If you hand wave away ethnic, species, class, religious, caste, gender, tensions, you end up with the very safe and boring McHappy Monoculture... Where your fantasy world looks like a bad Ren Fair.
You don't have to deal with these themes every game and you use it as a highlighter rather than a sledge hammer.
I like having all the spices of the really world in my fantasy world - it gives extra dimension, it gives hooks, and challenges, things to strive against, stuff to win in spite of.
As for Drow in my world they are monsters, they are the KKK and Taliban of the Elven world. They are baby sacrificing demon worshipers... Yes there is a good chance they will get killed on sight.... If a PC is playing one I let up a little but I don't make it a cake walk.
And if you go for the ultra-realistic grim and gritty medieval simulation, you end up with a world where anyone born into the wrong class or sex (which is almost everyone) is pretty much screwed. Joy. That's a lot of fun.
Play how you want. There are lots of examples in fantasy literature of everything from one end of the spectrum to another. Neither are inherently better than the others. Obviously there needs to be conflict, but it doesn't have to be race or sex based. It can be pure evil demons invading the perfect world. Or race-linked street gangs fighting each other for scraps. There are good stories to be had either way.
Like I said before highlighter not sledge hammer.
Grey is an infinite amount of shades from off white to coal black - you adjust your shades of grey to suit your table. You have multiple shades for multiple topics, not a single shade for the whole game.
Problem here is most people are stuck in a black white and middle mindset and that they have to choose one.
I like slightly off white. As in, yeah its a lawful good country, and it has a small, entrenched seedy underbelly. It was made by a major act of betrayal, a sort of Kristallnacht, and while it means well, and they are a friendly and jovial culture in the interior, its neighbours, especially the monster neighbours, really do not trust it or its faiths.
Thus I made a LG theocracy with ancient Dwarven roots (although there are no Dwarves left here anymore).
RACISM! Because....REASONS!If it works why care? Racism/sexism can get pretty cliché anyways.Yeah, racism being the be all and end all to a character is pretty dull.
There are plenty of reasons for a character to be racist, but racism shouldn't be the sole arbiter of what reason is for that character.
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There are plenty of reasons for a character to be racist, but racism shouldn't be the sole arbiter of what reason is for that character.
You didn't read that in the right voice.
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Relevant:
While we're on the topic of in-universe prejudices and old cliches like the haughty, aloof elves, I'd like to say that modern-day social justice warriors in both their positive and negative extremes (read: tumblr) informed my depiction of elves in recent games, and it was a result that my players liked so much that I'm going to be hard-pressed to play the "elves are haughty" trope in the traditional, overt manner ever again.
Essentially, I've been having elves not check their privilege. I don't mean that in the sort of all-purpose social bludgeoning weapon sense that "check your privilege" has come to mean on the internet, but rather in the original intent of little fallacies in cultural and racial upbringing that can lead to some pretty serious disconnects when not consciously acknowledged.
For instance, I had the Lawful Good elven paladin of Erastil NPC tell the half-elf player character to give up her elven duel, because it wasn't as important to her as it was to the elf on the other end. This was an absolutely well-meaning intent, because he just didn't want the half-elf to get hurt, but the subtext was that the elven duel was more the "purview" of her fullblooded adversary, that she was somehow less deserving of either the rewards or consequences of her actions.
Similarly, both the Paladin and the villainous elf at the other end of the duel apologized to the party for the collateral damage of the duel--by addressing the elf in the party. The intent was to apologize to everyone, but in both cases they chose to communicate this sentiment to the most racially/culturally familiar of the group.
Another frequent topic of contention involving the duel was the friendly sentiment by multiple elves that "you can work this out over time rather than doing anything rash, you have your whole life to fix things;" an option that, in the time scale that they were referring to, would have only been feasible to the elf or the gnome (depending on whether or not she gets bored) in the party, not the half-elf or the dwarf, and certainly not the half-orc, who will likely die in his sixties or seventies. None of the elves in question consciously thought about this.
Outside of the duel, I had the elven priestess of Calistria openly refer to the half-orc sorcerer as "exotic," without any consideration of the racial commentary she was making, despite the fact that the half-orc identifies not as an orc but as ethnically Chelaxian, the closest thing the Inner Sea has to a "white-bread" setting.
One angle that the party played up on a villainous social encounter with an elf was that the villain was an adulterer, and the villain's father was a disapproving social conservative. However, I left it extremely unclear whether the father disapproved of extramarital dalliances, or of extramarital dalliances with humans, as was the case with this particular NPC. Certainly what the villain was doing was wrong, regardless, but I tantalized the players just a little bit with the prospect that the values were just slightly...off.
The final keystroke that had my players wincing was when a powerful elven patron gave everyone lavish rewards for a quest. All of them were wondrous items with additional art value, but it was only when the players looked at the item entries that the discrepancy became obvious: the half-elf, half-orc, dwarf, and gnome had all received gifts worth 6,000 gp, while the elf was holding a gift worth 8,000. They were all magnificent, personalized rewards, which left no real room to complain, but despite the beautiful gifts, the whole exchange left a bitter aftertaste.
Whereas I've always been a little bit bored with the comparatively traditional portrayals of elves, dwarves, and halflings in Golarion (especially compared to those wacky gnomes), I felt that this approach really drove in to my players the cultural and racial disconnect between themselves and the elves, and allowed them to acknowledge that even the most well-intentioned can be racist without realizing it. Watching the players alternately call out or forgive elven NPCs depending on their transgressions has been very interesting for me.
I read all of that, and liked it, even if it was one mega grey quote.
Relevant:
...While we're on the topic of in-universe prejudices and old cliches like the haughty, aloof elves, I'd like to say that modern-day social justice warriors in both their positive and negative extremes (read: tumblr) informed my depiction of elves in recent games, and it was a result that my players liked so much that I'm going to be hard-pressed to play the "elves are haughty" trope in the traditional, overt manner ever again.
Essentially, I've been having elves not check their privilege. I don't mean that in the sort of all-purpose social bludgeoning weapon sense that "check your privilege" has come to mean on the internet, but rather in the original intent of little fallacies in cultural and racial upbringing that can lead to some pretty serious disconnects when not consciously acknowledged.
For instance, I had the Lawful Good elven paladin of Erastil NPC tell the half-elf player character to give up her elven duel, because it wasn't as important to her as it was to the elf on the other end. This was an absolutely well-meaning intent, because he just didn't want the half-elf to get hurt, but the subtext was that the elven duel was more the "purview" of her fullblooded adversary, that she was somehow less deserving of either the rewards or consequences of her actions.
Similarly, both the Paladin and the villainous elf at the other end of the duel apologized to the party for the collateral damage of the duel--by addressing the elf in the party. The intent was to apologize to everyone, but in both cases they chose to communicate this sentiment to the most racially/culturally familiar of the group.
Another frequent topic of contention involving the duel was the friendly sentiment by multiple elves that "you can work this out over time rather than doing anything rash, you have your whole life to fix things;" an option that, in the time scale that they were referring to, would have only been feasible to the elf or the gnome (depending on whether or not she gets
Yeah, second darkness was great for those moments. And our dm was an elf lover! My cavalier was disappointed by their arrogance, stupidity and racism over and over, the cav was hardly a social progressive lol.
My next character, I want to have a char really fixated on honour and the honour of his companions. Probably a samurai, could be just great for certain adventure paths like Jade Regent.
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for Toz.
Ok here are some of the levels of ethnic tensions, I use in my game:
Varisia is perfect example for ethnic tension....
Maybe once in 5 sessions I might have a Cheliaxian descended shop owner watch a Varisian traveler like a hawk, and outright refuse service to a Shoanti. Or the party see a group of Shoanti heavys kick the crap out of a Cheliaxian settler for looking at them wrong. Or some drunk stagger out of an inn and call a PC a filthy what ever.
I don't do it all the time I don't make it a focus I use it to highlight the fact that the party is not in Cloud Cuckoo Land *.
* Aristophanes reference for the classicists playing along.
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Shoanti are also an interesting crew in Magnimar.
for Toz.
Ok here are some of the levels of ethnic tensions, I use in my game:
Varisia is perfect example for ethnic tension....
Maybe once in 5 sessions I might have a Cheliaxian descended shop owner watch a Varisian traveler like a hawk, and outright refuse service to a Shoanti. Or the party see a group of Shoanti heavys kick the crap out of a Cheliaxian settler for looking at them wrong. Or some drunk stagger out of an inn and call a PC a filthy what ever.
I don't do it all the time I don't make it a focus I use it to highlight the fact that the party is not in Cloud Cuckoo Land *.
* Aristophanes reference for the classicists playing along.
Slumming it with Aristophanes? Where is your Plutarch?
Good points though. :D
for Toz.It's cause I forgot my smilies again, isn't it?
I think of you as all sunshine and smiles dude ;-)
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If only people actually spoke about the other levels instead of propagating the OFF/11 dichotomy...Especially since the very people bemoaning the lack of that gray now were pushing that dichotomy pretty damn hard for the past few pages.
Personal stance on racial tensions: They should be present, but they shouldn't result in unavoidable "no win" situations. I've complained before about worlds staying static regardless of what the players do.
@Ellis Mirari: Personally I'd have no problem with CG drow rebels either. Not everyone sees a race/alignment combo and immediately goes "omg clone"! I'd prefer to see what they've actually got first. :)
This exactly.
One of the greatest disappointments I had playing was under a GM who was determined to slam home the settings default prejudices. I was playing a 1/2 orc who was raised in the barbarian lands. But everyone regardless of where they were from treated me like dirt. Even after I single handedly saved a farm family from a murderous monster I couldn't even get a kind word. Visiting shops was a foolhardy waste of coin because I was charged a small fortune for even the lowest junk... The GM made it clear I could never change the attitudes and that no where would ever accept me. When I tried to retire and switch to an elf since all elves in his human setting were treated as visiting royalty, he said no. So I stopped showing up to that game.
See, with me, it's more like those shunned (in my case, hobgoblins and outsider types) races need to conceal their nature with disguise checks (easily passed when dealing with common folk, not so much with people in cities) or be generally mistrusted by people until their respect is earned.
A good example is this one NPC I have running an alchemy shop in a small town outside them ajor adventure hub city. Because a lot of travellers pop in, he has his assistant run the storefront and, when he comes out, has to wear headwraps, but the locals trust him because he has saved their lives with his expertise on many occasions. So far no ones chosen to play a hobgoblin (only running with this settings for a year now) but it would work out the same way.
The point of having racial prejudice in a tabletop narrative is to see people rise above, in my opinion. We don't play games to see our heroes fail to defeat the BBEG, similarly we don't play characters that have a racial prejudice against them to see their efforts at improving their lot completely fruitless.
It happened pretty organically. I was using a Necromancer Games module, The Vault of Larin Karr for its setting, Quail Valley, and the PCs ran into two evil halflings--Devlo, a death priest, and Harry Jack, an evil rogue. On top of that, my drunken anarcho-syndicalist player was, um, playing a halfling warrior named Tramora III who had his memory erased by pixies and fell under the sway of the CE Scarred Lands god, Vangal.
Woops, my bad, the Scarred Lands version was Tramora II.
Tramora I ruined a homebrew campaign based on the Nyambe: African Adventures book, Tramora II ruined the Scarred Lands campaign and Tramora III Peasantsbane ruined the Carrion Crown campaign.
For Rise of the Runeplutocrats, he's made a halfling rogue. Hopefully, he won't be named Tramora IV.
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Ironically, a non-evil drow/tiefling/goblin/etc. is much less "cliche" than the evil ones, yet the former was the star of a popular novel series and is thus unusable by anyone anymore.Not only that, but the depiction of goblins as evil is racist to begin with. I mean, who the hell are you pinkskins to judge?!?
In other news, not only are good drow wicked cliche, but drow are wicked cliche. They're so boring I've only ever used them once, and that was in the Scarred Lands where they were different. They were LE.
Tieflings? Pfft. Lame.
Down with Paizo!
Vive le Galt!
A bit off topic, but I've always hated the Forgotten Realms Drow as a very intricate, powerful society . . . consisting entirely of stab-happy for the evulz CE psychopaths.
Now, I'm not super familiar with Golarion Drow (other than the whole good elves turning drow when they become evil enough, which bothers me in its own way) but the idea of a bunch of chronic needlessly malicious murderers building a powerful underworld society that rivaled even the most powerful human settlements just bothered me. Every other mundane CE evil 'society' is barely held together under strong leadership or external threat and then disbands or implodes on itself due to the nature of chaotic evil. THAT makes sense. What doesn't make sense is a delicate power scheme in impressive underground labyrinths featuring powerful magic. That screams Lawful Evil and Drow should, over all, be Lawful Evil.
I also agree Tieflings are lame, but I do have to admit that's partially a personal prejudice in that I've never seen one played well. As a race, the are apparently very attractive to angry teenage boys and men who never grew out of being angry teenage boys because that's about the only way I've encountered them.
A bit off topic, but I've always hated the Forgotten Realms Drow as a very intricate, powerful society . . . consisting entirely of stab-happy for the evulz CE psychopaths.
Now, I'm not super familiar with Golarion Drow (other than the whole good elves turning drow when they become evil enough, which bothers me in its own way) but the idea of a bunch of chronic needlessly malicious murderers building a powerful underworld society that rivaled even the most powerful human settlements just bothered me. Every other mundane CE evil 'society' is barely held together under strong leadership or external threat and then disbands or implodes on itself due to the nature of chaotic evil. THAT makes sense. What doesn't make sense is a delicate power scheme in impressive underground labyrinths featuring powerful magic. That screams Lawful Evil and Drow should, over all, be Lawful Evil.
Scarred Lands dark elves are also different because instead of worshipping a Spider Goddess, they worship a god who lives among them on the Prime Material Plane and is trapped in the body of a giant golem.
Here is a little write-up.
I don't recall if it was you or somebody else who mentioned "how come you never see a good duergar," but I kind of chuckled, because the one time I did use dark elves in Quail Valley, I was using the WOTC module, Forges of Fury and it was to replace duergar.
In the Scarred Lands, dark dwarves are also different and it didn't make sense to use them.
Every other mundane CE evil 'society' is barely held together under strong leadership or external threat and then disbands or implodes on itself due to the nature of chaotic evil.
Its held together by a crazed spider goddess with evil mandates, exist partially manipulated by Illithid, their neighbors are the other deep races who also happen to be evil a good amount of the time(snirvgiblin and druergar and a few others), the underdark is made of external threats, they do suffer infighting all the time for both sport, pleasure, politics, religion, and lifestyle. If I remember correctly one of the leading causes of drow death is drow so they aren't exactly being lawful good about things. Does that fit your criteria? I should also note chaotic evil doesn't mean the society has to abort all forms of civilization.
There is also a good drow goddess in the forgotten realms setting named Eilistraee who happens to be chaotic good and all about drow freeing themselves from the matriarchal chaotic evil settlements of the underdark. They aren't all evil, and Drizzt isn't the only good one. If I remember correctly she's never mentioned in any of the Drizzt novels too for some odd reason, but I haven't read any of those in forever.
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it seems like it happens a lot in RPGs where people decide that their character should be a racist misogynistic d-bag, and then use the "but its in my backstory" card when i ask them about it
why does every Barbarian or other fringe type PC have to be like that?
i'm all for coming up with compelling backstories, it makes my job easier. racism and misogyny is not compelling, its just offensive and tends to put gamers in a bad mood when the Barbarian wont listen to the wizard PC because "she's a southern wench"my question is, is this a recurring problem with gamers as a whole or just in the midwest?
do gamers use their characters to act out their deep down racism and sexism, cause it kinda seems that way from my seat.and thats really, really disappointing because in my youth it seemed that gamers were a more liberal forward thinking bunch then the general populace.
do woman gamers run into this a lot, does it turn them off from gaming?
how as a GM do you deal with this?
You have two choices.
1. Let them run their characters as written.
2. stop the game and start a new one with a new group. OR . . .
3. You could always ask them why.
The Scarred Lands were way better than any other D&D campaign setting ever published.
Except, maybe, Golarion.
Everywhere else? Pfft.
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Dark Sun.
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Vangal the Reaver shiznits all over Dark Sun.
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The Forgotten Realms never inspired me much, it seemed to me at the time a bit meh.
I liked Mystara and Greyhawk, had a bucket load of fun with Darksun... But by then I was playing RoleMaster, GURPS, Robotech, TMNT , Rifts, WoD and Shadowrun.... So it wasn't until 3.5 I came back to D&D.
RoleMaster and Shadowrun remain my favourite systems.
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I never played Dark Sun, I'm just a recovering Scarred Lands fanatic.
I haven't played in a lot of worlds, really, just memories of reading old Dragon issues and old, bad TSR novels.
:(
If only people actually spoke about the other levels instead of propagating the OFF/11 dichotomy...Especially since the very people bemoaning the lack of that gray now were pushing that dichotomy pretty damn hard for the past few pages.
Personal stance on racial tensions: They should be present, but they shouldn't result in unavoidable "no win" situations. I've complained before about worlds staying static regardless of what the players do.
@Ellis Mirari: Personally I'd have no problem with CG drow rebels either. Not everyone sees a race/alignment combo and immediately goes "omg clone"! I'd prefer to see what they've actually got first. :)
This exactly.
One of the greatest disappointments I had playing was under a GM who was determined to slam home the settings default prejudices. I was playing a 1/2 orc who was raised in the barbarian lands. But everyone regardless of where they were from treated me like dirt. Even after I single handedly saved a farm family from a murderous monster I couldn't even get a kind word. Visiting shops was a foolhardy waste of coin because I was charged a small fortune for even the lowest junk... The GM made it clear I could never change the attitudes and that no where would ever accept me. When I tried to retire and switch to an elf since all elves in his human setting were treated as visiting royalty, he said no. So I stopped showing up to that game.
That is just ridiculous. Was everyone a snooty city dweller? Was there no guild of warriors, mercs, rangers or barbs to chill out with?
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That is just ridiculous. Was everyone a snooty city dweller? Was there no guild of warriors, mercs, rangers or barbs to chill out with?
No his setting didn't have guilds. Warrior types tended to treat me as an enemy of the state and watch my every move in case I decided to be violent against the commoners who were abusing me. The cities were however the only places that would let me past the gates. Rural encampments would attack or lock me in prison on sight. I also appeared to be the only half orc in existence. Or they were so rare I never found another.
Gaming should be fun... this wasn't. Maybe if after I had helped save the city twice they might have warmed up a little... nope. GM said "Racial stereotypes are built into the game as punishment for playing that race and can't be changed."
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That is just ridiculous. Was everyone a snooty city dweller? Was there no guild of warriors, mercs, rangers or barbs to chill out with?No his setting didn't have guilds. Warrior types tended to treat me as an enemy of the state and watch my every move in case I decided to be violent against the commoners who were abusing me. The cities were however the only places that would let me past the gates. Rural encampments would attack or lock me in prison on sight. I also appeared to be the only half orc in existence. Or they were so rare I never found another.
Gaming should be fun... this wasn't. Maybe if after I had helped save the city twice they might have warmed up a little... nope. GM said "Racial stereotypes are built into the game as punishment for playing at my table and won't be changed."
FIFY :P
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As far as being stuck playing this and unable to retire. The GM allowed us free raise deads at the temple. So death was not an option. Well maybe if a TPK could have happened, but unlikely since the monsters would run away if they had TOO much of an upper hand. Only to reappear later in weaker numbers. Also the GM didn't want anyone switching characters because we would ruin the story. And there was an elaborate story, my misery was apparently not relevant to that story.
As far as being stuck playing this and unable to retire. The GM allowed us free raise deads at the temple. So death was not an option. Well maybe if a TPK could have happened, but unlikely since the monsters would run away if they had TOO much of an upper hand. Only to reappear later in weaker numbers. Also the GM didn't want anyone switching characters because we would ruin the story. And there was an elaborate story, my misery was apparently not relevant to that story.
seriously? I have pulled deus ex machinae (dei ex machina?) to avoid TPKs before, but just having the monsters flee when they are doing too well? Do all your sessions happen on opposite day?
This GM was not so enlightened Hitdice.
seriously? I have pulled deus ex machinae (dei ex machina?) to avoid TPKs before, but just having the monsters flee when they are doing too well? Do all your sessions happen on opposite day?As far as being stuck playing this and unable to retire. The GM allowed us free raise deads at the temple. So death was not an option. Well maybe if a TPK could have happened, but unlikely since the monsters would run away if they had TOO much of an upper hand. Only to reappear later in weaker numbers. Also the GM didn't want anyone switching characters because we would ruin the story. And there was an elaborate story, my misery was apparently not relevant to that story.
I am not sure what you mean by the bolded part? Yes seriously... though it only happened once, probably because he failed to balance the encounter to adjust for the wasting curse an ancient dragon decided to inflict on me. Not that the curse really concerned me since death ends curses and I was frequently killed. Keep in mind this was 3.0e D&D and many thought playing a 1/2 Orc was blatant power gaming because they had a +2 to Strength.
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The Scarred Lands were way better than any other D&D campaign setting ever published.
Definitely. Every D&D setting should have an in-setting explanation for half-naked sorceresses.
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RACISM! Because....REASONS!If it works why care? Racism/sexism can get pretty cliché anyways.Yeah, racism being the be all and end all to a character is pretty dull.
TOZ, I only have ONE question for you....
EXPLOSIONS?
The Scarred Lands were way better than any other D&D campaign setting ever published.
Except, maybe, Golarion.
Everywhere else? Pfft.
I have a soft spot for the Scarred Lands setting. It was the first setting I ever played 3e in, and was the start our our main, 8 years-ran group(now defunct, split into smaller groups). Good times. One of my favorite characters was a Wood Elf from the Hornsaw forest... Yeah...
On topic, I think adding elements of racism and general xenophobia can add a lot of flavor and tension to a game, but can easily be overkill. It really depends on the kind of game being run at the time. PC's needing information or help from xenophobic backwoods settlers, for example, could have a lot of room for role-playing out these tensions, and help develop the PC's characters, since in situations like that, simply "hacking and slashing/looting corpses" won't solve the problem.
If I only have a couple of hours to run a module(and character creation), and the module itself doesn't touch on racism or class warfare, then I'm probably leaving those elements out for the evening, and just focusing on the adventure at hand.
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Never played in any other setting except FR while i played D&D. Was involved in a short lived planescape game though. But we've experienced nothing special because the GM sucked.
We played a bunch of different settings during 3.5's heyday. Each of us that became DM's, wound up running a different setting; I ran Ravenloft, another friend ran Scarred Lands, another did Dragonlance, later switching up to Eberron. There was plenty of plane-hopping in between as well, so we spent a considerable amount of time in Sigil, the Astral Plane, Acheron, etc.
But, ever since everyone moved on to Pathfinder, everyone just plays Golarion now. Sure, the "all under one roof" buffet of Golarion is okay, but I miss the traveling, and different flavors of different settings. Blah. Same old setting gets bland after a while(I wasn't a big fan of Golarion in the first place).
It does, fortunately, Golly has plenty of good pockets even if the coat can get a bit bland.
The best setting was Eberron in my opinion. The very place felt dynamic it had deep layers of history and a sense of a setting moving forward things done here matter.
The best setting was Eberron in my opinion. The very place felt dynamic it had deep layers of history and a sense of a setting moving forward things done here matter.
Eberron was interesting, but didn't really scratch my "medieval fantasy" itch. It felt too modern; lightning rails(trains), airships, Warforged, etc. Almost Steampunk, without the branding. Not a bad thing at all, just wasn't what I was looking for at the time. I bet PF's Gunslinger and Alchemist classes would fit right in, now that I think about it.
We had a lot of Warforged players in our Eberron games, and the DM worked in the "fish out of water" angle really good. The common folk were slightly afraid of the former killbots-turned-civilians, but it played out well, i think.
The best setting was Eberron in my opinion. The very place felt dynamic it had deep layers of history and a sense of a setting moving forward things done here matter.
Eberron was interesting, but didn't really scratch my "medieval fantasy" itch. It felt too modern; lightning rails(trains), airships, Warforged, etc. Almost Steampunk, without the branding. Not a bad thing at all, just wasn't what I was looking for at the time. I bet PF's Gunslinger and Alchemist classes would fit right in, now that I think about it.
We had a lot of Warforged players in our Eberron games, and the DM worked in the "fish out of water" angle really good. The common folk were slightly afraid of the former killbots-turned-civilians, but it played out well, i think.
Warforged was always a race I found interesting. I'm thinking about twisting them up with dwarves in my setting to give all 31 original flavors some home.
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One more reason I love the Shoanti. Gender-equal barbarians all up in that piece.
Same reason I love real world Vikings, rape was punishable by death yo!
Did that include rape while out raiding? Did it include non-Vikings brought back as prisoners or slaves? Did it include thralls or other low-status women?
Or was it just protection for the upper class women? Still better than many cultures, of course.
Eberron was interesting, but didn't really scratch my "medieval fantasy" itch. It felt too modern; lightning rails(trains), airships, Warforged, etc. Almost Steampunk, without the branding. Not a bad thing at all, just wasn't what I was looking for at the time. I bet PF's Gunslinger and Alchemist classes would fit right in, now that I think about it.
We had a lot of Warforged players in our Eberron games, and the DM worked in the "fish out of water" angle really good. The common folk were slightly afraid of the former killbots-turned-civilians, but it played out well, i think.
I read the first campaign setting book for that, and enjoyed it quite a bit, but never got to play there. :(
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Good Viking rape book, if, um, you like those kinds of things:
The Demon of Scattery by Poul Anderson and Mildred Downey Broxon