Stacking Question

[Mechanical Pear]

If I have a +1 Impact weapon with Leaden Blades cast on it, while I'm under the Influence of Enlarge Person....how does that work? Technically, the only size bonus being added is Enlarge person, the other two just say they do damage as though they were bigger.

[Nefreet]

Lead Blades does not stack with Impact. Enlarge person stacks with either.

[Nefreet]

It's not so much an issue of "stacking", just conceptualizing what's going on.

Both Lead Blades and Impact change the base damage as though the weapon were one size category larger than it physically is. The weapon size remains unchanged, though. So a medium longsword with Impact deals damage as a large longsword. Casting Lead Blades has no meaningful affect, since the longsword is still medium. Enlarge Person, however, works, since now the base size is one larger.

[Mechanical Pear]

Hm, I see your point. I'm wondering if there are any other opinions on the issue, though, so far, I'd agree with you.

[Nefreet]

This question has been asked many times before. A quick search should point you to similar conclusions.

[Salindurthas]

While under the effect of Lead Blades and using an Impact weapon, the following rules apply to your weapons:

Lead Blades: "All melee weapons you are carrying when the spell is cast deal damage as if one size category larger than they actually are".
Impact: "An impact weapon ... deal[s] damage as if the weapon were one size category larger."

This is a tough call.

I can definitely see where Nefreet is coming from.

At the same time, I imagine this example:
I have a Normal sized Impact Longsword.
I now come under the effect of Lead Blades.
I now deal damage as if I had a Large Longsword with Impact.
A large Longsword with Impact deals damage like a Huge Longsword.
Therefore I deal damage as if using a Huge Longsword.

Tough call, but I'm leaning towards them stacking.

[Nefreet]

Also consider that the spell used to create the Impact enchantment is Lead Blades.

[Salindurthas]

Well, I was leaning toward them stacking, but now I'm closer to the fence.
Still a tough call.

[Akerlof]

Salindurthas wrote:

At the same time, I imagine this example:
I have a Normal sized Impact Longsword.
I now come under the effect of Lead Blades.
I now deal damage as if I had a Large Longsword with Impact.
A large Longsword with Impact deals damage like a Huge Longsword.
Therefore I deal damage as if using a Huge Longsword.

Tough call, but I'm leaning towards them stacking.

Look at how the abilities are worded:

Impact Weapon:

Quote:

This special ability can only be placed on melee weapons that are not light weapons. An impact weapon delivers a potent kinetic jolt when it strikes, dealing damage as if the weapon were one size category larger. In addition, any bull rush combat maneuver the wielder attempts while wielding the weapon gains a bonus equal to the weapon's enhancement bonus; this includes all bull rush attempts, not only those in which a weapon is used, such as Bull Rush Strike, Shield Slam, or Unseat.

Lead Blades:

Quote:

Lead blades increases the momentum and density of your melee weapons just as they strike a foe. All melee weapons you are carrying when the spell is cast deal damage as if one size category larger than they actually are. For instance, a Medium longsword normally deals 1d8 points of damage, but it would instead deal 2d6 points of damage if benefiting from lead blades. Only you can benefit from this spell. If anyone else uses one of your weapons to make an attack it deals damage as normal for its size.

So, you have a medium sized +1 Impact long sword. It deals damage as if it were a large longsword, but it is still medium sized. Now you cast Lead Blades, since your long sword is medium sized, it will deal damage as if it were a large longsword. Since neither actually modifies the size of the weapon, they do not stack.

Now, look at the wording for enlarge person:

Quote:

All equipment worn or carried by a creature is similarly enlarged by the spell. Melee weapons affected by this spell deal more damage (see Table: Tiny and Large Weapon Damage). Other magical properties are not affected by this spell. Any enlarged item that leaves an enlarged creature's possession (including a projectile or thrown weapon) instantly returns to its normal size. This means that thrown and projectile weapons deal their normal damage. Magical properties of enlarged items are not increased by this spell.

Your medium longsword is actually enlarged, not just dealing damage as if it were larger. Note the difference in how it is explained. Now you have a large sized +1 Impact long sword, which deals damage as if it were a huge longsword. If you cast Lead Blades, it's still a large longsword, so Lead Blades will cause it to do damage as if it were huge.

Lead Blades and Impact are based upon the weapon's size, but neither actually changes the size of the weapon so they don't stack. Enlarge person, however, does change the size of the weapon, so it stacks.