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Count Caromarc the Galadriel of Carrion Crown


Carrion Crown


Hey there! I want to use Count Caromarc in our campaign as gift giver like Galadriel in LotR. This way I wish to introduce some more atmospheric items. They don't need to be magical in nature, but ... special!

At the moment I have no idea which items! Does anybody has any suggestion?

Thanks a lot!!

EDIT: I should mention that I don't use/have Ultimate Equipment.

Scarab Sages Dedicated Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014

Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Cards, Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

Just remember that Galadriels gifts weren't just (or even foremost) powerful magic items. Most items impact on the rest of the adventure is fairly situational (the light, the clasps) with the lembas bread, and the ropes probably being only real items of predictable use. Magic items given this way are a problem in D&D, because many items become less useful as the heroes gain power - and many players won't bother remembering how the now useless sword was an important gift just a few adventures ago.
The gifts of Galadriel were items that carried the memory of beauty through the dark times the heroes entered - that is something hard to bring to CC.


Thank you feytharn! You are absolutely right. I surely don't want to claim to be a LotR expert. I simply saw the Count emerging from his laboratory, a few days after the events in Trial of the Beast, back in shape, looking just like his illustration from Rule of Fear and saying: "Good news everyone!" - no, perhaps he begins differently. He used the days to craft some tools to fight his tormentors and thank his saviors in his very own way. (In my campaign the Count doesn't have information on the whereabouts of the Path, to give the players some downtime!)

I guess it is possible to give items that will surely see their use, like about anything to fight the undead, and I imagine that these could sometimes make the difference between life and death, success and failure. I see a certain resemblance between Virlych and Mordor. That being said, it might not be items that carry the memory of beauty into this dark region, but a gadget that saves the day or encounter!

Scarab Sages Dedicated Voter 2013, Dedicated Voter 2014

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Cards, Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

Back with some more semi useful babbeling:
- The best choice for this are Items that don't rely on simple numerical bonusses - those don't stay useful long enough to be remembered.
- describe the gifts in detail, make the players remember the item, not just the boon it gives.
- give each item a slight twist - nothing that changes its power level, but something to set it apart from other items of the same sort.

Example could be:
- a metamagic rod that actually is a masterwork (or even slightly enchanted) mace
- a bag of holding that can change its color and trimmings to fit the style or even mood of its owner
- a figurine of wondrous power with a distinct personality
- a spellbook, not only containing a collection of very useful spells for all levels but also granting a slight bonus on spellcraft checks to identify items from a certain school of magic or a diplomacy bonus when dealing with sages/nobles or another distinct group.


+1 on figurines of wondrous power et al.

Those types of magic items are good memorable handouts that don't directly raise the power of the character and add more of a theme of "magical/mystical"

Star Voter 2013

Interesting. My Count Caromarc was subsequently arrested by angry Ustalavics, hauled before a magistrate for "crimes against nature and humanity" and would have been executed had he not cited an old law that allowed him permanent incarceration in exchange for forfeiture of all title!

I agree with those above that any gift-giving should be custom-tailored for your group. That said, what's your party makeup, the characters and their rough backgrounds and motivations? Perhaps we can find some good ideas by investigating that.


how did the public at large have any information about count caromarc to prove wrong doing of any type?

Star Voter 2013

The PCs. They didn't stop the mob and just got ahead of them, so when they caught up they ransacked the remains of Schloss Caromarc and the PCs revealed his "atrocities".

Grand Lodge

Yeah, you might not want to plan on the fact that the party will be best friends with the former count. The party I ran though Trial of the Beast was fairly pissed at all the crap they had to wade though to get to the top of the tower, especially when most of it was terrible monsters the former count had created.


Thanks everyone getting involved in this discussion. At the moment I don't have time to reply in full length, but I already spotted some good points on the fly. I come back on you ASAP!

BTW The party actually said nothing to Count Caromarc about his horrific creatures that almost killed them. Strange, but true. Perhaps one reason why our Count is so extra good friend with them. He wants them to stay that cool with his work!


The party i am DMing for looted his castle, even his doors from their frames. Then they blackmailed him forextra payout. That being said, if you want some notable items, you could create some items that evolve with party powers. Maybe a staff that adds new spells as they gain levels, or a sword that gains in power. Also useful would be something as simple as a wand that allows them to apply their own CL and spell DC modifiers to it. Stuff you won't ever get from the moduleitself.

I don't know about your party, but if i gave mine a figurine of wondrous power, it would soon be converted to gp for an item that's actually useful, and can't be replaced by a40 gp horse or a fly spell.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

It's pretty hilarious your party was so extreme in their looting. If my PCs did that, I would give them pretty poor rates for selling the stuff (since they need to unload it all really fast), and I'd probably find some way for the Count to get some measure of revenge in the end.

As for your suggestion of "items that evolve with party powers," that's what I did in my campaign from the outset, taking inspiration from a "Legendary Weapons" 3rd-party Pathfinder resource. It was part of Lorrimor's original bequeath. It slightly unbalances things, since it is a pretty big boon, but it allows me to be stingier at other parts (for example, I'm not going to make up the difference if the party doesn't loot the mansion, and it doesn't look like they are going to, except for magic items). Also, my approach to gaming is that players love cool magic items so I'm happy to be generous. And I'm not too focused on killing my players, so I don't mind giving them the extra help.


Well, they didn't really care about how much gold they received, they were just pissed about all the golems and other creations left free to wander the castle. In fact they had originally wanted to kill the Count, but decided looting and blackmail was better. A lot of his stuff they didn't even sell, for example, they ate all his food, drank or spilled all the alchohol, smoked all his tobacco, slept in his bed, etc... They were being more vindictive than greedy in their looting habits, for the most part (though the adamantine door 'was' turned into an adamantine axe for the barbarian).


Victor Zajic wrote:
Yeah, you might not want to plan on the fact that the party will be best friends with the former count. The party I ran though Trial of the Beast was fairly pissed at all the crap they had to wade though to get to the top of the tower, especially when most of it was terrible monsters the former count had created.

I'm not sure I'm understanding "atrocities" He made some creatures.

They live in his home.

the PCs are moving through his home, they are "pissed" because they got chewed on by his guard dogs?

That doesn't make sense to me.

The count made the beast (and the AP) so they are flesh golems right, so assumingly made from dead body parts.

But heck did he grave rob these body parts? Or where they donated or purchased?

IRL donated body parts are transplanted into people who need them (hearts and livers and other things)

So This doesn't make the Count any more evil than our current RW society with relation to body parts, as you don't have any proof how they were acquired.

The AP is a failed experiment. but the Beast is kinda a good one.

he's actually a decent guy.

the Whispering way is the enemy, they are the ones that made the beast do bad things and screwed up the counts home.....

So maybe my memory is missing something?

Grand Lodge

As it turns out, players are free to react to things as they see fit, even if it doesn't make sense to the GM. Assuming/demanding your players are going to react in a certain way usually leads to poor gm-craft.


Victor Zajic wrote:
As it turns out, players are free to react to things as they see fit, even if it doesn't make sense to the GM. Assuming/demanding your players are going to react in a certain way usually leads to poor gm-craft.

This pretty much. We can have a philosophical discussion about the Count's morality all day long, but that has no impact on how your players are going to view the event. Some PCs are going to be fine with him, while others are going to view him as an abomination. For my group it was simple. They had gone to this castle to warn the Count about the impending mob, as well as talk to him about the Beast. While there, they were attacked by countless flesh golems and other guardian creatures, so by the time the got to him they were feeling less than charitable. The only reason they didn't kill him is because he had already been tortured so much by the Whispering Way, they felt that there wasn't too much more to do to him... well except extorting more gold out of him.

Star Voter 2013

Exactly. My PCs were sensitive to the political overtones of a titled count who created a monster who in their eyes and regardless of the trial's outcome was at least another indication of noble excess and disregard for the people and at worst a deliberate retaliation for past transgressions. My PCs do not consider themselves heroes, and although they learned that Caromarc was as much a victim of the Whispering Way as they were, they also understood that it was his own mad obsession that started the problem. Maybe it was best, they conceded, to let him be handled by the people, because they had a job to do pursuing the Whispering Way.

I thought it to be a fitting conclusion in an AP that has a darker bent. But then a lot of games I run are ones where the lines of morality are intentionally blurred.

Also, your party sounds delightful, Overcast. :)


Thanks Yossarin; I like what your party has done as well, nothing like making the laws of the land work for the party instead of against them for once. If you're interested, I started a campaign journal of my PC's party, since they seem to be one of the few evil-aligned parties doing Carrion Crown. Although the evil has been slowly shifting towards good recently. Anyhow, here's the link, if you want to amuse yourself.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2oxey?Evil-Party-in-Carrion-Crown


Thanks Yossarin; I like what your party has done as well, nothing like making the laws of the land work for the party instead of against them for once. If you're interested, I started a campaign journal of my PC's party, since they seem to be one of the few evil-aligned parties doing Carrion Crown. Although the evil has been slowly shifting towards good recently. Anyhow, here's the link, if you want to amuse yourself.

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2oxey?Evil-Party-in-Carrion-Crown


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Our party consists of:

Balduan Tarrt (LG male human paladin [Undead Scourge] 5 of Iomedae)
Bestimotor von Simmelwitz (NG male gnome summoner 7)
Iacobus Antonius Santorio (LN male human inquisitor 6 of Iomedae)
Gizella Biahara (NG female human cleric 7 of Pharasma)
Stralicia Mancini (CG female human alchemist 7)
Tira Krähenfuß [Crowfoot] (NG female human witch 5)

The group is named The Silver Ravens after the batch they aquired back in Ravengro becoming investigators. Their ghostly chronicler named them, whose journal can be read here (but beware German). So a Black (or in this case Silver) Jade (or in this case Silver) Raven Figurine of Wondrous Power would indeed make for a fine start!

Does anybody have the Treasury of the Macabre? Perhaps this vile volume also has something in it...

Ans perhaps it is not a spellbook, but a formula book for Stralicia...

Star Voter 2013

Yeah, that's the right idea. And you can tweak them a little to reflect Caromarc's creative genius and make them like clockwork ravens (like the clockwork owl from Clash of the Titans) or some amalgamation of reanimated bird and metal. Like ravens with metallic silver beaks, a subtle nod to the group's adopted mission of undead destruction. If you take it a step further and modify these raven figurines so that the ravens can Silversheen a weapon 1x/day by tapping a silvery beak against the blade or something, then you've given them just that much more utility that will come in handy throughout at least two of the upcoming four books.


I like that idea of silversheen. Having just finished the last werewolf encounter in Book 3, I can say that the PCs regret not having invested more in silversheen or silver weapons. They were just rolling past most of the werewolf encounters, but the last one with Adimarus Ionescu nearly killed 2/3 of the party, and it would have been a lot smoother if they had been able to bypass his DR.

Of course, I do have to point out that in the game I run, we don't allow magic weapons to bypass DR based on the amount of + it has. A +1-+5 enhancement to a blade is already statistically better than any other enhancement, excluding keen, there's no way I feel comfortable allowing it to bypass DR as well.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Overcast, don't the weapons have to have at least a +3 to ignore DR?
Does anyone in your party have a +3 weapon?


I'm not sure the specific rules on the + before it starts ignoring DR, but no, no one currently has a +3 weapon in Broken Moon. However I was speaking as a general rule within the campaigns I run, not just limited to Carrion Crown. In fact, our entire group has embraced the idea (we work on a rotating GM basis; two games always running concurrently, and we switch off games week to week), and we have all decided not to let magical + bypass DR.


Voomer wrote:

Overcast, don't the weapons have to have at least a +3 to ignore DR?

Does anyone in your party have a +3 weapon?

yea where is this rule, specifically please?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I wasn't familiar with it either until I looked it up. From the Pathfinder Reference Doc: "Weapons with an enhancement bonus of +3 or greater can ignore some types of damage reduction, regardless of their actual material or alignment. The following table shows what type of enhancement bonus is needed to overcome some common types of damage reduction."
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/special-abilities#TOC-Damage-Reductio n

Grand Lodge

My playgroup has decided that rules is dumb and we're not going to use it.


Victor, I agree. Is this even actual PF rules? it should be printed in a book somewhere if it is


Pendagast, yes it's an actual PF rule, as Voomer quoted the actual rule above. And you're right, it's a dumb rule. If you're not using it in your campaign already, there's no need to start.


It's probably reflecting the sacred cowness of older editions when certain monsters couldn't be hurt at all unless you were using a +3 or greater weapon

Star Voter 2013

Yes, that is what I had always assumed about that rule. We do not use it either.


Yossarin wrote:
Yeah, that's the right idea. And you can tweak them a little to reflect Caromarc's creative genius and make them like clockwork ravens (like the clockwork owl from Clash of the Titans) or some amalgamation of reanimated bird and metal. Like ravens with metallic silver beaks, a subtle nod to the group's adopted mission of undead destruction. If you take it a step further and modify these raven figurines so that the ravens can Silversheen a weapon 1x/day by tapping a silvery beak against the blade or something, then you've given them just that much more utility that will come in handy throughout at least two of the upcoming four books.

Nice one! And HOORAY for clockworks!!

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