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To add another wrinkle to this, a lot of local "lodges" have multiple sessions of the same scenario on a game day with VOLUNTEER GMs. If these VOLUNTEERS are expected to pay out of pocket for the privilege of running at someone else's event, AFTER spending hundreds, maybe thousands of dollars on books ($65/ea), maps ($25-30/ea), and minis (yeah, I know, from Wizkids, but still $8+/ea), I see a lot of VOLUNTEERS dropping out. I VOLUNTEERED to run a scenario at a game store 90 miles away, but the VC said that he couldn't give me a copy of the scenario, not even a hard copy when I get there an hour early. Guess who's no longer VOLUNTEERING to help out?
Are they TRYING to lose VOLUNTEER GMs???
Marcia Schoonover
The Once and Future (now maybe non-existent) GM
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To add another wrinkle to this, a lot of local "lodges" have multiple sessions of the same scenario on a game day with VOLUNTEER GMs. If these VOLUNTEERS are expected to pay out of pocket for the privilege of running at someone else's event, AFTER spending hundreds, maybe thousands of dollars on books ($65/ea), maps ($25-30/ea), and minis (yeah, I know, from Wizkids, but still $8+/ea), I see a lot of VOLUNTEERS dropping out. I VOLUNTEERED to run a scenario at a game store 90 miles away, but the VC said that he couldn't give me a copy of the scenario, not even a hard copy when I get there an hour early. Guess who's no longer VOLUNTEERING to help out?
Are they TRYING to lose VOLUNTEER GMs???
Marcia Schoonover
The Once and Future (now maybe non-existent) GM
The VC absolutely may loan you a physical copy to run from. In fact, any person can loan another a physical copy of a scenario to run. That has been the case for years. Perhaps your VC didn’t know that (and if your VC did not know that, then that’s a major issue that needs to be resolved.). If the store owner is a registered retailer with Paizo, I believe they also get the scenarios, too, and could loan you a physical copy.
But, generally speaking, it has been true since the beginning of organized play here that GMs were generally expected to buy their own scenarios, that’s not new.
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The VC absolutely may loan you a physical copy to run from. In fact, any person can loan another a physical copy of a scenario to run. That has been the case for years. Perhaps your VC didn’t know that (and if your VC did not know that, then that’s a major issue that needs to be resolved.). If the store owner is a registered retailer with Paizo, I believe they also get the scenarios, too, and could loan you a physical copy.
But, generally speaking, it has been true since the beginning of organized play here that GMs were generally expected to buy their own scenarios, that’s not new.
The VC has already given his one allowed copy to another GM, so no love for me.
But if they're expecting the GMs to buy their own copies, it's no wonder we're losing GMs right and left. We only have 4 left in our town of the 12 or more we had two years ago. As I said earlier, I would buy mine for private games, where I run for my friends, but when running for the organization or store, it's a lot to ask from someone who is volunteering to run for strangers.
Marcia
Contributor
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Now, now. Don't blame the volunteer who drove 90 minutes to run a game. She's right to be a little frustrated.
In Minnesota, we worked hard to help cover some of the hidden costs to GMing. That's why the Twin Cities has a map lending library -- we're trying to provide support to our new GMs. And if cost of scenarios is a problem for a GM, we lend them. But not every area can afford to have a map library. We were lucky to have a number of GMs who had large map collections and created a spreadsheet of who has what, and started providing the maps and filling in holes in the collection. Almost all of my Paizo bucks (aka convention gift certificates) go towards that map collection, and I've had numerous local GMs donate maps to us after they've benefited.
But that took time to administrate, build, and persuade other locals of the use of it, and quite a bit of cash from a number of local GMs.
Other areas may have a single Venture Officer (or no Venture Officer) who is doing the best that they can with the resources they have. It can be tough to build a region.
Marcia, you might want to let your Venture Officer know that he can now lend out a single electronic copy of a scenario provided that you promise to delete it after use. The rules have changed a bit, and that may help. We want you to stay a volunteer. Goodness knows that we need all our GMs.
And thank you for the volunteering that you did for Organized Play before. I'm hoping that we can win you back.
Hmm
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I totally get that it must have been frustrating to drive that far and then not have a copy of the scenario you expected to get. I'm not blaming anyone. I was just trying to say it's much harder to try to fix something an hour before the game starts. If anything, the Venture Officer should have let the volunteers know what they needed to bring. Everyone's human and makes mistakes; I'm all about how to make it better for next time.
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I dislike the changes.
Remove stat blocks for common mobs, the special ones are suppose to be continued, pushes more prep time onto GMs. Now GMs have to have to access to NPC Core, Monster Core (n-1 as more monster cores comes out), and Alien Cores. And now stat blocks are going to span multiple pages or be pages away feom the actual encounter location. Ao flipping back and forth, just like in PFS1e. So the reduction in adventure length doesn't mean less time for GMs to prep.
I understand the AP argument. APs are bigger and have limited space. And they are PRINTED while PFS/SFS adventures are not printed. So I dont buy it when someone says that APs don't have stat blocks. Yes they do. For the special entities.
I also don't believe adventures ever made money. They are given away to venture officers and to GMs that receive Con support from Paizo. That is a hugh number of free digital copies.
The decision to reduce the size and time is purely an economic decision that I suspect was fought hard but the people who don't play the game and only look at the numbers made the decision.
I am fearful that this decision will kill Oranized Play as we know it now.
Venture-Agent, Virginia—Newport News
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The decision to reduce the size and time is purely an economic decision that I suspect was fought hard but the people who don't play the game and only look at the numbers made the decision.
As someone who has often had to rush the endings before stores closed, or drag scenarios into the next week's session, I would dispute that statement.
Some folks/stores can only do weeknight sessions, and stores aren't staying open as late as they used to since the COVID pandemic.
Venture-Captain, North Carolina—Central Region
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As the VC in question above, I'm disappointed that what I said is being so drastically misrepresented. I said I'm allowed to share one copy, and that I had already shared it with the other signed up GM, a local who asked weeks ago. We've both had the conversation about how many copies a Venture-Officer can have lent at a time a couple of times recently, so I did not expect it to be a surprise.
As an additional note, the game in question has not yet occurred, so no one drive 90 minutes only to have this happen. And our store does not have a retailer\store account with Paizo... The staff has so many other products\events they're juggling I have tried to avoid adding another to their plate.
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As the VC in question above, I'm disappointed that what I said is being so drastically misrepresented. I said I'm allowed to share one copy, and that I had already shared it with the other signed up GM, a local who asked weeks ago. We've both had the conversation about how many copies a Venture-Officer can have lent at a time a couple of times recently, so I did not expect it to be a surprise.
This was never about a specific person or situation, as it has been an ongoing problem for years and years. When they have someone volunteering to support their company's product at a public event, they should make it easier to run, not harder. I thought that they had loosened things up since I quit several years ago, as it hasn't seemed to be a problem recently and GMs nowadays had the materials that they needed. I was disappointed that I would not be able to get what I needed when I was willing to drive for 90 minutes to run the game.
I was venting at Paizo for disincentivizing volunteers, never at the VC who was simply applying the rules that Paizo had imposed on him. I'm sorry I hurt him. I wasn't mad at him. I really wanted to help out and got frustrated with Paizo's limitations.
Marcia
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Whatever the solution is, it seems like something that should have been worked out long before ever getting in a car to drive 90 minutes.
The game is this week. When I realized that I wouldn't have the scenario to prep, I told the VC that I wouldn't be able to make it and dropped out, rather than drive the distance unnecessarily. He was perfectly fine in what he said, as that is what Paizo has told him he has to do. I was just surprised that this was actually a Paizo rule that would serve to limit how many GMs a lodge could support at a given event.
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Whatever the solution is, it seems like something that should have been worked out long before ever getting in a car to drive 90 minutes.The game is this week. When I realized that I wouldn't have the scenario to prep, I told the VC that I wouldn't be able to make it and dropped out, rather than drive the distance unnecessarily. He was perfectly fine in what he said, as that is what Paizo has told him he has to do. I was just surprised that this was actually a Paizo rule that would serve to limit how many GMs a lodge could support at a given event.
I'm glad you found out before you drove that far. I'm surprised, too, that you were not able to get a scenario. Until recently, I've only been playing Play by Post, and at the big Play by Post events online, they offer scenario support to GMs who need it. GAMEDAY XIV had almost 200 tables.
What do you mean by scenario support?
Paizo will gift you the scenario that you wish to run — if you sign up by our deadline. Not included: APs, Adventures in hardback books (eg:Dark Archives, King Maker Companions), Emerald Spire, or Thornkeep.If you need scenario support, you must register your game by August 20, 2025.
GAMEDAY XIV announcement link .
I've just started to GM at our local game store, and the Venture Officer always offers me a copy, although since I started, we have never had an event where the same scenario was played at multiple tables, other than Free RPG Day. So I haven't come across your situation yet. I wonder if it has to do with the size of the event?
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As the VC in question above, I'm disappointed that what I said is being so drastically misrepresented. I said I'm allowed to share one copy, and that I had already shared it with the other signed up GM, a local who asked weeks ago. We've both had the conversation about how many copies a Venture-Officer can have lent at a time a couple of times recently, so I did not expect it to be a surprise.
As an additional note, the game in question has not yet occurred, so no one drive 90 minutes only to have this happen. And our store does not have a retailer\store account with Paizo... The staff has so many other products\events they're juggling I have tried to avoid adding another to their plate.
Thanks for clarifying that. I was reading comments from the bottom up and just saw this. Things make a lot more sense now.
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Marcia, I repeat: I am willing to lend you scenarios in cases where the store is running two of the same adventure. I'm also a VO, and am more than willing to help games outside my area. (You would have to promise to delete the adventures after running them.)
And I also want to iterate Driftbourne's suggestion to run for conventions. Most conventions with 15 or more tables get full scenario support with free copies of the adventure provided to the GM.
Respectfully yours,
Hmm
PS Kyrand, you're a great VC that was in a bind. Rest assured that we all know that.
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The decision to reduce the size and time is purely an economic decision that I suspect was fought hard but the people who don't play the game and only look at the numbers made the decision.As someone who has often had to rush the endings before stores closed, or drag scenarios into the next week's session, I would dispute that statement.
Some folks/stores can only do weeknight sessions, and stores aren't staying open as late as they used to since the COVID pandemic.
True about store hours. I guess I am lucky to be in an area where this is not a problem.
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True about store hours. I guess I am lucky to be in an area where this is not a problem.The decision to reduce the size and time is purely an economic decision that I suspect was fought hard but the people who don't play the game and only look at the numbers made the decision.As someone who has often had to rush the endings before stores closed, or drag scenarios into the next week's session, I would dispute that statement.
Some folks/stores can only do weeknight sessions, and stores aren't staying open as late as they used to since the COVID pandemic.
Our group plays on Saturday, and although the store is open from 10 am to 10 pm we still have to finish on time because the store has other games scheduled after us.
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Here's the thing. Somebody needs to gather the statblocks. It can be done once by Paizo, or it can be done hundreds if not thousands of times by GMs, and adds another point of failure.
Eyup.
I cannot for the life of me, after ...10+ years of asking at least (with a break in the middle largely because they started putting the monsters in), get a sensible answer on what kind of "development" an appendix of critters needs to be function.
Needs. to be functional.
NOT
What kind of development it gets.
If you can't swing the kind of development it gets just run it through an online templater and stick it on there the same way any other DM could. I can't see how any error could possibly be worse than it not being there. If you copy paste in a flux capacitor instead of capacitor flux someone will let you know.
WHY make someone replicate that work ad nauseum?
The bottleneck in running OP is new DMs. How much easier is it to say "here's a scenario, there's the monsters" than " oh right, heres the scenatio, there's the mechanics, go to this other website and download the monsters and switch back and forth between the two files...
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We are on the same page. So after so many years, the only conclusion I come to is that they are trying to save a little money by not paying an editor, or proofreader, or whomever, to put the appendix together.
It comes down to the dollars. And with the mess that the world economy is in because of stupid policies, it is hard for me not to understand. Don't like it but there is very little I can do about it.
I am still playing.
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Here's the thing. Somebody needs to gather the statblocks. It can be done once by Paizo, or it can be done hundreds if not thousands of times by GMs, and adds another point of failure.
Eyup.
I cannot for the life of me, after ...10+ years of asking at least (with a break in the middle largely because they started putting the monsters in), get a sensible answer on what kind of "development" an appendix of critters needs to be function.
Needs. to be functional.
NOT
What kind of development it gets.
If you can't swing the kind of development it gets just run it through an online templater and stick it on there the same way any other DM could. I can't see how any error could possibly be worse than it not being there. If you copy paste in a flux capacitor instead of capacitor flux someone will let you know.
WHY make someone replicate that work ad nauseum?
The bottleneck in running OP is new DMs. How much easier is it to say "here's a scenario, there's the monsters" than " oh right, heres the scenatio, there's the mechanics, go to this other website and download the monsters and switch back and forth between the two files...
On the other hand, if you wanted to hold a pillow over the face of organized play so it dies a slow, quiet death, then this would be a great way to do it.
As I've said before, I can live with the narrower level bands, and with the shorter scenarios (and hey, at least the price is coming down correspondingly). But no stat blocks is a deal killer, and will absolutely ravage the PFS GM pool. Putting aside the question of whether aggressively pursuing cost savings for PFS scenarios (i.e. marketing) is really even a good idea, cutting stat blocks is just an incredibly short-sighted way to go about it.
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I'm a little slower to ascribe malice. I think its one of those gamer things where solution A is not perfect therefore solution B must be the right answer. This goes double when someone assigns a rule, and the rule starts to seem like an unchangeable fact when rules are very changeable. (IE, making the treasure in a scenario balance out to the payout was (is? I think they changed that?) Was an enormous fiddly nit picky PITA that provided only the pay out of.. a little bit of immersion and complying with the rule? I think the immersion could have been solved with a check and or a Bill for in game damages...
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I'm a little slower to ascribe malice. I think its one of those gamer things where solution A is not perfect therefore solution B must be the right answer. This goes double when someone assigns a rule, and the rule starts to seem like an unchangeable fact when rules are very changeable. (IE, making the treasure in a scenario balance out to the payout was (is? I think they changed that?) Was an enormous fiddly nit picky PITA that provided only the pay out of.. a little bit of immersion and complying with the rule? I think the immersion could have been solved with a check and or a Bill for in game damages...
To be clear, I don't actually believe that someone at Paizo is trying to kill organized play.
I do, however, believe that removing stat blocks is such a comically bad idea that I can understand why someone might.
I think Paizo more often than not gets things right, but occasionally they get obstinate about sticking with really boneheaded decisions (like say, Pathfinder Online). I did a few years as a software engineer right out of college in the late nineties, and it was blindingly obvious that Paizo really had no clue what they were biting off with that one (though they at least had the sense to eventually spin Goblinworks off so it wouldn't take the whole company down with it).
The stat block decision seems similarly clueless...no matter how I come at it, it just makes no earthly sense.
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Can’t say I have a stake in this argument having been out of OP for awhile, but I do think the stat block removal will be a problem that gets revisited.
This is my hope as well.
Looking at the experience on display by the commentors,hopefully that will come into play. Lots of Stars, Novas, and Glyphs shown here.
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I'm honestly surprised at how big of a deal so many people think this is. I just bring a side-device with me (in my case, an older mobile phone from two upgrades ago) to have stat blocks available on. If I'm going to be GMing somewhere with no / questionable internet, then part of my scenario prep is to rip said stat blocks from a PDF/AoN ahead of time, and plop them onto my side device as a local file (pdf, jpg, whatever.)
I dunno, doesn't feel especially onerous or deal-breaking to me. Maybe I'm just used to doing a bunch of digital prep work ahead of time, from all those years of Pandemic VTT, though ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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I dunno, doesn't feel especially onerous or deal-breaking to me. Maybe I'm just used to doing a bunch digital prep work ahead of time, from all those years of Pandemic VTT, though ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
It's not someone thats used to prep work that I'm worried about , it's someone that you're handing ok, here is how this whole organized play thing works, here's the dming, here's the scenario, here's a door barricading rulebook, here's you in charge of taking responsibility for everyone's fun night, here's the scenario don't forget to bring it and here's the prep don't forget to bring it...
They didn't used to be there. It was annoying. They put it in and there was much cheering Woo HOOOOO, and NO ONE. I mean NO ONE said "Arrrgh this is terrible!"
I will admit, some of this is my personal pet peeve of letting the perfect being the enemy of the good. I HATE that thought process and I see it a LOT with gamers. If your options are nothing or something that looks terrible but works well the thing that looks terrible but works still works but.
This comes down to someone with a professional PDF editor does this amount of work once or 1,000 people all do slightly more work 1,000 times. ...do you have ANY idea how good an idea needed to be to NOT get any complaints out of this crowd? Before everyone split off into different discords?
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I think how people play might have a big factor on how they prep.
In play-by-post, I'm used to having to convert all stat blocks into a usable format for dice expressions in the forums, but the pace of play is so slow that it doesn't matter to have it all done before starting the game.
I have no VTT experience.
My first live game GMing SFS was 2 weeks ago. I printed out the scenario, and I made a note card for each encounter or skill challenge (most of the skill challenges listed 6 or 7 options.) I practiced a few times, reading through the scenario. Then, at the last minute decided to use my Chromebook instead, although I brought the printout as a backup. I think I could have run the game fine without most of my note cards using the printout, since I could see 2 full pages at a time, and flipping a page was easy and showed more. Using the Chromebook book I could only see about 2/3 of a page at a time; it was easy to get lost scrolling, so I would have had a really hard time without the note cards.
So, as a new live play GM, I think having to do the prep helped me out a lot. Having the new shorter 2-3 hour-long scenario helped too. I also like having time to add things to a scenario to make it longer if there is time. I would be horrible at trying to time manage a scenario to fit a tight time schedule, which scares me away from GMing more than prep time does.
So if I'm playing from a printout, I'd want the stat blocks in the scenario as they happen. If I'm using my Chromebook, I'd rather have them in the back if they are included, so they are easy to print out, so it's easier to follow the text and have the stat blocks on separate note cards or printouts. So it's hard for me to say which is best.
For one scenario, I have plenty of time to prep one scenario, but 2 of the other Starfinder GMs are too busy with work or college to GM right now, so I'm not trying to prep 4 scenarios at one time, while also playing a live character in PFS2 and 2 other SFS characters online.
Maybe I shouldn't count as a new live GM for this conversation, in the sense that I had already played PF2e, SF1e, and SF2e for 3 years, already use AON, already am familiar with organized play rules, and GM a couple of play-by-post. Even with that experience, moving to GM Live felt like a big step. For someone who doesn't know the OP rules, or has used AON, and or is new to the game. Adding having to find and prep stat blocks is a lot to deal with.
But even if time were not an issue, there are a lot of what-ifs that could happen if stat blocks are not included.
1. Oops, I forgot my note cards
2. I was planning on using AON, oops, there's no wifi
3. I forgot to charge my Chromebooks' batteries; luckily, I brought a printout with stat blocks.
4. This one happened to our VO. He was ready to play a character, and just as we were about to start, 3 new players showed up. So the VO and one other player dropped out of our table to make a 3rd table instead of turning away the new players. Luckily, the VO had a backup scenario with him, much harder to do if it didn't have stat blocks in it.
5. If the stat block in the scenario is just a note saying see page 243 of some book, there is a chance during prep to miss it and not prep it at all.
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<<SNIP>>
it is good you are use prepping for adventures. That is good.
The point is not prepping, the point is the extra time that it is going to cause GMs ton have to do. And the possible barrier it will cause for new GMs who dont understand how to prep or where to look for mob details.
Of the 3 SF adventures I have ran, 1 used stars from the NPC core. So I had to got there to find the stats because they were not in the PDF.
I agree with the wolf (know better than not too!) that the decision will likely have a negative impact on organized play.
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I have been involved with PFS since 2011. I was there in the “before times”, when only unique stat blocks were included. A few years later, after repeated requests from Venture Officers, Paizo started adding all stat blocks to the scenario.
Those of you saying “this isn’t a big deal” - it may not be a big deal for YOU. But as someone who organized conventions, sometimes you have to hand a GM a scenario and ask them to run it on the fly. “But, Mark, they can use their phone to get the stat blocks!”. It isn’t that simple. Some convention halls don’t have good cell reception, and most don’t have available wi-fi. I can’t tell you how many times *I* have been asked at a con to run something on the fly.
I will never do it again. Having to go out and search for those stat blocks, and have multiple tabs or whatever, is not only inconvenient, it greatly slows the table down.
So, I am begging Paizo to reconsider this decision. It is a horrible decision with tremendous potential negative consequences, and very little positive upside.
And let us just be clear here: there is no doubt in my mind this decision was made because Paizo honestly believes it will improve development, etc. and thus improve the program. People shouldn’t be questioning their motives or motivations - it is well-intentioned.
But I don’t think it will have the positive impact they believe it will.
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I guess I missed something. We can ADD stuff the adventure now?
Oh your talking about the adjustments. Got ya.
But that is not new.
I guess I missed something. We can ADD stuff the adventure now?
Oh your talking about the adjustments. Got ya.
But that is not new.
If you are referring to the allowed adjustments to encounter difficulty biases on APL or party size, that is not what I'm talking about.
Here's a thread I started on how far you can push things.
How far have you pushed not "Run as Written"?.
That thread was inspired by this blog post.
Revising "Run as Written".
I think this topic is even more important now that all SF2e scenarios are shorter and repeatable. To not get off topic here, I'll continue this conversation on the old thread on How far have you pushed not 'Run as Written"?
Venture-Lieutenant, Ohio—Toledo
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I have been involved with PFS since 2011. I was there in the “before times”, when only unique stat blocks were included. A few years later, after repeated requests from Venture Officers, Paizo started adding all stat blocks to the scenario.
Those of you saying “this isn’t a big deal” - it may not be a big deal for YOU. But as someone who organized conventions, sometimes you have to hand a GM a scenario and ask them to run it on the fly. “But, Mark, they can use their phone to get the stat blocks!”. It isn’t that simple. Some convention halls don’t have good cell reception, and most don’t have available wi-fi. I can’t tell you how many times *I* have been asked at a con to run something on the fly.
I will never do it again. Having to go out and search for those stat blocks, and have multiple tabs or whatever, is not only inconvenient, it greatly slows the table down.
So, I am begging Paizo to reconsider this decision. It is a horrible decision with tremendous potential negative consequences, and very little positive upside.
And let us just be clear here: there is no doubt in my mind this decision was made because Paizo honestly believes it will improve development, etc. and thus improve the program. People shouldn’t be questioning their motives or motivations - it is well-intentioned.
But I don’t think it will have the positive impact they believe it will.
Mark, I agree with everything you just said. I started in 2010 and my experiences have been the same. This is a significant barrier to growth and participation.
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Those of you saying “this isn’t a big deal” - it may not be a big deal for YOU. But as someone who organized conventions, sometimes you have to hand a GM a scenario and ask them to run it on the fly. “But, Mark, they can use their phone to get the stat blocks!”. It isn’t that simple. Some convention halls don’t have good cell reception, and most don’t have available wi-fi. I can’t tell you how many times *I* have been asked at a con to run something on the fly.
Mark, I agree with everything you just said. I started in 2010 and my experiences have been the same. This is a significant barrier to growth and participation.
That's fair enough - running something cold, with no prep time, feels like a very fair and valid reason to want to have all the stat blocks in the scenario.
But - how often are people running things cold? I mean, I don't claim to be the most prolific GM, but I've been GMing in Org Play for nine-ish years, I've got my Five Thingies, I've GM'd at three Gen Cons (six, if you count online Pandemic ones) and dozens of local game days and conventions, both IRL and online. And I can count the number of times I've been asked to run cold on one hand, with fingers to spare.I get it happens, but - does it really happen often enough, to warrant being a major, or even a significant, driver of policy?
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That's fair enough - running something cold, with no prep time, feels like a very fair and valid reason to want to have all the stat blocks in the scenario.
But - how often are people running things cold? I mean, I don't claim to be the most prolific GM, but I've been GMing in Org Play for nine-ish years, I've got my Five Thingies, I've GM'd at three Gen Cons (six, if you count online Pandemic ones) and dozens of local game days and conventions, both IRL and online. And I can count the number of times I've been asked to run cold on one hand, with fingers to spare.I get it happens, but - does it really happen often enough, to warrant being a major, or even a significant, driver of policy?
Happening in org play generally and happening at conventions are two different things. While it can happen at regular game days, I think that’s a pretty small number. Conventions, though? It happens a LOT.
I have GMed or HQed at 10 gen cons, and probably 7-8 Origins, and I don’t know how many smaller, local conventions. And it has happened at least once at just about every one of them. It happens.
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Venture-Agent, Netherlands—Utrecht
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In a sense, my local PFS lodge is lucky in that a fair few of us managed to snag a wide range of PFS adventures to start with, then got enough Paizo support to keep it running afterwards. Without people being generous and the store having wifi, we would have struggled without the stats line being in the scenario. We even struggle sometimes if there's a spell caster enemy because we need to know what X rank cantrip or spell does.
To a point, I think if enemy stats are included, the spells that enemy uses should be included as well because it helps GMs have this kind of stuff to hand. Even if say people can look up a spell on pathbuilder, actually having the enemy stats/spell to hand in a book can save time
Yeah, that's been a bugbear of mine as well. While I know several common cantrips off the top of my head, it'd be nice if they were included. And this is just copy-pasting off Nethys, it shouldn't need an editor to look it over. But this would increase pdf size even more, and leadership has been pretty vocal about that. Personally, I don't have a problem with it, but there must be a reason why they do.
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Yeah, that's been a bugbear of mine as well. While I know several common cantrips off the top of my head, it'd be nice if they were included. And this is just copy-pasting off Nethys, it shouldn't need an editor to look it over. But this would increase pdf size even more, and leadership has been pretty vocal about that. Personally, I don't have a problem with it, but there must be a reason why they do.
To me they seem REALLY stuck on the idea that the adventure has to look as good and be in the same style as a printed product when it is an electronic only thing.
All you need to do is page break, new page, put the monsters there at the spot in the scenario where they occur, time in with the rest of the scenario. I don't know if the free PDF editors do that now but last time I tried it was a paid feature.
But that makes dreaded white space. Which is sacrilege to the trees who died to make the paper not to cover every last inch in ink and apparently burns some peoples eyeballs....in a print product. In a digital product all it does is inconvenience some more electrons. If someone is printing it out and for some reason DON'T want that information, they can just go print pages 1-5 8-12 and 19-24
I don't get it. I know my aesthetics run especially philistine but almost every session has a dm grumbling and flipping through pages because the scenario is laid out with aesthetics over usability. The creatures name and motivation and tactics are here, there's two pages of mapping, their stat blocks, another map, then the stat blocks for the other NPC in the fight...* Surely that's worse than skipping development on certain pages.
*this is a bit of an outlier example but its an example, not much if any exageration
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Venture-Agent, Netherlands—Utrecht
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The aesthetics thing is a good one, BNW. Not sure if that's the reason why they're doing this, but it's certainly a good point to make. But yeah, I vastly prefer usability over (conventional) legibility.
Spell Core sounds awesome. A compendium of all the spells compiled into one tome. A spellbook, if you will. The only downside is that each hardcover releases new spells, so it'll never be truly comprehensive. The Spell Cards are a good substitute. The remastered ones have all the spells from PC1 and PC2, that's a lot. The downside of those, though, is that it's not as easy to leaf through than an actual book.
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Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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Those of you saying “this isn’t a big deal” - it may not be a big deal for YOU. But as someone who organized conventions, sometimes you have to hand a GM a scenario and ask them to run it on the fly. “But, Mark, they can use their phone to get the stat blocks!”. It isn’t that simple. Some convention halls don’t have good cell reception, and most don’t have available wi-fi. I can’t tell you how many times *I* have been asked at a con to run something on the fly.I will never do it again. Having to go out and search for those stat blocks, and have multiple tabs or whatever, is not only inconvenient, it greatly slows the table down.
Ok I've got to know this but you surely have had to look up stuff haven't you. Spells, monster abilities, subsystems, lore, pictures not included in the scenario, and Im sure more.
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Ok I've got to know this but you surely have had to look up stuff haven't you. Spells, monster abilities, subsystems, lore, pictures not included in the scenario, and Im sure more.
Those of you saying “this isn’t a big deal” - it may not be a big deal for YOU. But as someone who organized conventions, sometimes you have to hand a GM a scenario and ask them to run it on the fly. “But, Mark, they can use their phone to get the stat blocks!”. It isn’t that simple. Some convention halls don’t have good cell reception, and most don’t have available wi-fi. I can’t tell you how many times *I* have been asked at a con to run something on the fly.I will never do it again. Having to go out and search for those stat blocks, and have multiple tabs or whatever, is not only inconvenient, it greatly slows the table down.
Not during the game, I don’t. I capture all that stuff in my prep so I almost never have to look up anything in game. And that info that I need to add to a stat block, I can just add to the pdf in the scenario, and then print it out. I don’t have to go find stat blocks, compile them by encounter, do my own layouts, etc.
And because I spend so much time in prep to get that info ahead of time so I don’t have to waste the time of the players at the table, I will never run cold again at a con if I ALSO have to worry about finding the stat blocks.
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I think it should be noted that what’s being missed is that Paizo shouldn’t be going out if it’s way to make MORE work for it’s unpaid GMs and volunteers, and though that isn’t the purpose of this change, that’s exactly what the effect is.
Others have said the same thing.
If this were my home AP campaign, sure, I’ll do that work (and I do) because in volunteering to GM for my group, I accept that work. But, as a GM for organized play? No, I don’t agree with that - Paizo can, and should, provide those stat blocks so as to minimize the extra work that GMs need to do.
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Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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I think it should be noted that what’s being missed is that Paizo shouldn’t be going out if it’s way to make MORE work for it’s unpaid GMs and volunteers, and though that isn’t the purpose of this change, that’s exactly what the effect is.
Others have said the same thing.
Yeah but 10 minutes of work isn't really that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things especially if you have venture officers that are competent at their position and actually help the GMs. I know that sounds really blunt but man oooo man the biggest strengths of my lodge is everyone will go out of their way to help one another with prep and running a scenario.