Merging feat chains


Homebrew and House Rules


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So I was thinking that certain feat chains/combos would be merged or altered in a possible upcoming game. Feats would scale, Players will play low to mid level martial classes, probably single-class. Players who have one of these feats are considered to meet the prerequisites of the feat(s) they replace. I have a list of ones below, can you tell me if they're balanced? Also, if there's already a free compilation of things like this somewhere (I'm pretty sure there is), please link me.

Also, some feats are going to be made free, because they make no sense otherwise.

free feats:

Power Attack
Functions as normal, but for free. If you meet the prereqs, you can use it.

Combat Expertise
Functions as normal, but for free. No need to meet the prereqs to use it.

feats:

Great Fortitude v2
Benefit: If you have levels in a class with a strong fortitude save, you gain a strong fortitude save for one class. Otherwise, you get +2 to your fortitude save.
Replaced: Great Fortitude.

Iron Will v2
Benefit: If you have levels in a class with a weak will save, you gain a strong will save for one class. Otherwise, you get +2 to your will save.
Replaced: Iron Will

Lightning Reflexes v2
Benefit: If you have levels in a class with a weak reflex save, you gain a strong reflex save for one class. Otherwise, you get +2 to your reflex save.
Replaced: Lightning Reflexes

Sure Saves
Prerequisites: Great Fortitude v2, Iron Will v2, Lightning Reflexes v2, or 3 strong saves.
Benefit: For each strong save you have, you may reroll any save once a day. (max 3 times) If you multiclass, choose one class to determine your number of saves.
Replaced: Improved Great Fortitude, Improved Iron Will, Improved Lightning Reflexes

Improved Two-Weapon Fighting v2
Prereqs: Dex 15
Benefit: As regular Two-Weapon Fighting. Gains the benefit of Improved TWF at BAB 6 and Greater TWF at BAB 11. Gains an additional attack at -15 at BAB 16. Can make an attack with both weapons as a standard action, with an additional -2 to hit.
Replaced: TWF, Improved TWF, Greater TWF

Rapid Shot v2
Prereqs: Dex 15, Precise Shot
Benefit: As Rapid Shot. Gain an attack at -5 at BAB 6, another at -10 at BAB 11, and another at -15 at BAB 16. This does not stack with TWF for thrown weapons.
Replaced: Rapid Shot, Manyshot

Precise Shot v2
Benefit: As Precise Shot. Gains the benefit of Improved Precise Shot at BAB 11.
Replaced: Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Improved Precise Shot

Vital Strike v2
Benefit: Gains the benefit of Vital Strike at BAB 6, Improved VS at BAB 11, and Greater VS at BAB 16.
Replaced: Vital Strike, Improved Vital Strike, Greater Vital Strike

Mobility v2
Prereqs: Dex 13
Benefit: You gain a +1 dodge bonus to AC, and an additional +4 dodge bonus against attacks of opportunity and a +4 bonus to acrobatics checks to move through a threatened space. When wearing light or no armor, you gain a +10 bonus to base speed.
Replaced: Fleet, Dodge, Mobility

Lunge v2
Benefit: Gains the benefit of Lunge at BAB 6. If you have Mobility v2, you also gain the benefit of Spring Attack.
Replaced: Lunge, Spring Attack

Liberty's Edge

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Interesting!

You might also check out the Scaling Combat Feats section in the New Paths Compendium from Kobold Press.


Looks pretty good, though Great Fortitude has a typo.

EDIT: I'd add Weapon Finesse as a free thing, then add Weapon Finesse c2, where you pick any melee weapon and can finesse it. Great Axe? Sure. Earthbreaker? Go ahead.


Azten wrote:

Looks pretty good, though Great Fortitude has a typo.

EDIT: I'd add Weapon Finesse as a free thing, then add Weapon Finesse c2, where you pick any melee weapon and can finesse it. Great Axe? Sure. Earthbreaker? Go ahead.

So:

Weapon Finesse for free.

Would Deadly Aim for free also be fair, or no?

I feel like the Weapon Focus feat below is still a bit of a feat tax and doesn't give new and interesting options like feats should.

Also:

moar feats:

Improved Weapon Finesse
Prerequisite: Dex 13
Benefit: You may use Weapon Finesse with one-handed slashing or piercing weapons, as well as two-handed piercing weapons. At BAB 3, when you are using a single Finesseable weapon one-handed, you may use your dexterity bonus instead of your strength bonus for damage. At BAB 6, you may use your dexterity bonus instead of your strength bonus with multiple weapons or a single two-handed weapon. This is multiplied by 1.5 if two-handed or 0.5 if off-hand, as normal.
Special: Rogues may treat their Rogue levels as full BAB for the purposes of this feat. If you have Finesse Training, at BAB 3, you may use your dexterity bonus instead of your strength bonus for damage with thrown weapons.
Replaced: Slashing Grace, Fencing Grace, Dervish Dance

Weapon Focus v2
Prerequisite: None!
Benefit: As Weapon Focus. At BAB 8, you gain the benefits of Weapon Specialization. At BAB 16, you gain the benefits of Greater Weapon Focus. At BAB 24, you gain the benefits of Greater Weapon Specialization and Penetrating Strike. At BAB 32, you gain the benefits of Greater Penetrating Strike.
Special: Fighters count their BAB double for the purposes of this feat.
Replaced: Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialization, Penetrating Strike, Greater Weapon Focus, Greater Weapon Specialization, Greater Penetrating Strike

Weapon Proficiency Training
Prerequisite: None!
Benefit: You gain proficiency in all simple weapons. You also become proficient in a number of martial or exotic weapons equal to 1/2 your BAB, minimum 1. At BAB 8, you become proficient in all martial weapons.
Replaced: Simple Weapon Proficiency, Martial Weapon Proficiency, Exotic Weapon Proficiency

Unarmed Combat Training
Prerequisite: None!
Benefit: As Improved Unarmed Strike, Catch Off-Guard, and Throw Anything. At BAB 8, you gain the benefit of Improvised Weapon Mastery.
Special: You may take weapon-based feats as if improvised weapons were a weapon. If you have an ability that replaces your unarmed strike damage die, you may use that with improvised weapons.


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Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Reposting from here:

Consolidate the feat chains based on BAB that do the same thing, just better (if a feat requires additional feats in the prerequisites, keep it separate, though): Improved Disarm gives additional effects of Greater Disarm at +6 BAB (combine Improved Feint and Improved Trip with Greater Feint and Greater Trip in the same fashion), combine Wind Stance and Lightning Stance (20% at +6 BAB and 50% at +11 BAB, or set it to scale at 40% at +11 BAB and 60% at +16 BAB), combine Cleave and Great Cleave (extra attacks kick in at +4 BAB), combine Improved Bull Rush and Greater Bull Rush (same fashion as Improved Disarm), combine Improved Sunder and Greater Sunder (same fashion as Improved Disarm), combine Two-Weapon Fighting with Improved Two-Weapon Fighting and Greater Two-Weapon Fighting (additional off-hand attacks kick in at +6 and +11 BAB), combine Vital Strike with Improved Vital Strike and Greater Vital Strike (increase damage at +11 and +16 BAB).

Combine Improved Dirty Trick and Greater Dirty Trick, Improved Drag and Greater Drag, Improved Reposition and Greater Reposition, Improved Steal and Greater Steal, Shot on the Run and Parting Shot, Second Chance and Improved Second Chance.

Combine Cleaving Finish and Improved Cleaving Finish (since Cleave and Great Cleave are combined), Deathless Initiate with Deathless Master and Deathless Zealot, Devastating Strike and Improved Devastating Strike (don't combine with Vital Strike, however), Dimensional Assault and Dimensional Dervish (don't combine the other feats in the chain, though), Final Embrace Horror and Final Embrace Master (don't combine with Final Embrace, though), Impaling Critical and Improved Impaling Critical, Moonlight Stalker and Moonlight Stalker Feint (don't combine with Moonlight Stalker Master, though), Net Adept and Net Maneuvering (don't combine with the other feats in the chain, though), Nightmare Fist and Nightmare Weaver (don't combine with Nightmare Striker, though; adding a status effect without a separate feat is too powerful, IMO), Rending Fury and Improved Rending Fury (don't combine Greater Rending Fury, though; adding a status effect without a separate feat is too powerful, IMO), Snap Shot with Improved Snap Shot and Greater Snap Shot, Stalwart and Improved Stalwart, Twin Thunders and Twin Thunders Flurry (don't combine with Twin Thunders Master, though; adding a status effect without a separate feat is too powerful, IMO), Whip Mastery with Improved Whip Mastery and Greater Whip Mastery.

Combining feat chains based on skill ranks, such as Blind-Fight with Improved Blind-Fight and Greater Blind-Fight, Improved Stonecunning and Stone Sense, Haunted Gnome with Haunted Gnome Assault and Haunted Gnome Shroud, Siege Engineer and Master Siege Engineer (don't combine with Siege Gunner, though), would also make sense. So does combining Blighted Critical with Greater Blighted Critical, as well as Sap Adept with Sap Master.

The style feat chains should probably still require separate feats, as each feat in the chain provides different benefits, rather than just improving on earlier feats in the chain. Also, don't just lump together combinations of feats or feat chains (like Critical Focus) where each feat is relatively unrelated in the effects (such as Shield Slam and Shield Master) or are based on specific class levels.


I was thinking, for combat maneuvers:

feats:

Improved Combat Maneuvers
Prerequisites: Combat Expertise/None!
Benefit: You may make a number of different types of combat maneuvers equal to 1/2 your BAB (minimum 1) without provoking attacks of opportunity. You choose which maneuvers at the beginning of the day. If did not choose all your allotted maneuvers at the beginning of the day, you may choose after 15 minutes of practice. At BAB 8, you may instead use any combat maneuver without provoking an attack of opportunity.
Special: Classes that would have Improved Unarmed Strike or Combat Expertise under normal rules gain this feat.
Replaced: Improved X (combat maneuver)

Greater X (combat maneuver)
Prerequisite: Improved Combat Maneuvers
Benefit: +4 to this type of CMB/CMD check. At BAB 6, you gain any other benefits listed in the Improved (combat maneuver) and the Greater (combat maneuver). At BAB 11, you may make this type of maneuver as part of a full attack, although you take a -4 to your check if you could not normally attempt the check as part of a full attack so without this feat.
Replaced: Greater X (combat maneuver)

Toughness
Prerequisites: None!
Benefit: As Toughness. You gain a benefit equal to your BAB on checks covered by Endurance, and may sleep in light or medium armor without becoming fatigued. At BAB 3, you gain the benefit of Diehard.
Replaced: Toughness, Endurance, Diehard

Cleave
Prerequisites: Str 13, Power Attack
Benefit: As Cleave. At BAB 4, you gain the benefit of Great Cleave. At BAB 6, you gain the benefit of Cleaving Finish. At BAB 8, you gain the benefit of Improved Cleaving Finish.
Replaced: Cleave, Great Cleave, Cleaving Finish, Improved Cleaving Finish

Other rule change: No Int requirement on later combat maneuver feats.


I've tried my hand at Condensed feats: placing all related feat benefits into the smallest number of feats possible.
Ran into bigger complications down the road and kind of shelved this for now, but in case it helps with ideas here's some of the stuff I've done.

Notes: I basically plumbed the PRD for feats that were seemingly related (or used the base feat as a prerequisite) and instead put them into an "Improvements" section, which just granted this new effect at the higher level automatically, instead of requiring choosing another feat.
I also added new "actions" to key off some of the feats abilities, so it would be a little more cohesive.
Lastly, I noticed a great dearth of... "stuff", for higher levels. It's painfully noticeable that there's just his drop of abilities after 10th level or so. I ended up pushing some things higher and made them stronger, or came up with new stuff that fit the theme.

BASIC COMBAT CHANGES:

Combat Actions: The following are now considered basic combat actions.

Fighting Defensively: You may fight in a defensive manner, taking a -2 penalty on all attacks in a round to gain a +2 dodge bonus to AC until the start of your next turn. You may choose to fight defensively when you declare that you are making an attack or a full-attack action with a weapon with which you threaten.
Upon reaching +4 base attack bonus, and every +4 thereafter, you increase your penalty by -1 and increase your dodge bonus by +1.

Fighting Recklessly: You may fight in a reckless manner, taking a -2 penalty on all attacks in a round to gain a +2 weapon damage bonus on every attack. You may choose to fight recklessly when you declare that you are making an attack or a full-attack action.
Upon reaching +4 base attack bonus, and every +4 thereafter, you increase your penalty by -1 and increase the damage bonus by +1.
The damage bonus is doubled when wielding a one or two-handed weapon with two hands.

Total Defense: As a full round action you may assume a total defensive posture. You no longer threaten with any weapon, cannot make any attacks or attacks of opportunity, and gain a +4 dodge bonus to AC until the start of your next turn.
Upon reaching +4 base attack bonus, and every +4 thereafter, you increase your dodge bonus by +2.

Total Abandon: You may fight without regard to your own safety. You have a -10 penalty to AC, lose dodge, shield and Dexterity bonus to AC, and gain a +1 bonus to attack and +2 weapon damage bonus on every attack. You may only choose to fight with total abandon at the start of your turn, and its effects last until the start of your next turn.
Upon reaching +4 base attack bonus, and every +4 thereafter, you increase your attack and damage bonus each by +1.
The damage bonus is doubled when wielding a one or two-handed weapon with two hands.

This obviates the need for the following feats: Combat Expertise, Power Attack, Deadly Aim (and anything similar).

Additional Attacks of Opportunity: When your base attack bonus reaches +6, +11, and +16, you receive an additional attack of opportunity per round.

Point-Blank Range: Some types of ranged attacks and attack actions or bonuses are limited in range, typically because they require seeing smaller detail on far away targets. Point-blank range is limited to your first range increment, or 30 feet, whichever is higher.

Precision Damage: Some forms of damage are based more on where you've hit the target, rather than how hard you hit or how well you used the weapon. As precision damage is already a form of hitting a critical spot on a target, it is not multiplied on a critical hit, and creatures who are immune to critical hits are immune to this damage.
Limited precision damage is more stringent, such damage also requires that you must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. Also, concealment greater than 20% or improved cover negates this form of damage. Creatures without a vital spot (such as Oozes or Elementals) are immune to limited precision damage.

Damage Reduction: Some forms of damage reduction are more inherent to the creature. It may represent toughness, or the ability to ignore pain. This damage reduction is stacking; it is applied after any other non-stacking damage reduction is applied, and multiple sources of this kind of damage reduction stack. It is denoted as a = after the slash (ex: 5/=), and is effective against any attack that does not ignore damage reduction.

--General Feats--

ARCANE COMBAT TRAINING:

You have learned how to use your arcane talents in heavy combat.
Prerequisites: Able to cast arcane spells, light armor proficiency or greater, spellcraft 1 rank
Benefit: You reduce your arcane spell failure chance when wearing armor by 5%. If you have greater armor proficiency or more ranks in spellcraft, you may reduce the penalty further.
Medium armor proficiency reduces your ASF chance by an additional 5% (total 10%). Heavy armor proficiency reduces your ASF chance by an additional 5% (total 15%).
Spellcraft reduces your ASF by an additional 5% every 5 ranks.
Improvements: Upon reaching +1 base attack bonus, you may infuse one of your weapons or your armor with magic for 1 round. As a swift action, you may grant a +1 enhancement bonus to attack and damage to your weapon, or +1 enhancement bonus to AC to your armor. This bonus increases by an additional +1 for every 5 ranks in spellcraft.
Upon reaching +4 base attack bonus, you may infuse all your weapons and armor with magic for 1 round.
Upon reaching +8 base attack bonus, you may use concentration to maintain the magical enhancement as a free action every round, making concentration checks when necessary. The spell level is treated as 3rd level.
Upon reaching +12 base attack bonus, you may trade enhancement bonus for a weapon or armor special that is no greater than a +1 bonus.
Upon reaching +16 base attack bonus, you may trade enhancement bonus for any weapon or armor special.
Note: The one feat I'm not sure if it's giving too much, even with the intent of going over the top in design. I'll include it anyways though, for completeness.

MARTIAL EXPERTISE:

You have expanded your training in combat ability.
Benefit: You treat your total Hit Dice as your base attack bonus when calculating your Combat Maneuver Defense, and when gaining new proficiencies.
You gain +1 hitpoint for every Hit Die that is lower than d10.
Improvements: Upon reaching 4 Hit Dice, you treat your total Hit Dice as your base attack bonus when qualifying for feats or feat improvements, as well as increases from fighting defensively, fighting recklessly, total defense and total abandon actions.
Upon reaching 8 Hit Dice, you treat your total Hit Dice as your base attack bonus towards gaining additional attacks and attacks of opportunity for having a high base attack bonus.

ENDURANCE:

You have enhanced physical stamina; harsh conditions or long exertions do not affect you and you can withstand greater punishment.
Benefit: You gain +3 hit points. For every Hit Die you possess beyond 3, you gain an additional +1 hit point. If you have more than 3 Hit Dice, you gain +1 hit points whenever you gain a Hit Die (such as when you gain a level).
In addition, you gain a +4 bonus on the following checks and saves: Swim checks made to resist nonlethal damage from exhaustion; Constitution checks made to continue running; Constitution checks made to avoid nonlethal damage from a forced march; Constitution checks made to hold your breath; Constitution checks made to avoid nonlethal damage from starvation or thirst; Fortitude saves made to avoid nonlethal damage from hot or cold environments; and Fortitude saves made to resist damage from suffocation.
You may sleep in light or medium armor without becoming fatigued.
Improvements: Upon reaching 2 Hit Dice, you regain additional hit points equal to half your Constitution modifier (minimum +1) when you regain hit points by resting or through magical healing. Also, you gain the recover action.

Recover - You gain a number of hit points equal to your Hit Dice per day that you may recover if you have been injured. As a swift action, you may recover as many hit points as you wish, up to your maximum. You regain these points with rest. You may recover as an immediate action in response to taking hit point damage.

Upon reaching 4 Hit Dice, you roll twice against effects that cause nauseated or sickened conditions, and against poisons, taking the higher result.
Upon reaching 6 Hit Dice, you may make a recover action to attempt a new saving throw against a harmful condition or affliction requiring a Fortitude save that is affecting you. You must spend a number of points equal to the DC of the effect - 10 to reroll. If this save against the affliction fails, there is no additional effect, but a successful save counts toward curing an affliction such as poison or disease. You cannot recover from instantaneous effects, effects that do not allow a saving throw, or effects that do not require a Fortitude save.
Upon reaching 9 Hit Dice, you are able to ignore the effects of extreme temperatures, and do not need to roll saving throws for temperatures between -50 and 140 degrees Fahrenheit. Also, you may sleep in heavy armor without becoming fatigued.
Upon reaching 12 Hit Dice, you may use a recover action to delay the onset of a harmful condition or affliction (such as panicked, paralyzed, stunned and so on), including permanent and instantaneous conditions. You may use a single point to delay a single condition for 1 round. You may use additional points in a single recover action to delay additional conditions and to delay them for longer.

DIE HARD:

You are especially difficult to kill.
Benefit: When your hit point total is below 0, but you are not dead, you automatically stabilize. You do not need to make a Constitution check each round to avoid losing additional hit points. You may choose to act as if you were disabled, rather than dying. You must make this decision as soon as you are reduced to negative hit points (even if it isn't your turn). If you do not choose to act as if you were disabled, you immediately fall unconscious.
Improvements: Upon reaching 3 Hit Dice, you gain the bolster combat action.

Bolster - You may forgo the dodge bonus from fighting defensively or the total defense actions, and instead gain the equivalent amount of DR, up to a maximum of 5/=, until the start of your next turn.

Upon reaching 6 Hit Dice, you are no longer staggered when at 0 hitpoints or lower.
Upon reaching 9 Hit Dice, when making a bolster action, you may double your DR for a single attack. This lasts until you get hit, or until your next turn. Upon being hit, you lose your DR from bolster until your next turn and are fatigued. You may not perform this if you are fatigued.
Upon reaching 12 Hit Dice, you no longer lose 1 hit point when you take an action while at 0 hitpoints or lower.
Upon reaching 15 Hit Dice, when making a bolster action, you may increase your DR up to a maximum of 10/=.
Upon reaching 18 Hit Dice, whenever a creature rolls to confirm a critical hit against you, it must roll twice and take the lowest result.

SKILL EXPERTISE:

You have expanded your training on a particular skill set.
Benefit: Upon selecting this feat, Upon selecting this feat, choose a specific Training style. Choose a skill from the list and treat it as a class skill.

Academic - Appraise (Int), Craft (Int), Heal (Wis), Knowledge (all) (Int), Linguistics (Int), and Profession (Wis).
Adventurer - Acrobatics (Dex), Climb (Str), Fly (Dex), Handle Animal (Cha), Knowledge (dungeoneering) (Int), Knowledge (geography) (Int), Knowledge (nature) (Int), Perception (Wis), Ride (Dex), Survival (Wis), and Swim (Str).
Arcana - Knowledge (arcana) (Int), Knowledge (planes) (Int), Knowledge (religion) (Int), Linguistics (Int), Spellcraft (Int), and Use Magic Device (Cha).
Socialite - Bluff (Cha), Diplomacy (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Knowledge (history) (Int), Knowledge (local) (Int), Knowledge (nobility) (Int), Linguistics (Int), Perception (Wis), Perform (Cha), and Sense Motive (Wis).
Trickster - Bluff (Cha), Disable Device (Dex), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Knowledge (engineering) (Int), Perception (Wis), Sleight of Hand (Dex), and Stealth (Dex).

In addition, select a Focus and a Talent, and gain the benefits as listed.

Focus - You gain a +3 bonus to a single chosen skill.

Talent - Select a particular talent (see below). You gain a +2 bonus to the skills listed.

Acrobatic - Acrobatics and Fly
Alertness - Perception and Sense Motive
Animal Affinity - Handle Animal and Ride
Artisan - Appraise and all Craft
Athletic - Climb and Swim
Bookworm - All Knowledge and Linguistics
Deceitful - Bluff and Disguise
Deft Hands - Disable Device and Sleight of Hand
Magical Aptitude - Spellcraft and Use Magic Device
Persuasive - Diplomacy and Intimidate
Prodigy - All Perform and all Profession
Self-Sufficient - Heal and Survival
Stealthy - Escape Artist and Stealth

Improvements: Upon reaching 4 Hit Dice, and every 4 additional Hit Dice, you gain a skill trick from a skill that is in your selected Training style.
Upon reaching 10 ranks in a Focus or Talent skill, the bonus is doubled (+6 for Focus, +4 for Talent).
Note: You may select this feat more than once. Each time, you may select a new Training style and class skill from any known Training styles, or choose three additional class skills from any known Training style. You also select another Focus and Talent, and gain an additional skill trick every 4 Hit Dice.

FINESSE EXPERTISE:

You have trained in using your agility rather than brute strength for many aspects in combat.
Benefit: You may use Dexterity in place of Strength for your melee attack rolls and combat maneuver checks. You may make a number of extra attacks of opportunity per round equal to your Dexterity bonus (minimum 1), and may make them flat-footed.
Improvements: Upon reaching +1 base attack bonus, you may forgo putting your strength behind the attack to aim for a more vital area. You may replace your Strength bonus with your Dexterity bonus to damage. A Strength penalty still applies. This is considered precision damage and is limited to point blank range.
Upon gaining 4 ranks in a Strength skill (such as Climb or Swim), you may use your Dexterity modifier instead of Strength modifier for these skills.

HEIGHTENED DEFENSE:

Due to specific training, or tough life experience, you are hardier than normal in some way.
Benefit: You may select one of the defensive options below.

Great Fortitude - You gain a +2 bonus to Fortitude saves.
Iron Will - You gain a +2 bonus to Will saves.
Lightning Reflexes - You gain a +2 bonus to Reflex saves.
Thick Skinned - You gain a +1 bonus to natural armor.

Improvements: Upon reaching 3 Hit Dice, you may use an alternate ability score towards your chosen defensive option, as follows:

Great Fortitude - You may use your Strength bonus instead of your Constitution bonus for Fortitude saving throws.
Iron Will - You may use your Charisma bonus instead of your Wisdom bonus for Will saving throws.
Lightning Reflexes - You may use your Intelligence bonus instead of your Dexterity bonus for Reflex saving throws.
Thick Skinned - You may use your Constitution bonus instead of your Dexterity bonus to AC. This is treated as natural armor, instead of a dodge bonus.

In all cases, a penalty in the original ability score is still applied.
Upon reaching 6 Hit Dice, you may reroll a failed save or force a reroll on a successful critical hit against you (based on your chosen defense), once per day.
Upon reaching 10 Hit Dice, you gain a further +2 to your save or natural armor.
Upon reaching 15 Hit Dice, you may now always roll twice on your chosen saving throw, choosing the highest roll. If you have chosen Thick Skinned, you instead gain DR 5/=.

Note: You may select this feat more than once, selecting a different defensive option each time.

--Combat Maneuvers--
Note: For purposes of these feats, the Feint combat action is considered a "special combat maneuver". It is treated as a combat maneuver for these purposes, but use special rules for resolution.

MANEUVER TRAINING (COMBAT):

Your combat style includes a particular set of combat maneuvers at which you excel.
Benefit: Upon selecting this feat, you may choose a single combat style below, gaining improved ability with the listed maneuvers. You no longer provoke an Attack of Opportunity when performing these maneuvers. Feinting can be performed as a move action, and opponents cannot avoid your Overrun attempt. You may decide to use your Dexterity bonus instead of your Strength bonus on your CMB checks for these maneuvers.
Additionally, you gain a +2 bonus when performing or defending against these maneuvers.

Acrobatic - Bull Rush, Overrun, Reposition, Trip and one other choice.
Swashbuckling - Disarm, Feint, Reposition, Trip, and one other choice.
Powerhouse - Bull Rush, Drag, Grapple, Overrun and one other choice.
Tactical - Choose any 4.
Underhanded - Dirty Trick, Disarm, Feint, Steal, and one other choice.

Improvements: Upon reaching a +6 base attack bonus each combat maneuver in your chosen combat style gains the following additional improvements. Also, the bonus to performing and defending against the maneuvers is increased by an additional +2 for every +6 base attack bonus you gain (+4 at 6 BAB, +6 at 12 BAB, and +8 at 18 BAB).

Bull Rush - Your victim's movement from bull rush provokes attacks of opportunity from your allies (but not you).
Dirty Trick - The penalty lasts for 1d4 rounds, plus 1 round for every 5 points you exceed the check. It takes a standard action to remove the penalty.
Disarm - Your victim's disarmed item lands 15 feet away in a random direction.
Drag - Your victim's movement from drag provokes attacks of opportunity from your allies (but not you).
Feint - Whenever you use feint to cause an opponent to lose his Dexterity bonus, he loses that bonus until the beginning of your next turn.
Grapple - Maintaining a grapple is now a move action, allowing you to make two grapple checks a round (although you only need to succeed at one to maintain the grapple).
Overrun - If your victim is knocked prone by your overrun, they provoke an attack of opportunity.
Reposition - Your victim's movement from reposition provokes attacks of opportunity from your allies (but not you).
Steal - A stolen item is not discovered until the end of combat, or until the victim attempts to use it.
Sunder - When destroying an item, you may transfer any remaining damage to the wielder. This does not apply if you leave the item at 1 hitpoint.
Trip - You victim provokes an attack of opportunity on a successful trip.

Special: You may select Maneuver Training multiple times, selecting a different combat style each time. Bonuses from different styles overlap, they do not stack.

MANEUVER STRIKE (COMBAT):

You can quickly perform combat maneuvers in your attack routine.
Prerequisites: Maneuver Training, base attack bonus +6
Benefit: You may perform a combat maneuver listed in your chosen style faster than normal. The following combat maneuvers can now be made in place of a normal attack: Bull Rush, Dirty Trick, Drag, Feint, Reposition, and Steal.
When performing any combat maneuver, a successful check allows an attack roll to cause damage as a swift action.
Improvements: Upon reaching a base attack bonus of +9, whenever you score a critical hit with an attack, you may apply a combat maneuver from your chosen Maneuver Training as a swift action, in addition to the damage dealt.
Upon gaining a base attack bonus of +11 there is no action cost for applying the extra attack or applying the maneuver on a critical hit.
Upon gaining a base attack bonus of +16 no attack roll or check needs to be made, a successful combat maneuver check now simply deals damage and a successful critical hit applies a combat maneuver (use the roll to determine the check if needed, ie grapple DC).

RANGED MANEUVERS (COMBAT):

You are able to make tricks shots, performing combat maneuvers at range.
Prerequisites: Maneuver Training, base attack bonus +3
Benefit: You may now make the following maneuvers with a ranged weapon: Bull Rush, Dirty Trick, Disarm, Sunder, and Trip.
Improvements: Upon gaining a base attack bonus of +9, you may attempt to pin your target using a grapple check. Success causes your weapon or ammunition to catch them in some way while sticking to a surface, and the victim is treated as entangled and anchored (cannot move). The victim can escape if they succeed a grapple check, escape artist check, or simply pull out the pinning object with a strength check using a free hand (DC equal to your base attack bonus + strength score).

COORDINATED MANEUVERS (COMBAT, TEAMWORK):

You and your ally are able to line up your maneuvers to overwhelm a target.
Prerequisites: Maneuver Training
Benefit: If an ally who also has this feat threatens your target, you may roll twice and choose the highest on your maneuver check. The maneuver must be one that is on both of your listed maneuvers gained from Maneuver Training.
Improvements: Upon gaining a base attack bonus of +3, you gain a +1 bonus to your maneuver check against a target for each attempt made of the same maneuver against that target within the last round by any allies who also have this improvement.
Upon gaining a base attack bonus of +9, the maneuvers no longer need to be the same as your allies when rolling twice, or to gain the stacking bonus.
Upon gaining a base attack bonus of +15, if an ally misses a maneuver against a target you threaten (or are otherwise able to reach with a combat maneuver), you may make a maneuver attempt as an immediate action.

MANEUVER ARCANA (METAMAGIC):

You are able to take your skill at maneuvers and tweak your spells so they can apply their effects.
Prerequisites: Maneuver Training
Benefit: You may apply a maneuver against the victims of your maneuver arcana spell. The type of spell that can be used with maneuver arcana depends on the descriptor and effect (see below). The maneuver check uses your casting stat instead of Strength score, and if a maneuver has an effect that can be maintained, it requires another spell of the same maneuver for each check to maintain it. A maneuver arcana spell uses up a spell slot one level higher than the spell's actual level.

Bull Rush - air, earth, electricity, force, sonic, and water
Dirty Trick - all but alignment and death
Disarm - acid, air, cold, curse, earth, electricity, fear, fire, force, pain, sonic, and water
Drag - air, earth, electricity, force, sonic, and water
Feint - curse, darkness, disease, emotion, fear, language-dependent, light, mind-affecting, pain, poison, shadow, and sonic
Grapple - air, cold, earth, force, shadow, and water
Overrun - air, earth, electricity, force, sonic, and water
Reposition - air, earth, electricity, force, sonic, and water
Steal - air, earth, force, shadow, sonic, and water
Sunder - acid, cold, earth, fire, force, and sonic
Trip - air, earth, electricity, force, sonic, and water

--Combat Styles--
A note on my intent: I went through all the related feats for a particular combat style (say, ranged or two weapons, etc), and tried to fit them all into a main feat, plus at most two additional feats that might diverge in focus. Basically, you can "perform" with a single feat, and "excel" with another feat, and become "masterful" with three feats. The point is to allow more than one combat style, even for non-Fighters, and allow picking up things like that sweet Endurance or Diehard feat, or that over-the-top Skill Expertise, without stunting your combat style.

RANGED:

RANGED TECHNIQUE (Combat)
You are well trained in ranged combat.
Prerequisites: Dexterity 13
Benefit: You gain a +1 bonus to attack and damage against enemies within point-blank range. Also, you no longer suffer the standard -4 penalty for making a ranged attack at an enemy engaged in melee.
Improvements: If you have the Mounted Combat feat, you suffer half the penalties for using a ranged weapon while your mount is moving: -2 (instead of -4) when your mount makes a double move, and -4 (instead of -8) when your mount is running.
If you have the Mobility feat, you may make a ranged attack at any point during your rush movement action.
Upon reaching +3 base attack bonus, you only suffer a -1 penalty per full range increment between you and your target when using ranged attacks.You also gain the focused shot combat action.

Focused Shot - As a standard action, you may make an attack with a ranged weapon and add your Intelligence modifier on the damage roll. This attack must be made within point-blank range, and is considered precision damage.

Upon reaching +6 base attack bonus, when making a focused shot, you do not provoke an attack of opportunity. Also, if you have the Mobility feat, you may choose to provoke an attack of opportunity from one or more opponents who threaten you, but gain an additional +4 dodge bonus to AC against such attacks. An opponent that makes such an attack and misses you loses his Dexterity bonus to AC against you until the end of your turn.
Upon reaching +9 base attack bonus, you may make a focused shot on your first attack in a full attack.

.
PRECISE TARGETING (Combat)
You excel at making precision shots, threading the needle every time.
Prerequisites: Dexterity 15, Ranged Technique, base attack bonus +6
Benefit: Your ranged attacks ignore the AC bonus granted to targets by normal, soft and partial cover, as well as concealment of 20% or less.
Improvements: If you have the Blind-Fight feat, you gain the ricochet shot combat action.

Ricochet Shot - As a standard action, you can make a ranged attack at a wall or piece of solid terrain, and have it ricochet off. When you do, use the square immediately in front of the wall or piece of solid terrain to determine line of sight to a target, and this square is considered the new origin square of the attack. Use that square to determine the effects of cover, and your own square to determine the effects of concealment.

Upon reaching +9 base attack bonus, you reduce damage reduction applied to your ranged attacks by 2 for each successful ranged attack you made against the same target in the round.
Upon reaching +11 base attack bonus, you ignore anything less than total cover, and the miss chance granted to targets by anything less than total concealment.
Upon reaching +16 base attack bonus, when you make a focused shot, your target does not gain any armor, natural armor, or shield bonuses to its Armor Class.

.
RAPID FIRE
You can send out a barrage of ranged attacks.
Prerequisites: Dexterity 15, Ranged Technique
Benefit: When making a full attack action, you may shoot twice for every ranged attack. These extra attacks are considered secondary weapon attacks (-5 attack bonus). As these shots are loaded and fired quickly, they only apply one-half Strength damage (if the weapon would normally allows it), and the damage is reduced by one step (for example, a longbow would be reduced from 1d8 to 1d6 for a Medium sized creature).
Improvements: If you are proficient with firearms or crossbows, you may reload such weapons on step faster. For example, a full round action becomes a standard action, a standard action becomes a move action, and a move action becomes a free action allowing multiple attacks in a round.

TWO WEAPONS:

TWO WEAPON TECHNIQUE
You have trained in the skill of using a weapon in each hand in combat.
Prerequisites: Dexterity 13
Benefit: Your penalties on attack rolls for fighting with two weapons are reduced. The penalty for your primary hand lessens by 2 and the one for your off hand lessens by 6. You may also make an additional attack with your off-hand weapon for each attack gained from high base attack bonus, using the same bonus as these attacks.
Improvements: If you are proficient with the net and are holding the line to an entangled target, you can drag or reposition the target as an attack action with that hand, and any attacks made with a weapon in your other hand against the target gains +2 attack and damage rolls.
If you are proficient with a one-handed or light firearm or any crossbow, you do not provoke attacks of opportunity when firing that weapon from anyone you threaten with a melee weapon in your other hand.
Upon reaching +6 base attack bonus, you may forgo your first primary hand melee attack to make a feint check against an opponent. If you successfully feint, that opponent is denied his Dexterity bonus to AC until the end of your turn.
If you have the Shield Bash feat, upon reaching +11 base attack bonus, you no longer suffer any penalties on attack rolls made with your shield while you are wielding another weapon, and add your shield's enhancement bonus to attack and damage rolls made with the shield as if it were a weapon enhancement bonus.

.
OFF-HAND FETTER
You use an off-hand weapon in a defensive and distracting manner, blocking attacks and setting up disarming blows.
Prerequisites: Dexterity 15, Two Weapon Technique
Benefits: When using a melee weapon in your off-hand, you gain a +1 shield bonus to AC. This bonus increases to +2 when fighing defensively or using the total defense action. You also gain the parry combat action.

Parry - If your forgo your off-hand attacks for the round, you may apply the off-hand weapon enhancement bonus as shield enhancement bonus to AC. If an opponent misses you with a melee attack due to your AC while you are parrying (10 + parry AC bonus), the attack is considered parried and you may make a feint action as an immediate action.

Improvements: Upon reaching +3 base attack bonus, you gain an additional attack of opportunity per round for each off-hand attack you give up when parrying. These extra attacks of opportunity can only be made with your off-hand weapon.
Upon reaching +6 base attack bonus, when you parry an attack, you may spend an immediate action to make a disarm or sunder maneuver attempt with a primary-hand weapon. This maneuver is made with a +5 bonus, and sunder damage is doubled. Also, upon making a successful feint, you now cause the target to lose their Dexterity bonus to AC until the end of your turn.
Upon reaching +9 base attack bonus, when you parry an attack, you may make a bull rush, disarm, feint or sunder maneuver as an attack of opportunity, using your off-hand weapon. You may not follow when making this bull rush action. Also, upon making a successful feint, you now cause the target to lose their Dexterity bonus to AC until the beginning of your next turn.
Upon reaching +12 base attack bonus, when you parry an attack, your opponent provokes a normal attack of opportunity from you. The attack of opportunity must be made using your off-hand weapon.

.
OFF-HAND ASSAULT
You have learned to make devastating off-hand combination attacks.
Prerequisites: Dexterity 13, Strength 15, Two Weapon Technique
Benefits: You add your full Strength bonus to damage rolls made with your off-hand weapon. You also gain the combination strike combat action.

Combination Strike - When you successfully hit with your off-hand weapon immediately after hitting with your primary-hand weapon, you deal additional damage on the off-hand attack equal to one half your base attack bonus.

Improvements: Upon reaching +3 base attack bonus, when you perform a combination strike, you can force a foe to make a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + half your base attack bonus + Strength) as a swift action. If they fail their saving throw, they are shaken for 1 round (until just before your next turn). If they are already shaken, they become staggered instead.
Upon reaching +6 base attack bonus, when you perform a combination strike, you can make a trip attempt as a swift action against a larger creature, up to two sizes larger. The trip attempt is made using 1.5x your Strength.
Upon reaching +9 base attack bonus, when you perform a combination strike, you may immediately make a rend attack as a swift action. This attack is made at your highest base attack bonus, and deals 1d6 points of slashing damage plus your Strength bonus.
Upon reaching +12 base attack bonus, when you perform a combination strike, you may force a Fortitude saving throw as a free action, and if they are already staggered, they become dazed. If they are already dazed, they instead become stunned.
Upon reaching +15 base attack bonus, your rend damage is increased to 1d12 slashing damage plus 1-1/2 your Strength bonus.

I only have half-made feats for things like Shield use and Mobility (hence, the reference to a "rush" action in the ranged feats).
Nothing made yet for the Twohanders, Mounted combat, or Single weapon (offhand free) techniques.

..

This has been sitting on my computer for a while now, while I tried to figure out what I wanted to do with skills and skill tricks (this was before unchained, and even unchained doesn't fulfill my "it must handle higher level content appropriately" requirements).

Hope it gives you some ideas, even if it wasn't exactly what you were looking for.


Sounds cool! I like the fighting defensively/fighting recklessly things. Would it be unbalanced to allow a penalty to AC or hit or damage to get a bonus to one of the other ones?


Should Cleave grant Whirlwind Attack?


mmm i think this could work, i have turned off some feats too (making them free for everyone who meets the prerrequs)

throw anything
unarmed attack


Juda de Kerioth wrote:

mmm i think this could work, i have turned off some feats too (making them free for everyone who meets the prerrequs)

throw anything
unarmed attack

I tossed that in under my second post, as a single feat.


here are my merging feats from the corerulebook.
note that you have the feat with all the feats inside, but you still have to meet the prerreqs for working with (example twf; you need dex 15, improved you need dex 17 and greater youll need dex 19)

Acrobatics (acrobatics, agile maneuvers)
Improved Initiative (Imrpoved Initiative, Quick Draw, Rapid reload)
improved disarm (improved disarm, greater disarm)
improved faint (improved faint, greater faint)
improved trip (improved trip, greater trip)
combat expertise (combat expertise, stand still)
dodge (dodge, mobility)
wind stance (wind stance, lightning stance)
mounted combat (mounted combat, mounted archery, ride by attack)
point blank shot (point blank shot, far shot, precise shot)
rapid shot (rapid shot, many shot)
cleave (cleave, improved cleave)
improved bull rush (improved bull rush, greater bull rush)
improved overrun (improved overrun, greater overrun)
improved sunder (improved sunder, greater sunder)
Vital Strike (Vital Strike, Improved Vital Strike, Greater Vital Strike)
Two-Weapon Fighting. (TWF, Two-Weapon Defense, Improved TWF, Greater TWF)


also, i made some feats as combat actions for free:
unnarmed attack
throw anything
improvised weapon
catch of guard

and reading the apg i see no reason to make those feats chains, since they are very specific. also i think the core feats are the roots for everything else. so, the feats that realy matter are this ones.


One thing I did in a play-by-post I started running was if you took a combat feat, then you automatically got to pick a "chain" that required the feat you got all the feats you qualified for. Only melee combat feats though, because ranged combat is already has an advantage.

Power Attack on the Cleave chain gave you Cleave as a bonus feat, and when you qualified you'd get Great Cleave, etc.


im still working on this, some one else out there with the same idea?


Azten wrote:

One thing I did in a play-by-post I started running was if you took a combat feat, then you automatically got to pick a "chain" that required the feat you got all the feats you qualified for. Only melee combat feats though, because ranged combat is already has an advantage.

Power Attack on the Cleave chain gave you Cleave as a bonus feat, and when you qualified you'd get Great Cleave, etc.

I'd say to drop the archery chain-ness and get rid of either Precise Shot/Improved Precise Shot or Clustered Shots and Rapid Shot/Manyshot. Precise Shot/Improved Precise Shot practically negate the need for melee, and Clustered Shots with Rapid Shot/Manyshot let you deal a ton of damage and punch through DR. So either create a "zone" for melee, or a general damage nerf so that archery is comparable with melee.

If people get over with archery within 1 or 2 feats, they have feats to do things other than archery.

Also, by boosting feats, you boost Fighters, because Fighters are made of feats.


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I don't see a problem with boosting fighters.


Azten wrote:
I don't see a problem with boosting fighters.

I don't, either. Uh, just to re-ask an old question, should the Cleave chain grant Whirlwind Attack?


My Self wrote:
Azten wrote:
I don't see a problem with boosting fighters.
I don't, either. Uh, just to re-ask an old question, should the Cleave chain grant Whirlwind Attack?

i say no. whirlwind attack should be an stand alone feat.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I could see reasoning for it to be a part of the feat chain though. A sort of evolution from Cleaving one or two foes to everyone.


Yeah, I completely dislike Whirlwind's feat chain. It basically implies all this movement, and gives movement related bonuses, but at the end you have to be standing still (full round action) to perform the ability.

Whirlwind actually feels like a natural progression to Cleaving: You start by swiping a couple people at a time, then a few more, then *everyone around you*.


I don't particularly agree that combat expertise and power attack should be free.

Combat Expertise is reflected in Fighting Defensively and Total Defense, but taking a feat gives you a more powerful version of the two.

Power Attack likewise should have more of combat options, Something like Fighting Offensively where you abandon AC to gain some damage, or some AB.

Maybe a set of options like

Fighting Defensively - Gain AC for AB
Fighting Offensively - Gain AB for Damage
Fighting Recklessly - Gain Damage for AC

Then Power Attack, Combat Expertise, and a new feat where you could trade damage for Attack bonus would be more training one would have in those particular areas of combat.

I'd also go with some differences with my version of the increased saves.

Great Fort would give you the ability to use Fort in the place of reflex, if you have +7 base fort once per day. Additional uses at +9 and +11.

Lighting Reflexes would be the same, but works on will saves

Iron will would do the same but function for fort saves.

A lot of feats I'd redesign would end up looking closer to equipment tricks.

Like Toughness would get more powerful if you have Endurance, granting a dr of x/- equal to half your level but only against non-lethal damage. A small bonus for sure, but it gives it more flavor. If you have Diehard, then the bonus amount of HP Toughness gives also increases how far you can go into negative hp.


have you watched Witcher 3 Combat skill Whirl? its like whirlwind attack in my mind :3


Darche Schneider wrote:

I don't particularly agree that combat expertise and power attack should be free.

Combat Expertise is reflected in Fighting Defensively and Total Defense, but taking a feat gives you a more powerful version of the two.

Power Attack likewise should have more of combat options, Something like Fighting Offensively where you abandon AC to gain some damage, or some AB.

Maybe a set of options like

Fighting Defensively - Gain AC for AB
Fighting Offensively - Gain AB for Damage
Fighting Recklessly - Gain Damage for AC

Then Power Attack, Combat Expertise, and a new feat where you could trade damage for Attack bonus would be more training one would have in those particular areas of combat.

I'd also go with some differences with my version of the increased saves.

Great Fort would give you the ability to use Fort in the place of reflex, if you have +7 base fort once per day. Additional uses at +9 and +11.

Lighting Reflexes would be the same, but works on will saves

Iron will would do the same but function for fort saves.

A lot of feats I'd redesign would end up looking closer to equipment tricks.

Like Toughness would get more powerful if you have Endurance, granting a dr of x/- equal to half your level but only against non-lethal damage. A small bonus for sure, but it gives it more flavor. If you have Diehard, then the bonus amount of HP Toughness gives also increases how far you can go into negative hp.

That sounds cool, but also slightly impractical. I'm kinda interested in shrinking multi-feat dependency, so fewer feat interactions, the better. Also, you'd have to make huge feat descriptions if you intend to have more than one or two feat combo options.

I like the AC -> AB, AB -> Damage, Damage -> AC triangle thing. Would it hurt to have it be a single feat, or just part of the combat system? It feels unfair to require someone to fill a feat slot with a feat they absolutely need to pick up to stay relevant.


I don't feel that it would become an absolute need to stay retentive to have to pick up the feats, of course I can only speak of my own experience where I've got characters who make very heavy use of fighting defensively, taking total defense actions.

Made one of my GMs a bit annoyed with my scythe wielding sorcerer who could become untouchable by anything other than a nat 20, by just simply having fighting defensively or total defense actions.

I'm kinda okay as well with having feats becoming 'huger' because we'd be working to take out a large number of them that are just upgrade types. From my experiences with other systems that have qualities or edges, often what ends up happening is you just get a number of disjointed abilities, or very weak abilities in feats.

The two feats that interact, either one could have the interaction clause as well. Though, I'd use this method specifically more for style feats. Blend the feats together into one like the equipment trick feats.

Besides that.. For example my Toughness example, would end up being five different feats normally. But we've combined it to three feats by having the interactions between the feats.


ppl have you merged already other books feats chains? i have merged core only, and since im not a player just a gm, i dont know or care other books chains, still i have all those books
ultimate combat
ultimate magic
advanced players guide
advanced class guide
advanced race guide
inner sea world guide


I agree that the whirlwind chain is very odd, one of my friends, when he is the gm uses a cheaper version of whirlwind attack. and is a house rule that i see very interesting with huge potential.

Swing (combat maneuver)
it provokes AoO.
you make one attack per any adjacent enemy near you. every attack uses your Str mod bonus and can only be done with large weapons.
Benefit: as a full round action you spin in a circle hitting all enemies surrounding you.

the first attack goes with your str mod and bonuses, the next ones goes with a -1 to str mod cumulative per attack maded. when you reach str mod 0 you cannot siwng any further.
you can´t use the 5ft step after this action and you obtain -2 to ac, and you cannot use your str bonus your next turn.

its a cheaper whirlwind verion, and a desperate movement at our parties. we alway use it when we are outnumbered or such. it has no feats to lessen the penalties

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