If you steal a horse from a 20th level Cavalier, does it remain incredibly powerful? How much would something like that sell for?
Can the party rogue steal his friend's horse again every time he uses his class powers to replace it? And if the Cavalier gets a cut of the profits, does that violate any class rules?
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You could almost say the same thing about a character's familiar or animal companion though too, couldn't you? Isn't it an assumed risk that something really bad could happen to a character's "non-leveled" cohort of some kind (I didn't know how else to phrase that....) when they drag it along on an adventure?First, a cavalier without his mount looses how many of his class abilities? He doesn't exactly have the option to not "drag it along," it is a huge part of his class. But putting it at risk and it dying in battle is one thing, and IMO that's fine. Heck, that's heroic. But a DM forcing pcs to abandon their mounts and then killing it with DM Fiat? No. Just no.
But that's the risk you take when playing a Cavalier. Just like you take a risk when playing a Wizard with his spellbook, a fighter with his special sword etc...
By default, the game assumes that everything is fair game. Ever wonder why you are allowed to get another mount if the one you have dies?
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how exactly do you move the horses once they;re unconscious?
+If we're worried about the horses putting up a fight, there's always Drow Poison to knock them unconscious.
Who said anything about moving them? Knock them out, help yourself to what's in the saddlebag, coup de grace them, and be on your way. If you really want to steal the horse, I'd say cut it up first into easy-to-transport sides of meat. Leave the bone and grisle behind-- it's not worth carrying, and the butcher might pay more if you've done some of his work for him.
But Mr. Corvin, I'd say your current plan works just fine as a hook for an adventure. Have the PC's use Survival to follow the bandit or the warhorse, and see which one they track down. Just make sure that the warhorse and its assailant are both alive next time the PC's see them, even if they don't stay that way long.
I think you've got more going for you without the horse being slain:
1) There have been great posts about the Survival checks, etc. to find the horse.
2) You could have the horse standing over a dead bandit who happens to have "plans" for the bad guy, but it turns out to be misinformation and leads them into an ambush..
3) You could have them return just in the nick of time to see hired bandits trying to take the horse and have a proper fight on your hands
4) You could have the bandit "trap" the horse with some sort of scrying spell to see what the PCs are doing..
If I were an evil villain, merely taking the horse doesn't do much for me.. I'd use the opportunity to trick or lure the players into something deeper..
First, a cavalier without his mount looses how many of his class abilities? He doesn't exactly have the option to not "drag it along," it is a huge part of his class.
Not as huge a part as you think, and not that many Class Abilities are lost when the Mount is gone... besides the Mount itself who is meant to be killable (that's what HPs are for).
If they were high enough level (I don't think they are if a 2nd level Fighter is a recurring NPC villani) then Cavalier's Charge and Expert Trainer would be in play, but those apply to ANY mount you are riding, not just the Bonded Mount. Otherwise, you are getting full usage out of your HD, BAB, Saves, Skills, Weapon/Armor Proficiencies, Feats, Challenge, Order Abilities, Tactician, Banner (if high enough level)...But putting it at risk and it dying in battle is one thing, and IMO that's fine. Heck, that's heroic. But a DM forcing pcs to abandon their mounts and then killing it with DM Fiat? No. Just no.
No... That's just in-world coherence for leaving your mounts (bonded or not) in the path that the enemy NPCs take to flee the scene. And it's not DM fiat if he's following the actual rules, i.e. handle animal or combat rules to kill an animal. He's stated that the Cavalier Mount is in 'Guard' mode, I'd rather have him play out the consequences of that than decide that bad things happening to unattended animals 'just don't happen' in his games.
I'm also using the event as a way for the PCs to get some information about the equipment the bandits have access to.
How? Does another PC have Speak With Animals spell/ability?
