I am trying to pathfinderize a 20th level artificer, and I'm running into the stumbling block of what could his capstone ability could be?
Any ideas?
Also, if anyone has any input as to what other changes are necessary to bring him to par, I would appreciate the input.
Thanks,
Taka
I dont think It needs a capstone. the abilty it grants are powerful as is. Only think that needs changed is the craft reserve.
Normally is is x amount of xp. As xp cost is gone, you times the amount x 5 and make that the amount of gold you may not spend on an item.
so at level 1 its a 100 GP limit at 20th it is 25'ooo gp limit.
Note I always state you may never use it to pay 100% of the cost.
but really the increasing reserve and the new infusions are enough to keep taking the class to 20.
It was always a powerful class. There is no need to make it stronger it is on par as is.
I also fixed the weird hiccup in the spell progression. I'm not sure if that was a typo or what.
if ya mean the one staring at 4th level infusions yeah, I always guessed typo and fixed it myself.
I played with an Artificer in an Eberron campaign and we usually had one of the following scenarios:
1) 10 minutes to prepare. Artificer is totally awesome, buffs everything in sight, and basically get to go nova.
2) Surprised. Artificer is sucky unless he starts using those action points. Since those are limited by level, he tended to just plink away at monsters with his crossbow unless he felt the situation was desperate or we were close to leveling.
I'm not sure how I would run this as a DM, but I don't think it would be easy. I definitely wouldn't pull their casting time down to standard actions. Infusions are pretty powerful compared to spells - the balancing factor is their casting time.
There were a few huge problems I had with the class that I took the chance to nerf for Pathfinder. The aforementioned infusion progression hiccup... A little more generous on the Skill list...
But also the implied ability to combine UMD with crafting scrolls was too much. My Wizard player was having a grand time hording hard-won spells from various sources, and suddenly we had a character who could just pull any scroll out of his exhaust pipe (he's a warforged, too). Sure they would make a great team in that regard, but the fun was gone.
In the end, we decided that the Artificer could copy spells but not create a spell they hadn't encountered. In my case, this was a feature of his being a warforged (he's the only one) "absorbing" the spell into a special battery. I suggest a similar rule, even if it amounts to a "recipe book," just so you don't completely destroy the art of scrounging Wizard spells.
...if that's important to you.
Honestly, it's a cool concept but very sloppily executed in my opinion.
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Being that I always oppossed the eberron setting when I heard it was selected in Dragon, I purchased, read, than sold my book a long time ago. And keep in mind this is comming from someone that likes to play utility clerics, what is the appeal of the artificer? It just seems like a completely boring idea to me, not in need of its own class.
I had a friend try one out when it first came out, and even watching him play it a few months, I couldn't understand what could be interesting about it. So what is the artificer love?
Being that I always oppossed the eberron setting when I heard it was selected in Dragon, I purchased, read, than sold my book a long time ago. And keep in mind this is comming from someone that likes to play utility clerics, what is the appeal of the artificer? It just seems like a completely boring idea to me, not in need of its own class.
I had a friend try one out when it first came out, and even watching him play it a few months, I couldn't understand what could be interesting about it. So what is the artificer love?
As far as I can tell, it mostly indulges people's inner mad scientist, the part of them that wants to use something they made themselves to destroy whatever they're facing. Now, a wizard could do it ordinarily, but that's different. A wizard, he just forces reality to do something then he's done, the magic's gone. An artificer, he can take this simple piece of wood, and he can make it do whatever he wants, then he makes it do it again.
In other ways, other spellcasters say "I know of a way to solve our problem!" Artificers say "I already made a way to solve our problem."
Being that I always oppossed the eberron setting when I heard it was selected in Dragon, I purchased, read, than sold my book a long time ago. And keep in mind this is comming from someone that likes to play utility clerics, what is the appeal of the artificer? It just seems like a completely boring idea to me, not in need of its own class.
I had a friend try one out when it first came out, and even watching him play it a few months, I couldn't understand what could be interesting about it. So what is the artificer love?
As far as I can tell, it mostly indulges people's inner mad scientist, the part of them that wants to use something they made themselves to destroy whatever they're facing. Now, a wizard could do it ordinarily, but that's different. A wizard, he just forces reality to do something then he's done, the magic's gone. An artificer, he can take this simple piece of wood, and he can make it do whatever he wants, then he makes it do it again.
In other ways, other spellcasters say "I know of a way to solve our problem!" Artificers say "I already made a way to solve our problem."
...
But also the implied ability to combine UMD with crafting scrolls was too much. My Wizard player was having a grand time hording hard-won spells from various sources, and suddenly we had a character who could just pull any scroll out of his exhaust pipe (he's a warforged, too). Sure they would make a great team in that regard, but the fun was gone.
..
I think I am reading here that the Artificer can create a scroll and then the wizard copies that spell into his spellbook?
That actually does not work as the wizard can only copy arcane scrolls and the artificer actually creates Artificer scrolls which are neither arcane or divine. So if an artificer creates a scroll of fireball the wizard can't use the scroll unless he makes a successful UMD. As the fireball is not on the artificer's class list even the artificer that crafted the scroll has to make a UMD roll to cast it successfully.
So the wizard still has to do his research and study to get access to those rare and hard to find spells.
My group is starting up a game using PfRPG rules as soon as the final release hits our doorsteps. The game will be based in the WizO setting of Eberron and one of our newer players is intrigued by the Artificer. I am concerned that the Artificer is going to be seriously outclassed by the new core classes at all levels and I was hoping to get some debate and dialog going about the power balance of lower level Artificers - I am less concerned about Cap Stone since I doubt we will ever hit level 20....
My home games have had unlimited cantrips and artificers for awhile and the unlimited cantrips does seem to hurt the artificer. So I came up with a new class features that helps with this problem. I think it gives them back the versatility the class is suppose to have and still sticks with the theme of infusing items.
Basically the artificer can infuse a small metal or wood wand with a single cantrip (arcane or divine) with a limited number of charges. Then the artificer and only the artificer can use that wand to cast those cantrips. The wand can be used over and over again and each time its charged the cantrip placed in it can be changed. The charges only stay in the wand for a short duration.
Here are the full details:
My groups Wiki page on Artificers
Artificer Cantrip Wand: Artificers can infuse a special kind of wand known as an artificer cantrip wand. The infusion process requires a standard action that completely fills the wand with a number of charges equal to your artificer level. This ability can be used an unlimited number of times per day. Each time the wand is infused it can hold any single arcane or divine cantrip from the groups allowed books. A wand can be charged and used over and over again as the wand does not burn out or become useless after its charges have been used up. This is different from a normal wand. Once the wand is charged only the artificer that charged the wand can activate it. As the artificer cantrip wand is an infused item use magic device skill can not be used on it.
- Wand Activation: Unless the infused spell needs a longer casting time, the wand can be activated as a standard action. Each activation uses up one charge. The spells cast by the wand are at the same caster level(CL) as the artificer that infused the wand.
- Wand Charges: The wand holds a number of charges equal to your artificer class level. These charges are held for a number of rounds equal to your artificer class level before the wand loses all charges. An artificer can only have one wand charged per 5 artificer levels at any given time (ie 2 at level 5, 3 at level 10, 4 at level 15, and 5 at level 20).
- Wand Creation/Material: An artificer cantrip wand can be made out of the same material as normal magical wands or more expensive and durable materials. The only requirement is it has a minimum material cost of 20gp worth of material. The wand can be crafted by anyone with at least one level of the artificer class. Many artificers craft their own wands, but others occasionally purchase them. Whether the wand is crafted or purchased, the minimum cost is 20gp for an artificer cantrip wand.
There were a lot of suggestions in this old thread.
My final version of the Artificer was near the end of the thread itself (after that some of the most broken combos of the Artificer were made known to me).
Here is a thread at the WotC board that is VERY useful for the artificer. It even has a link to a PDF version of the thread content at the bottom of the first post.