In my Pathfinder setting, I've decided not to have divine magic. This is because it doesn't fit in with the way the deities act at all. I want to take those divine spells not directly related to religion and fold them into the arcane spell lists, and I'm looking for advice on what to keep besides Heal/Harm and Cure/Inflict.
I do have some relevant caveats. First off, I don't have the Conjuration (Healing) subschool. Everything that would be a part of it belongs to the Necromancy school. Secondly, undead are healed by Heal/Cure and harmed by Harm/Inflict. Healing magics stitch tissues together, the opposite magics rip it apart at the cellular level. Whether said tissues are dead or alive is irrelevant to this. There is no turning of undead. There is no positive or negative energy. I am retaining the Druid as a class concept, but with a lot of tweaking, though this tweaking is related more to the combat system than the magic system.
For those wondering, I do take a very scientific view of magic within this world, and I do plan to give martials things to compensate for Wizards getting another thing they can do.
Healing magics stitch tissues together, the opposite magics rip it apart at the molecular level.
Note that this should have consequence of healing/inflicting magic not working on incorporeal beings (no molecules), possibly not working on gaseous creatures (lack of complex molecular structures) and possibly not working on elementals (quite different molecules than those building organic tissue, different molecular structures). If healing/inflict magic would be rules to be versatile enough to work on elementals then it should also work on constructs which, from scientific point of view are much closer to elementals than elementals are to living beings (which is result of D&D/PF defining living beings according to magical criteria instead of biological ones).
I haven't thought about elementals, because I personally don't use planes or extraplanar creatures at my table. That's not to say they don't exist in my settings, I just don't put thought into them because it's not a flavor I'm particularly into. Ditto for gaseous creatures. Ghosts I love.
Up the top of my head, I'd be prone to say healing magic wouldn't work on any of these creatures. I would, however, not have a problem with the appropriate elemental damage type healing elementals. A walking pillar of fire being healed by a fireball seems to make sense if one is thinking in terms of D&D logic.
Another thought. For the purpose of Harm/Inflict, ripping something apart at the cellular level is not the same as disintegration. It rips it apart in the sense that it weakens the bonds enough for small ruptures to start appearing, not in the sense that every bond completely disappears. If you want to completely destroy these bonds, cast Disintegrate.
On this subject, I think that any construct made from body parts should reclassify as undead unless it is powered by technology rather than magic. After all, if a zombie cannot be differentiated from a flesh golem in the sense that a zombie is reanimated by negative energy and a flesh golem by other means, why should they have different types?
Another thought. For the purpose of Harm/Inflict, ripping something apart at the molecular level is not the same as disintegration. It rips it apart in the sense that it weakens the bonds enough for small ruptures to start appearing, not in the sense that every bond completely disappears. If you want to completely destroy these bonds, cast Disintegrate.
I think that such description would fit more with Transmutation-based healing/inflict. Necromantic healing I would see more working with metabolic processes and manipulating living organisms on cellular level.
Another thought. For the purpose of Harm/Inflict, ripping something apart at the molecular level is not the same as disintegration. It rips it apart in the sense that it weakens the bonds enough for small ruptures to start appearing, not in the sense that every bond completely disappears. If you want to completely destroy these bonds, cast Disintegrate.I think that such description would fit more with Transmutation-based healing/inflict. Necromantic healing I would see more working with metabolic processes and manipulating living organisms on cellular level.
Good point. I'll just refluff this into working with tissues at the cellular level instead of molecular level. Still doesn't work on gaseous or elemental creatures, because those cells are inorganic.
Does it have an SRD?
In my Pathfinder setting, I've decided not to have divine magic. This is because it doesn't fit in with the way the deities act at all.
You could also explore the "just another branch of arcane magic" approach, whereas cleric spells loose their "divine" moniker and become "arcane prime" spells, or whatever.
IIRC, they did something similar for AD&D Lankhmar setting (Fritz Leiber's Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser). White Mages (clerics) were "wizards" practicing a more "wholesome" type of magic (and therefore had more hit points, could cast in armour etc) while Black Mages (mages, renamed wizards in 3e) were casting from a more occult and "taxing" spellcasting tradition. The influence of gods was absent from both traditions.
In other words, I think it would be easy enough to re-fluff the cleric and strip them of their divine influence. Since you're keeping the druid as a class concept, you can do the same with cleric.
'findel
... Still doesn't work on gaseous or elemental creatures, because those cells are inorganic.
Who says elementals have cells? I like them better as animate avatars of their element held together by will and magic.
... Still doesn't work on gaseous or elemental creatures, because those cells are inorganic.Who says elementals have cells? I like them better as animate avatars of their element held together by will and magic.
Still wouldn't be effected by this healing magic.
In my Pathfinder setting, I've decided not to have divine magic. This is because it doesn't fit in with the way the deities act at all.You could also explore the "just another branch of arcane magic" approach, whereas cleric spells loose their "divine" moniker and become "arcane prime" spells, or whatever.
IIRC, they did something similar for AD&D Lankhmar setting (Fritz Leiber's Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser). White Mages (clerics) were "wizards" practicing a more "wholesome" type of magic (and therefore had more hit points, could cast in armour etc) while Black Mages (mages, renamed wizards in 3e) were casting from a more occult and "taxing" spellcasting tradition. The influence of gods was absent from both traditions.
In other words, I think it would be easy enough to re-fluff the cleric and strip them of their divine influence. Since you're keeping the druid as a class concept, you can do the same with cleric.
'findel
I think removal is a better option for me than refluffing. I'd rather Wizards be able to choose to learn whatever group of spells fits their character concept than having a class for the "White concept" and a class for the "Black concept". That, and the Witch has a monopoly on the magical traditionalist concept.
I decided to use a Witch archetype to represent the Druid class concept, since my main worry was that the dominance of ranged combat in my setting makes Wild Shape and Summon Animal impractical as fighting methods. Rather than think up a whole new class, I just need to think of a class feature to replace the Hex. The best part is that my ideas for Druid fluff match what I see Witches as being all about fairly well.
Out of curiousity, why replace Hex?
Only part of the class that doesn't seem to scream Druidlike to me.
Kind of off topic but a cool way to think of your type of magic, could be similar to how Dr Manhattan's powers work in Watchman. If you are unfamilar with it, he manipulates matter at the quantum level. There's lot of cool things you could do if you don't want to go super 'sciency' with it. Such as an inflict spell bursting the cell wall (there are a number of ways that could be done), or the magic cancels the electromagnetic bonds that hold the atoms/molecules together.
That would be a good way to get around the whole elemental healing situation, although I cant thing how it would work for fire. But a water elemental it would work on. Just because its not made of cells it still made of up oxygen and hydrogen bonded together, if you break the bonds holding them together.
Like Drejk said if you want to thing of necromancy as manipulating biology on a cellular level, you could recreate a number of effects similar to spells that would be quasi scientific.
Really depends on how core the whole magic is essentially just people manipulating particles.
Kind of off topic but a cool way to think of your type of magic, could be similar to how Dr Manhattan's powers work in Watchman. If you are unfamilar with it, he manipulates matter at the quantum level. There's lot of cool things you could do if you don't want to go super 'sciency' with it. Such as an inflict spell bursting the cell wall (there are a number of ways that could be done), or the magic cancels the electromagnetic bonds that hold the atoms/molecules together.
It seems to me to be exact difference between Kelsey's inflict and disintegration spell.
I think removal is a better option for me than refluffing. I'd rather Wizards be able to choose to learn whatever group of spells fits their character concept than having a class for the "White concept" and a class for the "Black concept". That, and the Witch has a monopoly on the magical traditionalist concept.In my Pathfinder setting, I've decided not to have divine magic. This is because it doesn't fit in with the way the deities act at all.You could also explore the "just another branch of arcane magic" approach, whereas cleric spells loose their "divine" moniker and become "arcane prime" spells, or whatever.
Black magic vs white magic was only an example as to how to arcane tradition could exist side by side, but in no mean mandatory.
That being said, removal of the class makes sense since you're also removing channeling and turning undead (which are main features of the cleric "chassis", whatever the fluff).