Goblins Must Die! (Pathfinder 1e Newbie Game) (Inactive)

Game Master DeJoker

Here be the Discussion Thread

3d6 + 6 - 2 ⇒ (4, 2, 4) + 6 - 2 = 14
3d6 + 6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 3, 5) + 6 - 2 = 14
3d6 + 6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 6, 6) + 6 - 2 = 18

3d6 + 6 - 3 ⇒ (3, 4, 3) + 6 - 3 = 13
3d6 + 6 - 1 ⇒ (2, 3, 1) + 6 - 1 = 11
3d6 + 6 - 1 ⇒ (2, 1, 4) + 6 - 1 = 12

Alright finished my walk so I can organise my thoughts some on the stats.

I'll turn the 13 and 11 into two 12's so I can get things right, as it is hard to organise things with odd numbers for me.

So far got a few ideas for the array order
14,14,12, with the 18 going into a mental stat with the rest as 12's, as putting an 18 in the physicals with the 14's feels a bit min-max.

14,18,12,with the last 14 going into a mental stat with the rest as 12's

would of liked the ones in recruitment, that I cancelled on, as the first 3 were the same, but the last 3 were a bit more likable.

No you do not get to adjust the numbers that you rolled as that is not how that works these are your rolls: 18, 14, 14, 13, 12, 11

Therefore those are you numbers going forward to which you get to add your racial modifiers to.

Sorry that you canceled (deleted) the ones in Recruitment thread but these will do just fine and they do average more than a 13 so a solid set of numbers.

I can recover them since I have not posted in recruitment, as Rolls are saved to each new post in a thread.

I just recovered the rolls, and put them up.

Ok. I made my rolls in the recruitment thread. If I was wrong, sorry. Any way here they are cut and paste. If I need to reroll I will.

roll 1: 3d6 + 6 - 3 ⇒ (4, 3, 4) + 6 - 3 = 14
roll 2: 3d6 + 6 - 1 ⇒ (5, 1, 6) + 6 - 1 = 17
roll 3: 3d6 + 6 - 2 ⇒ (3, 4, 2) + 6 - 2 = 13
roll 4: 3d6 + 6 - 2 ⇒ (2, 2, 3) + 6 - 2 = 11
roll 5: 3d6 + 6 - 1 ⇒ (4, 1, 5) + 6 - 1 = 15
roll 6: 3d6 + 6 - 1 ⇒ (6, 2, 1) + 6 - 1 = 14

Before racials I’m thinking S: 17 D: 14 C: 14 I: 13 W: 11 Ch: 15

Might switch int and wis

Reposted from recruitment thread:

I’m still thinking Human, Skald (Fated Champion archetype).

Quick question. In PFS play they let you switch out scribe scroll feat for the extra performance feat. Would you be willing to do allow this switch.

As far as what I’d like to see from the game. A little intrigued within the guild. Otherwise I’m open to anything.

Okay RHMG I have those rolls now and we can go with those.

Oh and RHMG and G-Unit if you are aware of the Feat Tax Guidelines I will be using them on a case by case basis as I do not fully agree with all of them but I definitely do agree with some of them.

First that I definitely agree with their call on Weapon Finesse and as such this is no longer a Feat and it is just something that anyone can do that is using either Light Weapon or a Weapon with the Finesse quality.

I will also of course be adopting the Deft Maneuvers Feat as the replacement for the normal Weapon Finesse Feat when it comes to the Greater Combat Maneuver Feats as outlined in the Feat.

Note: I will be posting any and all changes to the Campaign tab for easier look up but I just want to get some of these on the table right here during character building.

Also, I will be working with each of you to help you create a more robust background assuming you are interested in giving your character more depth and ties into the world and campaign in general. So do think about those backgrounds.

So here is the revised Human Race -- this race has been balanced to all the other allowable races and no this does not follow the optional Race Building Guidelines becauase I found those to be rather unbalanced as well and I had already created my version prior to those guidelines coming out so I stuck with mine. However, if you want an idea of how I this kind of equates to the Race Building Guidelines -- in my book a Standard Specific Feat would be equal to 4 RPs while a take any Feat you want would be equal to 6 RPs. I have been working (but have not completed) altered set of Race Building Guidelines that reflect a more balance system as this will help me fine tune my version as mine was based on comparing the Racial Feature against what a Feat can give you.

Oh and yes G-Unit you can swap the Scribe Scroll Feat for the Extra Performance Feat -- however -- the Scribe Scroll Feat is actually Craft Magic Item Feat -- yes a new Feat Tax is in place here.

RHMG Animator has request to play a Half-Frost Folk which they made a conversion of from DnD 3.5e I believe. We have been discussing this in PM but I am bringing it here so everyone can see what we are doing and get a better idea of how I think balance is maintained. He used the Race Building Guidelines as found in PF1e Advanced Race Guide however I do not agree with those Guidelines as they are written as they are not consistently balanced and further I require all my Races to be of equal worth so that no Race is better than another Race they are just different. Now my version of balanced Races was built before the Advanced Race Guide book was published but I have been looking an converting my version over to a modified version of that Race Building Guide which I have not completed as of yet.

Next I want inform everyone that there are no normal Humanoid Races nor Creatures for that matter that have Dark Vision considering that in our Real World there are no creatures that possess such an ability. The closest we have is Infrared Vision possessed by an extremely few creatures.

That being said you will find that all of my non-magical creatures will not possess Dark Vision they will possess Low-Light Vision and/or some other sense that allows them to navigate in the dark if they are not the kind that would use an artifical light source.

This means the most the bad guys will need an artificial light source just the like the good guys do.

Sounds good. As far as background goes (painting with broad brushstrokes). I see this Skald as being a shield bearer for a previous member of the guild (probably a sibling or spouse), on their first mission (perhaps they were betrayed?). As a result the Skald is haunted by their past and has their former member watching over them// haunting them.

Mechanically I think the Possessed Hand feat (link) would be cool. And perhaps the spirit totem line of rage powers.

Looking drawbacks and story feats to help supporters this idea.

I’ll need help on were they could be from. If they were betrayed, does the pc know about it? who was it and why? Any help filling in the blanks would be appreciated. Also, I’ll have to figure out why they joined the guild to begin with.

Well also keep in mind that you are a 1st-level character which basically most of your background deals with training to become what you are.

So maybe your character was not betrayed but their mentor was and the metnor was able to pass information onto the charcter that gave a clue without the entirety of the information as to the betrayer or the entirety but the character would not be able to prove the betrayal nor take this individual on by themselves at your current level and of course speaking out without prood would do nothing but perhaps get them to mysteriously disappear never to be heard from again or meet an unfortunate fatal accident or encounter

The path you choose kind of depends upon what you would like to pursue as a player -- a complete mystery or a known power struggle

Okay so let us examine first my version of the Human using Race Points:

Now let us look at the Half-Frost Folk or Rimy Race that was proposed.

Oh and folks keep in mind that a Trait should equal about half of a Feat and all Feats should be about equal in power. So if you find a Trait or a Feat that you feel might be over or under powered and you want to take it then please bring it to my attention and we can address it. I have fixed a few Feats and Traits in the past but I would have to dig them up and then if no one wants to take them its wasted time. So I will reserve that for feats that only the players are wanting to take.

That being said and I am not sure if anyone is even taking this but the Meta Magic Feats for Arcane Spell Casters are not as costly as they are outlined. To help you understand many Meta Magic Feats will simply cost another spell slot of the same level while a 50% increase in power is only a 1 level step up and 100% increase in power is only a 2 level step up. This is based off of the actual spell power levels when comparing one spell of one level to another spell of a higher level spell.

Here is the alias for G-unit’s PC.

I like the mentor idea, I’m going run with it and flesh it out.

A couple of questions:
Are we from a particular branch of the guild?
What age do people start training at the guild?
Is there an admission process?

....

So RHMG Animator I hope that helps you see what I am looking at and striving for when I go to balance a race against other races -- the Race Building Guidelines are horribly unbalanced as they stand. I personally believe they were engineered to make the current Races appear balanced which sadly they were not and thus this broke the entire concept of creating a system to build balanced races from scratch.

I both agree and disagree, Most of the Core Races are pretty Balanced already, also your Breaking an UNspoken rule for races, All racial adjustments are in EVEN numbers (2,4,6,8) This rule even goes to it's predecessor D&D 3.X.

And I think you don't understand enough to properly work and balance the system. Your revised Half-frost folk you sent me via PM had the Cold Subtype, and it seemed you did not understand the impacts of it, what it entailed.

Your making changes to the system you don't seem to realise the impacts are. And I've play with this system for over 20 years, so I have a good feel for impacts on changes.

Stalker: ??? Have no clue what this is but cannot be worth more than a modified 1 RP (aka 1/4 of a Feat or 1/2 a Trait)

Yeah this proves you don't know the system or its content as well as you think you do or where it is from.

Stalker is in the ARG, in the race builder section, under the skills and feats subsection.

Also If this GAME is for Newbies, that should mean you keep the system as STANDARD and in the ORIGINAL STATE as possible, that means no race tweaking, no messing with Feats or Traits.

Your changes, make the game are no longer Pathfinder 1e,
but Homebrew based on Pathfinder 1e, which is a big difference.

..
Next I want inform everyone that there are no normal Humanoid Races nor Creatures for that matter that have Dark Vision considering that in our Real World there are no creatures that possess such an ability. The closest we have is Infrared Vision possessed by an extremely few creatures. .....

Then the Goblins are no longer goblins, especially not "Goblin Slayer" Goblins.

This impacts more then you think......

DeJoker wrote:

..
Next I want inform everyone that there are no normal Humanoid Races nor Creatures for that matter that have Dark Vision considering that in our Real World there are no creatures that possess such an ability. The closest we have is Infrared Vision possessed by an extremely few creatures. .....

Then the Goblins are no longer goblins, especially not "Goblin Slayer" Goblins.

This impacts more than you think......

My irl group has used this rule for 12+ years. It actually works out really well in play.

RHMG Animator wrote:

....

Then the Goblins are no longer goblins, especially not "Goblin Slayer" Goblins.

This impacts more than you think......

My irl group has used this rule for 12+ years. It actually works out really well in play.

On paper and at the table, it does. But there is more book keeping and clarification in other formats that are not in person since only areas with light sources are visible.

In a game I'm in, the archer had a number of issues due to having only Low-Light vision, all member with Darkvision had no issues with the fight and had to Help the those with Low-Light vision to see the enemy.

And the Newbie wants to be "Goblin Slayer" which means Goblin Slayer Goblins, which means the Goblins have Darkvision and they are humanoid.

I agree darkvision makes things easier. Just like not tracking encumbrance makes things easier. Your example points out exactly why darkvision is a bit broken.

As far as goblin slayer goblins go, I have no clue, as I am not familiar with the source material. However, this is a game, and if we can agree that they don’t have darkvision, then in our version they don’t. I’m not going to get hung up about it.

Thanks G-Unit for you understanding on that and I look forward to working with you on your character's background. Just keep in mind the world we are going to start in is currently in a sort of cloud state meaning I have an idea for the starting place and some of its immediate surrounds which will allow to pretty much merge in just about any backstory that we end up coming up with.

Okay RHMG Animator no Goblins do not necessarily need Dark Vision to be Goblins and be effective in the dark it just means that in this rendition -- which will definitely not be a mirror of the manga but simply be borrowing concepts from it -- they have another means of navigating within the dark which depending on whether the PCs learn this information or not could affect how the PCs end up dealing with Goblins in an effective manner.

Next RHMG Animator if you have issues with a not by the RaW (Rules as Written) but rather a by the GaW (Guidelines as Written) which explicitly states that a GM should feel free to use what works and discard or alter what does not work for their game. So I adhere to the GaW and I will state up front that there will be alterations to the GaW that I have used in all my PF1e games quite successfully. So if that is a problem for you then I am not sure this is the game for you. However, if you are willing to give it a try and see where it goes (as you might just enjoy those changes) you are more than welcome to stick around and I will do my best to create game content -- (cannot guarantee the mechanics part will not change) -- that will hopefully be enjoyable to you.

This also means I am perfectly committed to creating a version of your Race that you want to play although it might not be exactly what you intially outlined. However, if I were a RaW DM I might have issues with your race from a balance stand point as it seems that race was being designed to exploit the Race Building Guidelines rather than just create an actual playable race with a specific flavor.

So let me know how or if you want to proceed with things RHMG Animator

I'll be dropping, as I what you as GM pitched as a PF 1e game was False advertisement.

As the number of alterations it looks like your doing, and likely will do, makes it really is a Homebrew with PF 1e as a reference and not PF 1e as printed in the Archive of Nethys which you yourself reference in the recruitment. Meaning you contradicted your own Opening post and lied.

As there was no warning of alterations to Standard Basic content in the recruitment, and given wording used, will likely tweak even the classes to high heaven. Which is not in the recruitment OP.

Well RHMG Animator that is your call -- I also said I was running this for someone else and they are currently quite excited with what I am presenting and while I did not wave a big red flag saying that there would be alterations to the Guidelines what I am doing is actually covered within those Guidelines.

Further I even mentioned things about not worrying about the Guidelines if there is something you wanted to. Like for instance your requested Race does not only not exist within the Aonprd Guidelines it does not even exist in any guidelines anywhere that is associated with Pathfinder 1e and you were creating it completely homebrew from something slightly related from a DnD 3.5 guideline.

Therefore there ws nothing that I said nor that I am doing that is a lie. While your stance is rather hypocritical since what you wanted was completely homebrew meaning you were not even going to abide by what you claim was the reason you joined. Still not a surprise all-things-considered. Still I have to thank for the walk through the Race Building Guidelines as that helped me better refine balancing the races.