SO an extra 400gp based off the original price. Brining the Total up to 4400gp, and since you don't get the increase in productivity you can do 1000gp a day bringing the total to 4.4 days really.
We going to wait for Tink to craft and anyone else to fill the two days, or are we supposed to start interacting with the queen?
You can start talkign to her right away, what tink does can be hand waved over the 2 days
Ok, but I don't have a clue how Lynn would act in front of a queen. First thought was to ask her about the beauty line she uses. Looking like twentysomething, while actually being some hundred years old. Also 15th level pally of Iomedae...
I'd prefer if she would start to talk, so I get an idea what kind of personality she is.
Let us break this down.
Base cost is 4000 gp
We then begin with the first challenge, prepping.
I attempt 1 of the 2 checks and pass.
If someone else wants to attempt the second check they can.
Assuming nobody does we set the craft cost to 85% and 1000gp of price per day.
So we make it in 4 days.
We then attempt the second challenge. I fail this check which means it is a failure so we add 10% top the 85% and get 95%.
We then attempt the third challenge.
I meet all the criteria so instant pass. I complete the item.
Final cost is 95%-5% for feat = 90%.
Now the question is how the speed increases from arcane builder, cooperative crafting and Crafting Mastery mythic add into this.
Also I get to attempt all skill checks twice due to Crafting Mastery.
I pass on this second check, which means I make no adjustment.
Final price is 85%-5% = 80%
The DC for the Alchemy check is 30 though, so you fail by less than 5 so it is just a fail not a crit failure.
Also for the first check you did get a Crit Success since you beat the DC of 21 by 9 points or greater than 5. So your cost is set to 75% I might be reading it wrong but the Vessel is independent from the other checks, the final check is based off of how many success/failures you have.
Actually, not quite the case, with only 1 check per challenge it is impossible to crit succeed or fail.
You can only crit if both checks are attempted.
I dont recall anything being about beating the check by 5 making it a crit
I would think that is the way it works I realize it doesn't say that at all but the first check is independent since you are just making the vessel.
You got a 30 the DC was 21, how do you know if you got
Critical Success You have a superlative and efficient vessel. Set
the base cost at 75% of the market price, and set the item’s
creation time to 1 day per 2,000 gp of the item’s market price.
VS
Success You have a satisfactory vessel. Set the base cost at
85% of the market price, and set the item’s creation time to
1 day per 1,000 gp of the item’s market price.
You must create or prepare an item to handle the magic you
intend to instill within it.
This is the first line of the vessel, I am going to rule if you best the DC by 5+ that is how you get the crit success since it steam lines it, you get on the DC or 1-4 above you get a regular success
A 1-4 under is a fail and 5+ under is a crit failure for the vessel, the rest are based on the Task rolls.
So you are ruling the first can be critted based on the +5/-5.
I am happy with that.
Does that apply to all challenges?
Makes sense to me, There isn't an alchemy lab in Defender's Heart but there is in the Garrison and that Alchemy shop so either of those would apply a +5 bonus
As would crafters fortune
So if I did my crafting at night and burned by surge, at a lab, with crafters fortune, I beat the dc by 5.
I am 4 down, and I can add 11 minimum, 10 with just the spell and the lab
I looked at the suggested item creation rules and they suck. Not in general. But with our party, where almost no-one can spare a meaningful amount of skill points to invest in Craft/UMD/Knowledge(all) and taking 10 not being an option, this loses out to the original system.
Original rules we get Tink doing stuff, taking 10 to auto-succeed.
With us doing teamwork on 4 checks, we'll get a lot of fails or challenges we can't cover the skills for. But without taking these challenges we are above 50% market price for no benefit.
Role play wise this could be a lot of fun. Tink ordering the fighters around to hold this and that and don't move and, no not this, but that and really working together on creating something special. But with all the DCs being minimum 15+CL the result will be rather disappointing and expensive.
That is where having the right bonuses help, having an alchemy kit adds +2 or +5 for a lab. Making a spot in the Cart that has an extra dimensional space to keep all Tinks toys for crafting would be a bonus.
I agree the system is a bit comber some if others cannot contribue but you all have some skill that you most likely could. I can add a link to the PDF on my Gdrive if people want.
With me being able to reroll all the checks, and burn surges on the rolls, we have a pretty good chance of at least meeting the DC. Maybe not beating it by 5.
Now as we get to higher levels and start doing more challenges there are more chances to reduce the cost and get perks/quirks which means I can drive the price down to 25% instead of 45% and we can get a bunch of other cool stuff on top too
We still need to figure out how my speed increasers will effect the crafting time
Yes I can make up tasks but right now I am going to stick with the list.
If anyone else has thoughts on the Tasks I am open to them.
Yes I can make up tasks but right now I am going to stick with the list.
If anyone else has thoughts on the Tasks I am open to them.
What is this in reply to?
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I've been through using this unchained crafting system when my home group played an AP about a year back The net result, summed up for a party built to use it (Everyone had taken skills to help with crafting down to things like Craft shoes) was that we we slightly worse off than if we had used the base crafting rules. Quirks and drawbacks out-weighted advantages and we ended up with items that did not work inside a town or only worked at night. It was sorta fun at first, but in the end we agreed it was a lot more work and not worth the effort.
With me being able to reroll all the checks, and burn surges on the rolls, we have a pretty good chance of at least meeting the DC. Maybe not beating it by 5.
Now as we get to higher levels and start doing more challenges there are more chances to reduce the cost and get perks/quirks which means I can drive the price down to 25% instead of 45% and we can get a bunch of other cool stuff on top too
The bolded part, the Challenges or Tasks are in the book but you can make up different ones.
Ah yes.
What I mean by that is that there is 1 challenge per 5k gp. As the items get more expensive we make more challenges which means more chances for quirks and perks
that is fair, So Azrael you don't like the new craft system?
Holy crap. I'm away for a day and there's 52 posts.
Tink decided to talk to us :) Iko weigh in on the crafting if you would like.
Don't think I really need crafting done. Unless there's specific items he can make.
Generically a cloak of protection would be rad.
You just need some fantasy and you immediately see where you need crafting done, because he can make anything.
+1 Outsider(Evil) Bane Amulet of Mighty Fists
+1 HOLY Outsider (evil) bane AoMF
+1 HOLY Outsider(Evil) Bane, Outsider(Chaotic) Bane Amulet of Mighty Fists
By the way, can we talk about enchantments to my glaive please? ;)
Bane's don't stack unfortunately.
You could go Holy, Evil Outsider Bane, Axiomatic AoMF though.
Also on an AoMF you don't need to make it +1 before adding the other goodies
As to your glaive we are definately doing Impact. Beyond that I am not too sure what else would be good to have for a vital strike build
Bane: A bane weapon excels against certain foes. Against a designated foe, the weapon’s enhancement bonus is +2 better than its actual bonus. It also deals an extra 2d6 points of damage against the foe.
One could argue, that Bane is one effect, and stacking it for different types only broadens the number of creatures it applies to. But to avoid useless discussions about cheesy rulings, I'd settle for a Glaive with
- Evil Outsider Bane
- Human Bane
- Holy
- Axiomatic
- +4
I guess, when you start now crafting it will be done in about 200 days?
From the faqs
Bane: Can I apply multiple bane special abilities to the same weapon? If so, do their effects stack?
You can apply multiple bane special abilities to the same weapon. For example, you can have a +1 dragon- and fey-bane longsword, which has an increased enhancement bonus and damage against dragons and against fey.
If you have multiple bane effects on a weapon and attack a creature against which more than one bane applies (such as a chaotic- and evil-outsider bane weapon used against a demon), the effects do not stack: the weapon's enhancement bonus is only +2 higher than its actual enhancement bonus, and it only deals +2d6 points of damage against that opponent.
(Compare to fighter weapon training or ranger favored enemy bonuses, both of which say you use the highest bonus if more than one bonus applies.)"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
You dont want impact to make your vital strikes better?
Depending on how Raltus rules that all my speed increases and feats effect things I could do it in far far less time than 200 days
Impact is indeed not bad. Especially as it applies to all creatures. But it only offers 3.5 points additional damage for a +2 bonus. Opposed to 7 from Holy or Axiomatic. So it would mean to reduce the numeric bonus further to get a
- +2
- Evil Outsider Bane
- Human Bane
- Holy
- Axiomatic
- Impact
Glaive
That's probably not worth it, as I'd lose two points to hit.
The reason impact is good is that it stacks with enlarge, so when you vital strike your damage is better
haha you guys are going all out eh? Good thing those are a while off.
We're playing Mythic. I expect to cut down the Storm King in a way that makes all of the Abyss shudder in fear. ;)
Just remember a lot of the BBEG will be mythic as well
Well I guess that item was decided for me. Make it so Tink!
Mr. Tink, sounds like you are giving him a command in Star Trek
I'll eventually want something like Bane on my crossbow and perhaps holy on my Earthbreaker
Coolio
Raltus, you still need to tell me how my speed boosts are going to work
Spark of Creation = -5 % cost
Arcane Builder (Craft Wonderous) = 25% faster
I would say that the Spark of creation trait goes first and lowers the cost, then you can build from that 25% faster.
so something that is 1000 - 5% = 950 would take 1 day or 8 hours.
8 hours - 25% = 6 hours.
So if you pushed yourself you could so 2 items in 1 day or 12 hours but you would be fatigued till you got 12 hours of sleep.
That work for you?
Works for me.
I am also interested in how my double speed from cooperative crafting and the double speed from crafting mastery come into effect
I will look into those today.
Cooperative Crafting - might not work out for you since no one else is taking crafting feats, mind you if you made someone to assist you or paid for a follower that could work.
Crafting Mastery - So you would double your GP value made in the day, nothing to do with speed really just if you can do 1k a day you can do 2k with that feat and you can roll twice which gives you a better chance of succeeding. So you could make a Cloak of Resistance +2 in 2 days instead of 4 normally.
Cloak of resistance 4000 - 5% cost = 3800 (It would take just under 2 days because of being able to do 2k a day,
16 hours - 25% time reduction = 12 hours
It might be closer to 11 hours
Interesting, so with the Aid of Blue you could double your daily ability to craft to 2k a day right away.
So you could make anything worth 2k in less than a day because of your trait and feats
I also have crafting mastery
so how does the double doubling work
Tink can do 2000 gp a day, if Blue helps him he could do 4000 gp a day. So your -5% to cost and 25% incrased spell basically allow you to finish much faster in that day. Around 6 hours.
Can I just check the maths?
If I only succeed at the first check our base is 1000gp a day, Tink doubles that to 2k because of crafting mastery, and then Blue doubles again to 4k?
If I crit succeed at the craft check I get a base of 2k, which doubles through crafting mastery to 4k, which blue doubles to 8k
Am I understanding you correctly?