Welcome back :)
Thanks!
So I came back home and found situations at work kinda wonky. One guy's on vacation, one of our assistant managers got requisitioned to another store 'cause their manager quit, and one of my coworkers was ran over by a van on his scooter (he's okay but out of work for a bit). So I'm kind of covering a lot of shifts at the moment so my posting here will be slow for a while.
*flops*
I was browsing a local Alaskan gamer group today, and came across a picture depicting Wolvering as a Jedi with Lightsaber claws instead of Adamantium claws. I immediately shared it to the Pathfinder group.
However, I wonder, have you ever felt so evil as to throw something so deadly as Wolverine with force powers and lightsabers at the party?
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I was browsing a local Alaskan gamer group today, and came across a picture depicting Wolvering as a Jedi with Lightsaber claws instead of Adamantium claws. I immediately shared it to the Pathfinder group.
However, I wonder, have you ever felt so evil as to throw something so deadly as Wolverine with force powers and lightsabers at the party?
I don't think I could come up with anything so terrifying without snapping the CR system over my knee. XD
Bumping to get Ashiel's opinion on necromancer/power-level for this thing.
Hey, brother! Long time no see!
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Hey, brother! Long time no see!
Ditto!
I've been busy. :P
Bumping to get Ashiel's opinion on necromancer/power-level for this thing.
I'm not 100% sure what the question is. Reading through the post linked, it seems this is for 5E which largely means that power level is largely irrelevant since we're talking mook hordes (high level is meaningless in 5E as what 5E describes as high level doesn't exist; in almost all cases you are better off with a suitably sized militia).
As far as the tournament goes there's a lot of ways you could balance both an investigation AND the tournament going on. Especially if it it were drawn out over a few weeks or better in-game time, in addition to all the ideas you posted for giving incentives for participating in the tourney.
If we're talking in terms of d20 scaling and the relative power of the death cleric, that's largely hinging on the outside factors. A plague-zombie type thing is do-able by a 5th level cleric with animate dead so pretty low on the totem pole by D&D power scales but high enough to be a superhero for real-life people. However, in terms of a viral-curse that animates shadows, creates zombies, and traps souls as lemure devils that's kind of outside the scope of a character.
Which brings us to the outside influences. It would theoretically be possible to have some sort of magical item and/or magical disease-curse stuff that could be created with the okay of the GM (such as a magical sacrificial alter or somesuch), and one could probably justify some sort of magical virus created using Craft Wondrous Item with spells like animate dead, create greater undead, and planar ally or something to create a vial of doom-lixir.
That could even be conceivably done at low levels as well depending on what sort of item creation rules you were using (Pathfinder would allow the priestess to make a difficult but not impossible Spellcraft check to create it).
Works for me!
(I was mostly just curious if you knew more/had crunched more numbers - I was reasonably sure you had, but I can't find that now... but what you put works well!)
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Works for me!
(I was mostly just curious if you knew more/had crunched more numbers - I was reasonably sure you had, but I can't find that now... but what you put works well!)
Well if your interest is just in getting hordes of controlled minions, mystic theurge is surprisingly adept at this even though it's generally inferior to full casters. The main reason is because you can progress multiple caster levels at the same time while applying bonus caster levels twice.
For example, let's take mystic theurge with 3 wizard / 3 cleric, 4 theurge levels (10th level). Spells like death knell or ioun stones can further raise caster level. So with only death knell sacrificing a chicken or something beforehand, or hypothetical theurge at 10th level could cast animate dead as an 8th level wizard and 8th level cleric for a total of 64HD worth of controlled undead (compared to a cleric's 44 HD you've got 20 extra HD). The gap grows as level increases and other forms of +caster level comes online (but you have to wait longer for higher tier spells like create (greater) undead).
A mystic theurge could likewise use binding spells to trivially collect lemure devils to spread around. Realistically speaking, lemure devils would be virtually a no-brainer to bind into service as they are mindless and can't even resist a caster's demands when using planar binding so they could just be unleashed into the world as 1d4 claw damage soul-puddings to pester the local militia.
That said, it's my understanding that necromancy is grossly powerful in 5E because animate dead can crush most anything due to the mechanics of that game. Being a mighty hero doesn't really mean anything because the town militia doesn't really need you, they can kill the dragon/pit-fiend/demigod themselves and if they're facing similar numbers then you can't realistically help much either (because a horde of mooks will kill you too), so it could be very dangerous to face an evil necromancer.
Also the level ranges and overall plot would be a good start for crunching some numbers in Pathfinder or something, or we could talk about justifying a tournament while handling an investigation and such as well or...well, most anything if a particular subject is raised. :P
Mostly I meant numbers in 5E - I'm not familiar enough with the system to know what kind of numbers there even are.
For example: is the Mystic Theurge thing 5E? Or PF?
(That's what I mean - I'm not sure.)
I was wondering about hypothetical maximums based on RAW stuff for 5E.
So, for example let's say a necromancer could, at maximum level, run 43 (randomly generated number from my brain) undead.
The reason I was looking for that (though I hadn't made it clear), was giving a rough guesstimate of what a person could expect to face.
So, say, Doomkitty's hypothetical death mage was at the minimum maximum undead-keeping level (whatever that was; I think 5E did away with caster levels, so I figured it miiiiiiiight not matter what level they were at, so long as they hit level <X>?).
For the purposes of this conversation, if we "tie" the skin-aberration, gore-ooze, brain-devourer, etc. numbers to that (so, for example, for each skeleton she holds, she can have one of the others), that generates a rough "army" size that she could wield with absolute control.
Beyond that, I figured that she figured that the plague would take care of itself (probably because worshipers of her god, or bearers of her god's holy symbol are immune or something - I dunno, it's not my game, and it was a vague thought anyway).
Anyhoo, that's what I was really after... but if you don't have those, that's fine. I just wasn't sure.
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Mostly I meant numbers in 5E - I'm not familiar enough with the system to know what kind of numbers there even are.
For example: is the Mystic Theurge thing 5E? Or PF?
(That's what I mean - I'm not sure.)
I was wondering about hypothetical maximums based on RAW stuff for 5E.
So, for example let's say a necromancer could, at maximum level, run 43 (randomly generated number from my brain) undead.
The reason I was looking for that (though I hadn't made it clear), was giving a rough guesstimate of what a person could expect to face.
So, say, Doomkitty's hypothetical death mage was at the minimum maximum undead-keeping level (whatever that was; I think 5E did away with caster levels, so I figured it miiiiiiiight not matter what level they were at, so long as they hit level <X>?).
For the purposes of this conversation, if we "tie" the skin-aberration, gore-ooze, brain-devourer, etc. numbers to that (so, for example, for each skeleton she holds, she can have one of the others), that generates a rough "army" size that she could wield with absolute control.
Beyond that, I figured that she figured that the plague would take care of itself (probably because worshipers of her god, or bearers of her god's holy symbol are immune or something - I dunno, it's not my game, and it was a vague thought anyway).
Anyhoo, that's what I was really after... but if you don't have those, that's fine. I just wasn't sure.
Ah, gotcha. :o
Well I'll go re-download the 5E stuff and browse it. I had deleted it from my HD. :\
No rush! It's up to you!
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I know you've said you consider Pathfinder paladins to be tier 3. Could you please explain what makes them so much more versatile than 3.5 paladins?
In combat, it seems to me that their versatility has decreased, if anything. 3.5 paladins have access to martial study and some cool CW feats that broaden their use of actions beyond hitting things with a stick. In Pathfinder, barring access to PoW/PoWE, the only big new in-combat trick it gets is Aura of Resolve, which seems relatively small given that it already had good will saves, and the fact that in 3.5 it is relatively easy to gain immunity to mind-affecting effects with items (which everyone lost in pathfinder). Though, I'll grant the ability to give your allies a save boost is nice. Otherwise, the new paladin class features seem to be mostly number boosts and damage dealing.Out of combat, the big things it gains in pathfinder is Mercy. That, I'll grant, is a huge utility boost, but is it really enough to push the class up two full tiers?
Of course, as I am mainly just familiar with 3.5, I'm not accounting for systemic changes that work in the paladin's favor. I haven't checked whether the paladin spell list has been substantially altered for the better, or whether supplemental content pushes it up further the way fighters got pushed up in 3.5 via new feats, Dungeon Crasher, Zhentarim, hit-and-run fighter and some other ACFs.
I can see that the combination of the numerical buffs to its old features and Mercy can push it up into the borderline tier 3/tier 4 range. Basically, I am asking you to try to convince me that the paladin is actually tier 3 and not just borderline 3-4, using arguments that separate it from its 3.5 counterpart.
One of the biggest enhancement's to the Paladin's overall effectiveness is the shift from Wisdom for casting to pure Charisma for pretty much everything. In general it means that pushing Charisma gives you not only incredible saves but solid offensive options and ensures that you are not only able to cast your spells when they come online but will frequently have a number of bonus spells. It's a small change but it makes getting bonus spells (or spells at all) a much easier prospect than in 3.x.
Lay on Hands was drastically improved. In 3.x, Lay on Hands healed P_Level * Cha_Mod. At the top end, 20th level Paladin with 30 Charisma could heal 200 HP / day. At pretty much all levels, the amount of damage you can heal is pretty crappy. It also always takes a standard action to use, making it useful for nearly nothing save out of combat healing and very limited healing at that.
Lay on Hands in Pathfinder (before taking into account modifiers) heals Paladin level/2 * 1d6 hit points a number of times per day equal to 1/2 Paladin level + Charisma modifier (which means a 4th level Paladin with a 18 Charisma heals a total of 12d6 damage (about 42) per day (compared to the 16 a 3.x Paladin could. Since the Paladin can use it on herself as a swift action, the Paladin can continue to act while displaying astounding levels of resilience. When you look into Paladin options that are available in Pathfinder, you find things like Fey Foundling or favored class modifiers that add additional +healing to their LoHs.
Side Note: If you want to make an exceptionally study Paladin, a Demon-spawn Tiefling (+2 Str, +2 Cha, -2 Int) with the favored class bonus (+1 HP / level when using LoH on yourself), with the Fey Foundling feat (+2 HP / die rolled when you are healed) can allow you to ignore excessive amounts of damage (our hypothetical 4th level Paladin would be able to heal for 2d6+8 6 times per day as a swift action or about 15 Hp per use or 90 Hp / day).
Mercies allow Paladins to remove irritating or debilitating status ailments and again are part of the swift-action to use Lay on Hands on themselves which they will likely be doing already so it's essentially a free status-recovery of your mercy if applicable.
Paladins gained new immunities, such as immunity to Charms and Compulsions and passive DR 10/evil (which humorously even most evil enemies, save evil-subtyped outsiders, cannot easily bypass so in most cases it's as good as DR 10/- since +5 weapons aren't practical for NPCs).
Paladins can grant smite to their whole party + minions, which gets pretty silly.
Paladins were stealth-buffed by the changes to the item creation mechanics from 3.x->PF. Before, if the Paladin lacked the associated spell for an item they couldn't even attempt to make it so item creation was a futile endeavor for Paladins in 3.x (their spell list is small and specific, dealing with mostly focus combat and utility). However, Paladins can now very comfortably use their caster levels + class skill bonuses to fashion their own gear effectively which makes them less reliant on random-dice gods for gear and allows them to specialize comfortably (and can give them a virtual increase in WBL).
Their spells are prepared so they can craft Pearls!
They have access to Unsanctioned Knowledge which lets them pick up some cool spells off some other spell lists allowing them to do some interesting things.
Paladins in Pathfinder can be cornerstones of a party. Feats like Ultimate Mercy mean they can raise anyone who died by just dumping lay on hands into them and then getting a night's rest. They can even skip the component by taking a negative level for a day (freaking awesome).
Their divine bond no longer has to be a mount. Now I like the mount but in many campaigns it isn't very practical or helpful and it is clearly an issue for non-small sized characters, and the ability to increase or add properties to your weapon in a pinch can be pretty sweet.
So in the end we're left with a class that...
1. Is extraordinarily durable vs physical harm.
2. Is extraordinarily durable vs magical harm.
3. Is effective at making their own magic items.
4. Has immediate access to spell-trigger support items like wands.
5. Has access to daily abilities that let them do things like scaling energy resistances, pop Lay on Hands when they fall below 0 HP, move without provoking attacks, auto-confirm crits vs evil foes, recover ability damage, etc.
6. Brings resources to the party rather than draining them.
7. Has exceptionally good magic item synergies (ring of evasion + divine grace + ring of free action + celestial armor = unstoppable juggernaut; pearls of power can give tons and tons of uses of things like grace, hero's defiance, bless weapon, and lesser restoration; their abilities universally stack with magic items).
8. Immunities actually translate into more magic item potential. For example, being immune to fear, charms, compulsions, and poison (delay poison as a 1 hour/level spell) means that you can skip magic items that guard against those things and replace them with other things.
If we compare this to the Warblade or Crusader from 3.5, which last I checked were considered tier 3 classes on JaronK's tier list, the PF Paladin stacks up nicely. It's rare to find an adventure where they are just twiddling their thumbs. They are good in combat, social, survival, and party support and can either ignore or adapt to issues very well.
Other Notes: Divine Power was nerfed for clerics as it doesn't increase BAB but instead gives a rather substantial luck bonus to hit and damage. Paladins can pick up Divine Power via Unsanctioned Knowledge and it stacks with their goodies.
Paladins did receive a few buffs that were mostly numeric. However, the sheer scale of those buffs make those abilities worth far, far more than their 3.x counterparts. For example, smite lasted 1-attack and was wasted on a miss in 3.x, now it lasts until your foe is dead and auto-pierces DR. Lay on Hands was piddly healing, now it's amazing (so amazing that Paladins can just forget Constitution if they want in favor of Charisma).
I can't really think of a reason that a Warblade would be Tier 3 but a PF Paladin wouldn't be. Especially since the Paladin is actually more versatile overall than the Warlade. Virtually all of their awesome stuff comes either from their class features, feats made for them, or are from options that synergize with them well without being piled behind lots of prerequisite-walls.
How is your life doing? :D
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How is your life doing? :D
All in all, doing okay with no complaints. I'm down with the flu but eating meds to keep the fevers & such down. Was so busy working I forgot to look around for flu vaccinations. :|
Haven't really been doing much on the Paizo forums lately. Most gaming-related stuff I'm working on is little bits by bits of my project and I've become rather disenchanted with the Paizo forums overall. I still like a lot of the people here but I'm just not really into the macro-consciousness here, I haven't had any good discussions lately, and I'm not really ever excited about anything Paizo is releasing anymore or their FAQrata(and sitting on the forums criticizing stuff isn't really what I want to do with my time).
Let's see...
Been trying to do Christmas shopping, improving my art skills (I got a graphics tablet as an early Christmas present and I'm trying to follow some tutorials to get a better idea how to paint digitally, which is where most of my art really falls apart), hanging out with friends when possible. Got to play a bit of Pathfinder with some friends of mine on Maptools the other day (despite trying to cough up my lungs :D) which was fun (I'm playing a modified merfolk-vitalist-egoist-thing).
How about you? :)
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Shame that, forums are less interesting without your insight, haha. Well hopefully you'll still post here when your projects reach testing stage. I definitely will want to see that Wrath of the Righteous sans Mythic thing too one day. Had to end that thing on a cut scene it got so tedious.
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Aww, you guys are sweet. (#^-^#)
I'll try to spend a bit more time here. :)
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My hard-drive died forever, leaving me temporarily stranded on a phone.
Currently playing Blue Rose with my wife - a setting I would have presumed was like candy 'round here by for which I've yet to be much of a conversation, even though I started a thread (link when I'm not on a phooooooooone).
Hurt my foot by stepping on a broken end of a bag. Still hurts.
And I've been wanting to do more PF stuff, but haven't really had the time.
Oh, and I got both the original X-Com and the current one: I was playing the original, but lost all my research data with the loss of my hard-drive. So... aliens won on a count of technical glitch, I guess. ::/
Over-all, GREAT! God has blessed mightily and well. :D
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The Grinch That Stole Christmas... Whaddya think? Possibly silly and fun adventure?
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Today I noticed that animal companions get two ability score increases every 4 HD. An ability score increase every 4 HD is an effect of HD (see Bestiary) just like gaining feats are. However, animal companions also receive a special ability every 4 HD called Ability Score Increase which is an Extraordinary ability.
Since there is no exception made for them for the normal rules for Hit Dice, they get both. :0
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Wait, I knew something before Ashiel did? Crap, this is topsy turvy world! Next I'm gonna be hearing that the stealth nerf to the ghost touch net was a joke.
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Wait, I knew something before Ashiel did? Crap, this is topsy turvy world! Next I'm gonna be hearing that the stealth nerf to the ghost touch net was a joke.
-_-
...What stealth nerf?
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Wait, I knew something before Ashiel did? Crap, this is topsy turvy world! Next I'm gonna be hearing that the stealth nerf to the ghost touch net was a joke.-_-
...What stealth nerf?
Ditto. What stealth nerf? :o
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When ultimate equipment came out, Ghost Touch was swapped to only apply to ammunition and melee weapons. A net is neither. Thus, you cannot have ghost touch nets.
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When ultimate equipment came out, Ghost Touch was swapped to only apply to ammunition and melee weapons. A net is neither. Thus, you cannot have ghost touch nets.
o_o
...
(ノ ゜Д゜)ノ ︵ ┻━┻
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In a way you can still do it though. It only got stuck on every table but Ranged Weapons table but the ability never specifically calls out you can't. It's just one of those IMPLIES things.
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In a way you can still do it though. It only got stuck on every table but Ranged Weapons table but the ability never specifically calls out you can't. It's just one of those IMPLIES things.
Whaizo. Just Whaizo. XD
EDIT: Omg, they really did nerf it.
Ghost Touch: A ghost touch weapon deals damage normally against incorporeal creatures, regardless of its bonus. An incorporeal creature's 50% reduction in damage from corporeal sources does not apply to attacks made against it with ghost touch weapons. The weapon can be picked up and moved by an incorporeal creature at any time. A manifesting ghost can wield the weapon against corporeal foes. Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as both corporeal or incorporeal.
Moderate conjuration; CL 9th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, plane shift; Price +1 bonus.
Price +1 bonus; Aura moderate conjuration; CL 9th; Weight —
A ghost touch weapon deals damage normally against incorporeal creatures, regardless of its bonus. An incorporeal creature's 50% reduction in damage from corporeal sources does not apply to attacks made against it with ghost touch weapons. The weapon can be picked up and moved by an incorporeal creature at any time. A manifesting ghost can wield the weapon against corporeal foes. Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as both corporeal or incorporeal. This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons and ammunition.
There are not enough tables to flip!
*grumbles and decides to try to speed up the production of my RPG system*
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In a way you can still do it though. It only got stuck on every table but Ranged Weapons table but the ability never specifically calls out you can't. It's just one of those IMPLIES things.Whaizo. Just Whaizo. XD
EDIT: Omg, they really did nerf it.
Ghost Touch: A ghost touch weapon deals damage normally against incorporeal creatures, regardless of its bonus. An incorporeal creature's 50% reduction in damage from corporeal sources does not apply to attacks made against it with ghost touch weapons. The weapon can be picked up and moved by an incorporeal creature at any time. A manifesting ghost can wield the weapon against corporeal foes. Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as both corporeal or incorporeal.
Moderate conjuration; CL 9th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, plane shift; Price +1 bonus.
Price +1 bonus; Aura moderate conjuration; CL 9th; Weight —
A ghost touch weapon deals damage normally against incorporeal creatures, regardless of its bonus. An incorporeal creature's 50% reduction in damage from corporeal sources does not apply to attacks made against it with ghost touch weapons. The weapon can be picked up and moved by an incorporeal creature at any time. A manifesting ghost can wield the weapon against corporeal foes. Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as both corporeal or incorporeal. This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons and ammunition.
There are not enough tables to flip!
*grumbles and decides to try to speed up the production of my RPG system*
Ah right there it is. I was wondering if I was misrecalling the bottom part when I went hunting for it again now. Beat me to it again Flash- Er Ashiel!
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Aww...
You are missed. This is one of the most often checked threads that I watch...
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Aww...
You are missed. This is one of the most often checked threads that I watch...
Yeah I'm gonna try to be around more often. :)
I miss you guys too. :D| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Ah right there it is. I was wondering if I was misrecalling the bottom part when I went hunting for it again now. Beat me to it again Flash- Er Ashiel!In a way you can still do it though. It only got stuck on every table but Ranged Weapons table but the ability never specifically calls out you can't. It's just one of those IMPLIES things.Whaizo. Just Whaizo. XD
EDIT: Omg, they really did nerf it.
Ghost Touch: A ghost touch weapon deals damage normally against incorporeal creatures, regardless of its bonus. An incorporeal creature's 50% reduction in damage from corporeal sources does not apply to attacks made against it with ghost touch weapons. The weapon can be picked up and moved by an incorporeal creature at any time. A manifesting ghost can wield the weapon against corporeal foes. Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as both corporeal or incorporeal.
Moderate conjuration; CL 9th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, plane shift; Price +1 bonus.
Price +1 bonus; Aura moderate conjuration; CL 9th; Weight —
A ghost touch weapon deals damage normally against incorporeal creatures, regardless of its bonus. An incorporeal creature's 50% reduction in damage from corporeal sources does not apply to attacks made against it with ghost touch weapons. The weapon can be picked up and moved by an incorporeal creature at any time. A manifesting ghost can wield the weapon against corporeal foes. Essentially, a ghost touch weapon counts as both corporeal or incorporeal. This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons and ammunition.
There are not enough tables to flip!
*grumbles and decides to try to speed up the production of my RPG system*
So much for the "Thou shalt not publish rules that contradict or override the CRB" stuff they've been spouting for years. I have to wonder if Ghost Touch still remains as it was originally printed in the most recent version of the CRB. If it does, then it should overrule the version in UE.
Not that I really care. I don't really trust most of the errata decisions these days anyway. They only time I really ask for a FAQ or errata is if I genuinely don't know the answer to a question.
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Not that I really care. I don't really trust most of the errata decisions these days anyway. They only time I really ask for a FAQ or errata is if I genuinely don't know the answer to a question.
I can't actually remember them fixing anything. I can only remember them breaking stuff, over and over again, creating weird conflicts and exceptions. Every FAQatta I've seen has never actually made the game any better, nerfs the wrong guys, etc.
What would you say to a warlock class that instead of spells used a kind of initator type system? So instead of worrying about x spells per level, they have class abilities that scale with level, not unlike an mmo.
What would you say to a warlock class that instead of spells used a kind of initator type system? So instead of worrying about x spells per level, they have class abilities that scale with level, not unlike an mmo.
That could work out pretty well actually. Last I played WoW (about 75% of the way through Warlords I think), mana doesn't even work like the same resource anymore anyway (Int doesn't increase maximum mana, it just increases the potency of spells, and your spells eat a % of your maximum mana, and spirit increases how fast your mana % regenerates) so a mana-like system like psionics isn't even any more accurate than a cooldown / regenerating resource system like initiators.
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As an aside, I'm finally working on the actual classes in my RPG and have been for a couple of days. The barbarian is almost 100% finished (just a matter of adding in which Rage powers are making it into the RPG, which are being tweaked, and which are being axed), the bard is almost 100% finished (my friend Raital who posted in this thread way back is slavering at the mouth for the bard o_o;), Druid is under construction, everything else is in conceptual stages only.
Class/level progression has changed wildly from standard d20. Each level you choose a path: Martial, Magical, Hybrid. This determines your statistics (such as HP, BAB, etc). You're otherwise a blank slate. However, you get talents which can be spent to pick up a class or develop an existing class (1 at 1st level to choose your first class with, and you get an additional talent every even level).
Class features and abilities are acquired by spending your talents. Virtually all of them scale with your character level (in fact, all references to level in the classes mean character level). As a result, you can build your ideal character with seemless multiclassing that combines various talents together.
In fact, because of this, there is no need for prestige classes in the traditional sense.
My friend Raital was excited when she found that bards who have fully invested in their bard class are among the best (if not the best) buffers in the game.
Merely for being a bard you can pick up some performances, with our personal favorites being the Inspire X performances (courage, greatness, heroics, etc). Each performance does fairly minor but useful things (inspire courage reaches +3 hit/damage, reduces fear effects by 1 step; inspire greatness eventually provides up to 15 temp HP/round and gives +3 effective levels; inspire heroics gives up to a +3 dodge and +3 morale bonus to Fort/Ref/Will).
However you can invest a talent into each of them to juice them up, and one of their talents "Symphony of Inspiration" allows you to chain the performances together and maintain them all at once.
So a bard who has invested 6/10 talents into Inspire Courage, Inspire Greatness, Inspire Heroics, and Symphony of Inspiration can provide the following effects to any allies affected: +5 morale to hit and damage, immunity to fear, +25 temp HP / round, +5 dodge to AC, +5 morale to Fort, Ref, and Will, +5 effective character level, attack penalties for extra attacks reduced by 4 (in d20 legends, this essentially allows +2 attacks without suffering a penalty). Notes: The +5 effective level affects anything that is based on your character level other than your base statistics. Any class features, abilities, spells, maneuvers, or special attacks like breath weapons which are based on your level now function as if you were that many levels higher; so the bard would do things like raise the DR of the party's barbarian, make the mage's spells stronger, allow Paladins to heal and smite harder, etc).
I figure that the best way to create a class that has level based powers, as opposed to spells and slots.
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I've been checking out Patreon for a bit because of a few projects I was supporting and noticed it's kind of part developer blog, part tip jar, part think-tank for projects. As a result I've decided I'm going to set up a Patreon account within the next few days which I'll use as a place to post regular updates and such publicly and serve as a tip jar to help pay for things like art for when the core rulebook is ready to be published. I don't expect to get rich off this sort of thing so when I do, I'll pretty much be posting all my updates to the public version of the Patreon page so anyone can feel free to drop by and get the goods when it's up.
With a bit of luck and some hard work, I'll be able to drum up enough interest in the game and its continued development to fund art and maybe spend a little less time working my day job and working on RPG stuff.
So, uh, wish me luck yeah?
I figure that the best way to create a class that has level based powers, as opposed to spells and slots.
Well one of my favorite aspects of the 3.5 Binder from Tome of Magic was the cooldown on their major abilities. Most every vestige had a few always on abilities and one big ability that could be used once every 5 rounds.
It's an amusingly simple yet very effective system. Possibilities for variations are numerous.
EDIT: Similarly, recharging resources can be a cool mechanic too. The gunslinger demo I threw together back during the UC playtest uses a grit mechanic that ranges from 0-12 grit. You ideally have a d12 that you use to track your grit at the table, so some abilities provide +grit, others consume grit.
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I'm most excited about getting it into the playtesting phases. My friends and I have already been hitting the early drafts of stuff with our hammers to find cracks and bugs in the system but I'm anxious to get a lot of people involved and trying to break the system into a million little pieces so we can pick 'em up and try again.
Since I started writing the classes section of the RPG, we already came up with a solution to an issue that was initially a problem that was on the back burner.
Essentially, I had the gist of how I wanted to lay out the class system, mixed with a sudden design epiphany after Raital was asking me some questions concerning how she was going to be able to build her PC and what would be possible, which led to the current class system that I've got ironed out right now.
The big kicker, however, was that I hadn't set up some sort of limiting factor on how many classes you could merge together with multiclassing. I want the system to be beautifully versatile and seamless when it comes to multiclassing and building your ideal character but in an early version (which was changed a few hours ago and now makes me super happy) there was no downside to selecting as many classes as possible and in fact just gave free power (which is terribad) but I hadn't decided on a limiting factor. After deciding on a limiting factor we were happy with, I'm super excited about building characters in this system now.
You can now have the Paladin Druid you never knew you wanted. lol
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So you're saying I can't be Vorpal Kickasso. Bad game, ruined forever! I demand a refund!
Then again, I still can be the Squid of Smiting... Okay one more chance! Then I am taking my banana bread and going home! HOME!
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So you're saying I can't be Vorpal Kickasso. Bad game, ruined forever! I demand a refund!
Yeah, as I explained it to my friend Raital when I was discussing the bug...
Let's say you wanted to be a kickass barbarian. So you pick the martial path every level, invest all your talents into barbarian talents, and at 20th level you're THE barbarian. Sounds good, yeah?
The issue is, currently, you pick the martial path every level, begin as a barbarian, add rogue, invest all your talents into barbarian talents, and at 20th level you're THE barbarian...but also have +3d6 sneak attack. You're 100% as good as the first guy just with more cookies. That's an issue. It not even a little issue since you could theoretically just dip every possible class to get their basic mechanics while also being THE BARBARIAN with no drawbacks.
But we've fixed it and it's glorious.
Then again, I still can be the Squid of Smiting... Okay one more chance! Then I am taking my banana bread and going home! HOME!
You kid, but in my campaign setting there actually are "flayer"-like squid aberration people as a player race so a Squid of Smiting isn't even out of the question. :P
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Well I've got a patreon page more or less finished. Had to figure out how to hide my patronages on the page. I'm supporting a couple of adult indie games and while I'm 100% happy with that, it's probably inappropriate for my RPG project to link to those projects... (6_6);
Still trying to figure out some cool rewards for people donating more than $1.00 / month. It's hard to come up with cool rewards for stuff and I don't want to make any crazy promises I can't keep or anything. At the moment I've got ideas for...
Rewards
$1.00 = You get access to the patron feed where some pre-release stuff might be announced before it's finalized (essentially kind of a think-tank). You get to see any art commissioned for the project and critique it before it's made public. You get a copy of the rulebook pdf when it's complete if you've pledged $1.00 ten times.
$5.00 = As $1.00 and you get copies of material that my team and I are tinkering with before they're released for public playtesting (making you kind of an alpha-tester). You get a copy of the rulebook pdf when it's complete if you've pledged $5.00 two times.
$10.00 = As $5.00 and you get a copy of the rulebook pdf when it's complete, and you get your name/nickname (up to 3 total names such as Ronald "Zits" McDoodle) included in a collection of special-thanks credits in the book.
$20.00 = As $10.00 and you can request I do a small pdf book dedicated to you and signed by me. The book can be something like your own class for d20 legends, a mini-adventure, a short story, a collection of magic items, or I'll draw you a picture (or a combination of any of the above). Word count on the book would be around 3,000+ words (at $0.01 cents per word that's still around $30 worth of writing :o).
Currently Considered Milestones
$100 / Month = I stockpile the cash and use it to commission art for the RPG from talented artists found on sites like DeviantArt.
$750 / Month = I get my manager at work to switch me to part time so I'm able to dedicate half my work time to developing RPG material.
$1500+ / Month = I resign to devote 100% of my work schedule to working on RPG related material, commissioning art, etc.
Any thoughts?
My thoughts: I want to have an extra $1,500 a month so I can throw it at you.
(Instead, you may have to settle for a one-time donation).
Either way, are the 1/5/10/20 awards one-time or per month? It doesn't matter: I'm just curious.
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But do they have 8 arms each carrying a pebble? This came up in one game, the paladin was against a foe who was hovering 10 feet in the air or so, and the paladin didn't have a ranged weapon and nobody had a flight option (My groups a little bad at cooperation and tactics). So I suggested to the paladin "Well, your smite evil isn't actually based on a weapon. So honestly you could pick up a rock, throw it, and add your level to damage if you hit. Sure the base damage is like, 1, but it's more than 0 isn't it."
So I got the amusing image of a paladin just throwing rocks and harsh words at a demon.
Anyhow, the patreon seems fair enough to me. And yeah showing those is probably a touch unprofessional, though based on previous posts I figure we pay most part to the same games :p. Plus I don't care about such things but overall it might be a good decision.
And yeah that sounds like it was a big issue. So how'd you fix the diversification at no penalty issue?
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But do they have 8 arms each carrying a pebble? This came up in one game, the paladin was against a foe who was hovering 10 feet in the air or so, and the paladin didn't have a ranged weapon and nobody had a flight option (My groups a little bad at cooperation and tactics). So I suggested to the paladin "Well, your smite evil isn't actually based on a weapon. So honestly you could pick up a rock, throw it, and add your level to damage if you hit. Sure the base damage is like, 1, but it's more than 0 isn't it."
So I got the amusing image of a paladin just throwing rocks and harsh words at a demon.
Anyhow, the patreon seems fair enough to me. And yeah showing those is probably a touch unprofessional, though based on previous posts I figure we pay most part to the same games :p. Plus I don't care about such things but overall it might be a good decision.
And yeah that sounds like it was a big issue. So how'd you fix the diversification at no penalty issue?
Have you heard of Bumi Meifong by Ravingdork? He's a character who fights by throwing rocks. Not even special rocks, just rocks he can pick up off the ground.
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I'd be careful about resigning on the strength of an ongoing financial commitment to the project by other people. Make sure you've built in enough of a 'buffer' that if there's a sudden wave of people cancelling their pledges you've got enough funds to cover a period finding work again.
I'm a big fan of it, but there's an upside and a downside to crowdfunding.
I figure that the best way to create a class that has level based powers, as opposed to spells and slots.Well one of my favorite aspects of the 3.5 Binder from Tome of Magic was the cooldown on their major abilities. Most every vestige had a few always on abilities and one big ability that could be used once every 5 rounds.
It's an amusingly simple yet very effective system. Possibilities for variations are numerous.
EDIT: Similarly, recharging resources can be a cool mechanic too. The gunslinger demo I threw together back during the UC playtest uses a grit mechanic that ranges from 0-12 grit. You ideally have a d12 that you use to track your grit at the table, so some abilities provide +grit, others consume grit.
I was thinking of having recharge, and concentration abilities. Like destro rain of fire has to be concentrated on, as well as drain soul for an affliction warlock.
Dunno how I'm going to do dots yet. 1/2 level per round of damage for level in rounds? It escalates quickly...| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
But do they have 8 arms each carrying a pebble? This came up in one game, the paladin was against a foe who was hovering 10 feet in the air or so, and the paladin didn't have a ranged weapon and nobody had a flight option (My groups a little bad at cooperation and tactics). So I suggested to the paladin "Well, your smite evil isn't actually based on a weapon. So honestly you could pick up a rock, throw it, and add your level to damage if you hit. Sure the base damage is like, 1, but it's more than 0 isn't it."
So I got the amusing image of a paladin just throwing rocks and harsh words at a demon.
The Paladin's ability to turn literally anything into a semi-practical fiend-slaying weapon is a cool trick often under appreciated. When your Paladin is rendered without weapons and beats down a fiend or other evil with just their gauntlets or sticks and stones it leaves a lasting impression on everyone who was involved.
Anyhow, the patreon seems fair enough to me. And yeah showing those is probably a touch unprofessional, though based on previous posts I figure we pay most part to the same games :p. Plus I don't care about such things but overall it might be a good decision.
Yeah well I figured that my RPG system is for pretty much anyone. My brother's first D&D experience was at the age of like...two, I think, and I've run lots of games for kids while I was babysitting and stuff. I figured having links to Malise and the Machine and Future Fragments would be inconsiderate to others. For everyone else there's Kimochi. :P
And yeah that sounds like it was a big issue. So how'd you fix the diversification at no penalty issue?
As we have it now, all characters begin the game with a "talent" and gain an additional 10 talents over the course of their 20 level career. Each class has one or two core talents which establish the basic abilities and/or resources of the class (for example, the core talent of barbarian is Rage). Spending a talent on a classes' core talent makes you a member of that class (so the freebie talent at 1st level allows you to pick up your first class).
Each class also has a number of talents that build off the class' theme or improve aspects of the class in some way. For example, the rogue will have talents that improve and/or modify sneak attack, barbarians can get a rage power progression and/or damage reduction, etc.
So a "single classed" character would be a paragon of their archetype, having invested all of their talents into talents from that class. For example, if you wanted to be "THE BARBARIAN" like I mentioned to Raital, at 20th level you might look something like...
The best rage providing +6 to hit/damage, +6 to saves, +80 temp HP, 10 rage powers, DR 10/-, a +3 dodge bonus to touch AC and Reflex that's doubled vs traps, +30 ft. movement speed, +15 ft. other speeds, uncanny dodge, the ability to spend rage rounds to recover your temporary HP each round, and anytime someone targets your Will defense with an ability that has multiple effects based on success you reduce the severity by 1 step (as an example, getting your saves crushed by an ability typically results in things such as longer durations, more severe effects, more damage, etc; so it's kind of like an Evasion ability for your mind).
Attaining all of this would require an investment of 100% of your class talents (and there's actually more that a barbarian can invest into so not all barbarians would be identical).
However, the player may decide to invest talents into a different class, effectively becoming multiclassed. This would allow the player to begin picking up class features from their new class. But since you've only got your first talent and the 10 others over the course of your career, every class feature you pick up from one class is a feature you aren't going to get from another. Since class features scale based on character level (albeit you often have to invest additional talents to get the best progressions) dipping other classes won't destroy you like it will in Pathfinder.
One could hypothetically pick up 11 classes over the course of their career, gaining the most basic features of each class, resulting in a weird doppelganger who did things like rage, sneak attack, bardic performance, wild shape, heal/smite stuff, have a familiar, a bloodline, a divine domain, etc. Albeit all of these would be the un-specialized versions of the basic features (for example, your rage would never advance to mighty or perfect rage and you'd never get rage powers, your bardic performances would be relatively minor buffs, your wild shape would be limited to small and medium animals, your sneak attack would only reach half as strong as rogue's, etc).
You might also find yourself a bit paralyzed as to where to spend your feats since some feats improve your class options (such as Extra Rage or Extra Performance).
The rules actually recommend that new players choose a single class to begin with and the class' recommended path (martial, magical, hybrid) and stick with it until they're more comfortable with the game, at which point they can start experimenting with more exotic builds.
My friend Raital is actually crazy excited about making a bard-rogue assassin-thingy that blenders enemies in close combat.
I'd be careful about resigning on the strength of an ongoing financial commitment to the project by other people. Make sure you've built in enough of a 'buffer' that if there's a sudden wave of people cancelling their pledges you've got enough funds to cover a period finding work again.
Yeah, I was considering that. It'd have to be at least pretty steady. Right now my dad, brother, and I are sharing the same house because it's more economical for both my dad and I to work and share the costs of maintaining our home and raising my brother. If I was to suddenly become unemployed we fortunately wouldn't end up in sudden destitution (but it would be tighter).
However, I cannot in good conscience quit my current job to focus entirely on writing an RPG game. It wouldn't be fair to put all the financial burdens on my dad and I think he would be very disappointed and not understand the reasoning behind quitting work to focus on "games".
If I could continue to contribute and have something tangible to demonstrate from my efforts, I think my dad would actually be more proud than disappointed and wouldn't be forced into carrying everyone on just his (IMHO already overworked) shoulders.
I'll be happy if I can generate some extra cash to commission art though. The $750-1500 milestones are probably pipe dreams. (^~^)
I'm a big fan of it, but there's an upside and a downside to crowdfunding.
Yeah I'm pretty cautious about it. I don't want to make any promises I can't keep and I don't want to ask a lot of money from people because the stuff doesn't grow on trees and every dollar that they earn is likely hard earned. It's one thing that makes the pledge levels really weird to try to set up because to me, $20 is a lot of money to be donating to someone every month for something that there's no concrete guarantee for.
In fact, my friend Aratrok thinks I need to work on the pledge levels / rewards because he thinks I'm offering too much for too little but I really want anyone who contributes to feel happy and satisfied. Y'know?
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My thoughts: I want to have an extra $1,500 a month so I can throw it at you.
(Instead, you may have to settle for a one-time donation).
Phew, that's a lot of money for one person. I'd feel super bad if anyone donated that much money as that's a really huge investment. You could start a business with that much spare cash lying around. ^~^"
One thing I think is really cool about Patreon though is the ant-effect (or Pikmin :D). Technically speaking if 1,000,000 people gave one person $1, that person would instantly be a millionaire (I don't expect that to happen of course but I'm just illustrating that small things in large quantities can be amazing).
Even if a hundred people are tossing $1 into the project every month, that should be enough to start commissioning some good art on a regular basis and I think that's an amazing concept.
Either way, are the 1/5/10/20 awards one-time or per month? It doesn't matter: I'm just curious.
At the moment each has the following note: "All rewards are available once unless specified otherwise. Further pledges at this level are for purely for satisfaction of support."
The $20 would also be limited to about 5-10 patrons so I don't get overwhelmed (it would be a bit self defeating to try to get more funding for D20 Legends only to spend all my time writing short stories and such for patrons :P), but I was thinking that I could possibly refresh it periodically when I was able to write some more.
Honestly, I'm actually hoping more for the pikmin effect. I can attest that dropping a couple of bucks each month isn't particularly painful to most people (that's usually not enough money to buy a drink or a candy bar) but with a bunch of people it could be amazing.