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Hey folks. I've written a guide to the Pathfinder Second Edition Bard. HERE IT IS.
Comments are welcome.
And yes, I know the Remaster is coming out soon. :-)
As usual with your guides, impressively comprehensive and detailed. Thank you! :)
Glad you like it!
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Thanks for the good work. Was a nice read.
I really liked the TLDR idea, will shamelessly snatch it for my own guide most likely.
Thanks for the good work. Was a nice read.
I really liked the TLDR idea, will shamelessly snatch it for my own guide most likely.
Same.
Or maybe I will shamelessly snatch your shameless snatch! Mua ha ha ha ha...! :-P
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Great guide overall! A few things I noticed while reading through:
--Ancestries in general: it may be worth mentioning the alternate boost to 2 stats available to all ancestries when discussing/rating ancestries with a Charisma flaw. Dwarf for example looks like a solid ancestry choice if you go with the 2 stat boost.
--Inner Radiance Torment: you mention it scales well, maybe worth mentioning that it scales too well/is likely being changed per developer comments?
--Summon Fey (rank 3), both spell discussion and Summon discussion: Dryad and Unicorn are both level 3 creatures and should be under rank 4 Summon Fey, not rank 3
--Sample spell repertoire progression: is it intentional to have Rank 3 Haste remaining on the lists through level 18 even after Rank 7 Haste (signature) is gained? (two spells can be swapped between L14 and L16 listing, one each at L15 and L16. I'm only seeing 1 swap, and I see no swaps from L16 to L18)
--Archetypes: I think form spells and Summons are questionable from archetypes since they're at least a spell rank behind. Similarly, going Druid for an animal companion is questionable due to poor scaling of the companion; for this purpose go Beastmaster instead.
--Archer: Bard already has access to Composite Shortbow (because it counts as a Shortbow for the purpose of the Bard ability granting proficiency with Shortbow), so the dedication is really just giving access to the other feats unless a Longbow is valuable for campaign-specific reasons
--Weapons: an archer Bard can't use a Wand of Manifold Missiles to good effect. The Wand only keeps firing missiles as long as it is wielded, preventing the Bard from firing a Bow. Could work with a thrown weapon build.
--Worn Items: Gloves of Storing can save an action each combat retrieving an important consumable or held item. I'd say they're worth a mention on an action-starved class
--List of bonuses/penalties: Enfeebled is listed instead of Clumsy for a status penalty to AC
Thanks for the good work. Was a nice read.
I really liked the TLDR idea, will shamelessly snatch it for my own guide most likely.
It's only fair! I stole a few things from your guide, after all!
How do you feel about the needle darts cantrip from Rage of Elements? It seems insanely strong other than being 2 actions. But, for that extra action, you’re getting an attack that’s more like to hit than a shortbow with 14 Dex, and has 150% of the average damage of a shortbow shot.
It's a very strong cantrip I only became aware of after I finished the guide. It features prominently in the Cleric guide I'm writing now.
I should go back and include it in the Bard guide, for sure.
EDIT: Done!
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Great guide overall! A few things I noticed while reading through:
--Ancestries in general: it may be worth mentioning the alternate boost to 2 stats available to all ancestries when discussing/rating ancestries with a Charisma flaw. Dwarf for example looks like a solid ancestry choice if you go with the 2 stat boost.
I detest that rule. Anyway, it's not a guide to Pathfinder, just to Bards. I get your point, but ... gaah! I hate that rule. So bland and flavorless.
--Inner Radiance Torment: you mention it scales well, maybe worth mentioning that it scales too well/is likely being changed per developer comments?
Is it? Can you point me to anything official?
--Summon Fey (rank 3), both spell discussion and Summon discussion: Dryad and Unicorn are both level 3 creatures and should be under rank 4 Summon Fey, not rank 3
Yeah. I just made a mistake. I've already fixed the Unicorn. I'll do the Dryad, too. Thanks.
--Sample spell repertoire progression: is it intentional to have Rank 3 Haste remaining on the lists through level 18 even after Rank 7 Haste (signature) is gained? (two spells can be swapped between L14 and L16 listing, one each at L15 and L16. I'm only seeing 1 swap, and I see no swaps from L16 to L18)
Yeah, good catch. I've replaced it with "Oneiric Mire."
--Archetypes: I think form spells and Summons are questionable from archetypes since they're at least a spell rank behind. Similarly, going Druid for an animal companion is questionable due to poor scaling of the companion; for this purpose go Beastmaster instead.
Fair point. What primal spells would you suggest instead?
--Archer: Bard already has access to Composite Shortbow (because it counts as a Shortbow for the purpose of the Bard ability granting proficiency with Shortbow), so the dedication is really just giving access to the other feats unless a Longbow is valuable for campaign-specific reasons
Can you point to the source of this assertion? First I've heard of it.
--Weapons: an archer Bard can't use a Wand of Manifold Missiles to good effect. The Wand only keeps firing missiles as long as it is wielded, preventing the Bard from firing a Bow. Could work with a thrown weapon build.
True enough.
--Worn Items: Gloves of Storing can save an action each combat retrieving an important consumable or held item. I'd say they're worth a mention on an action-starved class
--List of bonuses/penalties: Enfeebled is listed instead of Clumsy for a status penalty to AC
Oops. Thanks.
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Reads nicely, after I skip the ancestries (not my thing).
Synesthesia combined with inspire heroics (courage) using an orchestral brooch is a killer in many boss fights. Inspire Heroics is blue once you can afford the brooches.
--Inner Radiance Torment: you mention it scales well, maybe worth mentioning that it scales too well/is likely being changed per developer comments?Is it? Can you point me to anything official?
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--Archetypes: I think form spells and Summons are questionable from archetypes since they're at least a spell rank behind. Similarly, going Druid for an animal companion is questionable due to poor scaling of the companion; for this purpose go Beastmaster instead.Fair point. What primal spells would you suggest instead?
Heal, plus buffs like Ant Haul, Longstrider, Enlarge etc. are best since they don't care about proficiency/spell attack. Next best would be battlefield control spells like walls, Obscuring Mist, Web and similar. Blasting is a big gap in the Occult list so it might be worth packing a blast spell in the top Archetype slot.
--Archer: Bard already has access to Composite Shortbow (because it counts as a Shortbow for the purpose of the Bard ability granting proficiency with Shortbow), so the dedication is really just giving access to the other feats unless a Longbow is valuable for campaign-specific reasonsCan you point to the source of this assertion? First I've heard of it.
It's in the Composite Shortbow description: "Any time an ability is specifically restricted to a shortbow, it also applies to composite shortbows unless otherwise stated." If you're concerned about whether initial proficiencies count as abilities, see this post from a discussion on Reddit.
Here
--Inner Radiance Torment: you mention it scales well, maybe worth mentioning that it scales too well/is likely being changed per developer comments?Is it? Can you point me to anything official?
Thanks. Changed. It seems I must have known that already... or learned it since... because I referenced that post in the Cleric guide I'm writing now.
Heal, plus buffs like Ant Haul, Longstrider, Enlarge etc. are best since they don't care about proficiency/spell attack. Next best would be battlefield control spells like walls, Obscuring Mist, Web and similar. Blasting is a big gap in the Occult list so it might be worth packing a blast spell in the top Archetype slot.--Archetypes: I think form spells and Summons are questionable from archetypes since they're at least a spell rank behind. Similarly, going Druid for an animal companion is questionable due to poor scaling of the companion; for this purpose go Beastmaster instead.Fair point. What primal spells would you suggest instead?
Thanks. I'll think about this.
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It's in the Composite Shortbow description: "Any time an ability is specifically restricted to a shortbow, it also applies to composite shortbows unless otherwise stated." If you're concerned about whether initial proficiencies count as abilities, see this post from a discussion on Reddit.--Archer: Bard already has access to Composite Shortbow (because it counts as a Shortbow for the purpose of the Bard ability granting proficiency with Shortbow), so the dedication is really just giving access to the other feats unless a Longbow is valuable for campaign-specific reasonsCan you point to the source of this assertion? First I've heard of it.
I'm not convinced. If you have to cite a series of nested propositions, it makes it far less likely in my mind that the idea is RAI. However, I think it it should be the rule.
