Players knowledge of success or failure(4 or less) with Disable Device(Trap)

[8FoldPath]

A few questions in regards to Disable Device:

Quote:

Check: When disarming a trap or other device, the Disable Device check is made secretly, so that you don't necessarily know whether you've succeeded.

So the GM would do the role for the PC?, the PC is not aware of the roll result and obviously not the traps DC.

Quote:

The DC depends on how tricky the device is. If the check succeeds, you disable the device. If it fails by 4 or less, you have failed but can try again. If you fail by 5 or more, something goes wrong. If the device is a trap, you trigger it. If you're attempting some sort of sabotage, you think the device is disabled, but it still works normally.

Following the train of thought the PC is unaware of success or failure, How does the PC know if they should try again or not? Obviously if the player fails by 5 or more the trap goes BOOM!! thats a rather good indication of failure. If successful or failing by 4 or less nothing will happen?

[Abraham spalding]

You probably realize it with a name like that but this is the same can of worms that is opened when you have an ability that says, "you can choose to reroll after your roll but before you know if you succeeded or not."

[Skeld]

I roll Disable checks for my players. In fact, I prefer to roll the dice for my players in many cases where the result of the roll would give them too much metagame knowledge (such as with Sense Motive and some Perception checks).

-Skeld

[Lifat]

I'd say that there is some kind of indication of success like there is with catastrophic failure (setting of the trap), so if nothing happens that would be an indication to try again.
Personally speaking I would never roll Disable Device checks for my players.

[phantom1592]

I like to know what I rolled but not the DC I'm aiming for. I don't see it as metagaming, if it's something that the CHARACTER would know too. In my opinion a person would know if he really screwed up. If you roll (for pretty much anything), you can tell when you did something wrong.

NOT just 'I tried my best but it wasn't good enough...' but REALLY screwed up. Dropped the lockpicks, refered to a man's wife as his mother, stubbed your foot and yelped... Something you just know you failed...

I noticed this just the other day bowling. Sometimes I waited and watched (and tried to telekintecally steer) the ball to the target... and JUUUUUST missed... Sometimes I knew from the moment it left my fingers that I missed.

[8FoldPath]

Thanks for your inputs guys, Phantom you both raise good points. However if its a horrible fail the trap will explode in your face.

I like your Idea Lifat, for example in the event the disarm was successful you say "The traps wires loose tension" or something to indicate its disabled. That seems to be the way to go.

I made a post about it here as well for those playing at home.

http://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/53039/players-knowledge-of-success-o r-failure4-or-less-with-disable-devicetrap

I tend to agree its mostly in the wording, in that only if you are attempting sabotage, you may think the device is disabled. Otherwise let the player know if it was successful or failed in some way or another.

[Abraham spalding]

FWIW:

James Jacobs has some thoughts about this in this thread.