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So the Chronicle is available now, and I was assuming since this module was a Special Case (Not as long as normal Modules) that the rules for Fame and XP would be with the Chronicle, I guess I should not assume...
So I might have missed it but has Mike posted anywhere on what the Fame and XP will be?
Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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A question - for PFS play should we still use the pre-gens as given in the module? (ala We Be Goblins)
Or could this module be played with appropriate level PFS characters?
For Free RPG day I'm planning on running it entirely with the Pre-gens - just trying to get clarification if that causes problems with anyone getting PFS chronicle sheets for playing (and how they can then use those sheets with their regular PFS characters)
Note that this is a module, not a scenario - the rules are different. Players can only put credit for a pregen onto a brand new PFS character. The pregens in this module are not legal for general PFS play, but Mike Brock has stated that it is legal to earn PFS credit for this module using these pregens.
I expect some of the players at my table on Saturday will be running their own level-appropriate PFS characters; I'm certainly not going to force them to run a pregen and start a new PFS character to use the credit.
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A question - for PFS play should we still use the pre-gens as given in the module? (ala We Be Goblins)
Or could this module be played with appropriate level PFS characters?
For Free RPG day I'm planning on running it entirely with the Pre-gens - just trying to get clarification if that causes problems with anyone getting PFS chronicle sheets for playing (and how they can then use those sheets with their regular PFS characters)
Note that this is a module, not a scenario - the rules are different. Players can only put credit for a pregen onto a brand new PFS character. The pregens in this module are not legal for general PFS play, but Mike Brock has stated that it is legal to earn PFS credit for this module using these pregens.
I expect some of the players at my table on Saturday will be running their own level-appropriate PFS characters; I'm certainly not going to force them to run a pregen and start a new PFS character to use the credit.
This 100%. Thanks John.
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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My trusty GM's assistant has now audited the pregens using HeroLab. There are a few discrepancies (Ezren has too many feats/skills, Harsk's cloak of elvenkind doesn't seem to be affecting his Stealth, and Merisiel doesn't qualify for one of her feats), but nothing too unbalancing.
At this point I feel comfortable using these pre-gens in the module. I also feel that a regular 4th-level PFS character should be OK - a 20-point build should compensate for being one level lower. A 5th-level PFS character shouldn't have any problems, but I don't think they'd be too overpowering. I wouldn't want to run a table of six 6th-level PFS characters, though, especially if they were well suited to this kind of encounter. Fortunately I don't think that's likely to occur at a Free RPG Day table.
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My trusty GM's assistant has now audited the pregens using HeroLab. There are a few discrepancies (Ezren has too many feats/skills, Harsk's cloak of elvenkind doesn't seem to be affecting his Stealth, and Merisiel doesn't qualify for one of her feats), but nothing too unbalancing.At this point I feel comfortable using these pre-gens in the module. I also feel that a regular 4th-level PFS character should be OK - a 20-point build should compensate for being one level lower. A 5th-level PFS character shouldn't have any problems, but I don't think they'd be too overpowering. I wouldn't want to run a table of six 6th-level PFS characters, though, especially if they were well suited to this kind of encounter. Fortunately I don't think that's likely to occur at a Free RPG Day table.
Ezren doesn't have too many feats. 3 for HD, 1 for human, Scribe Scroll at lvl 1, lvl 5 wizard bonus feat, Alertness for being near his familiar. 7 feats.
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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Ezren doesn't have too many feats. 3 for HD, 1 for human, Scribe Scroll at lvl 1, lvl 5 wizard bonus feat, Alertness for being near his familiar. 7 feats.
Thanks - I suspect my assistant (who is unfamiliar with familiars) didn't know about the conditional 'Alertness', and simply tried to assign it as a regular feat.
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How much gold will a brand new character get from this mod? Also I imagine brand new means never played correct, and not just any first level character?
You know a mod like this would be so much simpler if the players could hold onto the credit like they can scenarios. Only myself and one player have a character eligible to play this mod tomorrow [and I have to run it] and a few of the other players still are on their first 1st level PC. It kinda sucks that they have to start a new PC that they may not ever play in order to get use of the chronicle sheet.
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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How much gold will a brand new character get from this mod?
500gp
Also I imagine brand new means never played correct, and not just any first level character?
One would presume that's what "brand new" means. ;)
You know a mod like this would be so much simpler if the players could hold onto the credit like they can scenarios.
Agreed. On the other hand, it's good for everyone to eventually have more than one character. At least when someone gets around to making that second PC, they'll get to start with more than 150gp and be closer to 2nd level.
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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After Will's comment, I went back and did some more calculations.
I'm not entirely sure an average table (playing either the pregens or a typical mix of the kind of PFS level 5 characters I see) would prevail here.
First of all, let's look at the basic combat (no buffs, no special attacks):
Avalexi can cast Vampiric Touch at will, to get 6d6 temporary hit points. As she has +6 on melee touch attacks, and Seelah only has a touch AC of 10, that's going to succeed almost every time she tries it.
Meanwhile the PCs are going to have a hard time actually getting through. Seelah is the best damage dealer, but she's 'only' +10 to hit. Against AC 26 that's going to hit one time in four, for 1d8+4 damage (and that's assuming she's using a cold iron longsword). And 40% of the successful hits will be critical threats, which increases the expected DPR by 10%. That's still not very good, though - it works out to slightly over two points per round from Seelah's base attack.
Of the other pregens, Merisiel does at least have a cold iron dagger. If she can get a flanking partner she can get an occasional decent hit in. But even then she's going to have problems hitting very often.
Valeros is even worse off - he needs a good roll to hit, and an even better damage roll to get through Avalexi's damage resistance.
Ezren's spells aren't going to do a whole lot of good, Harsk can only do any damage on a critical hit, and Kyra can't even manage that.
Overall, Avalexi can probably recover damage by using vampiric touch faster than the party can deliver it in straightforward combat, and still have time left over to get in a few hits with her weapon.
So it looks as though the party will need to do something else to shift the balance in their favour. Seelah is, again, the go-to choice here, and at least one of the options (smite evil) is an obvious pick. But if the player isn't familiar with the Pathfinder rules they might not spot "bless weapon", which could also be useful if cast on another party member's blade. Similarly Kyra can use 'align weapon' to overcome DR. But that still doesn't address the major problem - if they can't get Avalexi's AC down below 26, they just aren't able to hit her often enough. And, again, spotting potentially useful items (Harsk's tanglefoot bags, perhaps) rather assumes the players will be well versed in the details of Pathfinder combat - a questionable assumption for a Free RPG Day module).
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I believe the reference is the following from page 29 of the
GUIDE TO PATHFINDER SOCIETY ORGANIZED PLAY:
If the player is playing a non-1st-level pregenerated character, he may
choose instead to apply this Chronicle to a newly created 1st-level character. If this is the case, reduce this value to 500 gp (or 250 gp for the slow advancement track).
These are the rules for a normal scenario. As Free RPG Day modules are more similar to scenarios than other modules, this rule rather than the one on page 23 which applies to full length modules:
If you play a pregenerated character, you apply the credit from the pregenerated character played to a newly created character, with the GP gained reduced to 1,398 GP (or 699 for slow advancement track characters).
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May I ask where you found the 500gp thing, so that I can tell the players where I the info is?Here.
Ok, well no one official said anything about the gold reward in that post. All Mike says is that the gold on the chronicle sheet is correct.
I believe the reference is the following from page 29 of the
GUIDE TO PATHFINDER SOCIETY ORGANIZED PLAY:If the player is playing a non-1st-level pregenerated character, he may
choose instead to apply this Chronicle to a newly created 1st-level character. If this is the case, reduce this value to 500 gp (or 250 gp for the slow advancement track).These are the rules for a normal scenario. As Free RPG Day modules are more similar to scenarios than other modules, this rule rather than the one on page 23 which applies to full length modules:
If you play a pregenerated character, you apply the credit from the pregenerated character played to a newly created character, with the GP gained reduced to 1,398 GP (or 699 for slow advancement track characters).
Right it's not a scenario so we shouldn't use those rules, because if I could use those rules I would have the players hold the credit till they hit fourth level.
And the module rules don't work either since they are for full length modules.
500gp sounds nice and fair but do I really have the authority to make up a gold amount without an official ruling?
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32
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John, your analysis is pretty spot on. I'd strongly recommend that any and all GM's read that to get a good grip on the scenario. I have a feeling that there will be a lot of posts come Monday about this scenario.After Will's comment, I went back and did some more calculations.
** spoiler omitted **...
I've been told that this module was actually designed for 6 players instead of 4; was that factored into the analysis?
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Venture-Captain, California—San Francisco Bay Area South & West
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I've been told that this module was actually designed for 6 players instead of 4; was that factored into the analysis?
Indeed it was. The very first sentence (after the credits) on the inside cover reads:
Dawn of the Scarlet Sun is a Pathfinder Module designed for six 5th-level characters ...
But the overall conclusion I came to is mostly independent of the actual number of players: A party that relies on toe-to-toe combat to solve problems is going to have a really hard time with the final encounter.
It really doesn't matter if you've got five characters or three characters failing to do any damage - what matters is if you've got any characters capable of making a significant contribution.
The wrong choice of pregens (especially in the hands of players not intimately familiar with their abilities), coupled with an unfortunate selection of regular PFS characters, could end up with a party that can not handle the BBEG.
I'd be cautious about running this for a table made up entirely of experienced players; I have even stronger reservations about a mixed table. I have to question the decision to offer a module this dangerous as a "Free RPG Day" promotion, where I'd expect there to be several novice players - possibly even players totally new to Pathfinder.
At the very least, I reserve the right to remind players that a strategic retreat is always an option worthy of consideration.
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You know a mod like this would be so much simpler if the players could hold onto the credit like they can scenarios. Only myself and one player have a character eligible to play this mod tomorrow [and I have to run it] and a few of the other players still are on their first 1st level PC. It kinda sucks that they have to start a new PC that they may not ever play in order to get use of the chronicle sheet.
It's coming with Guide 4.2
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Yup, there was some confusion, since this is technically a module, but not a 32 pager, so only worth the 500 gold a single scenario would reward.
Mike Brock's out of town, but a definitive clarification on this should be showing up soon. In the meantime, go with the 500 gold reward, so that you don't have to later track down and attempt to correct all those sheets.
But I'm never off work ;-)
Please use the module rules as presented in the organized play guide, with the exception of the gp going to a newly created character should be 500.
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(How are people getting this module to look at the stat block? I'm supposed to be running it tomorrow, and I'll be doing so cold, which isn't the greatest advertisement for Pathfinder.)
A few ways you could have gotten it...
1. Email Mike
2. Email your VC
3. Ask you Store to give it to you early for Prep.
4. Use a time machine to go into the future to pick one up at your store
5. Hack Paizo's network
6. Use you psychic powers to see it mentally in your head for prep.
* Only the first 3 are real
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Question:
Not that I am planning this, but this scenario seems aggressive (which is fine), what I am wondering is what happens if a pregen player dies?
The main group I run will all be pre-genning up, and just wondering what happens in the case of victory, but pregen player death. What do I award, or not award? Thanks.
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Ok, so the FAQ says 1 PP but Mike said 2 PP at http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz5kwr&page=2?Free-RPG-Day-modules-question#9 9
So 1 or 2 PP?
I'm getting way too confuzzled.
That post was from May 19th, and the FAQ update went up on June 7th. I can speak with 95% certainty that the FAQ is the model that we will be using.
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Question:
Not that I am planning this, but this scenario seems aggressive (which is fine), what I am wondering is what happens if a pregen player dies?
The main group I run will all be pre-genning up, and just wondering what happens in the case of victory, but pregen player death. What do I award, or not award? Thanks.
The rules aren't specific about this yet, but I believe for 16 page modules you give them 1 PP, 1 XP, and 500 gp to apply to a new level 1 PC - even if the pregen dies. This allows the player to get something for their time.