Goblin Squad Member
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Since I have been a very vocal advocate of both Non-Unique Names, Anonymity, and Disguises, I wanted to try to clearly describe my own ideas about how these systems should actually work.
First, I am acutely aware that this request entails significant design and development resources, and that a rational cost-benefit analysis may well determine one or more of them simply aren't worthwhile. I might even find myself voting against them depending on what they're up against in a Crowdforging Poll. I am not suggesting that these systems are necessary. Rather, I am trying to illustrate that they are feasible and desirable.
True Identity - It is a trivial matter for the True Identity of any Character to be known by the system. True Identity could be stored as a GUID.
Expressed Identity - The Player should have the option to select an Expressed Identity, that is the Identity they are expressing to the rest of the game. This might be their True Identity, or it might be an Alias. Each Alias should have a separate GUID.
Observed Identity - Each Observer of a particular character should have a separate GUID to reference that other character. This necessary in order to avoid storing that other character's actual GUIDs in local system log files. Otherwise, players would extract those GUIDs from the log files and build up a database outside of the game.
Sample GUIDs:
Nihimon's True Identity {77F7FB0C-4E73-46EB-A312-3B0B9D67D94C}
Nihimon as Sairin {DA7880B6-E6FA-49CE-B8FE-0751A5BB5A5F}
Nihimon as Observed by Khimber {FA2F02A8-46BA-4C0D-989D-67F0CF60FA98}
Sairin as Observed by Khimber {6A55AEE6-8CA9-45E5-93C2-15025DA1980E}
Nihimon as Observed by Fuinnaith {9F1D4D26-3980-46A3-B1BC-59049FB95206}
Sairin as Observed by Fuinnaith {4337EC37-D28F-4272-8A96-6D4D0A432C8B}
Familiarity & Recognition - There should be a Familiarity score for each Observed GUID. For example, if Khimber knows Nihimon, but has never interacted with Nihimon as Sairin, then Khimber should have a high Familiarity score with Nihimon, and a low one with Sairin. However, if Khimber encounters Sairin, his Familiarity with Nihimon should allow him to Recognize Nihimon, and include Sairin as a known Alias.
Disguises - Disguises, and related skills, should be necessary to reduce the chance of being Recognized by a character who has Familiarity with an alternate Identity. For example, if Nihimon has a good Sairin Disguise and appropriate skills, then Khimber's chance to Recognize Nihimon when he interacts with Sairin should be reduced. Naturally, there should be counter skills that Khimber could train to increase his ability to Recognize characters using Disguises.
Identification - When I Recognize another Character, I should see the name of the Identity by which I Recognize them. If that Character has multiple Known Aliases, I should be able to choose which is displayed. Whether or not this name appears in a Floaty Name Tag over that character's head should be entirely up to me on my end.
Nicknames - I should be able to assign a Nickname to any Observed Identity. For example, Khimber should be able to assign separate Nicknames to Nihimon and to Nihimon-as-Sairin, even if the knows they're the same character. This might help Khimber avoid calling him "Nihimon" when they are together and Nihimon is in Disguise as Sairin.
Broadcasting Identity vs. Anonymity - Players should be able to choose whether they want to Broadcast their Identity (True or Expressed Alias), or remain Anonymous. It should be possible to be Expressing an Alias at the same time as being Anonymous.
I tend to explain systems in terms of how they actually function, rather than in terms of the intended results. If you have any questions about why I'm requesting any particular feature, I'd be happy to go into more detail.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I forgot to include this.
There also needs to be a good way of being reminded of additional information about a character just by looking at their name in the chat window.
For example, there needs to be some way of differentiating two characters with the same name. I recommend using a half-bright color, or perhaps italics, to display any name which matches the name of someone you Recognize, but that is not that character.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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How would you propose to handle the hardware exponential problem where the lookup table for which guid is broadcast scales with the product of the number of identities and the number of players, and requires a partial search every time a character using a disguise meets a different character (to determine if the the disguised character is broadcasting a name that the other player recognizes, but isn't the disguised character)?
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CEO, Goblinworks
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How would you propose to handle the hardware exponential problem where the lookup table for which guid is broadcast scales with the product of the number of identities and the number of players
Bingo.
Its worse than this because you have all sorts of reputation and alignment things to manage too.
These issues have caused CCP endless problems with Factional Warfare, and that's in a system where there's no disguise. The database load is explosive.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The database load is explosive.
It seems likely to me that the Observer GUIDs could be generated as hashes, where the Observer's GUID and the Observee's GUID are hashed with a private key known only to Goblinworks, and then the Obervee's GUID is hashed with that result in order to create the GUID that gets sent to the Observer. This would not involve any database look-ups.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The other thing to add is there would need to be a way to describe someone to someone else, in essence giving them the id and display name that you would recognize.
What happens if you are killed by someone you don't know? do you get their displayed name? Or some random identifier that you can use/change as a nickname? Sure 'Cmdr Poopypants' killed you, but you don't know his alias, much less his real name.
Familiarity doesn't strike me as something that would need to be tracked, either you recognize them or not. Your brain should handle the familiarity part. If you can't recall how familiar each of your identities is with someone else, well that's your problem if you slip up.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The database load is explosive.It seems likely to me that the Observer GUIDs could be generated as hashes, where the Observer's GUID and the Observee's GUID are hashed with a private key known only to Goblinworks, and then the Obervee's GUID is hashed with that result in order to create the GUID that gets sent to the Observer. This would not involve any database look-ups.
Yes, but you then have to match that GUID to the plaintext string the observer should be given to view. Which is a lookup.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Familiarity doesn't strike me as something that would need to be tracked, either you recognize them or not.
Khimber knows Nihimon.
Nihimon is disguised as Sairin.Khimber encounters Nihimon-as-Sairin in the world.
How do you determine whether Khimber sees through Nihimon's Disguise?
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Goblin Squad Member
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I consider it a significant improvement, and a point in my favor, that we are now discussing the technical challenges rather than the basic merits.
I still think it's a headache for no real gain, but I've made those arguments elsewhere. Repeating them again doesn't make the discussion any more interesting. =P
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Goblin Squad Member
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Familiarity doesn't strike me as something that would need to be tracked, either you recognize them or not.Khimber knows Nihimon.
Nihimon is disguised as Sairin.
Khimber encounters Nihimon-as-Sairin in the world.How do you determine whether Khimber sees through Nihimon's Disguise?
Khimber meets Sarin. Khimber passes his check (perception? sense motive?) to see past the disguise, and recognizes Nihimon. Both names are linked, either by a single ID or by a reverse lookup on each. Khimber sees 'Sarin*' instead of 'Sarin', indicating an alias is being used and sees 'Nihimon' listed under known aliases.
Now imagine Khimber is disguised as Kaldor, someone who knows Sarin, but not Nihimon. It's up to Khimber to remember that Kaldor doesn't know Nihimon, and not let slip information that he shouldn't know.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Khimber meets Sarin. Khimber passes his check (perception? sense motive?) to see past the disguise, and recognizes Nihimon.
Don't you think Khimber should have his check modified by his Familiarity with Nihimon?
If I encountered my dad in a Santa Claus disguise, I think I would have a better chance of Recognizing him than I would of discovering the True Identity of some stranger in a Santa Claus disguise.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I still think it's a headache for no real gain...But that's a very subjective opinion. There are plenty of folks who have been extremely vocal about the "real gain" they see in some of these ideas.
That's very true. But to the best of my memory, I can't recall anyone actually articulating what that gain was. I'm not saying it didn't happen, just that I don't recall it. I've seen a lot of "I like..." and "It would be better...", but the only clear thing I've seen is "People who don't know me won't be able to use my name." Which isn't much of a gain no matter how you look at it. Maybe you can point me at a more clear argument for what the gain of all this complication is.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I can't recall anyone actually articulating what that gain was.
Well, again, "that gain" was largely subjective.
Maybe you can point me at a more clear argument for what the gain of all this complication is.
I can't help but see it as part of a whole system that works flawlessly in my head :)
A large part of my motivation in advocating some of these systems is in trying to move the genre as a whole away from some commonly accepted meta-game workarounds, such as disposable spy alts. Consider this post in conjunction with Knowledge Skills in the Information Age - A possible solution.
My desire is to see systems that create strong incentives for players to use a single account, and to use their mains for espionage. In order for that to be possible, the system must support Disguises and Anonymity, or else there will remain a very strong incentive to use disposable alts to achieve those results.
Once a player has resorted to a disposable alt, then they have cast off all constraints on their behavior.
Like being invisible, being in disguise has to be binary.
As always, thanks for sharing your thoughts with us. It sounds like we'll have good reason to hope that Disguises are included in the game, even if the rest doesn't make it in.
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Goblin Squad Member
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A large part of my motivation in advocating some of these systems is in trying to move the genre as a whole away from some commonly accepted meta-game workarounds, such as disposable spy alts. Consider this post in conjunction with Knowledge Skills in the Information Age - A possible solution.
My desire is to see systems that create strong incentives for players to use a single account, and to use their mains for espionage. In order for that to be possible, the system must support Disguises and Anonymity, or else there will remain a very strong incentive to use disposable alts to achieve those results.
So, I just perused the Knowledge Skills thread. While I think it's an interesting idea, what's being discussed there are not "Knowledge" skills. They're skills to get X bonus flavored as some sort of in-game knowledge. I suspect this goes back to the whole idea of information as an in-game item that I seem to recall you bringing up before. I think it's an interesting thought experiment, but we're a long way from it being viable in practice, if it ever will be.
That said, I support making things like disguise, and deception, and espionage viable on one character. I like the idea of a disguise system, and have even posted some ideas on how it might work. But you'll never stop people from rolling alts to do it. Alts have too many inherent advantages.
Once a player has resorted to a disposable alt, then they have cast off all constraints on their behavior.
Like this. No matter how you structure in-game disguise, if it can be beaten in-game, then an alt will always be a more powerful choice. It cannot. If a disguise can't be beaten in game, then it becomes a meta-game construct itself, just like having an alt. Except now it's an alt with more power.
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Goblin Squad Member
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But you'll never stop people from rolling alts to do it. Alts have too many inherent advantages.
The goal is not to stop it. The goal is to make it simpler to just use your main.
No matter how you structure in-game disguise, if it can be beaten in-game, then an alt will always be a more powerful choice.
I'm not sure that's true.
I believe that people will generally use the simpler option, as long as they have a reasonable chance of being successful. The trick is in finding that balance.
And, again, it doesn't have to be 100% effective. The goal is to devise systems that reduce the effectiveness of disposable alts, and increase the ability to do a lot of different things on your main.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I will not address the technical issues. I don't care, and can't change it. I do not have knowledge in that area and don't want to learn it.
But, as far as character list and disguises, if Hardin was ingame, I would be Hardin. But no one would know me, until we met. (Poof! You know the Hardin you just met, and an entry is made in your "known characters" list.)
I put on Groucho glasses. You see me and can pretty much tell I am Hardin. No disguise. Just a dork in Groucho glasses. You can see through my lame costume and know I am still Hardin. (I suspect this disguise would be weak enough to still show my name to you if that tool is in place.)
I get skilled in "Disguise" and look completely different, even though you know me, and might have worked with me. Compare the disguised me to your "Detect Disguise" skill, and now we have some dynamics in the spycraft archetype (I would guess this would be an "Aristocrat" category skill set). In this example things become much more complex and several layers of possible identifiers would have to be kept for your knowledge of who this disguised person is, as a separate entity from the Hardin you know.
It might not happen early on due to manpower constraints and technology, but mutiple identities seem like an important tool to eventually put into the toolkit for several categories of skills.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Ok, here are my thoughts. First, lets leave the Disguise issues out of it, we can get back to that later.
Lets suppose I wish to remain Anonymous. I tag myself as Anonymous and my broadcasted name changes to "Stranger" instead of "Drake Brimstone." I am also broadcasting an ID.
If I wish, I could manually "tell" some one who I am, authorizing the server to send them my real name to them which then gets stored on their account with my ID in their list of characters known.
If not, they can perform a manual skill check (Knowledge local perhaps?) with an easier DC the higher my Fame. (Fame being based on Reputation and total advancement, you are likely to be known more the higher level you are.) If this succeeds then the server gives them the my name as well as everyone in their party. (To symbolize them telling their party who I am.)
If I were not Anonymous my name and ID would be Broadcast to everyone who bothers to look at me.
This portion is entirely for RP reasons and should not effect other aspects of the game.
On to Disguise. I decide to disguise myself as Percy Rivers. I am broadcasting the name as if it were my own, however, I am broadcasting a different ID. This ID would be dynamically created when I first use the disguise to become Percy Rivers. Everything acts exactly the same as if I were a different character unless someone sees through my disguise and breaks it. At that point, I start broadcasting my Real Name and ID and everyone present gets both IDs stored in in their list as being me.
If some one sees me while in disguise as Percy Rivers and knows I am really Drake Brimstone (the ID is associated in their list with my real name). It will graphically inform them that I am in disguise as Percy Rivers but am really Drake Brimstone without breaking my disguise. (Perhaps they see my Broadcasted name as normal, but my Real name in parenthesis.)
If I am tagged as Anonymous AND in disguise instead of giving my Name and ID when my disguise is broken it returns me to the Anonymous state, showing "Stranger" to those who don't already have my real name in their list but still gives the real ID so if they had already met me they would still see my real name.
The only DB access required (outside of manually initiated skill checks) is when they log in and the game retrieves their current list and to update their server side list just as they would always be doing anyway when meeting a "new" person. If the individuals are already on each others client side lists (updated on login and as updates are sent to the server) then there is no need to update the server side lists, and no DB access.
This system would allow multiple false identities with minimal DB access.
Edit:
IDs are not different for different observers. IMO there is no need. If some one synchronizes their list with another characters list (be it via 3rd party or game supported.) there shouldn't be any reason to disallow this. It's just like if I told Jimmy about my friend Sarah. With that said, to avoid "advantages" for 3rd party tools, just include a game supported mechanic to share lists.