| Unicore |
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My play group is not really familiar enough with vehicle rules for anyone to feel real comfortable doing much vehicle play testing with this class, but I thought hard about going stunt driver and piloting a Velocipede.
On the pros side:
You are always next to a prop.
You use your speed for the speed of the vehicle so you can benefit from propelling strides (drive is a move action).
You'd be the BMX bandit.
On the Cons side:
past very low levels, your bike is going to get wrecked very quickly.
So many Daredevil feats move you, but don't let you substitute in a drive action so you can't use a lot of your abilities on a bike.
It isn't clear how many hands you need to drive a vehicle.
Vehicle rules get complicated about only being able to move one time and with something like a bike, that restriction feels silly and detrimental to the BMX Bandit fantasy.
You'd be the BMX bandit.
I think there is a lot of potential for the DD to interact better with vehicles and to introduce skateboards, roller skates, and potentially surf boards or other no hands/1 hand land, water and even air vehicles that use the drivers movement speed, but it is pretty difficult to test any of that out and report back on it effectively.
I think stunt driver probably should be baked into the class if the book these classes come out in has these kind of vehicles and they are one way that the class is intended to be able to be played. That would include having several more feats that include "drive" in the kinds of movement they allow.
For example, Rushing Stride feels built for something like this, but even maneuver feats like Forceful Kickoff Stunt would be very awesome with a bike or skateboard. Maybe even have some feats that allow for boarding to be a part of the movement and you could really have a very cool stunt driver build possible.
I tried to include these ideas in my general survey but I think it is worth pointing out here too and seeing if others would want the DD class to be able to be played this way.
| Mathmuse |
On March 3 my playtest daredevil tried out Stunt Driver in a rowboat (Kittyhawk, playtest daredevil, comment #19). But that was a race to get out of sight rather than combat, so only the +2 circumstance bonus from Stunt Driver was tested. And the test result was that the higher-Intelligence party members were just as good at Sailing Lore as Kittyhawk with her +2.
That rowboat was a Folding Boat, so the party is still carrying it. Maybe I can test out rowboat combat against an upcoming lake monster.
You use your speed for the speed of the vehicle so you can benefit from propelling strides (drive is a move action).
Are you saying that the daredevil pushes off the Velocipede as a prop to speed up the velocipede? That does not make sense in the usual sense of pushing off; on the other hand, pedaling requires pushing against pedals and rowing requires pushing against water with oars.
past very low levels, your bike is going to get wrecked very quickly.
The Props are not damaged when used, so wrecking the bike will require an enemy making an attack directly against the bike.
It isn't clear how many hands you need to drive a vehicle.
I would view riding a bike with one hand off the handlebars are reckless driving.
I recall someone--might have been Unicore--speculating that Risk & Reward might also have a section on more vehicles and reckless endeavors with them. I would accept a new clockwork motorcyle designed to let a daredevil play a motorcycle stunt driver. The daredevil's Stunt Driver feat should expand Daring Stunt to allow Driving instead of Striding, but we would also need clear rules about Grappling, Repositioning, Shoving, or Tripping from riding position.
If we allow a motorcycle stunt driver, we should also allow a horseback stunt rider. That would open up an animal companion line for the daredevil.
| Unicore |
Stunt driver is pretty clear that on a vehicle, you can treat that vehicle as a prop, so propelling speed should work mechanically with a velocipede and thematically as well. DDs should be fast on a bicycle. Really, they should be able to apply the bonus to all vehicle speeds, but right now the velocipede is the only one.
| exequiel759 |
If a vehicle, in this case a velocipede, can count as a prop with the Stunt Driver feat, which are the benefits exactly? I assume that means that it would benefit from Propelling Strides while riding and that can work as a mobile prop, but its worth it? You can't shove or reposition a creature into a vehicle you are riding, so unless you take Take the Wheel from the trick driver archetype I think the action cost of riding your velocipede into melee, unmount, and move away from your velocipede so you can push people into it isn't really worth the action cost.
I totally agree the class should have better support for vehicles on release.
| Unicore |
There is some weird stuff that is close to working, but not quite, based upon the boarding rules.
If you could drive with daring stunt, then daring stunt, grab and head slam would be a pretty awesome and thematic trick.
If stunt driver let you sub boarding actions for steps, then there could be some cool stuff with wheeling pull stunt. Ride up with a daring stunt and trip, wheeling pull stunt to jump off your moving bike(but still ask to both, grab them, pull them into the bike, then third action, reboard, or maybe even try to do the same thing again to reboard.
Stuff like that doesn’t seem overly powerful, but would be pretty cool and thematic.
It’d be even cooler if some of the personal sized vehicles could get runes that could add to colision damage, running over damage AND stunt damage.
| Unicore |
would freewheeling stike be too powerful if drive was included?
A fight on a boat would already enable full regular movement with this feat so I don't think so, but it would be a particularly strong ability. Perhaps the fact that you might need 1 hand to pilot the bike makes it less exploitable in a broken way?
| OrochiFuror |
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I want hover board shoes/skates now. Kick flips and ollies while slamming in to people for damage.
A gang of Kobolds, Goblins, Gnomes and Halflings called "The smalls", who skate and bike around Absolom. Led by Ricky Smalls, a gnome with a pompadour who does punk rock while swinging his hips.
So yes, we need vehicular integration, especially for personal craft.