area of effect, save DCs, uses per day, and other rules relating to channeling energy. Feats and abilities that modify or present alternative uses for channeled energy (such as Command Undead and Turn Undead) work normally with these variant channeling abilities.

By my reading, Positive Channeling to heal (or harm undead) would work normally, i.e. at his Cleric Level -2, but NOT with the Variant Channeling Effect for Rulership.

Does this seem correct, or am I projecting?


Just a Mort wrote:

Feather domain nets you an extra body on the battlefileld. Don't worry, fluffy(or probably furry) in this case, is better at smacking things then you are.

Just an example of a 7th level screen shot.

You start next to your animal companion(lion)

Lion is large, but narrow frame lets him squeeze around fine,

Lions stats
Str 23.
+4 BAB
Unbuffed +9 to hit, +6 to dmg

Just a small note: Animal Domain and the related subdomains have their pets at Cleric Level -3, so you would need to pick up the Boon Companion Feat for fuzzy to get Large and In-Charge on schedule.


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Merqutio wrote:

Hey my buddies and I are just getting into pathfinder and I'm looking to play a cleric since none of them want to play a support. I also want to have some impact on combat. I'm thinking of mainly supporting with a little bit of off tanking with shield and 1 hand weapon.

I'm playing a dwarf and odds are I can use the points from the point buy on creation to make up for the lack in charisma. I'm also considering picking up heavy armor feat for the off tanking.

The main problem I'm having is picking the right domains. Travel and the other movement domain seem like a help since I'm already slow as a dwarf but protection/law/good/etc seem like a better choice for a buff bot tank.

Look at Tark's guide

here...

And then check out Brewer's guide to the Reach Cleric

here...


One of the GM's in my Lodge had a particularly nasty Cleric build - a Neutral Cleric of Dispater. He used variant negative Channeling, as Dispater has the Rulership sphere of influence, which Dazes enemies that fail their Channel DC save. This guy shut down entire combats and saved the whole party a couple times. I've always loved Crowd Control builds that don't do direct damage, necessarily, but looked around for a way to create a cleric that isn't a worshiper of an evil deity.
After a little searching, I found the Osirion (i.e. Ancient Egyptian) Pantheon. Here are Neutral Deities with the Rulership S.O.I., cool favored weapons, and great domains, to boot!
I'm curious to see what people think of this build, and what I might do to improve it in terms of effectiveness as a channeler, and in terms of overall party usefulness, and where I should go after level 1.
Aasimar (Vanilla) Cleric of Horus
Domains: Day Subdomain, Feather Subdomain
Traits: Sacred Conduit (+1 To Channel DC), Observant (Grand Lodge)
Str:10
Dex:10
Con:14
Int:14
Wis:15
Cha:17
Channels NEGATIVE, Variant Channeling (Rulership): Harm - Creatures are dazed for 1 round.
Feat: Selective Channeling
Diplomacy: 9
Perception: 9
Sense Motive: 6
Spellcraft: 6
SPECIAL QUALITIES (selected):
Eyes of the Hawk (Ex)
You gain a racial bonus equal to 1/2 your cleric level on Perception checks. In addition, if you can act during a surprise round, you receive a +2 racial bonus on your Initiative check.

Sun's Blessing (Su)
Whenever you channel positive energy to harm undead creatures, add a +1 bonus to the damage dealt. Undead do not add their channel resistance to their saves when you channel positive energy.

He'll pick up Versatile Channeling at level 3, and then, besides Channeling-related feats, utility feats like Improved Initiative. I've considered Extra Traits to get Magical Knack, for dipping into Holy Vindicator without losing casting progression. Other than that and a very thematically-inappropriate level dip into Hellknight Signifier (I picture reskinning it as a Hawk helmet), I'm pretty vague on what would work best.

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