While I do love the Pathfinder pantheon, even before I was a GM or a player I was a Creative Writer, and once before ahad a work in progress of a fantasy pantheon of my own based on a blend of Wicca and Greco-Roman religions. For fun, I wanted to try and make it work as a pantheon for pathfinder games, and was looking for any and all advice people might give, from starting out to the end product. Obviously I know I want to try and make sure all domains are covered, but I wanted to know what other suggestions exist.
For now the only part of the Pantheon I found that still exists is the Parent gods (Mother and Father) and the six initial (now lost) god children. As I get advice I'll try and post WIPs of the pantheon and such.
Thanks in advance
-Border
It sounds like you have a start on the pantheon. Which Greco-Roman gods correspond to the Parent gods and their children that you mentioned?
Are you going to incorporate the Titans? Ancient evil gods locked away in the depths of Tartarus would be a good replacement for demon lords.
How are you going to deal with Hecate? She is not part of the main twelve gods and goddesses but she is arguably the most powerful goddess in the pantheon. I don't think her Roman equivalent is as powerful but in the Greek version, she has a rather large number of areas of influence. However, I wouldn't remove her completely because at the moment, I can't think of another Greco-Roman god related to magic or nature. Plus, the fact that she is the daughter of one of the nastier Titans could make for an interesting backstory. Actually, that gives a reason for her to be separate from the main pantheon.
Edit: Wait, Gaia would be nature... Can't believe I forgot that.
When I spoke of influence by Greco-roman, I meant by the actual formation of a God lineage or Pedigree. I had not thought of having the Titans being used to replace Demon Lords, and will certainly look into that.
What I had at first was this:
"Mother Goddess, who's womb bears the fruit of life of all things good. (Good, Life/Healing)
Father God, who's seed and hands carry the chaos of living through unto death. (Chaos, Death)
From their womb birthed six gods to watch over their children when they could not. One for the Humans, one for the Elves, one for the Dwarves, one for the Halflings, One for the Gnomes, and one for Orckin. (I may reduce it to five and take Orckin off the list)
But an Power Hungry mage grew too bold. He summoned fourth the children gods, claiming to seek knowledge of the world. Instead, he trapped them, using their power to imbued the powers of a god within him. The Mage lord became a god then, the god of all things death, evil, and destruction.
Out of their misery, Mother Goddess and Father God created not gods from their womb, but from their magic, creating new gods to take the duties of their initial children, but not take their place, with the hope one day their god-children might return."
Obviously it's more of a work in progress than anything else, and I'm still unsure about what to use for the five or six gods. I thought of using Virtues (Not the roman Catholic but other types. Valor, Kindness, etc) as the initial base, and then going from their, but whatever means I used to separate them out before I had not written down.
I think you should keep the Orc deity - it'd be interesting to see them as a PC race. It might also be interesting if the reason some are evil is due to the mage controlling that deity. The other Children might be free. Then again, the other five might have been captured by the mage in different ways, but the mage specifically uses the Orckin deity in some way that allows control.
Of course, if you're going for Greko-Roman/Wiccan there are the Protogenoi: Gaia, Uranus, Pontus, Nyx, Chonos, Anake and so on - the primordial forces of Time, Earth, Air, Water and so on. The Titans came later, and only from Gaia and Uranus but you could have it where Mother and Father had some other Elders around with them, but these other Elders were wilder and kept causing trouble and so had to be locked away.
The Children, taking over aspects of the world and guiding the six races, might have collectively had the power to release the Elders, but only together and none of them might have been so inclined. Your mage, on the other hand (or mages if more than one worked this) could have wanted to capture the Children to release the Elders - possibly in hope of being able to gain a reward from them (that or controlling them or gaining their powers). If the spell didn't work as planned, the Children could have been trapped in some way and might only be able to be released under certain circumstances. Of course, if they're trapped in items, gathering all six could allow you to release the Elders...
Could you please elaborate on what you mean when you say Wicca?
Indagare, I like your ideas a lot, Especially the idea of the six holding the keys to unlock the other Elder Gods beyond mother and Father. As for Keeping an Orckin God, I have considered keeping one.
OldManAlexi, I really like your idea of a seventh that represents freedom and hope, and may look into the idea of a young goddess. The original six never had children themselves, at least while gods. The idea I had of what happened to them was that the evil mage stole all power from them, turning them into Mortals, meaning their bloodlines exist in the mortal realm. But trapping they themselves somewhere might be interesting as well. And I really like the idea of the Misborn. I'd need to figure out what the six original gods represented first to decide what the twisted versions look like or represent, but I really like it.
Kelsey, i won't lie and say I know of Wicca. What I know is very little, and the influence was derived from a mother and father god pair that created the universe, with the mother god being more of the god figure than anything else. I have been wanting to look more into it so I might find more influence though. Do you have ideas to share maybe?
Even the basic story sounds awesome, dotting to watch progress and to maybe 'steal' this at a later date
Indagare, I like your ideas a lot, Especially the idea of the six holding the keys to unlock the other Elder Gods beyond mother and Father. As for Keeping an Orckin God, I have considered keeping one.
OldManAlexi, I really like your idea of a seventh that represents freedom and hope, and may look into the idea of a young goddess. The original six never had children themselves, at least while gods. The idea I had of what happened to them was that the evil mage stole all power from them, turning them into Mortals, meaning their bloodlines exist in the mortal realm. But trapping they themselves somewhere might be interesting as well. And I really like the idea of the Misborn. I'd need to figure out what the six original gods represented first to decide what the twisted versions look like or represent, but I really like it.
Kelsey, i won't lie and say I know of Wicca. What I know is very little, and the influence was derived from a mother and father god pair that created the universe, with the mother god being more of the god figure than anything else. I have been wanting to look more into it so I might find more influence though. Do you have ideas to share maybe?
I'm glad to help! Perhaps this combo will work:
The Mother and the Father, after long years of fighting, had placed the Elders in prisons because of their wild, dangerous natures. They then used a combination of their powers to lock the prison - and only a combination of their powers could release the Elders.
After this, there was peace, and Mother and Father were able to have Children. Six were born at one birthing, and helped Mother and Father to shape the world and the races in it. Each of the Six had a portion of the power of the Mother and a portion of the power of the Father. All Six could work together and release the Elders, but they knew from their parents how dangerous this was, and saw it in the remaining things the Elders had created which still roamed the world.
Meanwhile, the Elders strained against their prisons, but they could not escape. By chance a mage came near the prisons and the Elders corrupted him, promising him godhood and giving him a spell, a spell that could bind the Children and give him their powers - after this, he would release the Elders and rule with them.
The mage used the spell, but because he was mortal, it did not work as planned. The Children were reduced, but their innate divinity could not be removed. They became trapped, their memories lost. They wandered the world, their physical bodies could be killed, but their spirits would simply create a new shell elsewhere. They came to know and love many mortals, and from their seed the Godborn arose.
Though he had power equaling the Mother and Father, the mage's mind was mortal and overwhelmed and he was compelled to mate with a member of each of the mortal races. In each union he lost a bit of divine might, which came to seed as the Misborn - evil corruptions of the original Six, yet slightly less powerful because the mage himself also retained a bit of the divine power, making them equals. But the Godborn were bane to anything the Misborn created, and so protected the mortal realm.
In sorrow, Mother gave birth to a seventh child, a girl who represented freedom and hope. They then used magic to create six divine avatars, to take over the duties of the Six until they could be found (the spell the Elders gave hid the Six when it stripped them of their powers) and to fight the Misborn.
The Misborn and the mage tried and failed to release the Elders. Only the pure spirits of the Six could undo the locks of their prisons. And so the Great Hunt began...
Something to consider is the purpose of the pantheon. Religion is a tool we use to help ourselves make sense of the world around us. For example, the Native Americans who lived in the Montana region have a story about The Buffalo Dance. Their way of life was inundated with the cycle of life. They killed animals so that they themselves could live.
What I would suggest is finding something unique to your campaign and using an aspect of the story of your pantheon to explain it. Or reverse engineering that, finding something different about the pantheon and using that for inspiration about the world. It could be something that is different about the physics of the world, the natural order or just something inherent to the culture.
An example, the pantheon might include a story about a hero who isn't shown hospitality during his trials, the hero could even be one of the gods. Shortly thereafter, each of the individuals who refused him safe harbor has some sort of bad misfortune. The actual world itself suffers from dangerous nights for some reason (monsters, weather, whatever) and so there it is a strong tradition of giving travels a place to stay for the night.
Not every god/concept needs to have such easily connected dots to the "real world" in the campaign, but having a couple of them can make it much easier for the players to grasp/remember.
When I did some work on making a pantheon, I decided that the gods didn't create the universe; the universe is a side-effect of the first deific beings' appearance, ex nihlo.
The first set of "gods" were the Elemental Thrones.
The Fates (I had four) emerged from the shadows behind the Thrones.
The Thrones created various gods to oversee the day-to-aeon running of the universe.
Behind all these entities were the Cycle and the Balance, from which I had druidic cults spring.
A nod to Lovecraft with the Averted, beings (horrors) from Beyond Space.
Big war in heaven, yadda-yadda, 3 of the 4 original Thrones killed, replaced by gods. The very first mortal Ascendant, the first of the "new gods."
The elves, having seen this, begin a many thousands of years long project to create their own gods (it worked) more "new gods."
... and so on, and so forth.
The important thing, to my mind, is making sure your pantheon has consistent reasons for the gods to relate to each other, and to mortals, as they do.
My "old gods" -- the ones made by the Thrones -- were simple, had simple portfolios, and held broad sway over extensive areas of reality. Sun goddess, moon god, etc.
The "new gods" tend to be more focused, and more abstract -- god of trade, goddess of wealth, patron gods of various professions, etc.
Anyway, having a few fast-and-loose categories of god helped me immensely when I was trying to figure out who rules what.
Alitan, thanks. I'll use that as a well to help explain the roles of the gods themselves. Same to you Irontruth. Your notes on the reasons pantheons exist will help me a lot, going from Broad to more precise types of gods. Irontruth, your idea of the adventurer being shunned instead of given home is a tale that begets adventurers to have a place to rest.
Indagare, again, even more great ideas. I'll try to get a little more written down and finalize some small aspects before putting it here for more review and ideas.
Keep them coming guys!
If studying mythology/religion and what it means to the human experience sounds like a useful/interesting subject, I highly recommend checking out Joseph Campbell. In 1949 he published a book that essentially created the field of comparative mythology, noting that the central themes of the stories from each culture were basically the same.
If you have netflix, there's a short series "Joseph Campbell: Mythos" that consists of two 5 hour lectures (segmented into 1 hour episodes). They were recorded just prior to his death and to a certain extent he intended them to be a summation of his career and theories. The lecture is somewhat dry, there's no special effects or anything, but it's easy to follow and he's an interesting speaker.
He was also interviewed by Bill Moyers (a very good interviewer) that accompanied a book The Power of Myth. Somewhat nerd related he talks about how Star Wars follows all the key aspects of the traditional hero myth/journey.
Okay, here's what I have for ideas so far!
The universe is chaos, Born from the primal anarchy of existence. From the swaths of energy born the elder beings, creatures that manipulated the chaos they were born from. Like the chaotic womb that breadth them, these beings reeked chaos in all forms, creating the universe and it’s celestial bodies to best inflict their chaos. Rock was pushed together to create the earth. Fire spilled from the mountains to create oceans of lava. Water flooded the canyons to give birth to the oceans and rivers. Air filled the skies to contain everything together. Finally, the sun and the moon, thrown into the sky to light the world through day and night.
But two of these elder beings saw something beautiful within the horrific chaos. These two elder beings used the power of chaos to create an astral prison, and then fought together against their fellow elder beings. The battle built the universe and stars, sealing their fellow elders within the prison of the stars and keeping the secrets of their release. [Idea: The stars are the elder god beings locked away, and mother and father are the sun and original moon? [There are three moons in my world]].
An era of peace was born, and the elder beings, Mother, and Father, grew to know the chaos and harmony of love. From their seeds came the six gods of the races. Six gods who bore from them the life of races on the planet.
Josiah, god of the humans nation
Cécile, goddess of the elven people
Marveck, god to the dwarvenkind
Nemos, god to the gnomes
Meriana, goddess of the Halfling people
Gorven, god to the orckin
[Any and all names are work in progress]
Time was peaceful for many a year. The various races strived but lived in harmony, creating a prosperous time for the world. The six children of Mother and Father forsaw the world in their stead while they rested, communing with the earthbound children of the six to guide them in the right path. But not all found guidance. Two children who studied the primordial chaos of magic became envious of the power of the gods, wanting it for themselves. These mages, Azula and Rajan, Sought to find a way to take the power of the gods from them, and their prayers were heard. The whispers of the elder gods locked in their prisons twinkled in the night, gifting the mages with a power to become gods by stealing the power of the other children.
With this new knowledge, the mages sought their power. They called the gods to them, and of all the gods, five of the six came to them. Gorven, being weary of their call and more occupied with his own strong children, remained in his throne to oversee his children through a drought. Little did Gorven know this would be smart, as his five brothers and sisters became enthralled with the mages, their powers stolen by the mages. In retaliation for the injustice against his brothers and sisters, Gorven sent his children to war against the mages, creating the first bloodshed seen in the earth’s history. He lead his own armies, taking on the mages, But his powers were not enough. The mages sought ultimate strength, taking the power of his godhood from Gorvin and tossing him aside like the children, leaving them mortal with gods blood.
But the mages grew even more greedy. The condition given by the Elder gods was to seek the release of them. They sought Mother and Father, taking them on, but found the answer to the release of the Elder beings under their noses. The secret to opening the prison of the Elders was held by the children. Enraged, the mages tried to destroy the creations of the god children, but the mother and father stopped them, throwing them in their own special prisons within the sky to create the red and blue moon.
The years following showed what the Mother and father feared. From the taint of thre mages power, twisted beings birthed from the wombs of the mortals. Mutated grotesque beings with the power of pure chaos, these beings became known as the Eldarspawn, to show how close they were to the primordial chaos of their parental heritage. In grief, Mother birthed a new daughter, one of hope and faith, to show how much she wished for her children to return. In time, new beings arose, Divine birthrights upon children touched by the six, each born with a portion of their power. These god born fought the Eldarspawn, protecting humanity, and arising in death to a level of godhood to help oversee their nations.