TLDR down at bottom;
Background: I have a player who is new to d20 roleplaying, I'm trying to get her into pathfinder because I'm a big fan and my group is finishing up our white-wolf campaign.
Well, this particular player is resistant to DnD, likely due to the stereotypes. But she has enjoyed clawing more and more and the vast number of creative options you have for your characters. So after long sessions of saying yes, or no, to any particular "CAN I DO THAT!" she ended up wanting to be a Gnoll character, who after being cursed by a wizard, lich, or some other supernatural whatyado (we haven't hammered out the specifics) becomes a sorcerer of the Undead bloodline. Now she has her heart set on encountering and contracting lycanthropy.
The end result is supposed to be a fireball breathing, undead-gnoll-were-crocodile.
I thought maybe someone would get a kick out of all that but here's the Question:
I want to acquiesce to as much of this as I can, anything to get her into D20. So rather than contracting a disease that makes you frenzy upon being injured I decided that the bite of the ***** spells from D&D would be a good alternative. Now there is no were crocodile version of the spell but I figure the stats for were tiger work just as well, maybe up the strength from +12 to +16 and then take away the 2 claw attacks in lieu of str+1/2 on 1 bite. Overall damage is less I think. Only real issue is the purview of the adventure wont bring her the levels necessary to cast high-level magic.
TLDR: Is it gamebreaking to allow a sorcerer to learn bite of the were tiger at the same level as a druid? Or alternatively, would halving the durration of the transformation merit lowing it's caster level? I want this spell to be accessible earlier, any suggestions?
TLDR down at bottom;
Background: I have a player who is new to d20 roleplaying, I'm trying to get her into pathfinder because I'm a big fan and my group is finishing up our white-wolf campaign.
Well, this particular player is resistant to DnD, likely due to the stereotypes. But she has enjoyed clawing more and more and the vast number of creative options you have for your characters. So after long sessions of saying yes, or no, to any particular "CAN I DO THAT!" she ended up wanting to be a Gnoll character, who after being cursed by a wizard, lich, or some other supernatural whatyado (we haven't hammered out the specifics) becomes a sorcerer of the Undead bloodline. Now she has her heart set on encountering and contracting lycanthropy.
The end result is supposed to be a fireball breathing, undead-gnoll-were-crocodile.
I thought maybe someone would get a kick out of all that but here's the Question:
I want to acquiesce to as much of this as I can, anything to get her into D20. So rather than contracting a disease that makes you frenzy upon being injured I decided that the bite of the ***** spells from D&D would be a good alternative. Now there is no were crocodile version of the spell but I figure the stats for were tiger work just as well, maybe up the strength from +12 to +16 and then take away the 2 claw attacks in lieu of str+1/2 on 1 bite. Overall damage is less I think. Only real issue is the purview of the adventure wont bring her the levels necessary to cast high-level magic.
TLDR: Is it gamebreaking to allow a sorcerer to learn bite of the were tiger at the same level as a druid? Or alternatively, would halving the durration of the transformation merit lowing it's caster level? I want this spell to be accessible earlier, any suggestions?
I want to say giving class specific/defining spells usually involved a level bump. Back in a previous edition I think there were arcane spells that allowed for healing, but were at least a level (and more likely two) higher. So I don't see a problem with allowing it, there are rules for researching spells for this reason, I would just bump up the level of the spell once maybe. If you have the funds, and the player is really into the world of darkness type theme, I'd suggest looking into the Oathbound:Eclipse pdf. There are some rules involving were-ish and vampire characters in there that don't involve an immediate large CR adjustment right off the bat (err...no pun intended lol) and allow the character to grow and gain abilities more organically. Our current game is using some of the rules, in total they are fairly solid, just some abilities could have been spelled out a bit better. But that is where the DM comes in ;-)
Regardless, they would help the player get the concept that they are angling for and doesn't involved the damage/save or rage issue you are trying to avoid. It was well worth the money just for the reading, let alone the races, adaptions and other crunch. As a pdf you could go through, find what you like, copy/paste into another document and give that to the player as something to use if you wanted to pick and choose the rules you find viable for the adventure.
Edit: Paizo link to product
I just re-read the rules for Lycans in pathfinder. They are substantially weaker now. The werecrocodile, rather than getting a +8 to his strength in hybrid form, gets the higher of the original form or the crocodile's strength. So if a really strong character who has a 20 would get only +1 for going into hybrid form, though they do get +2 now no matter what animal it is.
2 questions:
First: to the developers, why were lycanthropes made so much weaker?
Second: what would spells like "Bite of the weretiger" look like (in terms of spell level) using the new system for lycanthropey strength?
I just re-read the rules for Lycans in pathfinder. They are substantially weaker now. The werecrocodile, rather than getting a +8 to his strength in hybrid form, gets the higher of the original form or the crocodile's strength. So if a really strong character who has a 20 would get only +1 for going into hybrid form, though they do get +2 now no matter what animal it is.
2 questions:
First: to the developers, why were lycanthropes made so much weaker?
Second: what would spells like "Bite of the weretiger" look like (in terms of spell level) using the new system for lycanthropey strength?
I can't speak for the dev team but I can point you to the massive changes in the polymorph school. "Were-" templates were rather powerful for what they were, you even gained the beast HD if I remember correctly. All for a measly 3(ish) LA. That in and of itself was over powered if you think about it. My guess would be adjusting the were- templates to someplace where they were both balanced and usable, was a factor in the changes.
As for the second question, find a X-shape spell of equivalent level and mine that for the appropriate stat bonus and size equivalent natural weapon damage. I'm not sure the "Bite of X" spells were OGL, so I don't think you're going to get a dev response on it. You would be better off asking the question in the conversion forum, not here on the rules forum for PFRPG (as it isn't a PFRPG spell).
I think giving her the spell is fine. I wold pick a sorcerer Bloodline write a variant of it ala the wild blooded archetypes and change a few spells foe her them and it will work fine.