Wild-Shaping Eidolon


Rules Questions


What would happen if a Level 1 Synthesist Summoner/Level 10 Druid tried to wild-shape while the Eidolon was wrapped around his body?

Would he change size, but keep the Eidolon's base physical stats (modified by the Wild Shape)?

Would he keep the Natural Armor of the Eidolon?

Dark Archive

Depends on what he changed into, but follow this basic guide. First, is the Eidolon still his size or larger, so he can fit in it? If the answer is no, either the wild shape fails to activate, or the eidolon is dismissed, as it no longer fits around the character.

Fused Eidolon:
Fused Eidolon, Ultimate Magic page 80 wrote:

A synthesist summons the essence of a powerful outsider to meld with his own being. The synthesist wears the eidolon like translucent, living armor. The eidolon mimics all of the synthesist’s movements, and the synthesist perceives through the eidolon’s senses and speaks through its voice, as the two are now one creature.

While fused with his eidolon, the synthesist uses the eidolon’s physical ability scores (Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution), but retains his own mental ability scores (Intelligence, Wisdom, and Charisma). The synthesist gains the eidolon’s hit points as temporary hit points. When these hit points reach 0, the eidolon is killed and sent back to its home plane. The synthesist uses the eidolon’s base attack bonus, and gains the eidolon’s armor and natural armor bonuses and modifiers to ability scores. The synthesist also gains access to the eidolon’s special abilities and the eidolon’s evolutions. The synthesist is still limited to the eidolon’s maximum number of natural attacks. The eidolon has no skills or feats of its own. The eidolon must be at least the same size as the synthesist. The eidolon must have limbs for the synthesist to cast spells with somatic components. The eidolon’s temporary hit points can be restored with the rejuvenate eidolon spell.

While fused, the synthesist loses the benefits of his armor. He counts as both his original type and as an outsider for any effect related to type, whichever is worse for the synthesist. Spells such as banishment or dismissal work normally on the eidolon, but the synthesist is unaffected. Neither the synthesist nor his eidolon can be targeted separately, as they are fused into one creature. The synthesist and eidolon cannot take separate actions. While fused with his eidolon, the synthesist can use all of his own abilities and gear, except for his armor. In all other cases, this ability functions as the summoner’s normal eidolon ability (for example, the synthesist cannot use his summon monster ability while the eidolon is present).

This ability replaces the class’s eidolon ability, bond senses, and life bond.

The following class abilities function differently for synthesist summoners.

Do you still have limbs with which you can cast spells with? If no, the eidolon is dismissed.

Providing that you are both the same size or smaller than your eidolon at this point, and you still have limbs to cast spells, you can now move on to the rest of your question. While you are fused with your eidolon, your physical stats are the same as its physical stats. Even if yours are better when you're in wild shape. As far as the natural armor bonus is concerned, they don't stack. It isn't armor being worn, and therefore your wild shape armor isn't "turned off" by the eidolon. Take the higher of the natural armor bonuses.


Hm. I see.

Though, I would disagree about the part with arms. That's only if you want to be able to cast spells with somatic components while morphed.

But I do agree about the stats. The Wild Shape changes your own stats, but not the Eidolon's, I would think.

At first, I was thinking "Since you are both considered one entity, the Eidolon gets the benifits of the stats boost, too."

But I was wanting to Wild Shape the Eidolon into a Large/Huge form, and that appears like it just won't work.

Dark Archive

If you are wild shaping anyway, you're probably going to pick up Natural Spell, so it shouldn't really mater. But looking through some of the forums, this thread seems to jive with the idea that you don't need arms, just need them for somatic components of certain spells. I yield to the point that you don't need them.

Scarab Sages

Nanomd wrote:
Depends on what he changed into, but follow this basic guide. First, is the Eidolon still his size or larger, so he can fit in it? If the answer is no, either the wild shape fails to activate, or the eidolon is dismissed, as it no longer fits around the character.

This is a questionable answer at best. As the summoner and eidolon are one being, the eidolon itself would be affected by the wild shape.

Quote:
Do you still have limbs with which you can cast spells with? If no, the eidolon is dismissed.

Incorrect, there is no requirement either the summon or the eidolon have arms. There is a requirement that the eidolon has arms if the summoner wants to cast spells. A druid/summoner with Natural Spell would bypass this limitation

Quote:
Providing that you are both the same size or smaller than your eidolon at this point, and you still have limbs to cast spells, you can now move on to the rest of your question. While you are fused with your eidolon, your physical stats are the same as its physical stats. Even if yours are better when you're in wild shape. As far as the natural armor bonus is concerned, they don't stack. It isn't armor being worn, and therefore your wild shape armor isn't "turned off" by the eidolon. Take the higher of the natural armor bonuses..

Given that the eidolon's size will change to match the form you wildshape into and the fact that there is no "arms" requirement anywhere in the summoner or synthesist descriptions, I see no reason this cannot work.

The disadvantage is that the eidolon will loose access to all EX and SU abilities not granted by the new form.

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